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Author Topic: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?  (Read 42499 times)

Online Gary Craig

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #40 on: June 03, 2019, 08:08:38 PM »
Opinion polls reflect how persuasive the Oswald defenders/conspiracy kooks (assisted by Stone's overwhelming Hollywood version) are.

Spence tried the sentimental-humanizing appeal in 1986 to little avail. CTs similarly argue that Oswald was a simple family man innocently manipulated and set-up. Having to "prove" things through time-travel doesn't sit well with judges.

"Opinion polls reflect how persuasive the Oswald defenders/conspiracy kooks (assisted by Stone's overwhelming Hollywood version) are."

 ::)

"...Popular belief in a conspiracy was widespread within a week of Kennedy's murder. Between November 25 and 29, 1963,
University of Chicago pollsters asked more than 1,000 Americans whom they thought was responsible for the president's
death. By then, the chief suspect, Oswald -- a leftist who had lived for a time in Soviet Union -- had been shot dead
while in police custody by Jack Ruby, a local hoodlum with organized crime connections.

While the White House, the FBI, and the Dallas Police Department all affirmed that Oswald had acted alone, 62 percent
of respondents said they believed that more than one person was involved in the assassination. Only 24 percent thought
Oswald had acted alone. Another poll taken in Dallas during the same week found 66 percent of respondents believing that
there had been a plot. There were no JFK conspiracy theories in print at that time..."


==================

"...many senior U.S. officials concluded that there had been a plot but rarely talked about it openly.

Kennedy's successor, Lyndon Johnson, publicly endorsed the Warren Commissions conclusion that Oswald acted alone. Privately,
LBJ told many people, ranging from Atlantic contributor Leo Janos to CIA director Richard Helms, that he did not believe the
lone-gunman explanation.

The president's brother Robert and widow Jacqueline also believed that he had been killed by political enemies, according to
historians Aleksandr Fursenko and Tim Naftali. In their 1999 book on the Cuban missile crisis, One Hell of a Gamble: Khrushchev,
Castro, and Kennedy, 1958-1964, they reported that William Walton -- a friend of the First Lady -- went to Moscow on a previously
scheduled trip a week after JFK's murder. Walton carried a message from RFK and Jackie for their friend, Georgi Bolshakov, a
Russian diplomat who had served as a back-channel link between the White House and the Kremlin during the October 1962 crisis:
RFK and Jackie wanted the Soviet leadership to know that "despite Oswald's connections to the communist world, the Kennedys
believed that the president was felled by domestic opponents."

In the Senate, Democrats Richard Russell of Georgia and Russell Long of Louisiana both rejected official accounts of the assassination.
In the executive branch, Joseph Califano, the General Counsel of Army in 1963 and later Secretary of Health Education and Welfare,
concluded that Kennedy had been killed by a conspiracy.* In the White House, H.R. Haldeman, chief of staff to President Richard Nixon,
wanted to reopen the JFK investigation in 1969. Nixon wasn't interested.

Suspicion persisted in the upper echelons of the U.S. national security agencies, as well. Col. L. Fletcher Prouty, chief of Pentagon
special operations in 1963 (and later an adviser to Stone), believed that there had been a plot.

Winston Scott, chief of the CIA's station in Mexico City at the time of Kennedy's murder and an ultra-conservative Agency loyalist,
rejected the Warren Commission's findings about a trip that Oswald had taken to Mexico six weeks before the assassination. Scott
concluded in an unpublished memoir that Oswald had, indeed, been just a patsy.

None of these figures was a paranoid fantasist. To the contrary, they constituted a cross section of the American power elite in 1963.
Neither did they talk about a JFK conspiracy for public consumption; they talked about it only reservedly, in confined circles..."


http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2010/11/the-kennedy-assassination-47-years-later-what-do-we-really-know/66722/

Offline Jerry Organ

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #41 on: June 04, 2019, 04:42:06 AM »
"Opinion polls reflect how persuasive the Oswald defenders/conspiracy kooks (assisted by Stone's overwhelming Hollywood version) are."

 ::)

"...Popular belief in a conspiracy was widespread within a week of Kennedy's murder. Between November 25 and 29, 1963,
University of Chicago pollsters asked more than 1,000 Americans whom they thought was responsible for the president's
death. By then, the chief suspect, Oswald -- a leftist who had lived for a time in Soviet Union -- had been shot dead
while in police custody by Jack Ruby, a local hoodlum with organized crime connections.

While the White House, the FBI, and the Dallas Police Department all affirmed that Oswald had acted alone, 62 percent
of respondents said they believed that more than one person was involved in the assassination. Only 24 percent thought
Oswald had acted alone. Another poll taken in Dallas during the same week found 66 percent of respondents believing that
there had been a plot. There were no JFK conspiracy theories in print at that time..."



Those are opinion polls on Jack Ruby's having just shot Oswald, not on the influence of conspiracy theorists.



Polls tightened in the wake of the Warren Report but widen with the first conspiracy books and debates.

Online Colin Crow

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #42 on: June 04, 2019, 05:05:35 AM »
Those are opinion polls on Jack Ruby's having just shot Oswald, not on the influence of conspiracy theorists.



Polls tightened in the wake of the Warren Report but widen with the first conspiracy books and debates.

And no real influence of the movie "JFK".   ;)
« Last Edit: June 04, 2019, 05:06:53 AM by Colin Crow »

Online Gary Craig

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #43 on: June 04, 2019, 02:40:12 PM »
Those are opinion polls on Jack Ruby's having just shot Oswald, not on the influence of conspiracy theorists.



Polls tightened in the wake of the Warren Report but widen with the first conspiracy books and debates.

"Those are opinion polls on Jack Ruby's having just shot Oswald, not on the influence of conspiracy theorists."

I have no idea what you're trying to convey with the above.

Here are the pertinent poll findings from the article.

"62 percent of respondents said they believed that more than one person was involved in the assassination. Only 24 percent thought
Oswald had acted alone. Another poll taken in Dallas during the same week found 66 percent of respondents believing that
there had been a plot. There were no JFK conspiracy theories in print at that time"

Online Gary Craig

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #44 on: June 04, 2019, 02:55:35 PM »

~snip~

Polls tightened in the wake of the Warren Report but widen with the first conspiracy books and debates.


All that says is the Warren Report doesn't hold up when scrutinized.

Offline Richard Smith

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #45 on: June 04, 2019, 03:51:15 PM »
All that says is the Warren Report doesn't hold up when scrutinized.

How many people who participate in these polls have "scrutinized" the WC?  I bet half or more haven't even heard of it and less than ten percent have read a single page.  Most people don't know the basic facts fifty plus years later or give a fig.  Their uninformed opinions are worthless.  They are more likely to have seen Stone's wacky, paranoid fueled film and believe "something" may have happened.  What they have no idea.  Or that "one guy" couldn't pull it off for some unspecified reason.  The kind of baseless nonsense that is peddled by many CTers despite the overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #46 on: June 04, 2019, 07:09:17 PM »
Here on the 22nd at about 6:15, Lt. Day can be seen holding CE 139 and the gouge can be clearly made out on the Forestock. Are you claiming that he could have taken Oswald's prints from another rifle?



Boo hoo, how does that change Day's testimony or the physical evidence or anything?

Sorry John, Hoover provided a memo and matching evidence which shows the precise location of a number of corresponding anomalies. The rifle still exists and the Palmprint still exists so your reasoning that this powerful evidence is somehow just a claim is nonsensical. If you or the CT community feels this strongly re this deception then why don't you do something about it and provide an expert scientific refutation or would you rather just flap your gums and rely on voodoo?



And this is the best you got, you're not very good at this, are you John.

JohnM

Mr Mytton....What caused the two parallel lines that are clearly visible in the photo?

Does the 5/8 inch diameter metal barrel of a Mannlicher Carcano have any characteristic that would create the two lines?

Offline Bill Chapman

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #47 on: June 04, 2019, 08:16:55 PM »
"Those are opinion polls on Jack Ruby's having just shot Oswald, not on the influence of conspiracy theorists."

I have no idea what you're trying to convey with the above.

Here are the pertinent poll findings from the article.

"62 percent of respondents said they believed that more than one person was involved in the assassination. Only 24 percent thought
Oswald had acted alone. Another poll taken in Dallas during the same week found 66 percent of respondents believing that
there had been a plot. There were no JFK conspiracy theories in print at that time"


So everybody believes Oswald was the shooter. Got it.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2019, 08:37:20 PM by Bill Chapman »

Online John Iacoletti

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #48 on: June 04, 2019, 10:49:42 PM »
Here on the 22nd at about 6:15, Lt. Day can be seen holding CE 139 and the gouge can be clearly made out on the Forestock. Are you claiming that he could have taken Oswald's prints from another rifle?

This photo of Day holding up a rifle is supposed to somehow prove that the print on the index card came from that rifle?

Quote
Boo hoo, how does that change Day's testimony or the physical evidence or anything?

Boo hoo.  Just because Day claimed something, that means it's true?  Even if it contradicts what Latona and Drain said?

Quote
Sorry John, Hoover provided a memo and matching evidence which shows the precise location of a number of corresponding anomalies.



Yeah, those "corresponding anomalies" are clear as mud.   :D

Online John Iacoletti

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Re: CT's, how did Oswald's rifle end up on the 6th floor?
« Reply #49 on: June 04, 2019, 10:52:42 PM »
Oswald ordered the rifle.

This cute picture doesn't show that Oswald ordered anything.

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Oswald possessed the rifle.

This cute picture doesn't show that Oswald possessed any specific rifle.

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Oswald's rifle was found at Oswald's work with Oswald's prints.

"Oswald's rifle".  LOL.  "With Oswald's prints".  LOL.

 

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