Proof JFK was killed as a result of a conspiracy.

[Steve Logan]

I have not heard of such.

The closest that I have read and heard is from Lee Bowers on his interview with Mark Lane.  He stated that he saw two men, a flash of light or smoke, the immediate area of the embankment.

Regardless, if you are trying to say that the shots from there would be too loud, I would like for you to show proof instead of your opinion.

How would you like the proof presented to you?
You want charts of data?
A video?
Db levels of firearms both outside and within enclosures such as 12 x 12 rooms/Cement barricades?
How about testimony from former law enforcement personnel with over 1000 hours of shooting firearms?

[Keyvan Shahrdar]

How would you like the proof presented to you?
You want charts of data?
A video?
Db levels of firearms both outside and within enclosures such as 12 x 12 rooms/Cement barricades?
How about testimony from former law enforcement personnel with over 1000 hours of shooting firearms?

That is up to you.  Whatever proof you have, it should be comparable to the shelter in the grassy knoll, with similar temperature and similar wind, wind speed, and the bullets and rifles should be the same.

[Royell Storing]

How would you like the proof presented to you?
You want charts of data?
A video?
Db levels of firearms both outside and within enclosures such as 12 x 12 rooms/Cement barricades?
How about testimony from former law enforcement personnel with over 1000 hours of shooting firearms?

    Bottom line is IF you believe shot(s) were fired from within the Pergola behind Zapruder and Sitzman, both Zapruder and Sitzman would also have to be involved in at least the cover-up. They both would have heard shot(s) fired from within mere feet of them vs Never having reported this. I am Not even going to get into their conduct After allegedly having been within feet of the assassins/fired shots.

[Keyvan Shahrdar]

    Bottom line is IF you believe shot(s) were fired from within the Pergola behind Zapruder and Sitzman, both Zapruder and Sitzman would also have to be involved in at least the cover-up. They both would have heard shot(s) fired from within mere feet of them vs Never having reported this. I am Not even going to get into their conduct After allegedly having been within feet of the assassins/fired shots.

Bottom line is I don't believe on anything JFK unless I can see proof.  I see proof of shots being fired from the pergola.  Whether Zapruder or Sitzman are involved, that is a different thread.  I am not concerned about their actions in this thread. 

BTW - Mr. Zapruder did report that he heard shots fired from right behind him.  He reported as such in the form of a TV interview minutes after the assassination and his Warren Commission testimony.

[Steve Logan]

That is up to you.  Whatever proof you have, it should be comparable to the shelter in the grassy knoll, with similar temperature and similar wind, wind speed, and the bullets and rifles should be the same.

Documented levels of discomfort thresholds occur in decibels at 120 dB
Documented levels of pain thresholds occur in decibels 130 to 140 dB
Within an enclosure eliminates any factor of wind and or wind speed.
The impact is on the shooter.
.22 caliber rifle 130dB
.223, 55GR. Commercial load 18" barrel 155.5dB
.243 in 22" barrel 155.9dB
.30-30 in 20" barrel 156.0dB.
7mm Magnum in 20" barrel 157.5dB.
.308 in 24" barrel 156.2dB.
.30-06 in 24" barrel 158.5dB. In 18" barrel 163.2dB.
.375 18" barrel with muzzle brake 170 dB.
.410 Bore 28" barrel 150dB. 26" barrel 150.25dB. 18" barrel 156.30dB.
20 Gauge 28" barrel 152.50dB. 22" barrel 154.75dB.
12 Gauge 28" barrel 151.50dB. 26" barrel 156.10dB. 18" barrel 161.50dB.
.25 ACP 155.0 dB.
.32 LONG 152.4 dB.
.32 ACP 153.5 dB.
.380 157.7 dB.
9mm 159.8 dB.
.38 S&W 153.5 dB.
.38 Spl 156.3 dB.
.357 Magnum 164.3 dB.
.41 Magnum 163.2 dB.
.44 Spl 155.9 dB.
.45 ACP 157.0 dB.
.45 COLT 154.7 dB.

Facts on noise levels:
1. Decibels measure sound pressure and are logarithmic. That means that only a 3db increase almost doubles sound pressure, a 6db increase quadruples sound pressure, etc.
2. Gradual hearing loss may occur after prolonged exposure to 90 decibels or above.
3. Exposure to 100 decibels for more than 15 minutes can cause hearing loss.
4. Exposure to 110 decibels for more than a minute can cause permanent hearing loss.
5. At 140 dBA noise causes immediate injury to almost any unprotected ear.
6. There is also the more extreme ?acoustic trauma?, which is an immediate loss of hearing after a sudden, exceptionally loud noise such as an explosion.

Your fakakta video of Bowers in no way addressed the questions I raised regarding the impact on the shooter(s).

So either your shooter(s) had a suppressed firearm , was wearing hearing protection or nobody fired anything from the pergola as per that phony doctored up Moorman photo that you proffered up as evidence showed.

In addition , with 30 years experience in Law Enforcement, I guarantee you if anybody fired an unsuppressed firearm or was not wearing ear protection they would have been on their knees in excruciating pain or rolling around the grassy knoll clutching their ears.





 

[Keyvan Shahrdar]

You have never been so wrong in your life.

1) Are you stating that Mr. Zapruder, who was there and stated that a shot came from behind him is wrong?
2) Are you stating that Mr. Newman, who was there and stated that a shot came from behind him is wrong?
3) Are you stating that the Mary Moorman photo from NBC News is a fake?  NBC News is in a conspiracy to provide fake images from Mary Moorman.
4) Are you stating that the Nix Film has been altered to show gunshots from the very place that Mr. Zapruder and Mr. Newman said they heard shots from and the Mary Moreman photo shows a man standing there?
If you believe that 1-4 are fabricated, that is your opinion, show proof that they are fabricated.

5) What type of enclosure are those guns fired in?  Are they fired in an open pergola similar to the one at the grassy knoll?  Can you share in this forum the type of enclosure being used and certify that those tests were done in that enclosure?

6) I don't know, and I suppose you don't know if the gunmen did wear any type of protection unless you have proof that states otherwise.  I know that when I went shooting with my police officer friends, we ware ear protection at the gun range.

[Steve Logan]

You have never been so wrong in your life.

1) Are you stating that Mr. Zapruder, who was there and stated that a shot came from behind him is wrong?
2) Are you stating that Mr. Newman, who was there and stated that a shot came from behind him is wrong?
3) Are you stating that the Mary Moorman photo from NBC News is a fake?  NBC News is in a conspiracy to provide fake images from Mary Moorman.
4) Are you stating that the Nix Film has been altered to show gunshots from the very place that Mr. Zapruder and Mr. Newman said they heard shots from and the Mary Moreman photo shows a man standing there?
If you believe that 1-4 are fabricated, that is your opinion, show proof that they are fabricated.

5) What type of enclosure are those guns fired in?  Are they fired in an open pergola similar to the one at the grassy knoll?  Can you share in this forum the type of enclosure being used and certify that those tests were done in that enclosure?

You have never been so wrong in your life.
  oh boy.

1) Are you stating that Mr. Zapruder, who was there and stated that a shot came from behind him is wrong?
Where did I mention Zapruder?
2) Are you stating that Mr. Newman, who was there and stated that a shot came from behind him is wrong?
Where did I mention Newman?
3) Are you stating that the Mary Moorman photo from NBC News is a fake?  NBC News is in a conspiracy to provide fake images from Mary Moorman.
No , but that colorized POS with the insinuated human forms is pure crap.
4) Are you stating that the Nix Film has been altered to show gunshots from the very place that Mr. Zapruder and Mr. Newman said they heard shots from and the Mary Moreman photo shows a man standing there?
Did I mention Nix?
If you believe that 1-4 are fabricated, that is your opinion, show proof that they are fabricated.
So your opinions have more weight than my opinions? I'm speaking about real life professional experience. All this other kook speak is you playing detective then offering up your inexperienced opinion.
5) What type of enclosure are those guns fired in?  Are they fired in an open pergola similar to the one at the grassy knoll?  Can you share in this forum the type of enclosure being used and certify that those tests were done in that enclosure?
See the answer to number 4.

[Keyvan Shahrdar]

You have never been so wrong in your life.
  oh boy.

1) Are you stating that Mr. Zapruder, who was there and stated that a shot came from behind him is wrong?
Where did I mention Zapruder?
2) Are you stating that Mr. Newman, who was there and stated that a shot came from behind him is wrong?
Where did I mention Newman?
3) Are you stating that the Mary Moorman photo from NBC News is a fake?  NBC News is in a conspiracy to provide fake images from Mary Moorman.
No , but that colorized POS with the insinuated human forms is pure crap.
4) Are you stating that the Nix Film has been altered to show gunshots from the very place that Mr. Zapruder and Mr. Newman said they heard shots from and the Mary Moreman photo shows a man standing there?
Did I mention Nix?
If you believe that 1-4 are fabricated, that is your opinion, show proof that they are fabricated.
So your opinions have more weight than my opinions? I'm speaking about real life professional experience. All this other kook speak is you playing detective then offering up your inexperienced opinion.
5) What type of enclosure are those guns fired in?  Are they fired in an open pergola similar to the one at the grassy knoll?  Can you share in this forum the type of enclosure being used and certify that those tests were done in that enclosure?
See the answer to number 4.

"So either your shooter(s) had a suppressed firearm , was wearing hearing protection or nobody fired anything from the pergola as per that phony doctored up Moorman photo that you proffered up as evidence showed." - These are your words, not mine, what else could you be insinuating here?  If you are talking about the colored portion of the picture, show proof that it is different from the original besides that fact that it is colorized.  Who are you kidding, you are just basing your conclusion on your opinion.  Show proof!

You have 30 years experience, act like it! - Just cause you are consumed with another belief does not mean it is so.