Author Topic: Oswalds Rapid Fire Training Distance  (Read 44793 times)

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Online John Iacoletti

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Re: Oswalds Rapid Fire Training Distance
« Reply #756 on: January 11, 2017, 05:36:49 PM »
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[Lane told the Warren Commission that Tippit shooting witness Helen Markham said that the shooter was short, heavy, and with bushy hair. Here is a transcript of Lane’s telephone interview with Markham. Judge for yourself whether Markham was an easily manipulated witness, and whether Lane was an honest advocate.

Helen Markham did say that the shooter was short, heavy, and with bushy hair.

LANE. He wasn't too heavy, and would you say that he had rather bushy hair, kind of hair?
MARKHAM. Yes, just a little bit bushy, uh huh.
LANE. It was a little bit bushy.
MARKHAM. Yes.

LANE. And when you were there, did they ever ask you anything else about Oswald? About whether he was tall or short?
MARKHAM. Uh, yes, sir. They asked me that.
LANE. And you said he was short, eh?
MARKHAM. Yes, sir, he is short. He was short.
LANE. He was short. And they asked if he was thin or heavy, and you said he was a little on the heavy side?
MARKHAM. And he was, uh, uh, well not too heavy. Uh, say around 160, maybe 150.
LANE. Well, did you say he wasn't too heavy, but he was a little heavy?
MARKHAM. Uh-huh.

Offline Gary Craig

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Re: Oswalds Rapid Fire Training Distance
« Reply #757 on: January 11, 2017, 05:53:00 PM »
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Whatever came off JFK's head at Z-313, according to Brehm, flew behind and to the left of the limo.
Hargis the motorcycle cop, who was to the left and rear of the limo, was splattered with blood and hit with something that caused him to think he may have been hit at Z-313.
JFK was slammed violently back and to the left at Z-313.

JFK Assassination Mark Lane Interviews Witness Charles Brehm 1960's
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JFK Assassination Mark Lane Interviews Witness James Tague 1960's
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JFK Assassination Witness J C Price Interviewed By Mark Lane 1960's
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« Last Edit: January 11, 2017, 06:03:03 PM
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Online Bill Chapman

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Re: Oswalds Rapid Fire Training Distance
« Reply #758 on: January 11, 2017, 06:39:19 PM »
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Helen Markham did say that the shooter was short, heavy, and with bushy hair.

LANE. He wasn't too heavy, and would you say that he had rather bushy hair, kind of hair?
MARKHAM. Yes, just a little bit bushy, uh huh.
LANE. It was a little bit bushy.
MARKHAM. Yes.

LANE. And when you were there, did they ever ask you anything else about Oswald? About whether he was tall or short?
MARKHAM. Uh, yes, sir. They asked me that.
LANE. And you said he was short, eh?
MARKHAM. Yes, sir, he is short. He was short.
LANE. He was short. And they asked if he was thin or heavy, and you said he was a little on the heavy side?
MARKHAM. And he was, uh, uh, well not too heavy. Uh, say around 160, maybe 150.
LANE. Well, did you say he wasn't too heavy, but he was a little heavy?
MARKHAM. Uh-huh.

Pretty sure that the prosecution would jump all over that as 'leading the witness'


Bogus Evidence
(Citation:McAdams)

Conspiracy books often claim that Mrs. Markham described the
Tippit killer as "short, heavy, and with bushy hair."

It's Mark Lane who is responsible for this factoid.

The following is excerpted from David Belin's NOVEMBER 22, 1963: YOU
ARE THE JURY.

What did Mark Lane tell the WC:
----------------------------------------------------------

      I spoke with the deponent, the eyewitness, Helen Louise
      Markham, and Mrs. Markham told me--Miss or Mrs., I didn't
      ask her if she was married--told me that she was a
      hundred feet away from the police car, not the fifty feet
      which appears in the affidavit. She gave me a more
      detailed description of the man who she said shot Officer
      Tippit. She said he was short, a little on the heavy
      side, and his hair was somewhat bushy. I think it is fair
      to state that an accurate description of Oswald would be
      average height, quite slender with thin and receding
      hair.  

------------------

Lane then (after some wrangling) presented the WC with a tape that
supposedly supported Lane's account of her testimony.

And what did his taped conversation with Mrs. Markham

Mr. Lane. But, well, just, could you just give me one moment and
tell me. I read that you told some of the reporters that he was
short, stocky, and had bushy hair.  

Mrs. Markham. No, no. I did not say this.  

Mr. Lane. You did not say that?  

Mrs. Markham. No, sir.  

Mr. Lane. Well, would you say that he was stocky?  

Mrs. Markham. Uh, he was short.  

Mr. Lane. He was short.  

Mrs. Markham. Yes.  

Mr. Lane. And was he a little bit on the heavy side?

Mrs. Markham. Uh, not too heavy.  

Mr. Lane. Not too heavy, but slightly heavy?

Mrs. Markham. Oh, well, he was, no he wasn't, didn't look too
heavy, uh-uh.  

Mr. Lane. He wasn't too heavy, and would you say that he had rather
bushy hair, kind of hair?  

Mrs. Markham. Yeh, just a little bit bushy, uh huh.

Mr. Lane. It was a little bit bushy.

Mrs. Markham. Yes.  

[Then Lane questioned her about the police lineup. Mrs. Markham
stated that she identified Oswald in the police lineup. Lane asked
whether the police had told her who it might be. Mrs. Markham
replied, "They didn't tell me one thing."  Lane then returned to
the events of the Tippit shooting and once again went back to Mrs.
Markham's description of the gunman]

Mr. Lane. Did you say that he was short and a little bit on the
heavy side and had slightly bushy hair?  

Mrs. Markham. Uh, no, I did not. They didn't ask me that.
 

[Then Lane asked her again about how she had described Oswald when
she made the affidavit.]

Mr. Lane. And when you were there, did they ever ask you anything
else about Oswald? About whether he was tall or short?  

Mrs. Markham. Uh, yes, sir. They asked me that.  

Mr. Lane. And you said he was short, eh?  

Mrs. Markham. Yes, sir, he is short. He was short.  

Mr. Lane. He was short. And they asked if he was thin or heavy, and
you said he was a little on the heavy side?  

Mrs. Markham. And he was, uh, uh, well not too heavy. Uh, say
around 160, maybe 150.  

Mr. Lane. Well, did you say he wasn't too heavy, but he was a
little heavy?  

Mrs. Markham. Uh-huh.  

Mr. Lane. You did say that?  

Mrs. Markham. I did identify him in the lineup.  

Mr. Lane. Yes, and did you say that the man who shot, did you tell
the officers that the man who shot Tippit had bushy hair?  

Mrs. Markham. Uh, no, I did not.  


Mr. Lane. But, but he did have bushy hair you said, just a little
bushy?  

Mrs. Markham. Well, you wouldn't say it hadn't been combed you know
or anything.  

Mr. Lane. Yes.  

Mrs. Markham. Of course, he probably had been through a lot, and
was kind of tore up a little . . .  

[Lane returned to the shooting of Officer Tippit and what Mrs.
Markham saw and then he asked her about her identification of the
gunman in the police station. She said that she wanted to be sure,
so she had had the police turn the man in the lineup "and they
turned him, and it was him."  For a third time Lane tried to have
Mrs. Markham state that the person that shot Tippit was short,
stocky and had bushy hair.]


Mr. Lane. Have you told any reporters about anything?  

Mrs. Markham. Well, one. They worried me to death.  

Mr. Lane. I'm sure they are after you because you're a very
important witness.  

Mrs. Markham. Uh-huh.  

Mr. Lane. Did any of the reporters, did you tell any reporter that
the person that shot Oswald, shot Tippit was short, stocky, and had
bushy hair?  

Mrs. Markham I did not.  

Mr. Lane. You don't remember telling it because one of the
reporters reported that in the newspaper.  

Mrs. Markham. Yes, I read that.  

Mr. Lane. You read that. What paper was that, do you recall?  

Mrs. Markham. Uh, I believe it was in the Herald.  

Mr. Lane. The Herald?  

Mrs. Markham. I believe, it might have been the News.  

Mr. Lane. It was one of the Dallas papers, uh?  

Mrs. Markham. Yes, sir.  

Mr. Lane. And, do you know what day that was?  

Mrs. Markham. No, sir.  

Mr. Lane. That was shortly after, though, wasn't it?  

Mrs. Markham. Yes, sir. They gave my address, name and everything.

Mr. Lane. Yes, and they had you quoted as saying that he was short,
stocky, and had bushy hair.  

Mrs. Markham. Well, they are just not right.  

Mr. Lane. But that's what they said, though.  

Mrs. Markham. I know it. They can put anything in papers.  

« Last Edit: January 11, 2017, 06:55:49 PM
by Bill Chapman
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Online John Iacoletti

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Re: Oswalds Rapid Fire Training Distance
« Reply #759 on: January 11, 2017, 07:18:20 PM »
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Pretty sure that the prosecution would jump all over that as 'leading the witness'

Pretty sure the defense would jump all over this as leading the witness:

Mr. BALL. Did you recognize anyone in the lineup?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. You did not? Did you see anybody--I have asked you that question before did you recognize anybody from their face?
Mrs. MARKHAM. From their face, no.
Mr. BALL. Did you identify anybody in these four people?
Mrs. MARKHAM. I didn't know nobody.
Mr. BALL. I know you didn't know anybody, but did anybody in that lineup look like anybody you had seen before?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No. I had never seen none of them, none of these men.
Mr. BALL. No one of the four?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No one of them.
Mr. BALL. No one of all four?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. Was there a number two man in there?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two is the one I picked.

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswalds Rapid Fire Training Distance
« Reply #760 on: January 11, 2017, 07:30:55 PM »
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Pretty sure the defense would jump all over this as leading the witness:

Mr. BALL. Did you recognize anyone in the lineup?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. You did not? Did you see anybody--I have asked you that question before did you recognize anybody from their face?
Mrs. MARKHAM. From their face, no.
Mr. BALL. Did you identify anybody in these four people?
Mrs. MARKHAM. I didn't know nobody.
Mr. BALL. I know you didn't know anybody, but did anybody in that lineup look like anybody you had seen before?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No. I had never seen none of them, none of these men.
Mr. BALL. No one of the four?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No one of them.
Mr. BALL. No one of all four?
Mrs. MARKHAM. No, sir.
Mr. BALL. Was there a number two man in there?
Mrs. MARKHAM. Number two is the one I picked.


Pretty sure the defense would jump all over this as leading the witness:

That maybe true ....And Markham was being lead ...But That doesn't alter the FACT that she described a man who did NOT fit the description of Lee Oswald to a Newspaper reporter and that was printed in the paper.

Online John Iacoletti

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Re: Oswalds Rapid Fire Training Distance
« Reply #761 on: January 11, 2017, 07:48:04 PM »
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That maybe true ....And Markham was being lead ...But That doesn't alter the FACT that she described a man who did NOT fit the description of Lee Oswald to a Newspaper reporter and that was printed in the paper.

Does anybody know specifically what newspaper this was that Mark Lane was referring to?

Online Walt Cakebread

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Re: Oswalds Rapid Fire Training Distance
« Reply #762 on: January 11, 2017, 07:59:36 PM »
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Does anybody know specifically what newspaper this was that Mark Lane was referring to?

The National Inquirer........