Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2


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Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5384 on: June 20, 2022, 10:52:11 PM »
‘This is starting to sink in’: Morning Joe says Jan. 6 findings are starting to ‘resonate’ with Trump’s base

MSNBC's Joe Scarborough was shocked by the results of a new poll showing a majority of Americans -- including one in five Republicans -- think Donald Trump should be prosecuted.

The survey conducted after the first week of public hearings by the House select committee found 58 percent of Americans believe the former president should be charged with a crime for his role in the Jan. 6 insurrection, and the "Morning Joe" host found the results astonishing.

"You look at the number -- only 19 percent of Republicans, let's stop for a second and think about this," Scarborough said. "In this world of small margins that we play by every election, whether it was 2016 or 2020, let's just stop for a second and go, oh, wow. Only 19 percent of Republicans think he should be charged with a crime and go to jail. That's one in five Republicans."

"Now, I must say, I ran four times and won easily four times," he added. "But if one in five of my base thought I should have been charged with a crime and gone to jail, I mean, I would have gone and practiced law a lot earlier. Again, this is starting to resonate, this is starting to sink in. I just -- we love to knock around Washington institutions. I'm not saying you, but all of us, we love to talk about how ineffective people in Congress or committees are. This committee has gotten the truth out to the American people, and even at the beginning of the summer, they're listening. That's shocking to me."

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5384 on: June 20, 2022, 10:52:11 PM »


Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5385 on: June 20, 2022, 11:13:15 PM »
‘Avalanche’ of evidence proves Trump was engaged in a ‘multi-faceted criminal conspiracy’: legal expert



Former Department of Justice prosecutors and officials speaking to The Guardian say that the testimony and evidence collected by the committee investigating the Jan. 6 Capitol riot has increased the odds of former President Donald Trump being prosecuted.

The ex-DOJ lawyers say new revelations make it more likely that Trump will be charged with crimes involving conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding or defrauding the United States. They also speculate Trump will be also be charged with fraud in regards to an alleged fundraising scheme that netted $250 million for an "election defense fund."

Former federal prosecutor Dennis Aftergut told The Guardian that no one "should underestimate the gravity of deciding to criminally charge an ex-president."

“Ultimately, the avalanche of documents and sworn testimony proving a multi-faceted criminal conspiracy to overturn the will of the people means one thing: if no one is above the law, even an ex-president who led that conspiracy must be indicted," he said.

In three hearings, a series of Trump advisers were shown saying they had warned him of the illegality of attempting to overturn Democrat Joe Biden's victory by persuading Mike Pence to block a normally pro forma process.

One committee member, Adam Schiff, told CNN on Sunday that subpoenaing Pence was "certainly a possibility," adding, "We're not excluding anyone or anything at this point."

Pence faced intense pressure from Trump to break with history and refuse on January 6 to formally certify Biden's victory.

But even after Trump supporters violently stormed the building, with some chanting "Hang Mike Pence," he refused to leave the complex and returned to the Senate chamber late at night to carry out the certification

“The January 6 committee’s investigation has developed substantial, compelling evidence that Trump committed crimes, including but not limited to conspiracy to defraud the United States and obstruct official proceedings,” Michael Bromwich, a former inspector general at the DOJ, told the Guardian.

“Bizarrely, Trump’s best defense to the mountain of evidence that proves these crimes seems to be that he was incapable of forming the criminal intent necessary to convict," Bromwich said. "That he was detached from reality, in Barr’s words. But there is strong evidence that he is not crazy – but instead is crazy like a fox."

“How else to explain his attempts to pressure the Georgia secretary of state to ‘find the votes’ necessary to change the result? Or his telling DOJ officials to simply declare the election ‘corrupt’ and leave ‘the rest to me’ and Republican House allies?” Bromwich said.

“All of this shows not someone incapable of forming criminal intent, but someone who understood what the facts were and was determined not to accept them. Because he couldn’t stand to lose. That was far more important to him than honoring our institutions or the constitution," he added.

A new poll shows that most Americans believe the former president should face charges. "This is starting to resonate, this is starting to sink in," said MSNBC commentator Joe Scarborough, noting that the poll showed that 19 percent of Republicans thought Trump should be charged with a crime.

Read more here:

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jun/19/trump-charges-january-6-hearings-capitol-attack

Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5386 on: June 20, 2022, 11:24:02 PM »
Internal Trump campaign emails show fake electors gambit was a 'concerted strategy': Washington Post

The gambit to send phony pro-Trump electors to back him in the 2020 electoral college was part of a "concerted strategy" that was aimed at giving Vice President Mike Pence cover to block the certification of the results on January 6th, reports the Washington Post.

Internal Trump campaign emails obtained by the Post show that campaign officials pressed Pence to accept the validity of the fake pro-Trump electors, even as lawyers working for the campaign acknowledged "they did not have legal validity and the gatherings had not been in compliance with state laws."

One email highlighted by the Post was written by notorious "coup memo" author John Eastman, who on December 19th, 2020 argued that the plan to send the electors to Congress was "dead on arrival" from a legal perspective because no state legislatures had certified them.

Nonetheless, Eastman said that Pence should accept them as valid in another email written days later, as doing so would create the impression that the results of the election were still in dispute.

"The fact that we have multiple slates of electors demonstrate the uncertainty of either," he wrote. "That should be enough."

The use of fake electors is drawing legal scrutiny in both Georgia and Washington D.C., where Department of Justice lawyers reportedly have empaneled a grand jury to look into the scheme.

The Post notes that the House Select Committee investigating the January 6th Capitol riots will be examining the fake electors scheme during its next hearing on Tuesday, June 21st.

Read More Here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/06/20/trump-documents-fake-elector-plan/

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5386 on: June 20, 2022, 11:24:02 PM »


Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5387 on: June 20, 2022, 11:34:24 PM »
Former prosecutor cites clues that could uncover proof of Donald Trump’s seditious conspiracy



Speaking over the weekend, House Select Committee member Rep. Adam Schiff (R-IL) cited "seditious conspiracy" as a charge for former President Donald Trump. Rep. Liz Cheney (R-WY) made the same comment when the first hearing unfolded and she made a detailed opening statement.

Among the things she promised, she said, that the committee will detail "plots to commit seditious conspiracy on January 6th."

Since then, MSNBC's Nicolle Wallace explained, Cheney has made it clear that she, "has made abundantly clear there's one person on trial and his name is Donald Trump, and in the court of public opinion, Liz Cheney has accused Donald Trump of obstruction an official proceeding ... there are fraud allegations being levied against him in the court of public opinion by this congressional committee."

Former deputy assistant attorney general Harry Litman said that it sounds to him that Kinzinger is alleging that Trump essentially "joined with the people who the department has already charged in the most serious thing and actually acted to try to overthrow the republic."

He went on to say that there are three "solid" charges he thinks that the Justice Department could try Trump with, but that the fourth cited by Kinzinger is possible but requires identifying co-conspirators.

"I think that's one where there's a very big dot for the DOJ to fill in, but on the others, basically, they seem different and convoluted," he said, noting that the way to spot the crime is to, "just look for a lie at the bottom. So, the alternate slates of electors, you just heard the email from [John] Eastman saying 'the fact that there are alternate states of electors.' That's not a fact. In fact, it's a fiction, and when you have that kind of knowing lie that's what's going to anchor one of the charges they think can be proven easily so far. Seditious conspiracy, [that's] the big-ticket item that they haven't shown yet with respect to Congressman Kinzinger. His hearing hasn't happened yet. So, we don't know what the evidence is that he will present."

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Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5388 on: June 20, 2022, 11:56:46 PM »
Donald Trump Has 'Zero' Defense in Georgia Investigation: Akerman



Donald Trump has "zero" defense against a criminal investigation into whether him pressuring Georgia Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger to tilt the election in his favor constitutes as election interference, said former Watergate prosecutor Nick Akerman on Sunday.

The ex-president is facing an investigation in the key swing state's Fulton County about whether or not his phone call with Raffensperger, whom Trump implored to "find" 11,780 votes to tilt the election in his favor, amounts to interfering in the election. The state's investigation is coupled with the House select committee that is investigating the attack on the U.S. Capitol last year, which is seeking to determine the extent of Trump's involvement in inciting the violence.

The committee's now-televised hearings have received much attention, but Akerman said during an appearance on MSNBC's The Katie Phang Show that the investigation in Georgia is more likely to "send Donald Trump to prison" because the tapes could bolster the prosecution's case against him.

"What is significant with those tapes is that when you put it in context of all of the evidence that the January 6 committee has uncovered—you put that together, Donald Trump has zero defense in Georgia," he said. "If I had to put my money on one prosecution that's going to go forward here that will send Donald Trump to jail—it's Georgia. No question about it."

Akerman explained the recorded audio tapes could be difficult for the former president's defense team to defend in court. In fact, he argued Trump's only defense in the case would be "trying to somehow pick up on some ambiguity in the tape that he didn't really mean what he said."

The former president, meanwhile, defended the call with Raffensperger in a post on his social media platform Truth Social on Sunday morning. He has previously declared investigations against him as a "witch hunt," and has insisted on his innocence, while also continuing to repeat the baseless claims that he lost the 2020 presidential election due to widespread voter fraud.

"My phone call to the Georgia Secretary of State, with many other people, including numerous lawyers, knowingly on the line, was absolutely PERFECT and appropriate. YES, it was a PERFECT CALL," he wrote.

As part of the state's investigation, a special grand jury earlier in June began hearing testimony from about 50 witnesses. The jury will provide a report to Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis, who will ultimately decide whether or not to indict Trump.

Other legal experts have offered similar perspectives that Trump could face criminal charges in the investigation. Former White House special counsel Norm Eisen said on CNN last Sunday that Trump "likely" committed crimes, and that the evidence "is particularly strong" against him.

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-has-zero-defense-georgia-investigation-akerman-1717186

Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5389 on: June 21, 2022, 11:09:35 AM »
Support for Criminally Charging Trump Over Jan. 6 Rises During Hearings

New polling shows that support for criminally charging former President Donald Trump over his actions related to the January 6, 2021 attack against the U.S. Capitol has risen as the public hearings of the House select committee investigating the violence of that day proceed.

The House investigators began holding public televised hearings on June 9, and have held three hearings until now—outlining the evidence they've uncovered surrounding the events of January 6 and Trump's efforts to unconstitutionally overturn the 2020 election results. Multiple witnesses have testified live or in previous video recordings, and have included former top administration officials, former White House lawyers, and Trump campaign officials.

Polling data released Sunday by ABC News/Ipsos shows a notable uptick in the number of Americans who believe Trump should face criminal charges for his actions compared to previous survey data from late April. The new poll was conducted from June 17 to June 18.

The survey shows that 58 percent of Americans believe the ex-president should face criminal charges. Meanwhile, 40 percent do not believe Trump should be indicted. The survey had 545 respondents and had a margin of error of plus or minus 4.5 percent.

Comparatively, a similar ABC News/Washington Post poll from late April found less support for criminally charging the former president. That previous survey showed just 52 percent believed Trump should face an indictment over the Capitol attack—six points less than the latest survey. A slightly larger amount (42 percent) also believed Trump should not face criminal charges at that time.

The April survey included 1,004 Americans and had a margin of error of plus or minus 3.5 percent.

Another recent survey by Navigator Research revealed that a majority of Americans also believe Trump should be indicted by the Justice Department. That poll had 54 percent in favor of charging the former president, and just 37 percent opposed to the idea. The data was collected from June 9 to 13 from approximately 1,000 respondents.

Trump continues to deny any wrongdoing related to the Capitol riot and his efforts to overturn President Joe Biden's election win. He insists that the 2020 election was "rigged" or "stolen," and criticized former Vice President Mike Pence for not going along with his unconstitutional plot to prevent Biden from taking office.

Despite Trump's claims about the 2020 election, no evidence has emerged corroborating allegations of widespread voter fraud leading to his loss. To the contrary, dozens of election challenge lawsuits filed by the former president and his allies failed in state and federal courts. Even judges Trump appointed ruled against the lawsuits.

The House select committee showed video of Trump's former Attorney General William Barr's testimony, in which he asserted that the claims about election fraud were "bulls***."

https://www.newsweek.com/support-criminally-charging-trump-over-jan-6-rises-during-hearings-1717213

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5389 on: June 21, 2022, 11:09:35 AM »


Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5390 on: June 21, 2022, 11:31:04 AM »
Newly released US Justice video exhibit shows the claustrophobic surge of the mob 13 minutes after Trump's 2:24pm tweet on Jan 6.

Watch: https://twitter.com/i/status/1538322923215364098

Approximately 3 minutes after Trump's Jan 6 tweet about Mike Pence lacking "courage". Video from US Justice Dept court exhibit.

Watch: https://twitter.com/i/status/1538500594368884739

Offline Rick Plant

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5391 on: June 21, 2022, 12:00:04 PM »
Exclusive: Pressure on Trump and his allies intensifies as Jan. 6 committee rolls out shocking new evidence



One day after Arizona’s 2020 presidential election, Donald Trump’s supporters, including armed protesters, converged on Maricopa County’s ballot counting center. That morning, a local congressman, Rep. Paul Gosar, R-AZ, had amplified Trump’s stolen election claims. He tweeted that Trump votes were uncounted in his state’s most populous county because many voters had used sharpie pens, which bled through the paper and spoiled their ballots.

Although the rumor, dubbed “Sharpie-gate,” was false, Gosar made a beeline for the protest. Rather than urging those present to accept disappointing results, he validated their fears. Gosar was not alone. Arizona Attorney General Mark Brnovich, another ambitious Republican – now running for the U.S. Senate as a “true conservative” – announced an investigation. These reactions, abusing their office’s prestige and authority, were not unique.

Trump called Maricopa County’s top elected Republican to pressure him to stop counting votes. The Arizona Republican Party, like the GOP in many battleground states, filed baseless lawsuits. Later that month, Trump’s Washington-based lawyers, who knew that Joe Biden won, flew into Phoenix. They met with GOP legislators, who let them use Arizona’s statehouse as a stage for making more false claims. In December, loyalists from state party officials to legislators, forged and signed a fake Electoral College certificate saying that Trump had won. Then they lobbied the vice president to count their fraudulent and illegal votes on January 6.

The fourth hearing by the House Select Committee to Investigate the January 6 Attack on the U.S. Capitol will focus on how Trump’s team pressured local and state government officials to overturn Biden’s victory. Tuesday’s witnesses include two Republican election officials from Georgia and a state legislator from Arizona who resisted Trump’s pressure and received numerous threats from Trump supporters that have continued into 2022’s elections.

The events in Arizona followed a template also seen in Georgia, Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin, according to the panel’s disclosures and other reporting compiled by States United Democracy Center, a nonpartisan organization advancing free, fair, and secure elections.

“The same lies and conspiracy theories that fueled the January 6 attack contributed to threatening and violent messages aimed at election officials,” its Arizona update said. “These threats were launched over email, voicemails, texts, letters, social media, and in-person events, including gathering outside election officials’ homes.”

As the hearings continue, there are not only questions of what accountability will ensue for participants in Trump’s failed 2020 coup, but what can be done about a Republicans who still embrace the stolen election lie. This past weekend, for example, the Texas Republican Party adopted these claims in its party platform. That action follows scores of election-denying candidates running for state and federal office in 2022 and winning their primaries.

“These candidates and their successful primary campaigns are a stark reminder that the insurrection—and the lies that sparked it—did not end on January 6, 2021 or when former President Trump left office,” wrote States United’s leadership team, Noman Eisen, Joanna Lydgate and Christine Todd Whitman (New Jersey’s ex-governor and a Republican) in Slate. “And they are proof that the kindling for the attack—and the continued stoking of the fire—is alive and well in the states."

The trio contend that local accountability would have the greatest impact with stopping the cynical and dangerous stolen election claims. They suggest disbarring the “bad lawyers” who perpetuated the evidence-free falsehoods, which means ending their legal careers. They said that “district and county attorneys can bring criminal charges” against the coup’s participants and cited the investigation in Georgia’s Fulton County, where Trump tried to get Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger to “find” votes to reverse Biden’s victory. (Raffensperger and his deputy are witnesses on Tuesday.)

They further suggested that local prosecutors go after militias like the Proud Boys and Oath Keepers for confrontations with police, citing a lawsuit by the District of Columbia Attorney General Karl Racine. They also suggested that state attorneys general go after Trump’s post-election fundraising where false claims were used to dupe donors, citing a Michigan inquiry that’s underway and a possible New York State investigation.

“Democracy cannot exist without the rule of law,” they wrote. “Seeking accountability for those who step outside those bounds is critical to stopping the ongoing insurrection before it’s too late. If we want to prevent an election hijack in 2022 and 2024, it’s going to take a full-speed-ahead approach to accountability. And just like with our elections, we believe those [accountability efforts] will be run and led by the states.”

Tuesday’s disclosures may suggest which legal venues would be best for seeking accountability.

But there is another aspect of accountability that involves understanding and confronting the dysfunctional political psychologies that enabled this crisis. Pro-Trump politicians, candidates and campaigners seem to share a mindset where they valued obtaining power above other personal, public, and professional considerations. It’s one thing to be a loyal and ambitious politician. It’s another to mimic party leaders who lie, show indifference to facts, embrace chaos and violence, bilk supporters, and say such actions were patriotic — and still are.

The hearings are revealing how far people who admired or envied Trump were willing to go. As new details surface so too are suggestions for how and where to hold participants accountable. But what has not yet been revealed is what might excise the dynamic in political life that allows such self-serving people to advance, and, as just seen in Texas, to keep lying.

https://www.rawstory.com/trump-january-6-hearing-evidence/

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Re: Trump supporters and conspiracy theory - Part 2
« Reply #5391 on: June 21, 2022, 12:00:04 PM »


 

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