Users Currently Browsing This Topic:
0 Members and 8 Guests are viewing this topic.

Author Topic: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?  (Read 7813 times)

Online Thomas Graves

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2809
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #160 on: September 12, 2019, 12:56:13 AM »


Iacoletti.

If you're so tired, why are you putting so much energy into this?

Hidden agenda?

--  MWT  :)

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #160 on: September 12, 2019, 12:56:13 AM »

Offline Barry Pollard

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 615
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #161 on: September 13, 2019, 12:08:45 AM »
Based on what? And for what purpose?

What’s your evidence for this being Darnell?

That’s a good analogy. If Willis was the only thing we had to go on, then we wouldn’t know who that was on the pedestal.

You do know that the son was born in 1977, right? And that he picked a different person in the Z film than either Tommy or Westbrook?

She doesn’t say “Calvert”. She says “Calver”. She’s just not emphasizing the “y”. How do you know how Calvery said it?

I base my opinion on Westbrook upon scores and scores of witnesses statements that I've read and/or listened to whilst cross-referencing the real evidence, that and the track record of the SFM.  She's there for one reason only, to confirm that the version of events the SFM has been selling them and their parents all these years is backed up by actual/damned witnesses who were there.  Three shots only, from one direction, the building and Oswald was indeed really creepy.
What does she get out of it?  Recognition, a little cash and perhaps the chance of further appearances.

Darnell in Towner, I've already said, newspaper in right hand pocket and he's running from the Sitzman position(where he filmed her) toward another spot where he filmed three more girls.  There is no visible problems with either the timing or positions of anyone in Towner when compared to the two clips credited to Darnell.  He came out of the RRY with everyone else that wasn't police or already there beforehand, his scenes from behind the wall are evidently from around that time.  Early.  There he's within earshot of Sitzman too, that's the next piece that's been credited to him, his fliming of her being interviewed and there is no reason to believe that the Towner film was taken any later than 10-15mins after the kill.

I don't know much about the son, that he picked yet another person in the evidence is no surprise, the one we like in Z is pretty much disguised, perhaps he'll come around.  Westbrook would need a serious intervention.  But I'll wait until I hear him say Calvery, struck me as odd and again, I don't trust her.

Darnell with newspaper in right hand pocket, ten minutes before we see the same thing in Towner.  Suit, build, position, timing all good, nothing to worry about and what if... if he came back and said he didn't remember shooting any of those aftermath scenes, like Altgens did for at least one of his images, would that seriously bother you?  Not me.  Altens 8 is exactly that because we say so.  You can't rely on memory, only evidence and Towner works for both me and Jimmy.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2019, 01:33:13 AM by Barry Pollard »

Offline Barry Pollard

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 615
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #162 on: September 13, 2019, 12:45:15 AM »
Not true.  You don't know when or from where the Darnell clip was taken.  You do know that both Willis 5 and Zapruder were taken at the same time and you can also tell where and at what Z frame the Willis 5 photo was taken.  You also have testimony from both Zapruder and Sitzman that they were on that pedestal during the motorcade.

The Darnell clip you're referring to with the 3girls has very little to go on except it's position, that we can pin down, everything we need is there.  Also if Towner was just a little sharper we could actually match those people in the background near the pergola to those in his own film, not just those near the "windows" but people near the Sitzman position which he also filmed(and theres a chance we haven't seem all of that clip yet).

Testimony don't prove a thing.
Sitzman was there, right there on that spot within minutes, it's her, proven by hard evidence from Darnell of her face and a few other images taken later around the TSBD and it matches the woman seen in Bell and the early frames of Z as well as the woman caiming to be her in filmed interviews taken years later.
For Zapruder there's nothing but a body in a suit and one half decent shot of his face that bears very little resemblance to him but some of us except it and live with it.  Those are the facts.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #162 on: September 13, 2019, 12:45:15 AM »

Online Thomas Graves

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2809
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #163 on: September 15, 2019, 12:06:00 PM »
Based on what? And for what purpose?

What’s your evidence for this being Darnell?

That’s a good analogy. If Willis was the only thing we had to go on, then we wouldn’t know who that was on the pedestal.

You do know that the son was born in 1977, right? And that he picked a different person in the Z film than either Tommy or Westbrook?

She doesn’t say “Calvert”. She says “Calver”. She’s just not emphasizing the “y”. How do you know how Calvery said it?

Iacoletti,

No he didn't.

He picked your "Glasses Woman" in Betzner-3, the same woman who is so large and tall in Zapruder.

You just made that up.

--  MWT  ;)
« Last Edit: September 15, 2019, 12:06:41 PM by Thomas Graves »

Online Royell Storing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2052
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #164 on: September 15, 2019, 04:14:28 PM »
I base my opinion on Westbrook upon scores and scores of witnesses statements that I've read and/or listened to whilst cross-referencing the real evidence, that and the track record of the SFM.  She's there for one reason only, to confirm that the version of events the SFM has been selling them and their parents all these years is backed up by actual/damned witnesses who were there.  Three shots only, from one direction, the building and Oswald was indeed really creepy.
What does she get out of it?  Recognition, a little cash and perhaps the chance of further appearances.

Darnell in Towner, I've already said, newspaper in right hand pocket and he's running from the Sitzman position(where he filmed her) toward another spot where he filmed three more girls.  There is no visible problems with either the timing or positions of anyone in Towner when compared to the two clips credited to Darnell.  He came out of the RRY with everyone else that wasn't police or already there beforehand, his scenes from behind the wall are evidently from around that time.  Early.  There he's within earshot of Sitzman too, that's the next piece that's been credited to him, his fliming of her being interviewed and there is no reason to believe that the Towner film was taken any later than 10-15mins after the kill.

I don't know much about the son, that he picked yet another person in the evidence is no surprise, the one we like in Z is pretty much disguised, perhaps he'll come around.  Westbrook would need a serious intervention.  But I'll wait until I hear him say Calvery, struck me as odd and again, I don't trust her.

Darnell with newspaper in right hand pocket, ten minutes before we see the same thing in Towner.  Suit, build, position, timing all good, nothing to worry about and what if... if he came back and said he didn't remember shooting any of those aftermath scenes, like Altgens did for at least one of his images, would that seriously bother you?  Not me.  Altens 8 is exactly that because we say so.  You can't rely on memory, only evidence and Towner works for both me and Jimmy.


    In order to put Darnell in position to film the Sitzman interview, You are being extremely liberal with your 10-15 Minutes after the Kill Shot time stamping of the Towner footage showing the Pergola. Your 10-15 minute time stamping does Not fit the time stamping Towner herself applied to her own footage. Also, I find it difficult to understand why a seasoned film journalist such as Darnell would elect to stand there and film a possible Sitzman Interview when he himself had No means to also record the accompanying Verbiage. All hell is unfolding around Darnell, yet he slams on the brakes and instead chooses to film what amounts to a Fractured Flicker interview?  Highly, Highly, unlikely and simply Not in step with Darnell being almost consistently In Motion from the time the Kill Shot was fired.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #164 on: September 15, 2019, 04:14:28 PM »

Online Thomas Graves

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2809
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #165 on: September 16, 2019, 09:37:44 AM »
    In order to put Darnell in position to film the Sitzman interview, You are being extremely liberal with your 10-15 Minutes after the Kill Shot time stamping of the Towner footage showing the Pergola. Your 10-15 minute time stamping does Not fit the time stamping Towner herself applied to her own footage. Also, I find it difficult to understand why a seasoned film journalist such as Darnell would elect to stand there and film a possible Sitzman Interview when he himself had No means to also record the accompanying Verbiage. All hell is unfolding around Darnell, yet he slams on the brakes and instead chooses to film what amounts to a Fractured Flicker interview?  Highly, Highly, unlikely and simply Not in step with Darnell being almost consistently In Motion from the time the Kill Shot was fired.

Maybe he intuited that she was telling a reporter or an FBI agent what she had seen and heard, realized that she had had an excellent view of the assassination, thought that what she was telling him might be kinda interesting, and decided to mosey on over to them and do a little simultaneous eavesdropping and filming?

How much time do you figure he spent with them, anyway?

An hour?

Two?

LOL

--  MWT  ;)
« Last Edit: September 16, 2019, 09:39:11 AM by Thomas Graves »

Online Royell Storing

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2052
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #166 on: September 16, 2019, 04:39:08 PM »
Maybe he intuited that she was telling a reporter or an FBI agent what she had seen and heard, realized that she had had an excellent view of the assassination, thought that what she was telling him might be kinda interesting, and decided to mosey on over to them and do a little simultaneous eavesdropping and filming?

How much time do you figure he spent with them, anyway?

An hour?

Two?

LOL

--  MWT  ;)

       Has anyone Ever viewed the Entire Sitzman Interview or even Know with certainty how long it lasted?  All we ever see is an extremely quick video snippet or still frame. Zapruder possibly being visible in Any portion of this Sitzman interview would impact his accepted timeline. This would include the timeline of Zapruder bumping into Harry McCormick.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #166 on: September 16, 2019, 04:39:08 PM »

Offline Bill Chapman

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2883
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #167 on: September 17, 2019, 03:53:42 AM »

Seriously, Iacoletti, have you always had as hard a time telling women from men as you're having with those three people on the Pergola Patio in the Towner film?

--  MWT   ;)

Can you post the pictures again

Thanks

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #167 on: September 17, 2019, 03:53:42 AM »

Online Thomas Graves

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2809
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #168 on: September 17, 2019, 05:00:16 AM »
Can you post the pictures again

Thanks

Bill,

Which "pictures" are you referring to?

Iacoletti and I have argued about several people in a lot of photos, frames, and films.

Big, tall Gloria Calvery (and her three headscarf-wearing colleagues -- Karan Hicks, Carol Reed and Karen Westbrook -- to her immediate left in Zapruder) ?

Stella Mae Jacob, Gloria Holt and Sharon Simmons by the Stemmons sign in Zapruder (Iacolett's and Westbrook's "... uh ... probably Carol Reed, definitely Gloria Calvery, and definitely me, Karen Westbrook!") ?

The three people on the Pergola Patio in the Towner film?  (Stella Mae Jacob, Gloria Holt and Sharon Simmons, aka Iacoletti's "blobs" or "men wearing Bermuda shorts") ?

-- MWT  ;)

PS  He and I haven't argued about Jane Berry, Betty Thornton, and Peggy Burney (the original subjects of this thread) for the simple reason that I haven't been able to identify them yet!

One thing's for sure, though, they certainly aren't the women Robin Unger or Don Roberdeau mislabled several years ago (Hicks, Reed and Westbrook).  LOL


« Last Edit: September 17, 2019, 06:00:07 AM by Thomas Graves »

Online Thomas Graves

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2809
Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #169 on: September 17, 2019, 05:52:27 AM »
Go to page 21 to see the photo he posted of some male models wearing Bermuda shorts.

https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1780.200.html


And scroll down the first page of this thread to see the three people on the Pergola Patio he thinks might be  dudes wearing Bermuda shorts:

https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1303.0.html

--  MWT   :D :D :D

« Last Edit: September 17, 2019, 06:15:21 AM by Thomas Graves »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Where Were Jane Berry, Betty Thornton and Peggy Burney During the Motorcade?
« Reply #169 on: September 17, 2019, 05:52:27 AM »

 

Mobile View