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Author Topic: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?  (Read 42240 times)

Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #40 on: March 23, 2020, 12:34:23 AM »
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Then why did 3 deputies (one of whom who worked at a sporting goods store) with 6 good eyes call it a Mauser?

And not just a Mauser, but a 7.65 Mauser.

John, watch this video frame by frame .....Starting at the first frame....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ep-L8ZBnJxU

What is the position of the rifle in the first frame when Lt Day reaches out and grabs the sling ?     What is the position of that leather sling?... Is it at 12:00 O'clock ( toward the ceiling)   3:00 O'Clock ----6:00 O'Clock --or 9:00 O'Clock  ?     
« Last Edit: March 23, 2020, 05:36:45 PM by Walt Cakebread »

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #40 on: March 23, 2020, 12:34:23 AM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #41 on: March 23, 2020, 12:38:42 AM »
What about Roger Craig? Was he a damned liar too? Why would a conspirator lie about reading "7.65 Mauser" off the barrel of the rifle? He was obviously not "in on it" so why do you think he was lying?

If Craig was telling the truth, then there were 2 rifles and Alyea didn't film the Mauser. Otherwise, if ANY shots came from the SN then it was NOT from the Carcano because that was the patsy rifle that was pre-planted as were the hulls. Or do you still believe that the MC was used in the assassination?

Roger Craig had a real mental problem.....( Mary Ferrell who knew Craig personally, said that Craig was a compulsive liar)   Once he had stuck his neck out and swore that the rifle was a 7.65 Mauser, his mental problem would not llow him to admit that he was wrong.

Offline Jack Trojan

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #42 on: March 23, 2020, 12:58:12 AM »
Roger Craig had a real mental problem.....( Mary Ferrell who knew Craig personally, said that Craig was a compulsive liar)   Once he had stuck his neck out and swore that the rifle was a 7.65 Mauser, his mental problem would not llow him to admit that he was wrong.

That's pretty damned thin. So Craig's "mental problem" invented the 7.65 Mauser part? And why do you believe that the rifle Craig was reading was the same rifle in the Alyea film? Was it because Fritz or Day said so?
« Last Edit: March 23, 2020, 12:59:14 AM by Jack Trojan »

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #42 on: March 23, 2020, 12:58:12 AM »


Online Mitch Todd

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #43 on: March 23, 2020, 01:22:51 AM »
That's pretty damned thin. So Craig's "mental problem" invented the 7.65 Mauser part? And why do you believe that the rifle Craig was reading was the same rifle in the Alyea film? Was it because Fritz or Day said so?
Craig didn't claim that he saw "7.65 Mauser" stamped into the barrel until his videotaped interview with Lane in 1973. His 1971 account of the rifle's discovery "When They Kill A President" In '68 doesn't mention it. Nor did Craig mention it in his Shaw trial testimony. Craig and Penn Jones were given a joint interview by the LA Free Press in 1968. This is what Craig said in that interview:

"RC: ...I was also present when the rifle was found. Now this rifle — there's no possible way that a man could lay that rifle between those boxes. He had to drop It in there, I'm six feet tall, and I couldn't reach down and pick that, rifle out without climbing on top of those boxes and getting down in 'em by moving some of 'em to get to that rifle. And there wasn't a scratch on that rifle, and the scope was not one fraction out of kilter.

FP: Did you handle that rifle?

RC: Yes, I did. I couldn't give its name because I don't know foreign rifles. I know it was foreign made, and you loaded it downward into a built-in clip. The ID man took it and ejected one live round from it. The scope was facing north, the bolt facing upwards and the trigger south. But there was another rifle, a Mauser, found up on the roof of the depository that afternoon."

His '68 story excludes the '73 version, and vice versa. You'd think that he would have gotten his story straight, had it happened that way.

Offline Jack Trojan

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #44 on: March 23, 2020, 02:20:49 AM »
Craig didn't claim that he saw "7.65 Mauser" stamped into the barrel until his videotaped interview with Lane in 1973. His 1971 account of the rifle's discovery "When They Kill A President" In '68 doesn't mention it. Nor did Craig mention it in his Shaw trial testimony. Craig and Penn Jones were given a joint interview by the LA Free Press in 1968. This is what Craig said in that interview:

"RC: ...I was also present when the rifle was found. Now this rifle — there's no possible way that a man could lay that rifle between those boxes. He had to drop It in there, I'm six feet tall, and I couldn't reach down and pick that, rifle out without climbing on top of those boxes and getting down in 'em by moving some of 'em to get to that rifle. And there wasn't a scratch on that rifle, and the scope was not one fraction out of kilter.

FP: Did you handle that rifle?

RC: Yes, I did. I couldn't give its name because I don't know foreign rifles. I know it was foreign made, and you loaded it downward into a built-in clip. The ID man took it and ejected one live round from it. The scope was facing north, the bolt facing upwards and the trigger south. But there was another rifle, a Mauser, found up on the roof of the depository that afternoon."

His '68 story excludes the '73 version, and vice versa. You'd think that he would have gotten his story straight, had it happened that way.


Getting his story straight was not the issue when there was enormous pressure on him NOT to bring up the Mauser. He knew the implications when he realized that the 6.5mm hulls did not match the 7.65mm Mauser. In his mind, at least, it implied a conspiracy, which leads you to wonder why he would put his life on the line to recount it. So your best guess is that Craig was a nut job who called out a conspiracy, which was all in his head. Alrighty then, case closed!


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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #44 on: March 23, 2020, 02:20:49 AM »


Offline John Iacoletti

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #45 on: March 23, 2020, 03:18:44 AM »
John watch this video frame by frame .....Starting at the first frame....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ep-L8ZBnJxU

What is the position of the rifle in the first frame when Lt Day reaches out and grabs the sling ?     What is the position of that leather sling?... Is it at 12:00 O'clock ( toward the ceiling)    12:15 ----12:30---or 12:45 ?   

It looks to me like the rifle is lying on its right side with the scope to the right and the sling to the left.

Online Mitch Todd

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #46 on: March 23, 2020, 04:30:07 AM »
Then why did 3 deputies (one of whom who worked at a sporting goods store) with 6 good eyes call it a Mauser?

And not just a Mauser, but a 7.65 Mauser.
What a lot of people would call a model '91 Mauser, aka an Argentine Mauser.  That particular model has a distinctive single-stack steel magazine that extends down below the forestock rather like a Carcano's. Subsequent Mausers use a dual-stack magazine that fit completely within the forestock. Beginning in the late 1950s, the Argentine government began to sell off its old Mauser bolt action rifles beginning with the model 91s. A number of firms imported them and sold them as-is, or "sporterized" them, shortening the barrels and replacing the stocks with something more along the lines of a hunting rifle. From what one a.a.jfk poster remembered, Sears and a number of other retail chains sold them in the early '60's. Weitzman may have simply seen the magazine peeking out from under the forestock and assumed that it was one of the Argie Mausers just based on that.

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #46 on: March 23, 2020, 04:30:07 AM »


Offline Gary Craig

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Re: Shells, rifle, SN... Who?
« Reply #47 on: March 23, 2020, 12:42:50 PM »