"We have developed no evidence"....


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Offline Rob Caprio

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Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #16 on: December 06, 2018, 11:07:27 PM »
Name one other person on the face of the earth who was present during both murders.

Don't have to and not doing so doesn't change my statement one iota.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #16 on: December 06, 2018, 11:07:27 PM »


Offline Rob Caprio

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Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2018, 11:10:40 PM »
Are you really suggesting that it was suspicious or impossible for the FBI to link the rifle to Oswald within a couple of days because it was "carefully hidden" behind some boxes for about an hour before being found?  Whew. The FBI found the records on the night of 11.22/23 that confirmed that the MC rifle found on the 6th floor was sent to Oswald's PO Box.  It had the same serial number as the rifle found on the 6th floor.  Oswald worked in that building.  It didn't exactly take Sherlock Holmes to reach this determination.  They had the documents to prove it.  I don't understand why anyone would suggest this couldn't have been done so quickly.   Or why it matters how long it took.

Your nonsense about the bag is laughable.  Oswald made an unexpected trip to the Paine house where his wife confirms he kept a rifle.   Frazier confirms Oswald carried a long bag to work the next morning, but for some reason Oswald denies this.  If it did not contain the rifle, then Oswald would seemingly have every incentive to admit to carrying a long bag and direct the police to it.  Instead he lies.  And his prints are found on such a bag.  And his rifle is gone when the police check the garage on 11.22.  In over fifty years no one has provided any explanation for his rifle not being there except as the one found in the TSBD as confirmed by the prints, serial number, documents, and known circumstances.

Says the guy who believes that an invisible bag is important somehow.

Offline Tom Scully

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Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2018, 06:02:15 AM »
Walt, Richard is posting in this thread because he practices an approach similar to mine. In your threads he sees an opportunity
to pick low hanging fruit. From experience he expects it is not difficult to challenge your claims because they do not evolve.

Silly.  What difference does the status of the investigation within two days of the assassination matter over fifty years later?  But even at that early point, they had found Oswald's rifle at the crime scene.  He had lied about and provided no explanation for it.  Oswald was a known political kook.  He carried a long package that morning, fled the TSBD within minutes, and was involved in the murder of a police officer less than an hour after the assassination.  His guilt was a slam dunk then.  And it is a slam dunk now.

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The Kennedy Assassination and the Current Political Moment

http://joanmellen.com/wordpress/speeches/the-kennedy-assassination-and-the-current-political-moment/
Talk at the 92nd Street Y,
 JANUARY 28, 2007
 THE KENNEDY ASSASSINATION AND THE CURRENT POLITICAL MOMENT

by Joan Mellen

It happened going on forty-four years ago, and yet the murder of President Kennedy remains simultaneously a subject of fascination and yet is still taboo within mainstream discourse. You will not find a free exchange of views on the Kennedy assassination in the ?New York Times?....
??

This surprising invocation of the Kennedy assassination occurred on January 2 nd at the funeral of President Gerald Ford, the last surviving member of the Warren Commission. I?ll read this extraordinary revealing paragraph from George H. W. Bush?s eulogy for those who missed it:

?After a deluded gunman assassinated President Kennedy, our nation turned to Gerald Ford and a select handful of others to make sense of that madness ? and a conspiracy theorist can say what they will ? but the Warren Commission report will always have the final definitive say on this matter. Why? Because Gerry Ford put his name on it and Gerry Ford?s word was always good.?

Allow me to add that when amendments were offered to the Freedom of Information Act, enlarging public access to affairs of state, Gerald Ford vetoed the bill, only for Congress to override his veto. Ford was no more a supporter of the truth than Mr. Bush?s son. George H. W. Bush?s own word was not always so good either. There are powerful reasons why George H. W. Bush was motivated to invoke the Warren Report, even, amazingly, to refer to a ?conspiracy theorist,? as if that designation would at once banish some truths he does not want available. Only two degrees of separation separate George H. W. Bush from Oswald himself.

At his 1976 confirmation hearings for the post of Director of Central Intelligence, a post into which he was elevated by Gerald Ford, Bush denied that he had any prior connection to the CIA. This was a falsehood. At the National Archives, and on the Internet, is a CIA document directed to its clandestine service (Record Number 104-10310-10271) that reveals that when, in the 1950s, Bush founded Zapata Oil, his partner was one Thomas J. Devine, who was not only an oil wildcatter, but a long-time CIA staff employee. Thomas Devine?s name does not appear in the original papers of Zapata, but it does in the company Bush created shortly thereafter as ?Zapata Offshore.?

This CIA document reveals that Thomas Devine had informed George Bush of a CIA project with the cryptonym WUBRINY/LPDICTUM. It involved CIA proprietary commercial operations in foreign countries. By 1963, Devine had become not a former CIA employee, but ?a cleared and witting contact? in the investment banking firm which managed the proprietary corporation WUSALINE. WUBRINY involved Haitian operations, in which, the documents reveal, a participant was George de Mohrenshildt, the Dallas CIA hander of ? Lee Oswald......

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=12758&relPageId=2




Same, document in image below, less redacted than image above, following uncovered simply by using search word. NATTILY @maryferrell :

Quote
John Train papers, 1960-2003 Mss 0058
https://web.archive.org/web/20141008041825/http://academic.shu.edu/findingaids/mss0058.html

 Seton Hall University
Biographical Note

 The John Train Papers include personal and professional correspondence, ... in Costa Rica, and a tire-retreading company in Guinea before serving in the Army


It turns out Joseph Dryer claimed he met with George DeM and Haitian banker Clemard Charles in NYC on same
day as CIA doc indicates Tom Devine did, April 25, 1963, just two weeks after the alleged attempt on the life of  Edwin Walker.
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Rochester Journal ? Dec 19, 1936
?In leading parts were Charles Boswell, Buddy Kitchen, Hawley Ward, Tom Devine. Julian Fitch, Martin Sher, Mike Mulligan, Peter Dryer,??

Quote
http://jfkforum.com
POSTED ON JULY 7, 2017
Something new here, we believe there is a gap to fill.

Quote
At this link, I have documented that in 1978 HSCA counsel asked Priscilla Johnson Macmillan why her book, ?Marina and Lee? was delayed at least a dozen years. See http://archive.is/esTuB
One excuse Priscilla offered was that she had experienced a bad period in which her father was a concealed suicide.
The last person reported to see Priscilla?s father Stuart alive and who reported him as missing to Locust Valley, LI police was James A. Thomas, a cousin of Allen Dulles whose sister Eleanor Lansing Thomas was maid of honor in Clover Dulles?s wedding.

?...The original 20 were classmates as long as grades K-9. Peter Dryer departed for Choate and Hawley Ward for St. Paul?s ?..
Meanwhile, in Concord, NH, Priscilla and Marina?s future book editor, MS Wyeth, gained a classmate and evidently Buz Wyeth and Hawley Ward became friends!



Misadventures of a Fly Fisherman: My Life with and Without Papa
 Jack Hemingway ? 1987
?I made contact with Joe Dryer and his brother, Peter, who was sharing digs with him in an apartment near the Malecon on the edge of old Havana. Their project sounded interesting, but there was no place in it for me..?

Quote
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=84&relPageId=64&search=cogswell_and%20palm
1. HSCA Report, Volume XII, pg 60
Found in: HSCA Appendix Volumes
broker in Palm Beach, Fla., had known George de Mohrenschildt in Haiti. The information came from Jack Cogswell of Palm Beach. According to Cogswell, he ran
with Loeb & Rhodes & Co. in Palm Beach and Dryer offered informa- tion about George de Mohrenschildt.(172) Dryer told Cogswell that when he knew de Mohrenshchildt
left Haiti in 1967. (175) Joseph Dryer



https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=66972&relPageId=2&search=cogswell
« Last Edit: December 07, 2018, 06:22:06 AM by Tom Scully »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2018, 06:02:15 AM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #19 on: December 07, 2018, 03:09:24 PM »
In addition, Dirty Harvey was observed as being rather 'Johnny-on-the-spot', if you will, at both murder scenes; the only person on earth that can lay claim to that somewhat dubious achievement.

Not that I'm going to want to assess him as guilty based solely on his rather fortuitous 'global positioning' that day, but that little gem would arguably serve the prosecution's opening statement rather well, I reckon.

if you will, at both murder scenes; the only person on earth that can lay claim to that somewhat dubious achievement.

Chappie ol chum... I assume that you are referring to the murder scenes of JFK and JD Tippit....  I the first case, ( the JFK scene) Lee Oswald worked in the TSBD .  I'm sure that even you will agree that the fact that he worked there is a solid legitimate reason to be at that site along with hundreds of other people who were at that site. 

And as to the second murder scene site ( The Tippit site) Lee Oswald was NOT positively ID'ed as the man who shot JD Tippit..

As a matter of fact the person who was the closest to Tippit at the time he was murdered was Domingo Benevides...who was a solid, rational, and observant person.   Benevides was carefully avoided by the police and was not taken to any police line up because Benevides told them that he'd seen the TV pictures of Lee Oswald, and Lee Oswald was not the man that he'd seen shoot JD Tippit.

Offline Richard Smith

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Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2018, 07:15:00 PM »
Are you really suggesting that it was suspicious or impossible for the FBI to link the rifle to Oswald within a couple of days because it was "carefully hidden" behind some boxes for about an hour before being found?

Of course not.... I should have realized that there would be readers who are of diminished reasoning ....

The problem is:... The rifle had not yet been fired by the FBI to create a bullet for ballistic comparison.  So there was no way that hoover could have determined that the carefully hidden rifle was in fact the murder weapon.

Hoover already had the serial number of the mannlicher carcano that Klein's had sent the the PO box of a Marine turn coat, commie who he had under surveillance.  Hoover knew that he could connect the rifle to Lee Oswald.

"Diminished reasoning" would encompass making silly claims like the red circles on the TSBD windows were some type of signal to LBJ.  A laughable, tin foil hat claim easily debunked by newspaper articles explaining those circles years before the assassination.  You are changing claims now.  Previously you disputed that the authorities could link the rifle to Oswald.  Now you are disputing that they could link it to the assassination.  Let's see.  A rifle is found hidden in the TSBD (or as you say "carefully hidden").  Witnesses confirm shots were fired from that building from a rifle.  Shell casings are found by a window on the same floor.  And the person linked to that rifle has fled the scene and been implicated in a murder of a police officer.  He is also a known political kook.  Now make a logical inference about the rifle.  Even Inspector Clouseau could figure out it was likely the assassination weapon at that point.

Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2018, 01:14:21 AM »
"Diminished reasoning" would encompass making silly claims like the red circles on the TSBD windows were some type of signal to LBJ.  A laughable, tin foil hat claim easily debunked by newspaper articles explaining those circles years before the assassination.  You are changing claims now.  Previously you disputed that the authorities could link the rifle to Oswald.  Now you are disputing that they could link it to the assassination.  Let's see.  A rifle is found hidden in the TSBD (or as you say "carefully hidden").  Witnesses confirm shots were fired from that building from a rifle.  Shell casings are found by a window on the same floor.  And the person linked to that rifle has fled the scene and been implicated in a murder of a police officer.  He is also a known political kook.  Now make a logical inference about the rifle.  Even Inspector Clouseau could figure out it was likely the assassination weapon at that point.

PS...You shouldn't compare yourself to Inspector Clouseau ....  Although I agree with you that even a dunce could be fooled by evidence presented by men with big shiny badges....

 Previously you disputed that the authorities could link the rifle to Oswald.  Now you are disputing that they could link it to the assassination.

The authorities COULD link a model 91 / 38 carcano to Lee Oswald.... The BY photo shows Lee holding a carcano...

But they sure as hell could NOT link that carcano in the BY photo to the assassination...  However maybe YOU can prove that the rifle in Lee's hands is the same rifle that was carefully hidden BENEATH pallets of books in the TSBD....  And Yes, Both Seymor Weitzman and Eugene Boone said they were able to see the rifle BENEATH the pallet when they got down on the floor and shined their flashlights  BENEATH the pallet.....
« Last Edit: December 08, 2018, 01:51:10 AM by Walt Cakebread »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #21 on: December 08, 2018, 01:14:21 AM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #22 on: December 08, 2018, 01:15:49 AM »
You lot want the entire assassination to be decided based on first day information
Investigations to you brainiacs are just 'excuses'


You've got that backwards. It was Hoover who decided the assssination on day 1 when he concluded that LHO was the lone gunman.


You lot are as children.

I take that by making such a comment you feel you are acting as a grown up, right?

It was Hoover who decided the assssination on day 1 when he concluded that LHO was the lone gunman.

Yes that's a fact.... Within minutes of Lee's arrival at DPD headquarters Hoover was on the phone ordering SAIC Gordon Shanklin to send Agent Hosty over to the DPD because Hosty had been "working with these people"  ( The Oswald's and The Paines) And at about this same time Hoover called RFK and informed him that the man who had killed his brother, President Kennedy, had been apprehended.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2018, 01:29:27 AM by Walt Cakebread »

Offline Alan Hardaker

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Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2018, 01:22:44 AM »
if you will, at both murder scenes; the only person on earth that can lay claim to that somewhat dubious achievement.

Chappie ol chum... I assume that you are referring to the murder scenes of JFK and JD Tippit....  I the first case, ( the JFK scene) Lee Oswald worked in the TSBD .  I'm sure that even you will agree that the fact that he worked there is a solid legitimate reason to be at that site along with hundreds of other people who were at that site. 

And as to the second murder scene site ( The Tippit site) Lee Oswald was NOT positively ID'ed as the man who shot JD Tippit..

As a matter of fact the person who was the closest to Tippit at the time he was murdered was Domingo Benevides...who was a solid, rational, and observant person.   Benevides was carefully avoided by the police and was not taken to any police line up because Benevides told them that he'd seen the TV pictures of Lee Oswald, and Lee Oswald was not the man that he'd seen shoot JD Tippit.

Dominic Benavides was interviewed by Dallas Police that same day and also gave a very lengthy testimony. Oswald did in fact fit the description Mr.Benavides gave in his testimony. He was actually driving past the incident at a speed of approx 25MPH and came to halt as he heard the gunshots. The fact that Mr. Benavides didn't give a 100% ID does not rule out Oswald as there were a number of other witnesses who did ID Oswald. Helen Markham,Barbara Davis,Virginia Davis,Scoggins  and others ID'd Oswald. It was Oswald that shot Tippit.Fact..end of.

The Hoover thing was just a lawman concerned that people would see Oswald had been to Russia and conclude that it was some kind of Russian involvement. No big conspiracy smoking gun thing. Just another odd trivial JFK thing/fact blown up out of all proportion.

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: "We have developed no evidence"....
« Reply #23 on: December 08, 2018, 01:22:44 AM »


 

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