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Author Topic: The Bus Stop Farce  (Read 83976 times)

Online Charles Collins

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2020, 08:55:59 PM »
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AFFIDAVIT OF EARLENE ROBERTS
http://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh7/pdf/WH7_Yarborough_aff.pdf

[EXCERPT]

The following affidavit was executed by Earlene Roberts on December 5, 1963.
PRESIDENT’S COMMISSION
ON THE ASSASSINATION OF AFFIDAVIT PRESIDENT JOHN F. KENNEDY
STATE OF TEXAS, County of Dallas, 88:

I, Earlene Roberts, after being duly sworn, do depose and state :
I live at 1026 Beckley, Dallas, Texas, where I serve as housekeeper for a room- ing house owned by Mr. & Mrs. A. C. Johnson.
On Friday, November 22, 1963, at approximately 1:00 pm I was sitting in the living room watching television about the President’s assassination when a man I knew as 0. H. Lee, but who has since been identified as Lee Harvey Oswald, came into the front door and went to his room. Oswald did not have a jacket when he came in the house and I don’t recall what type of clothing he was wearing.
Oswald went to his room and was only there a very few minutes before coming out. I noticed he had a jacket he was putting on. I recall the jacket was a dark color and it was the type that zips up the front. He was zipping the jacket up as he left.
Oswald went out the front door. A moment later I looked out the window. I saw Lee Oswald standing on the curb at the bus stop just to the right, and on the same side of the street as our house. I just glanced out the window that once. I don’t know how long Lee Oswald stood at the curb nor did I see which direction he went when he left there.

[...]


If you read the rest of the affidavit she says “About 30 minutes later three policemen came to the house.” 

30-minutes - LOL. She remembers everything so well...

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2020, 08:55:59 PM »


Online Charles Collins

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #9 on: November 18, 2020, 08:57:23 PM »
Charles, Roberts' earlier affidavit, December 5, actually backs up Aynesworth: "On Friday, November 22, 1963, at approximately 1:00 pm I was sitting in the living room watching television about the President’s assassination"

I noticed that Denis, thanks!

Offline Denis Pointing

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2020, 08:57:59 PM »
Why do you believe that Aynesworth twisted this? What was the purpose? How can you say with any certainty that Mrs. Roberts didn’t actually tell Aynesworth she was sitting? She could have easily misspoken that detail instead of Aynesworth being incorrect.

Charles, Roberts' earlier affidavit, December 5, actually backs up Aynesworth: "On Friday, November 22, 1963, at approximately 1:00 pm I was sitting in the living room watching television about the President’s assassination"

https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh7/pdf/WH7_Roberts_aff.pdf

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #10 on: November 18, 2020, 08:57:59 PM »


Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #11 on: November 18, 2020, 09:14:53 PM »

If you read the rest of the affidavit she says “About 30 minutes later three policemen came to the house.” 

30-minutes - LOL. She remembers everything so well...

What's that got to do with her not seeing where Oswald went after seeing him standing at the bus top
« Last Edit: November 18, 2020, 09:20:00 PM by Bill Chapman »

Online Charles Collins

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2020, 09:18:56 PM »
What's that got to do with not seeing where Oswald went after seeing him standing at the bus top

I am pointing out her apparent  lack of an accurate memory of the events. And indicating that I believe Hugh Aynesworth’s notes are more accurate than her memory 13-days afterwards.

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #12 on: November 18, 2020, 09:18:56 PM »


Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #13 on: November 18, 2020, 10:22:04 PM »
The anybody but LHO crowd likes to believe that LHO actually stood at the bus stop near his rooming house when he left it a little after 1:00 on 11/22/63. And they point this out as part of their argument claiming that LHO couldn’t have traveled on foot the distance to the Tippit murder scene in time to get there before Tippit was murdered.

Here is a quote from a photograph of the actual typewritten notes by Hugh Aynesworth written in May of 1964 for The Dallas Morning News and published in a book titled “The Reporters’ Notes by The Dallas Morning News published in 2013.

“Mrs. Roberts recalled the now star-boarder running in about 1 p.m. as she sat watching the TV coverage of the assassination. “Boy you’re in a hurry,” she said. He hasn’t replied yet. She told us Oswald (Mr. Lee as she knew him) had hesitated at the front of the house a moment, then started running down Beckley Street south.

So, the later claims by Mrs. Roberts that LHO went to the bus stop and waited there for a while are (quite obviously to me) not true. She may believe that he did, but it is apparent that her later memory is false. Her fresh recollection (given to Aynesworth and the others just hours after the event) of LHO running south on Beckley, and no mention of the bus stop, are bound to be more accurate than her later one. Our memories are reconstructions (unlike taped re-runs) based on associations. It is easy to understand how Mrs. Roberts could mistakenly associate another memory (of LHO standing at the bus stop at another time) as part of what she remembered of 11/22/63. We all have mistakenly remembered a few things wrong from time to time. And we only realize it when we encounter evidence contrary to our memories. So, it probably happens to all of us more often than we think it does.

Some of you will cling to Mrs. Roberts’ false memory account and say that it is true. But I am convinced otherwise. I always have felt this way. But now have firm evidence to support my conclusion.

Whether Roberts saw Oswald standing at the bus stop or not is of very little significance. Roberts tells us that when Oswald came in she was trying to get the television to work to watch the news at 1 o'clock and that he left again after about 3 minutes.
We also know from the Gary Mack time trial that the fastest route between Beckley and 10th street took 11 minutes to walk.

Combined this means that Oswald couldn't have gotten to 10th street until 1.12 pm at the earliest. Add on two minutes for a short conversation with Tippit and the events that followed and you've got a shooting at 1.14 pm.

The problem is there is convincing circumstantial evidence to justify the conclusion that the actual time of the shooting most likely was between 1.06 and 1.10. For instance, Markham said she took the same bus, on Jefferson, every day at approx 1.15 pm, which of course means that she would have been at the bus stop at the time of the shooting and thus couldn't have been at 10th street at 1.14 to witness it.

So, you see, the whole point of Oswald waiting at the bus stop or not is really a trivial matter. 

Online Charles Collins

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2020, 10:46:02 PM »
Whether Roberts saw Oswald standing at the bus stop or not is of very little significance. Roberts tells us that when Oswald came in she was trying to get the television to work to watch the news at 1 o'clock and that he left again after about 3 minutes.
We also know from the Gary Mack time trial that the fastest route between Beckley and 10th street took 11 minutes to walk.

Combined this means that Oswald couldn't have gotten to 10th street until 1.12 pm at the earliest. Add on two minutes for a short conversation with Tippit and the events that followed and you've got a shooting at 1.14 pm.

The problem is there is convincing circumstantial evidence to justify the conclusion that the actual time of the shooting most likely was between 1.06 and 1.10. For instance, Markham said she took the same bus, on Jefferson, every day at approx 1.15 pm, which of course means that she would have been at the bus stop at the time of the shooting and thus couldn't have been at 10th street at 1.14 to witness it.

So, you see, the whole point of Oswald waiting at the bus stop or not is really a trivial matter.

It never ceases to amaze what the naysayers believe...

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #14 on: November 18, 2020, 10:46:02 PM »


Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: The Bus Stop Farce
« Reply #15 on: November 19, 2020, 12:33:22 AM »
There is no doubt in my mind that he took notes of what Earlene Roberts said as she said it.

That may be so, but there's no evidence that it's actually true.

Nor is there any good reason to believe that Aynesworth's May 1964 account is more accurate than Roberts' own April 1964 account.