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Author Topic: Did Armstrong Get It Wrong?  (Read 889 times)

Offline Brian Doyle

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Did Armstrong Get It Wrong?
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2019, 11:34:49 PM »
    There is absolutely Nothing Southern connected to "axed". It can be heard in So Cal across to NY. Total  BS:

Point taken...

I grew up in the New York suburbs and come to think of it I did hear people say "axed"...Only I think they were people from minority households whose urban speech originated in the south...

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Did Armstrong Get It Wrong?
« Reply #10 on: October 01, 2019, 11:34:49 PM »

Online Tom Scully

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Re: Did Armstrong Get It Wrong?
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2019, 01:44:10 PM »
Say something, Tracy.  Try to be kind to the aminalz'......

(It speaks volumes about the near universal mindset of forum posters that my recent offer to attempt to help any of you sincerely interested in uncovering new details addressing your research/controversy concerns was responded to, for the most part, ONLY by requests from Michael Clark.)

Yeah, Mark! It is past time to reiterate who the worst poster on the internet is. (No, I am not referring to internet "luddite" Armstrong) John Armstrong was so intensely involved in this particular delusion in the 1990's, he actually wrote a letter to his "suspect," an actor playing the part of a detective on the TV sitcom, "Barney Miller"!

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07-09-2015, 09:52 PM  #402 (Al)bert Doyle 

FBI is lying Scully. They do so carefully by saying Rizzuto claimed Oswald was in the Village after returning from the Soviet Union. But a look at the claim would reveal the record shows the evidence Rizzuto was telling the FBI actually showed Oswald was in New York in 1961 and 1962 before the defecting Oswald returned from the Soviet Union. The Voice article was based on deceptive disinformation from the FBI in their attempt to discredit Steven Harris Landesberg and his explosive revelation that Oswald was seen with FBI provocateur Steven Richard Landesberg in New York. What FBI did was set-up SH Landesberg as being the same person as the provocateur who used the alias "L'eandes". As the evidence SH Landesberg was trying to reveal shows, L'Eandes was Steven Richard Landesberg. FBI knew this was dangerous so they screwed SH Landesberg and claimed he was L'eandes (As the inaccurate Village​ Voice article relates). That way they could commit him and not investigate the rest of the evidence that showed SR Landesberg was a provocateur who worked with the real Lee Harvey Oswald while a CIA imposter was in Russia.

Read the Education Forum Harvey & Lee thread to catch up.

Point taken...

I grew up in the New York suburbs and come to think of it I did hear people say "axed"...Only I think they were people from minority households whose urban speech originated in the south...

Ahhhh! Doyle, opining once again on southern accent.... brings back my prior disgust over his useless (clueless?) waste of all of our attention....

Doyle, (during his "impersonating his deceased father, in internet forums, and in Amazon book reviews, stage of arrested development'):

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Tom Scully posted: 07-10-2015, 06:31 AM (my reply to "FNU" Doyle is in the inner quote box, begins with: "Highly respected...")

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Originally Posted by (Al)bertDoyle
It takes real nerve to defend FBI in this case on this site. Scully, I think you have some facts mixed up. You better re-read the Armstrong link posted on page 45 of the EF thread.

I believe that link clearly describes SH Landesberg going to WMCA on the night of the assassination at around 3am. Gray had called FBI and they listened in. FBI then interviewed Rizzuto the next day.

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Respected, long time forum member Doyle, I am replying to your "Rizzuto the next day." reference here, for effect, and to make certain you do not overlook this! It takes even more nerve to dismiss the entire investigative record out of hand and replace it with unsupported speculation. I refer to the same documentary record John Armstrong cites and provides a collection of. I asked you to provide some proof, since there is none so far describing Barry Gray meeting Rizzuto face to face. Gray was not investigated on suspicion of misleading the FBI by not informing BU agents that Gray had knowledge that Rizzuto did not resemble L'eandes, but SH Landesberg was investigated and arrested. You twist your inability to support that Barry Gray saw Rizzuto in person, you ignore that Gray was not even investigated but SH Landesberg was, and then you present your suspicions as if they were my shortcoming or flaw....and you declare that I have a lot of nerve! Do you actually expect that your tactics are improving "this site"?

This is page (2) from this location. Does the web address ring a bell? What it tells us confirms it is a mistake for you to contest what I pointed out in my last post. Rizzuto called the Barry Gray show late, Gray enlisted the aid of the station's PR guy, Roger W. Turner, who steered Rizzuto immediately to meet with NYC BU agents for interview. GRAY NEVER MET FACE TO FACE with Rizzuto before FBI agents questioned Rizzuto.:

http://digitalcollections.baylor.edu/cdm/compoundobject/collection/po-arm/id/42754/rec/1


Can we move on to the Ralph Yates thread, now?
SH Landesberg did not mislead FBI. FBI misled SH Landesberg. I mean you might as well defend the Warren Commission while you are at it.

You're not following or responding to stated context here Scully. FBI pulled a fast one when it resolved the problem by showing their photo of L'eandes at a rally to the agents who interviewed Rizzuto. Both agents identified the man as Rizzuto. From that point on they created the pretext they needed to avoid having to investigate the rest of the evidence and the true identity of L'eandes. I would guess they probably found SH Landesberg's Marine psychiatric record and threatened to use it against him if he didn't confess to being L'eandes. They probably said you'll only do a week at Bellevue if you cooperate and then we'll leave you alone. Having gone through this before SH Landesberg caved and cooperated (or FBI flat out lied). Because of this he was only given a week in Bellevue. Ralph Yates was a tough Texan who wouldn't back down from what he knew to be the truth, especially against Yankee government men. They murdered Yates in a mental institution. Every single FBI document you cite was created under that pretext of burying SH Landesberg and destroying his story. For you to cite those records as if they were credible is a real violation of Deep Political understanding and only takes the side of the violators against the victim. The reason you don't see any FBI document detailing Barry Gray telling FBI that L'eandes and Rizzuto were definitely different people is because the FBI was trying to conceal that. They had made their move and were going to try to show SH Landesberg was L'eandes at all costs. But the scrutiny of the evidence Armstrong did proved otherwise. It is hardly based on "slim assumption" as you so incorrectly put it. Examination of the totality of the evidence creates a vast preponderance of SR Landesberg being L'eandes. You probably don't realize your own text betrays you. SH Landesberg was never documented speaking in a southern accent. The You-Tube videos I linked above show SR Landesberg doing so and saying "I always loved a southern accent".

Somewhere out in America in a dusty television console drawer lay and old VHS tape with a recording of a talk show Steve Landesberg was on in the 1990's. On that tape Landesberg says "I wish I never got mixed up with Oswald". Why, Mr Scully, with all that you have argued, would Steve Landesberg say that?

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http://wtracyparnell.blogspot.com/2017/01/armstrong-evolving-landesberg-theory.html

John Armstrong and His Evolving Landesberg Theory
January 06, 2017 by W Tracy Parnell

......Armstrong called this revised piece The Story of Two “Steven Landesbergs” because he has now added the late actor Steve Landesberg of Barney Miller fame to his literary lunacy. I am sorry to admit that his work was essentially inspired by my article The Hoaxster and the Conspiracy Theorists which was published at my website in April of 2015 and criticizes Armstrong and a group of like-minded individuals for their treatment of the Landesberg affair through a research period of about 10 years....

....UPDATE: Armstrong has removed all references to the “3 am Interview.”
However, because of an FBI document located by researcher Tom Scully, we now have a detailed chronology of the facts in this matter. The document shows that not only did the FBI agents who interviewed Rizzuto say that he and L’Eandes were the same person, but Roger Turner of WMCA radio did as well. Gray also saw the photo of L’Eandes and fingered him as the man he had originally interviewed in person in 1961.
According to the new document, Gray received a call from a man who identified himself as James Rizzuto sometime before 1:30 am on the 23rd of November. Rizzuto reminded Gray of the appearance of L’Eandes on his program in 1961, and added that L’Eandes knew Oswald and then promised to call back. Gray called the FBI at about 1:30 am and related the information about Rizzuto. Sometime before 2:00 am the FBI arrived at the WMCA station and interviewed Gray. At about 2:00 am Rizzuto called back while the FBI agents were there. “Under pretext with the assistance” of Roger Turner, the FBI persuaded Rizzuto to meet with them at a restaurant on 42nd Street. Turner apparently accompanied the agents to the meeting and saw Rizzuto there.
The agents met with Rizzuto and took him to the FBI offices for an interview where he related the now well-known story of Oswald, L’Eandes and Perry in New York in 1961-62. What is new here is that Rizzuto said he could not give out his home address because of “wife trouble”. He was also “evasive and secretive” about any other personal details. Rizzuto said he could be contacted at the Figaro Bar, but when agents inquired there nobody had ever heard of the fictitious Rizzuto. On November 27, Rizzuto called the FBI offices and said he had no further details to give them and again refused to provide his location.
On November 29, a photo of L’Eandes from one of the protest rallies was obtained by the FBI. The agents who interviewed Rizzuto identified the man in the photo as none other than Rizzuto. Turner likewise identified the L’Eandes photo as Rizzuto. Finally, Barry Gray identified the L’Eandes photo as the man he had interviewed in 1961. The agents now knew that Rizzuto was L’Eandes but were still unaware of Rizzuto’s true identity. The FBI report summarizes the situation perfectly:
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It appears L’Eandes assumed identity of Rizzuto and furnished information for the sole purpose of artfully involving himself in the captioned matter (JFK assassination) and thus securing desired publicity.

Another interesting piece of information from the report says that the FBI assumed L’Eandes (using yet another alias) might be the source of some of the information that was being circulated in newspapers at the time.
As mentioned previously, FBI agents eventually located Rizzuto who admitted that his real name was Stephen Harris Landesberg and he was charged with providing false information to the FBI.
The actual chronology of the Barry Gray/Rizzuto affair is as follows: .....
.:
« Last Edit: October 02, 2019, 02:21:17 PM by Tom Scully »

Offline W. Tracy Parnell

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Re: Did Armstrong Get It Wrong?
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2019, 02:27:46 PM »
Say something, Tracy.  Try to be kind to the aminalz'......

I have come to the conclusion that there is not too much you can say to those that want to believe something for whatever reason. The arguments are out there and everyone can make up their mind. I don't know what Mr. Doyle's current relationship with the Armstrong camp is (I can't keep track of everybody) but I assume he is still firmly a believer. So, I would caution him that he should not try and challenge anything in the official H&L doctrine or he could wind up persona non grata.

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Re: Did Armstrong Get It Wrong?
« Reply #12 on: October 02, 2019, 02:27:46 PM »

 

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