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Author Topic: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley  (Read 1967 times)

Offline Mike Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2019, 09:04:39 PM »
Hey Denis, Much of the information about that I am referring to comes from the video "JFK - The Smoking Gun" by Colin McLaren. It talks about Hickey, the people that saw him with a gun, and the people that smelled the gunpowder. It's about an hour and a half long and I think you can see it for $2-$3 on youtube, here's the trailer

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #10 on: August 28, 2019, 09:04:39 PM »

Online John Iacoletti

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #11 on: August 28, 2019, 09:04:59 PM »
"Shooting holes in theory that a Secret Service agent killed President Kennedy"   

https://www.inquirer.com/philly/news/Shooting_holes_in_theory_that_a_Secret_Service_agent_killed_President_Kennedy.html

From the article:

"Add in disagreements about how much JFK's head was leaning forward or turned toward the left, as seen below in a frame from the Zapruder film, and the trajectory further resembles guesswork."

Aren't they all?

Offline Jerry Organ

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2019, 10:09:54 PM »
Closeups of frames from the Charles Bronson film that were taken at the time of the fatal head shot apparently shows Hickey seated in the SS car/Queen Mary. Or at least with no rifle in his hands. It's not entirely clear (to me) that that's Hickey; I assume it's him (who else could it be?) since he was seated in the back left. However, it does show, again to me, pretty clearly no one in the back of the car with a raised rifle at the time of the head shot.

The below are from Dale Myers' site. The story/details can be found here: http://jfkfiles.blogspot.com/2013/08/drums-of-conspiracy.html





Wonder how Myers knows Hickey, rather than Bennett, is the lower of the two in the backseat. Myers believes Hickey is seated:

    "We wonder if ReelZ will show the amateur film of the assassination
     made by Charles Bronson, which shows Hickey seated at the moment
     of the fatal head shot?"



The Altgens photo, taken about three seconds before, would seem to favor Bennett as the person lower and forward of the elevated figure in Bronson. Bennett seems to me to be lower in Altgens than in Betzner/Willis; compare the level of Bennett's head relative to the level of Powers' head or the sun visor. Hickey therefore didn't change his elevation during the three seconds that followed, but did turn his head forward.

Which means Hickey, during the head shot, hasn't yet begun to reach to retrieve the rifle. Hickey starting to retrieve the gun after the last shot is consistent with what Hickey said. No other agent said he had the rifle before the last shot.

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #12 on: August 28, 2019, 10:09:54 PM »

Offline Mike Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #13 on: August 28, 2019, 10:11:03 PM »
Responding to the article https://www.inquirer.com/philly/news/Shooting_holes_in_theory_that_a_Secret_Service_agent_killed_President_Kennedy.html
 Accidents don’t get any freakier – The bullet had to go somewhere, he wasn’t aiming, he just accidently squeezed off a round.
No solid witnesses - Howard Donohue went through the Warren Report and found eleven witnesses that put the AR15 in Agent Hickeys hand at the time of the third shot. Of the eleven witnesses, seven are Secret Service agents.
Smoking Gun discredits grassy knoll – Yes because of the physics of the fatal shot. It hit JFK in the back of the passed through his brain and then exploded blowing out the right side of his forehead.  In the Zapruder film it shows blood and brain matter being blasted out of his head. That was not an entry wound. An entry wound would be slightly larger that the bullet’s diameter.
No one was sure Hickey’s fired the gun – One SS Agent said he thought that Hickey fired the gun.
Lawsuit – yes there was a lawsuit but we don’t know the particulars about it. Menninger went to Hickey’s house to confront him and Hickey didn’t even deny it. I think he said nothing and slammed the door in Menninger’s face if I remember correctly. Kind of peculiar behavior for an innocent man.
It’s dubious using a gapping hole to calculate trajectory – I don’t know that’s it’s dubious but the exit hole would have been somewhere within the gapping hole. Personally I would have used the center of the gapping hole.
Did the bullet enter near the base or 4 inches higher – The illustration shows the bullet entering JFK’s head just right of center about 2/3’s of the way up that back of his head. He deliberately tries to confuse the issue.
The frame of JFK in the limo shows him clutching his neck meaning that was his reaction to the second shot from the TSBD, not the third and fatal shot.
Any bullet fired at a cantaloupe or a watermelon is going to leave a nice round entry hole because of the soft material and the exit wound might be small and round in the case of a jacketed bullet and explosive if it’s a frangible bullet.
The pictures of the carcano bullets look like copper jacketed bullets. I believe the bullet’s fired from the 6th floor of the TSBD were steel jacketed bullets. Copper is way softer than steel.
All the points that the author brings up appear to be twisted. There is another critic that brought up a lot of points also and neglects to mention that there were actual witnesses. I believe McLaren emailed him and gave him an earful.

Offline Jerry Organ

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2019, 12:32:45 AM »
Responding to the article https://www.inquirer.com/philly/news/Shooting_holes_in_theory_that_a_Secret_Service_agent_killed_President_Kennedy.html
 Accidents don’t get any freakier – The bullet had to go somewhere, he wasn’t aiming, he just accidently squeezed off a round.
No solid witnesses - Howard Donohue went through the Warren Report and found eleven witnesses that put the AR15 in Agent Hickeys hand at the time of the third shot. Of the eleven witnesses, seven are Secret Service agents.

LOL! "in Agent Hickeys hand at the time of the third shot." Get real.

Quote
Smoking Gun discredits grassy knoll – Yes because of the physics of the fatal shot. It hit JFK in the back of the passed through his brain and then exploded blowing out the right side of his forehead.  In the Zapruder film it shows blood and brain matter being blasted out of his head. That was not an entry wound. An entry wound would be slightly larger that the bullet’s diameter.
No one was sure Hickey’s fired the gun – One SS Agent said he thought that Hickey fired the gun.
Lawsuit – yes there was a lawsuit but we don’t know the particulars about it. Menninger went to Hickey’s house to confront him and Hickey didn’t even deny it. I think he said nothing and slammed the door in Menninger’s face if I remember correctly. Kind of peculiar behavior for an innocent man.

Perfectly appropriate for an innocent man whose reputation is being assailed.

Quote
It’s dubious using a gapping hole to calculate trajectory – I don’t know that’s it’s dubious but the exit hole would have been somewhere within the gapping hole. Personally I would have used the center of the gapping hole.
Did the bullet enter near the base or 4 inches higher – The illustration shows the bullet entering JFK’s head just right of center about 2/3’s of the way up that back of his head. He deliberately tries to confuse the issue.
The frame of JFK in the limo shows him clutching his neck meaning that was his reaction to the second shot from the TSBD, not the third and fatal shot.
Any bullet fired at a cantaloupe or a watermelon is going to leave a nice round entry hole because of the soft material and the exit wound might be small and round in the case of a jacketed bullet and explosive if it’s a frangible bullet.

Problem with the melon tests is that neither Donahue nor McLaren used a surrogate for the hard tissue of the skull. Of course the FMJs aren't going to disintegrate striking the melon "head" when it's basically a ball of soft tissue. I'm surprised that McLaren's brand didn't suffer for such a serious forensic testing oversight.

Quote
The pictures of the carcano bullets look like copper jacketed bullets. I believe the bullet’s fired from the 6th floor of the TSBD were steel jacketed bullets. Copper is way softer than steel.
All the points that the author brings up appear to be twisted. There is another critic that brought up a lot of points also and neglects to mention that there were actual witnesses. I believe McLaren emailed him and gave him an earful.

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #14 on: August 29, 2019, 12:32:45 AM »

Online Royell Storing

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #15 on: August 29, 2019, 12:53:15 AM »

    Let's Not Forget: (1) SA Hickey's seated position is Higher than the Top of the Queen Mary Windshield, and (2) The JFK Limo and the Queen Mary are Traveling/Facing DOWN HILL. SA Hickey did Not need to Stand Up in order for an alleged shot fired from the AR-15 to clear the top of the Queen Mary windshield and reach the JFK Limo.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2019, 12:53:57 AM by Royell Storing »

Offline Mike Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #16 on: August 29, 2019, 02:36:55 AM »
 LOL! “In agent Hickey’s had at the time of the of the third shot.” Get real
Hey, I didn’t say it, the eleven witnesses did, were you there??
 
Perfectly appropriate for an innocent man to say, really??? How about asking what he is talking about??
Problem with melon tests………..
I am sorry but do disintegrate when they hit a melon, want to see pictures?


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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #16 on: August 29, 2019, 02:36:55 AM »

Offline Jerry Organ

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #17 on: August 29, 2019, 03:23:42 AM »
LOL! “In agent Hickey’s had at the time of the of the third shot.” Get real
Hey, I didn’t say it, the eleven witnesses did, were you there??

I have the book "Mortal Error". No where in it is there anything like:

    "Howard Donohue went through the Warren Report and found eleven witnesses
     that put the AR15 in Agent Hickeys hand at the time of the third shot"

Quote
Perfectly appropriate for an innocent man to say, really??? How about asking what he is talking about??

Some things are so ridiculous they don't dignify a serious response.

Quote
Problem with melon tests………..
I am sorry but do disintegrate when they hit a melon, want to see pictures?

FMJs disintegrate when striking a melon? Love to see that.

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #17 on: August 29, 2019, 03:23:42 AM »

Offline Mike Carney

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Offline Mike Carney

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2019, 09:30:01 AM »
McLaren: “Ten witnesses smelled gun smoke at street level at the time of the shooting”. The wind was 16 mph from the south west. The wind was blowing at 15 mph towards the TSBD. Patrolman Brown was standing above the motorcade on the overpass when he smelled gun smoke, wind was coming from behind him. Senator Yarbrough, riding in the car behind the Secret Service car, Ralph W. Yarbrough, was a war veteran and was very familiar with the smell of gun smoke. By days end, Deckers men pulled in several dozen witnesses. Hugh Betner saw one Secret Service agent pull out a gun, he was standing watching the motorcade. Senator Yarbrough also saw a rifle. Dallas Mayor see’s one Secret Service agent standup with a sub-machine gun. Secret Service agent Winston Lawson testified he saw a fellow agent holding a rifle, an automatic weapon and the first thing that went through his head is that he had fired it.
Agent Hickey was holding the AR 15. Agent Winston rides in the front of JFK in the lead car. He noticed Agent Hickey standing up in the follow up car, “I first thought that he had fired it”.

"Howard Donahue went through the Warren Report and found eleven witnesses that put the AR15 in Agent Hickeys hand at the time of the third shot. Of the eleven witnesses, seven are Secret Service agents". No mention of Mennengers book, I don't know. I have McLarens book on order, I will see what it says.

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Re: Did Hickey Fire the Fatal Shot - Originally Posted by Tom Dooley
« Reply #19 on: August 29, 2019, 09:30:01 AM »

 

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