Second Shot Reactions

[Charles Collins]

quote author=Martin Hinrichs

"What we see here is in my eyes clearly the impact-moment of the shot which hits Kennedy in his back.





"Credit Giuseppe Sabatino"

Well if someone believes that JFK already had his arms stuck up like that and his hands were already near his throat before he was hit in the back, then they must believe he had already been shot.

[Gary Craig]

Well if someone believes that JFK already had his arms stuck up like that and his hands were already near his throat before he was hit in the back, then they must believe he had already been shot.

Mr. SPECTER. As you are positioning yourself in the witness chair, your right hand is up with the finger at the ear
level as if clutching from the right of the head; would that be an accurate description of the position you pictured there?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes. Good. There was enough for me to verify that the man was hit. So, in the same motion I come right
back and grabbed the speaker and said to the driver, "Let's get out of here; we are hit," and grabbed the mike and I
said, "Lawson, this is Kellerman,"--this is Lawson, who is in the front car. "We are hit; get us to the hospital
immediately." Now, in the seconds that I talked just now, a flurry of shells come into the car. I then looked back and
this time Mr. Hill, who was riding on the left front bumper of our followup car, was on the back trunk of that car; the
President was sideways down into. the back seat.

~snip~

Mr. SPECTER. Now, in your prior testimony you described a flurry of shells into the car. How many shots did you hear
after the first noise which you described as sounding like a firecracker?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Mr. Specter, these shells came in all together.
Mr. SPECTER. Are you able to say how many you heard?
Mr. KELLERMAN. I am going to say two, and it was like a double bang--bang, bang.
Mr. SPECTER. You mean now two shots in addition to the first noise?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes, sir; yes, sir; at least.
Mr. SPECTER. What is your best estimate of the time, in seconds, from the first noise sounding like a firecracker until
the second noise which you heard?
Mr. KELLERMAN. This was instantaneous

~snip~

Mr. SPECTER. Can you describe the sound of the flurry of shots by way of distinction with the way you have described the
sound of the first shot?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Well, having heard all types of guns fired, most of them, rather, if I recall correctly these were two
sharp reports, sir. Again, I am going to refer to it as like a plane going through a sound barrier; bang, bang.
Mr. SPECTER. Now, you are referring to the flurry?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is right.
Mr. SPECTER. Did it sound differently from the first noise you have described as being a firecracker?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes; definitely; very much so.

~snip~

Mr. SPECTER. Mr. Kellerman, you said earlier that there were at least two additional shots. Is there any area in your
mind or possibility, as you recollect that situation, that there could have been more than two shots, or are you able
to say with any certainty?
Mr. KELLERMAN. I am going to say that I have, from the firecracker report and the two other shots that I know, those
were three shots. But, Mr. Specter, if President Kennedy had from all reports four wounds, Governor Connally three,
there have got to be more than three shots, gentlemen.
Senator COOPER. What is that answer? What did he say?
Mr. SPECTER. Will you repeat that, Mr. Kellerman?
Mr. KELLERMAN.President Kennedy had four wounds, two in the head and shoulder and the neck. Governor Connally, from our
reports, had three. There have got to be more than three shots.
Representative FORD. Is that why you have described--
Mr. KELLERMAN. The flurry.
Representative FORD. The noise as a flurry?

[Gary Craig]

John F Kennedy - The Autopsy

[Charles Collins]

Mr. SPECTER. As you are positioning yourself in the witness chair, your right hand is up with the finger at the ear
level as if clutching from the right of the head; would that be an accurate description of the position you pictured there?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes. Good. There was enough for me to verify that the man was hit. So, in the same motion I come right
back and grabbed the speaker and said to the driver, "Let's get out of here; we are hit," and grabbed the mike and I
said, "Lawson, this is Kellerman,"--this is Lawson, who is in the front car. "We are hit; get us to the hospital
immediately." Now, in the seconds that I talked just now, a flurry of shells come into the car. I then looked back and
this time Mr. Hill, who was riding on the left front bumper of our followup car, was on the back trunk of that car; the
President was sideways down into. the back seat.

~snip~

Mr. SPECTER. Now, in your prior testimony you described a flurry of shells into the car. How many shots did you hear
after the first noise which you described as sounding like a firecracker?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Mr. Specter, these shells came in all together.
Mr. SPECTER. Are you able to say how many you heard?
Mr. KELLERMAN. I am going to say two, and it was like a double bang--bang, bang.
Mr. SPECTER. You mean now two shots in addition to the first noise?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes, sir; yes, sir; at least.
Mr. SPECTER. What is your best estimate of the time, in seconds, from the first noise sounding like a firecracker until
the second noise which you heard?
Mr. KELLERMAN. This was instantaneous

~snip~

Mr. SPECTER. Can you describe the sound of the flurry of shots by way of distinction with the way you have described the
sound of the first shot?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Well, having heard all types of guns fired, most of them, rather, if I recall correctly these were two
sharp reports, sir. Again, I am going to refer to it as like a plane going through a sound barrier; bang, bang.
Mr. SPECTER. Now, you are referring to the flurry?
Mr. KELLERMAN. That is right.
Mr. SPECTER. Did it sound differently from the first noise you have described as being a firecracker?
Mr. KELLERMAN. Yes; definitely; very much so.

~snip~

Mr. SPECTER. Mr. Kellerman, you said earlier that there were at least two additional shots. Is there any area in your
mind or possibility, as you recollect that situation, that there could have been more than two shots, or are you able
to say with any certainty?
Mr. KELLERMAN. I am going to say that I have, from the firecracker report and the two other shots that I know, those
were three shots. But, Mr. Specter, if President Kennedy had from all reports four wounds, Governor Connally three,
there have got to be more than three shots, gentlemen.
Senator COOPER. What is that answer? What did he say?
Mr. SPECTER. Will you repeat that, Mr. Kellerman?
Mr. KELLERMAN.President Kennedy had four wounds, two in the head and shoulder and the neck. Governor Connally, from our
reports, had three. There have got to be more than three shots.
Representative FORD. Is that why you have described--
Mr. KELLERMAN. The flurry.
Representative FORD. The noise as a flurry?

So Kellerman apparently doesn’t consider the actual evidence. And he based his opinion that there was a “flurry” on his outdated and false information about the number and nature of the wounds. Nice!

[Gary Craig]

JFK's neck wound




Connaly's back wound



Mr. PURDY. Referring again to F-244, what is the earliest prior to that point that President Kennedy would have had to have been struck?
Dr. WECHT. I would say probably somewhere like--well I can't--I would put it, based upon the timing of the Zapruder film and counting the frames, I would put it back somewhere about a half a second, maybe even a little bit more, somewhere along there. I cannot be precise. I do want to point out at this time, if I may, because there is some confusion on this, sometimes there has been deliberate misrepresentation of the period of time during which the two gentlemen are behind the Stemmons Freeway sign. That is a period of 0.9 seconds. I emphasize that because we see in F-229 that indeed Gov. John Connally is sitting directly in front of the President. We see in F-244 that Gov. John Connally is still seated directly in front of the President. When we bring up the question of the trajectory, that hopefully we will get into later, they say, ah, but we cannot know what happened when they were behind the Stemmons Freeway sign. I just think it is important for the record to reflect upon the fact that what presumably they are asking us to just speculate upon is that in that 0.9 second interval, the President bent down to tie his shoelace or fix his sock, he was then shot and then sat back up. I do not mean to be flip, this is a very serious matter, but I would suggest that is a movement that the most skilled athlete, knowing what he is going to do, could not perform in that period of time. That is very important to understand, because we see their positions before and immediately afterward. I think it is pure poppycock, it would be an insult to this committee for anybody to suggest that we can't really determine trajectory because we don't know what the physical relationship was between the two men when the President was shot, and when they say under the single bullet theory, John Connally had also been shot.

[Gary Craig]

So Kellerman apparently doesn’t consider the actual evidence. And he based his opinion that there was a “flurry” on his outdated and false information about the number and nature of the wounds. Nice!

He was in the Limo when JFK was shot. I think his opinion of what happened carries some weight.

By the way, just so I can try to understand what you're trying to convey, what is it you consider false and outdated about the nature and

number of wounds?

[Charles Collins]

He was in the Limo when JFK was shot. I think his opinion of what happened carries some weight.

By the way, just so I can try to understand what you're trying to convey, what is it you consider false and outdated about the nature and

number of wounds?

KELLERMAN.President Kennedy had four wounds, two in the head and shoulder and the neck. Governor Connally, from our
reports, had three. There have got to be more than three shots.

He doesn’t identify or even differentiate the entrance wounds from the exit wounds. And he is inconsistent because he is apparently counting all four of JFK’s wounds but apparently ignoring the two exit wounds of Connally.

I said his information is false because it is incorrect. And it appears to me that he knew about the initial reports but didn’t know about the autopsy report results or the reports of the doctors that operated on JBC. Therefore, I believe that his information was outdated.

[John Mytton]

They made a whole lot of photos while setting up CE903, here's another from the same opposite side and it's obvious they are simply looking to line up the appropriate angle.



Now Gary, I'm sure you know the following devasting evidence exists yet I have never seen you post it, I wonder why?



Btw in the following composite of the above photo as compared to Crofts photo just seconds before on Elm street and we can clearly see that Kennedy's jacket is bunched. Oops!



JohnM