Users Currently Browsing This Topic:
0 Members

Author Topic: That "whole Bay of Pigs thing"  (Read 5137 times)

Offline Colin Crow

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1860
Re: That "whole Bay of Pigs thing"
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2019, 05:42:25 AM »
Advertisement

Obviously authorization of any plot to assassinate must come from the WH but the limitations placed upon Belin made it impossible to provide those specific when and who details. Given the mid-1959 timing of the "go-ahead" to discuss with Roselli, does anyone think the "Pres in waiting" Nixon was not all over this thing?

From Belin's Report (Rockefeller Commission 1975)

Bissell states that plans were developed to assassinate Lamumba and Sukarno. No assassination plans would be undertaken without authorization outside the Agency.
With respect to Castro??Therefore, the CIA, with appropriate authorization, undertook the development of an operation in support of Cuban exiles seeking to overthrow the Castro Government, the culmination of which became the Bay of Pigs disaster in April 1961.?

Also the CIA supported a late 1959 attempt against Castro via snipers. The Castro assassination attempts originated under the Eisenhower administration.

There are other comments in the Belin Report that back up the obvious.....any such action (ie. assassination) must have WH approval of some sort even allowing for plausible denial.

And this gives a clue as how there was a dual mechanism for dealing with issues, some under the larger NSC and others by a select smaller group.

"An examination of several of the major foreign policy problems that confronted the Eisenhower administration reveals that the NSC system was used to manage some and was virtually bypassed in others. When the question involved a policy debate between departments with strongly-held, contending positions, as it did in the case of the debate between the Departments of State and Defense in 1956(1957 over whether to introduce a more modern generation of weapons into Korea, the NSC process focused debate and produced an agreed decision after discussion of three draft policy papers.

Crisis situations, however, such as the Suez crisis of 1956, the off-shore island crises of 1955 and 1958, and the Lebanon crisis of 1958, were typically managed through telephone conversations between Eisenhower, Dulles, and other principal advisers, and through small meetings with the President in the White House, normally involving Dulles and other concerned advisers. Eisenhower sometimes used trusted NSC staffers to serve as an intermediary to gain information outside the chain of command as he did with Colonel Goodpaster during the Quemoy crisis in 1955."

Therefore the assassination discussions would have been via a select group and not the NSC or associated committees. This explains the comments of Dillon mentioned earlier. he was not "in the loop".

"C. Douglas Dillon, a member of this Commission, stated that while he served as Under Secretary of State from June 1959 until early January 1961, he heard no discussion of assassination attempts against anyone, except discussions which occurred in late July or early August of 1960 at a meeting at the Pentagon which covered  a great variety of matters in which "...a question regarding the possibility of an assassination attempt against Lumumba was briefly raised. The CIA representative indicated that the Agency did not undertake this sort of operation. This ended consideration of this subject." 
« Last Edit: May 09, 2019, 05:54:40 AM by Colin Crow »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: That "whole Bay of Pigs thing"
« Reply #16 on: May 09, 2019, 05:42:25 AM »


Offline Colin Crow

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1860
Re: That "whole Bay of Pigs thing"
« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2019, 10:18:49 PM »
Some familiar characters involved in this one......

Gerald Ford White House Altered Rockefeller Commission Report in 1975; Removed Section on CIA Assassination Plots

https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/briefing-book/intelligence/2016-02-29/gerald-ford-white-house-altered-rockefeller-commission-report

Offline Tom Scully

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1216
Re: That "whole Bay of Pigs thing"
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2019, 06:23:25 PM »
.....
Cogswell grew up one mile away from F Scott Fitzgerald's literary agent, Harold Ober. Cogswell attended Phillips Exeter at the same time as Ober's son, Richard, the future CIA agent close to Angleton. Cogswell first marriage, in 1945, was to the daughter of Cornelius Van Ness. a friend of Fitzgerald in Minnesota, early in his writing career.
Quote
https://www.nytimes.com/1995/07/23/books/the-other-sides-of-paradise.html
The Other Sides of Paradise
By BROOKE ALLEN JULY 23, 1995
...Two new books throw light on the well-known material by telling the life stories of supporting actors in the drama: the Fitzgeralds' daughter, Frances Scott, and the woman with whom Fitzgerald spent the last three years of his life, the Hollywood gossip columnist Sheilah Graham. Both books, oddly enough, are written by their subjects' children....

...DURING her teen-age years in the 1930's, Scottie was fortunate enough to have surrogate parents in the form of Fitzgerald's agent, Harold Ober, and his wife, Anne. She attended Vassar, wrote short stories for several magazines (including The New Yorker) at a precocious age, and in 1943 married Samuel Jackson Lanahan, a law student who came from a well-to-do Baltimore family. The couple moved to Washington, where Lanahan joined the Justice Department. There they became one of the best-and-brightest glamour couples of the heady 50's and 60's. ...
......

Quote
Suzy Says
DeMohrenschildt Mystery
By Suzy Knickerbocker
4/16/77 DMN

....De Mohrenschildt is constantly referred to as a mystery man and reputed member of Russian nobility.
He was neither.....In fact, this self-proclaimed society-hater, a geologist who insisted he was most comfortable amongst
intellectuals spent a lot of time hanging around the Racquet Club, the exclusive New York male
stronghold with Edward Hooker (the son of his stepaunt, the Countess Dimitri de Mohrenschildt)
and such sound social chaps as Staley Tregellas and Jake Cogswell.....
...According to family and friends DeMohrenschildt was undoubtedly a CIA stringer and periodically
made unexplained trips abroad. His Socially Registered confidant Jake Cogswell, another CIA
stringer, who established residence in Cuba before Castro. He barely made it out before the ax fell.

I have been searching for confirmation the Cogswells were familiar with the Obers for 5+ years. Earlier today, Eureka!
James (Jack aka Jake) K Cogswell III, Richard Ober, and Nick Katzenbach all simultaneously attended Phillips Exeter School.
Jackie was hired as a book editor by Tom Guinzberg after her return from Greece. Patsy Southgate, maid of owner in Nathan Ober wedding in image below, married Guinzberg Yale  roommate Peter Mathiessen who worked side by side with John Train and George Plimpton at Paris
Review in early 1950s.



Quote
https://www.theparisreview.org/letters-essays/6069/thomas-guinzburg-peter-matthiessen
Peter Matthiessen ISSUE 195, WINTER 2010
1926–2010

What great good luck for our nebulous and as yet unnamed Paris Review when Tom Guinzburg, all unsuspecting of the role he was to play, turned up in Paris in the spring of 1952, shortly after Bill Styron made his ­appearance. The president-to-be of The Viking Press, the eminent house founded by his father, Harold Guinzburg, Tom had served as managing editor of the Yale Daily News under Wm. Buckley (whose sister Jane was the main reason Tom had come to Paris) and as a senior-year roommate of the undersigned, who could confidently recommend his character, intelligence, and humor—a man, in short, whose sociability could be counted on (though not, it must be said, invariably; in one of his rare “surls,” he turned so dark of visage as to win the sobriquet “Black Tom”). With Bill and George, too, “Guinzo,” aka “Tombo,” was to become a lifelong friend. Board president from 2003 to 2006, he remained ever loyal to The Paris Review, which he served well for more than fifty years.

—PETER MATTHIESSEN

When Tom Guinzburg became president of The Viking Press in 1961, its editors and other staff were, of course, people his father had hired. But Tom rapidly put his own personal stamp on Viking. No books were signed up that he didn’t personally approve, no advances against earnings offered that he didn’t authorize, no publicity plans and marketing arrangements plotted without his knowledge. And he made the often humdrum procedures quite dashing, being dashing himself.

His big corner office had a rather opulent, slightly louche air that ­suited this big handsome man with his well-cut suits, boldly striped shirts, huge hands, and dazzling, rare smile. On a windowsill sat an enormous horned Viking helmet. A dartboard on one wall, to which he’d pin photos of agents and book reviewers who’d irritated him, was positioned so that he could take aim right from his desk.....




George Ohrstrom was an usher in Peter Matthiessen's (of the Paris Review and the CIA) wedding, as was the sister-in-law of Richard Ober of CIA. Usher Thomas Guinzburg would later hire Jackie Onassis. He was Matthiessen's Yale roommate and presented as not being witty to Matthiessen's CIA affiliation, but Guinzburg's father was OSS minister of propaganda (OWI) and immediately after WWII led a US intelligence program intended to influence what would and would not be suitable subject matter for publication



In 1937 Ohrstrom's father George was suspended from bond dealing and other financial brokerage activity by SEC on fraud accusations.
By 1943, Prescott Bush and others accomplished a messy rehab of Ohrstrom restoring his financial business license but not his reputation.:



CAROLINE MORGAN I5 MARRIED HERE
Bride at S. James' of John DeWitt Macomber—Couple Attended by Twenty-two


« Last Edit: June 30, 2019, 06:51:33 PM by Tom Scully »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: That "whole Bay of Pigs thing"
« Reply #18 on: June 30, 2019, 06:23:25 PM »