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Author Topic: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda  (Read 9899 times)

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #60 on: February 23, 2019, 12:25:32 AM »
I never have said that the TINY little fragments of bullet (which were found under Nellie Connally's seat) "could be traced to the rifle". I've never implied any such ludicrous thing. But the two larger fragments found in the front seat of the limo both had enough of the copper jacket attached to them so that the FBI could positively link both fragments to the C2766 rifle. [See the pics in the article below.]

Cakebread loses again.......as per the norm.

http://jfk-archives.blogspot.com/2011/09/ce567-and-ce569.html


the two larger fragments found in the front seat of the limo both had enough of the copper jacket attached to them so that the FBI could positively link both fragments to the C2766 rifle. [See the pics in the article below.]


Utter Bull Stuff!!..... You're either very stupid, or a damned liar....Von Pea Brain.  ( Actually I believe that you're  stupid... and a damned liar.)

Perhaps you've never heard the conversation between Hoover and LBJ  in which Hoover tells LBJ that the fragments from the limo are useless as evidence to verify they had been fired from the rifle.   In reality Hoover was telling LBJ not to wory because nobody could prove that the fragments had NOT been fired from "Oswald's"   carcano (CE 139)


Those fragments indicate that the rifle owned by Lee H. Oswald was the weapon that killed President John F. Kennedy.

This is your big opportunity Pea Brain.....  DEMONSTRATE how those fragments could be used to determine the groove width, twist rate, and any identifying  machine marks from the rifle's barrel.... Or even simpler....Tell us how   YOU can determine the caliber of the bullet....

C'mon big mouth....Step right up and show the world that you're smarter then any ballistics expert in the world....



« Last Edit: February 23, 2019, 12:47:00 AM by Walt Cakebread »

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #61 on: February 23, 2019, 01:02:03 AM »
Of course we know that the timeline did not allow for LHO to have the time to get the change out of his pocket and get a coke out of the coke machine and then be standing there calm with a coke in his hand while Baker has a gun pointing at him . The hits just keep on coming !

Mike, I'm happy to see someone who doesn't repeat the BS about Baker having his revolver jammed in Lee's belly....  I doubt that Baker even had the revolver pointed at Lee....I can accept that Baker had his revolver in his hand...but as far as actually having it aimed at Lee...I doubt it....And I scoff at the idea that he had the revolver jammed in Lee's belly.

Online Brian Doyle

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ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #62 on: February 23, 2019, 01:15:53 AM »
The question remains....Did someone witness Mrs Reid and Lee Oswald passing and did they hear her say anything to Lee??

Lee was the other party and he definitely could have used another incident to support his alibi.....  Bu Lee never mentioned any such encounter.....But he did remember meeting a man who was seeking a telephone....

Yes...Holmes indirectly as well as Lovelady by means of Jarman...

So you are saying Mrs Reid decided to make up a nutty hoax and tell it to the other office ladies minutes after it happened?

Lee wasn't the one who was interviewed, Harvey was...The reason Harvey never told of the Mrs Reid event is because he never witnessed it, it was Lee - which in turn is proof of its real-ness...

Shows how poor an understanding you have of all this...
« Last Edit: February 23, 2019, 05:05:02 AM by Brian Doyle »

Offline David Von Pein

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Re: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #63 on: February 23, 2019, 01:19:45 AM »
@Creepy Walt:

It depends on which of the "Limo Fragments" you're talking about at any given time. The TINY little fragments under Nellie's seat couldn't be traced to the Carcano, no. Nobody ever said they could be.

But the two larger fragments (CE567 and 569) were definitely fired from Oswald's rifle, as per the testimony of Bob Frazier of the FBI....

JOHN J. McCLOY - And you would say the same thing of Commission Exhibit 399, the bullet 399 was fired from that rifle?

ROBERT A. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Mr. McCLOY - And the fragment 567---

Mr. FRAZIER - 567, the one we have just finished.

Mr. McCLOY - Was likewise a portion of a bullet fired from that rifle?

Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Mr. McCLOY - You have no doubt about any of those?

Mr. FRAZIER - None whatsoever.

[...]

MELVIN EISENBERG - Mr. Frazier, did you examine this bullet fragment with a view to determining whether it had been fired from the rifle, Exhibit 139?

Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Mr. EISENBERG - What was your conclusion?

Mr. FRAZIER - This bullet fragment, Exhibit 569, was fired from this particular rifle, 139.

Mr. EISENBERG - Again to the exclusion of all other rifles?

Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.


----------------------------

Let me guess----Creepy Kook Cakebread thinks Robert A. Frazier of the Federal Bureau of Investigation was nothing but a big fat liar! Right, Cakebread?

----------------------------

And there's also the testimony of the independent firearms expert, Joseph Nicol....

JOSEPH D. NICOL. Yes. It is my opinion that the same weapon that fired Commission's Exhibit 572 also fired the projectiles in Commission's Exhibits 569, 567, and 399.

Mr. EISENBERG. That would be to the exclusion of all other weapons?

Mr. NICOL. Correct.


----------------------------

Let me guess----Creepy Kook Cakebread thinks Joseph D. Nicol was nothing but a big fat liar too! Right, Cakebread?
« Last Edit: February 23, 2019, 01:25:37 AM by David Von Pein »

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #64 on: February 23, 2019, 01:26:32 AM »
Yes...Holmes indirectly as well as Lovelady by means of Jarman...

So you are saying Mrs Reid decided to make up a nutty hoax and tell it to the other office ladies minutes after it happened?

Lee wasn't the one who was interviewed Harvey was...The reason Harvey never told of the Mrs Reid event is because he never witnessed it, it was Lee - which in turn is proof of its real-ness...

Shows how poor an understanding you have of all this...

Shows how poor an understanding you have of all this...

Well...We've finally found a point on which we agree.....cuz... I sure as hell don't understand how anybody who isn't a guest at some rubber walled hotel, could believe that there were two Lee Harvey Oswald's.   

It's one of the wackiest ideas ever conjured .......

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #65 on: February 23, 2019, 01:51:36 AM »
@Creepy Walt:

It depends on which of the "Limo Fragments" you're talking about at any given time. The TINY little fragments under Nellie's seat couldn't be traced to the Carcano, no. Nobody ever said they could be.

But the two larger fragments (CE567 and 569) were definitely fired from Oswald's rifle, as per the testimony of Bob Frazier of the FBI....

JOHN J. McCLOY - And you would say the same thing of Commission Exhibit 399, the bullet 399 was fired from that rifle?

ROBERT A. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Mr. McCLOY - And the fragment 567---

Mr. FRAZIER - 567, the one we have just finished.

Mr. McCLOY - Was likewise a portion of a bullet fired from that rifle?

Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Mr. McCLOY - You have no doubt about any of those?

Mr. FRAZIER - None whatsoever.

[...]

MELVIN EISENBERG - Mr. Frazier, did you examine this bullet fragment with a view to determining whether it had been fired from the rifle, Exhibit 139?

Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.

Mr. EISENBERG - What was your conclusion?

Mr. FRAZIER - This bullet fragment, Exhibit 569, was fired from this particular rifle, 139.

Mr. EISENBERG - Again to the exclusion of all other rifles?

Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.


----------------------------

Let me guess----Creepy Kook Cakebread thinks Robert A. Frazier of the Federal Bureau of Investigation was nothing but a big fat liar! Right, Cakebread?

----------------------------

And there's also the testimony of the independent firearms expert, Joseph Nicol....

JOSEPH D. NICOL. Yes. It is my opinion that the same weapon that fired Commission's Exhibit 572 also fired the projectiles in Commission's Exhibits 569, 567, and 399.

Mr. EISENBERG. That would be to the exclusion of all other weapons?

Mr. NICOL. Correct.


----------------------------

Let me guess----Creepy Kook Cakebread thinks Joseph D. Nicol was nothing but a big fat liar too! Right, Cakebread?

Hoover's lap dog....Robert Frazier??   You've got to be kidding.....He's a bigger liar than you....( and that's something hard to find)

But apparently you're too stupid to understand that I asked YOU (David Von Pea Brain) to demonstrate how YOU can show us how YOU can determine the groove width, the twist rate, and the caliber of the fragments in the photos that YOU posted.

Offline Jerry Freeman

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Re: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #66 on: February 23, 2019, 04:02:15 AM »
  TINY little fragments of bullet (which were found under Nellie Connally's seat)   
Were they ever entered as exhibits?
Quote
The Rifle Bullets
In addition to the three cartridge cases found in the Texas School Book Depository Building, a nearly whole bullet was found on Governor Connally's stretcher and two bullet fragments were found in the front of the President's car. 40 The stretcher bullet weighed 158.6 grains, or several grains less than the average Western Cartridge Co. 6.5-millimeter Mannlicher-Carcano bullet.41 It was slightly flattened, but otherwise unmutilated. 42 The two bullet fragments weighed 44.6 and 21.0 grains, respectively. 43 The heavier fragment was a portion of a bullet's nose area, as shown by its rounded contour and the
character of the markings it bore. 44 The lighter fragment consisted of bullet's base portion, as shown by its shape and by the presence of a cannelure. 45 The two fragments were both mutilated, and it was not possible to determine from the fragments themselves whether they comprised the base and nose of one bullet or of two separate bullets. 46 However, each had sufficient unmutilated area to provide the basis of an identification. 47 Based on a comparison with test bullets fired from the C2766 rifle, the stretcher bullet and both bullet fragments were identified as having been fired from the C2766 rifle. 48
I don't really know how they did all that. I read something about neutron activated or maybe it was spectroscopy or some sort of scientific analysis...but anyway, I read something about Hoover saying that the analytical differences were very close in identity. From what I understand...any difference at all is a bust in the process of complete identification. To proclaim with great certainty that a bullet was found on Connally's stretcher is quite a stretch in itself ...but then there are plenty of threads already running on that. This thread has been hijacked [as usual] so I might as well join in.

 

Online Brian Doyle

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ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #67 on: February 23, 2019, 05:08:31 AM »
Shows how poor an understanding you have of all this...

Well...We've finally found a point on which we agree.....cuz... I sure as hell don't understand how anybody who isn't a guest at some rubber walled hotel, could believe that there were two Lee Harvey Oswald's.   

It's one of the wackiest ideas ever conjured .......

You have a tendency to name-call and generalize when confronted by real points you can't answer...

Still waiting for you to answer the evidence...

Harvey never told of Mrs Reid because that encounter was had by Lee in the white T-shirt...

Offline David Von Pein

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Re: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #68 on: February 23, 2019, 05:22:11 AM »
Hoover's lap dog....Robert Frazier??   You've got to be kidding.....He's a...liar.

Why of course he is. He said something that Cakebread The Kook doesn't like....so, he's automatically a big fat liar! (What a surprise!)

~yawn~

Offline Alan Ford

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Re: ML Baker Sept '64 FBI Affidavit- Oswald and the Soda
« Reply #69 on: February 23, 2019, 10:01:45 AM »
Alan....May I remind you that your using the testimony that was extracted from Mrs Reid....   We have no real absolute proof that Mrs reid actually saw Lee Oswald and said to him "Oh, the President has been shot, but maybe they didn't hit him",
I'll grant that is what she stated in her testimony ....But that doesn't prove that she did not make it up out of thin air on the afternoon of the assassination.

It could have been nothing but an innocuous remark by Mrs Reid, which she intended as an insertion of herself into the scene. Many people ( particularly older women ) like to embroidery and place themselves near an exciting event...  Mrs Reid could easily have said..." My goodness...He walked right past me just a couple of minutes after the shooting.   I didn't suspect that he had just shot JFK, when I said . Oh, the President has been shot, but maybe they didn't hit him",

But once she said that she couldn't very well say....."Oh, I just made that up for the girls in the office".....

Belin NEEDED mrs Reid's testimony....and he wasn't about to challenge her....in fact he encouraged her.....

You're halfway there, Mr Cakebread!  Thumb1:

Mr Oswald visited the 2nd fl lunchroom for a coke before the assassination. Carolyn Arnold & Sarah Stanton saw him there.



The encounter with Officer Baker and Mr Truly happened at the front entrance. Mr Oswald was one of the people Officer Baker saw 'standing around' there when he dashed into the building.

This incident was covered up by being moved to the 2nd fl lunchroom. Mr Oswald's reported claims in custody were amended accordingly.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2019, 10:02:47 AM by Alan Ford »

 

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