CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?

[Walt Cakebread]

If this MC rifle was planted before the fact then the conspirators must not have realized that west side of the floor was being laid with new plywood necessitating having to move boxes

Seems like a risky place to pre hide the rifle near the stairs

However, if rifle was hastily planted after the fact , near the stairwell would be quickest place  sliding under the pallettes

Maybe Weitzman observed or at least realized the rifle was moved from UNDER a palette to its new position In a gap between 2 parallel rows of boxes

Perhaps Weitzman even witnessed a hand sliding a rifle thru the space of the pallet In coincidence with Boone shining a light

At the very least, Weitzman may have witnessed the destacking of the wall of boxes in order to photograph a rifle no longer laying “flat” and within the frame of a wooden palette

Instead, now the rifle was in vertical position up against a wall of boxes with NO wooden palette underneath the boxes

Seems like a risky place to pre hide the rifle near the stairs

Au contrair, monsieur ....  The LOGICAL place to hide the rifle was along a logical escape route.....That's where the police would look for a discarded weapon. And in fact the police DID search along the escape route several times before Boone and Weitzman discovered the well hidden rifle, beneath the pallet.  Had the rifle been in the location depicted in the official in situ photos it would have been discovered earlier.  They simply didn't anticipate Lee being in the 2nd floor lunchroom, when the plot called for him to be on the sixth floor.  When a DPD officer (Baker) saw Lee in the lunchroom about 90 seconds after the shooting they realized that the fact that the rifle was over five feet away from the escape route ( and buried beneath the pallet of book boxes) was an absolute rebuttal of their tale that Lee had ran by and dropped the rifle into the crack between boxes.   Baker's encounter with Oswald in the lunchroom really put the screws to their plot. 

However, if rifle was hastily planted after the fact , near the stairwell would be quickest place  sliding under the pallettes

Please present a realistic  estimate of the time necessary to hide the rifle beneath the pallet .....after moving the boxes of books, and then placing the rifle on the floor beneath the pallet and then stacking the boxes of books back over and around the rifle .

[Zeon Mason]

Ok Walt, you got a point there depending what kind of wooden palette

I was envisioning a palette that’s got about 4” space made from 2x4 s thru witch a rifle could be placed regardless how many boxes stacked on the upper platform

Do you have a photo of what type wooden palette was there on the 6th floor TBDS?

if it’s just  1x4 overlapping board type then. I’m in agreement that it would be difficult to quickly wedge rifle all the way underneath and probably would require removing boxes to lighten the load to do so

[Jerry Freeman]

A glitch in the timeline....

January 28, 1962: LHO orders a .38 caliber Smith and Wesson revolver by mail.
 Should be [if it indeed happened] 1963
 March 9-10, 1963: LHO takes photographs of the home of General Edwin Walker, a right wing activist.
March 12, 1963: Ruth Paine visits Marina at the new apartment. Also that day, LHO orders a rifle from Klein's Sporting Goods in Chicago.
March 20, 1963: The rifle and the revolver are shipped
March 25, 1963: LHO picks up the weapons   

Notice the remarkable 'coincidence' that the pistol [supposedly ordered two months before the rifle was] was shipped and then claimed on respectively the very same day as the rifle.
What are the chances of this?
Also note that presumably...Lee goes over to take pictures at General Walker's before any rifle to shoot him with ever arrives.
Why in hell take pictures anyway? What purpose would it serve?

[Tim Nickerson]

A glitch in the timeline....Notice the remarkable 'coincidence' that the pistol [supposedly ordered two months before the rifle was] was shipped and then claimed on respectively the very same day as the rifle.
What are the chances of this?
Also note that presumably...Lee goes over to take pictures at General Walker's before any rifle to shoot him with ever arrives.
Why in hell take pictures anyway? What purpose would it serve?

The revolver was not ordered two months before the rifle was.  Jan 27, 1963 was the date that Oswald filled out the coupon, not the date that he mailed it.

[Walt Cakebread]

A glitch in the timeline....Notice the remarkable 'coincidence' that the pistol [supposedly ordered two months before the rifle was] was shipped and then claimed on respectively the very same day as the rifle.
What are the chances of this?
Also note that presumably...Lee goes over to take pictures at General Walker's before any rifle to shoot him with ever arrives.
Why in hell take pictures anyway? What purpose would it serve?

When seen in the "blue notebook " dossier that Lee created along with the BY photo and maps of the area near Walker's house the photo would serve to convince any viewer that Lee had been stalking Walker and planning to ambush him .   And that was the crux of the plot.... The bullet hole in Walker's window was intended to be mute evidence that someone had tried to kill Walker ( a very vocal foe of Fidel Castro)    Lee had created the false dossier with the idea that the police would trace the rifle ( which he had left for the police to find)   reminds one of the TSBD sixth floor !    Lee had planned to be a "fugitive" and on his way to Cuba when the police discovered the blue note book with the BY photo (CE 133A) and the photo of Walker's house in it.   

The plot never blossomed because the police didn't fall for the nonsense that Walker spewed......

[Walt Cakebread]

Ok Walt, you got a point there depending what kind of wooden palette

I was envisioning a palette that’s got about 4” space made from 2x4 s thru witch a rifle could be placed regardless how many boxes stacked on the upper platform

Do you have a photo of what type wooden palette was there on the 6th floor TBDS?

if it’s just  1x4 overlapping board type then. I’m in agreement that it would be difficult to quickly wedge rifle all the way underneath and probably would require removing boxes to lighten the load to do so

Ok Walt, you got a point there

Thank you, Z....    But I hope you aren't simply taking my word....Have you seen Detective Studebaker's map of the sixth floor?    Studebaker measured the distance from the North Wall to the rifle on the floor, and recorded that distance as 15 feet 4 inches.   Since the aisle at the top of the stairs, that Lee would have had to pass through was approximately 10 feet from the north wall, he would have had to have reached across five feet and down four feet to place the eight pound rifle beneath the stack of boxes of books.    DO YOU BELIEVE THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN POSSIBLE???

[Jerry Organ]

Ok Walt, you got a point there

Thank you, Z....    But I hope you aren't simply taking my word....Have you see Detective Studebaker's map of the sixth floor?    Studebaker measured the distance from the North Wall to the rifle on the floor, and recorded that distance as 15 feet 4 inches.   Since the aisle at the top of the stairs, that Lee would have had to pass through was approximately 10 feet from the north wall, he would have had to have reached across five feet and down four feet to place the eight pound rifle beneath the stack of boxes of books.    DO YOU BELIEVE THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN POSSIBLE???

Map showing steps started about 10' 6" from North wall. First row of boxes begin about 14' 3" from steps.

Note first row of boxes southward from steps. South is towards viewer. Boxes in foreground at greater height were on a wood pallet.

Rifle located immediately south of first row of boxes southward from steps. Simple matter to reach over that row of boxes to place rifle on floor.

[Tim Nickerson]

Map showing steps started about 10' 6" from North wall. First row of boxes begin about 14' 3" from steps.

Note first row of boxes southward from steps. South is towards viewer. Boxes in foreground at greater height were on a wood pallet.

Rifle located immediately south of first row of boxes southward from steps. Simple matter to reach over that row of boxes to place rifle on floor.

Looking at the map in GIMP, the center of the aisle that Lee would have had to pass through was about four feet from where the rifle was found. If Oswald was reaching when he placed the rifle, the distance would have been less than that. It don't know what Walt means by "down four feet".