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Author Topic: Photographic Proof John Templin's Standing Next To "Glasses Woman" In Betzner-3  (Read 3673 times)

Online Thomas Graves

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John Iacoletti denies that it can be proved from the photos and films that his "Glasses Woman" in Betzner-3 is  Big-Tall, Black-Blouse And Black-Headscarf-Wearing Woman (Gloria Calvery) in the Zapruder film.

If he were to were to read Dallas News' November 2012 article You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login about JFK assassination witnesses Ernest Brandt and John Templin, ...

... and if he were to look at Robin Unger's infamous yellow-labeled Zapruder-151 frame and at Don Roberdeau's Map and find in them (gasp ... correctly-labeled!) Ernest Brand standing next to his (gasp ... correctly labeled!) 21 year-old friend John Templin, ...

... and if he were to look at the people, cars, and background in Betzner-3 and compare them with the people, cars, and background in Willis-5, ...

... Scrolling down until he finds said photos, and then enlarge them to his heart's content --
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... taking special care to notice that John Templin is in both Betzner-3 and Willis-5), ...

... and if he were to take into consideration the fact that Hugh Betzner -- whose "Betzner-3" was taken simultaneously with Z-187 and 0.874/second before "Willis-5" -- was standing on the other side of Elm Street, about 30 feet behind and a little to the left of Phil Willis (per Zapruder's LOS at Z-187) on the other side of Elm Street, ...

... and if he were to realize that Robin Unger's seriously mislabeled Zapruder frame is Z-151, and that Betzner-3 was taken simultaneously with Zapruder-187, and that Willis-5 was taken simultaneously with Zapruder-202, ...

... and if he were to realize that Abraham Zapruder can be seen standing on his pedestal and very near the L-R center point of both Willis-3 and Betzner-5 ( You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login ; ignore the red circle around so-called Black Dog Man in Willis-5), ...

... and if he were to realize that both Phil Willis and Hugh Betzner are visible in the background of Unger's yellow-labeled Z-151 frame (or at least in a clearer frame near it), ...

... well gosh, taking all of the above together (I mean he IS capable of doing that sort of thing, isn't he?), ...

... he'd realize that fedora-wearing trilby-wearing Ernest Brandt can be seen standing next to John Templin in Willis-5, and that John Templin can be seen standing next to your "Glasses Woman" (Gloria Calvery) in Betzner-3.

...

"Got it" now, Iacoletti?

-- MWT  :)

« Last Edit: April 20, 2019, 05:25:26 PM by Thomas Graves »

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Offline John Iacoletti

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Or do you require a POWERPOINT PRESENTATION, NOTARIZED STATEMENTS, AND DNA SAMPLES?[/size]

I require more than just your say-so.  For one thing, why should I believe you when you say that Unger mislabeled anything?

Secondly, why don't you just post the photos and mark who it is you're talking about instead of writing paragraphs and paragraphs of obtuse descriptions?

Thirdly, how does any of this rot show that the guy next to the Betzner blob is named John Templin?

Online Thomas Graves

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I require more than just your say-so.  For one thing, why should I believe you when you say that Unger mislabeled anything?

Secondly, why don't you just post the photos and mark who it is you're talking about instead of writing paragraphs and paragraphs of obtuse descriptions?

Thirdly, how does any of this show that the guy next to the Betzner blob is named John Templin?

Iacoletti,

1)  In his yellow-labeled Z-151 frame, Robin Unger got six people wrong and didn't even attempt to label the Big And Tall, Black-Blouse And Black-Headscarf-Wearing Gal (your "Glasses Woman"). LOL  If I remember correctly, Unger has grudgingly admitted that he mislabeled self-described American Indian Stella Mae Jacob as "Gloria Calvary" (sic).

2)  I already have posted Betzner-3 and Willis-5, Iacoletti.  They're in that long article by John Hunt, Jr. at the McAdams website.  All you have to do is scroll down and find them.  Let me know if you need any help in spotting Abraham Zapruder in them.  Let me know if you need help in spotting your "Glasses Woman" in Betzner-3, and the bare-headed guy (21 year-old John Templin) standing next to her.  Note how Templin is leaning a little bit towards your "Glasses Woman" in both Zapruder and Betzner-3, and how the peak of the fedora hat Templin's buddy, Ernest Brandt, is wearing can be seen peeking up from behind the right shoulder of the leaning-forward SS guy on the Queen Mary.

As regards Unger's yellow-labeled Z-151 frame and Roberdeau's map (in which Roberdeau recently moved Jean Newman to the other side of the unlabeled brown dot representing your "Glasses Woman" -- LOL), I'm afraid you're going to have to look them up, yourself.

3)  Have you read that 2012 Dallas News article about Templin and Brandt yet, Iacoletti? How do you imagine that Unger and Roberdeau actually labeled them correctly (they did, btw)?

Did they interview them? Did they read that article or one similar to it?  Did they meet them in Dealey Plaza one November the 22nd?

(IDK, but they did get them right.)

--  Mud Wrassler Tommy  :)
« Last Edit: April 03, 2019, 06:54:16 PM by Thomas Graves »

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Offline John Iacoletti

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Iacoletti,

1)  In his yellow-labeled Z-151 frame, Robin Unger got six people wrong

That's easy for you to say -- with no evidence whatsoever.  It's just as easy to say that you got seven people wrong.

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2)  I already have posted Betzner-3 and Willis-5, Iacoletti.  They're in that long article by John Hunt, Jr. at the McAdams website.  All you have to do is scroll down and find them.

No, you posted obtuse descriptions of them and links to offsite pages rather than just posting the photos and annotating them with who you are talking about.

And you still have provided ZERO evidence to support your identifications of Templin and Brandt, or how you decided that Templin was standing next to "tall woman" in Zapruder.  Nor have you marked where you think you see "glasses" on Betzner-blob.

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3)  Have you read that 2012 Dallas News article about Templin and Brandt yet, Iacoletti?

Indeed I have.  All is says is that Brandt "waved around a blurry photo", and that he was wearing a fedora that day.  It doesn't say what photo or where he was in the photo.  BFD.

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How do you imagine that Unger and Roberdeau actually labeled them correctly (they did, btw)?

I don't know.  But if you are going to cite them as authoritative, you better know how they made their determinations.  Particularly when you've picking and choosing what they got right and what they got wrong.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 07:08:44 PM by John Iacoletti »

Online Thomas Graves

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No, you posted obtuse descriptions of them and links to offsite pages rather than just posting the photos and annotating them with who you are talking about.

And you still have provided ZERO evidence to support your identifications of Templin and Brandt, or how you decided that Templin was standing next to "tall woman" in Zapruder.  Nor have you marked where you think you see "glasses" on Betzner-blob.

Indeed I have.  All is says is that Brandt "waved around a blurry photo", and that he was wearing a fedora that day.  It doesn't say what photo or where he was in the photo.  BFD.

I don't know.  But if you are going to cite them as authoritative, you better know how they made their determinations.  Particularly when you've picking and choosing what they got right and what they got wrong.

Iacoletti,

According to the Sixth Floor Museum, Dallas News and other sources, 37 year-old Ernest Brandt was wearing his fedora hat while he and his 21 year-old customer, John Templin, were standing together on the sidewalk on the north side of Elm Street, "near the Grassy Knoll."

Interesting, then, that when we look at, in sequence, Altgens-6, Croft,  Zapruder, Betzner-3, Willis-5, Bronson-5, and the Bronson film, we do not see two men standing together anywhere on the sidewalk on that side of the street. Not to mention near the GK, and with one wearing a fedora hat!  -- Except, of course, for Robin Unger's and Don Roberdeau's correctly-labeled Templin and Brandt.

Breaking News:
Here's an excellent article I just now stumbled upon. It's obvious that Brandt's talking about Willis-5, don't you think? What other photo might he be waving around that "captured," from the intersection of Houston and Elm, JFK and Jackie on Elm Street, and Abraham Zapruder and Marilyn Sitzman on a pedestal in the background, and a fedora-wearing spectator (Brandt) in between?
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And regarding Tall Girl's glasses, let me remind you that it was you that noticed them in Betzner-3 (obviously after having suspected them and then enlarging her face to confirm your suspicion) a couple of months ago.

You really don't remember calling her "Glasses Woman," John?

-- Mudd Wrassler Tommy  :)
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 10:24:14 AM by Thomas Graves »

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Offline Michael Walton

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Tom,

As John I said, it's not hard to post images here. You may want to take the time to learn how to post. I recall you saying you were in your late 60's so perhaps learning something new will keep those synapses firing away. Here's a post of Willis. See how easy it is?



But to a larger point, why do you keep blathering on about this? First it was your fixation on the Russians did it. Now you can't seem to let go of this glasses woman and fedora man and crying woman. If I'm not mistaken, this all goes back to one thing - whether the proposed time line of Prayer Man - and the people moving around in the various films and photos - is accurate enough to "prove" who exactly is up in the vestibule in the news film footage.

So John I wants more proof. So what? So what if it is the blue-scarfed woman down there or the Indian woman or whoever? Big deal.

The key here is one thing and one thing only - there is *someone* up in that vestibule. Is it Oswald? Is it a coworker? Is it a complete stranger who walked three blocks from their place of employment and then decided on a whim to walk down to that vestibule (maybe to get out of the sun) and watch the parade?

There's arguments and speculation that both support or go against whether it's Oswald or not. But in the meantime, it's amazing how you keep going on and on about this as it really doesn't make a damn bit of a difference in determining who killed Kennedy.

Offline John Iacoletti

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According to the Sixth Floor Museum, Dallas News and other sources, 37 year-old Ernest Brandt was wearing his fedora hat while he and his 21 year-old customer, John Templin, were standing together on the sidewalk on the north side of Elm Street, "near the Grassy Knoll."

The Dallas News article says nothing about "on the sidewalk on the north side of Elm Street, near the Grassy Knoll."  What sources?

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Interesting, then, that when we look at, in sequence, Altgens-6, Croft,  Zapruder, Betzner-3, Willis-5, Bronson-5, and the Bronson film, we do not see two men standing together anywhere on the sidewalk on that side of the street. Not to mention near the GK, and with one wearing a fedora hat!  -- Except, of course, for Robin Unger's and Don Roberdeau's correctly-labeled Templin and Brandt.

Doesn't even look like a fedora to me.


Other possible hats:




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And regarding Tall Girl's glasses, let me remind you that it was you that noticed them in Betzner-3 (obviously after having suspected them and then enlarging her face to confirm your suspicion) a couple of months ago.

Show me the glasses, Tommy:



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You really don't remember calling her "Glasses Woman," John?

I changed my mind after examining the above enlargement.  Why is that so hard for you to comprehend?

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Offline John Iacoletti

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So John I wants more proof. So what? So what if it is the blue-scarfed woman down there or the Indian woman or whoever? Big deal.

Agreed.  I don't care who Doyle and Graves think is whom, as long as they don't claim their wild guesses are proven facts.

Besides, given that you can't see Tommy's "hat man" in Betzner, OR Tommy's "glasses woman" in Willis, I'm not sure what he's on about.


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Online Brian Doyle

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Iacoletti isn't to be taken seriously and just naysays everything you post...

If you look at Walton's Willis 5 image you can see Karen Westbrook to the right of Secret Service Jack Ready in the follow-up car...

Look at Westbrook in this motion view of the spectators in Zapruder and you will see the woman I am pointing-out in Willis 5 IS Karen Westbrook...She snaps her head toward Reed whom she is standing next to having gone to the watch the motorcade together:


« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 11:18:29 PM by Brian Doyle »

Offline John Iacoletti

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If you look at Walton's Willis 5 image you can see Karen Westbrook to the right of Secret Service Jack Ready in the follow-up car...

There's no reason to think that blob is Karen Westbrook.

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Look at Westbrook in this motion view of the spectators in Zapruder and you will see the woman I am pointing-out in Willis 5 IS Karen Westbrook...She snaps her head toward Reed whom she is standing next to having gone to the watch the motorcade together:

Ridiculous argument.  How does a head turn (where do you even see that?) show that the people are Westbrook and Reed in particular?

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