Users Currently Browsing This Topic:
0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Author Topic: Oswald's Light-Colored Jacket  (Read 74627 times)

Offline Gary Craig

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 889
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #240 on: January 25, 2018, 01:17:38 AM »
How does changing one's "trousers" translate to changing one's shirt?

 :o

REPORT OF CAPT. J. W. FRITZ, DALLAS POLICE
                               DEPARTMENT

INTERROGATION OF LEE HARVEY OSWALD


~snip~

I asked him where he went to  when  he  left
work,  and he told me that he had a room on 1026 North Beckley, that  he
went over there and changed his trousers.....


~snip~

During  this  conversation  he told me he reached his home  by  cab  and
changed  his shirt and trousers before going to the show.  He  said  his
cab  fare  was 85 cents.  When asked what he did with his  clothing,  he
took off when he got home, he said he put them in the dirty clothes.


~snip~

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

He changed his shirt and trousers at his room.

The shirt he was arrested in wasn't the shirt he wore to work on 11/22/63.

Officer Baker testified to the WC that he was wearing different clothes when he saw him at the police

station than when he saw him in the TSBD.

Fibers matching the arrest shirt to the TSBD Carcano point to a frame up not Ozzie's guilt.

Offline Jerry Organ

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1000
    • Plaza 3D
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #241 on: January 25, 2018, 02:53:17 AM »
:o

REPORT OF CAPT. J. W. FRITZ, DALLAS POLICE
                               DEPARTMENT

INTERROGATION OF LEE HARVEY OSWALD


~snip~

I asked him where he went to  when  he  left
work,  and he told me that he had a room on 1026 North Beckley, that  he
went over there and changed his trousers.....


~snip~

During  this  conversation  he told me he reached his home  by  cab  and
changed  his shirt and trousers before going to the show.  He  said  his
cab  fare  was 85 cents.  When asked what he did with his  clothing,  he
took off when he got home, he said he put them in the dirty clothes.


~snip~

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

He changed his shirt and trousers at his room.

The shirt he was arrested in wasn't the shirt he wore to work on 11/22/63.

Officer Baker testified to the WC that he was wearing different clothes when he saw him at the police

station than when he saw him in the TSBD.

Fibers matching the arrest shirt to the TSBD Carcano point to a frame up not Ozzie's guilt.



I don't believe Oswald had a place for "dirty laundry" per se. I see in the photo above (of items seized at North Beckley) what the inventory calls:
  • "brown shirt"
  • "pair grey trousers"






Pat Speer obtained a color photo of the North Beckley rooming-house shirt from the National Archives.



( Speer webpage: http://www.patspeer.com/chapter-4b-threads-of-evidence )

Oswald's arrest shirt has been published on the web in some odd ways:



(Above: Image on the left was probably taken with a modern digital camera and may be the most accurate of the three. )



TV image that I think could be brighter.

So if Oswald did change his shirt at the rooming house (and the shirt found there is that shirt), he put on a very similar (tone and color) shirt that he apparently had on when arrested. Therefore I can see why Marina thought the arrest shirt was the one he wore when he arrived in Irving on Thursday.

Offline John Mytton

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2637
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #242 on: January 25, 2018, 03:07:59 AM »


I don't believe Oswald had a place for "dirty laundry" per se. I see in the photo above (of items seized at North Beckley) what the inventory calls:
  • "brown shirt"
  • "pair grey trousers"






Pat Speer obtained a color photo of the North Beckley rooming-house shirt from the National Archives.



( Speer webpage: http://www.patspeer.com/chapter-4b-threads-of-evidence )

Oswald's arrest shirt has been published on the web in some odd ways:



(Above: Image on the left was probably taken with a modern digital camera and may be the most accurate of the three. )



TV image that I think could be brighter.

So if Oswald did change his shirt at the rooming house (and the shirt found there is that shirt), he put on a very similar (tone and color) shirt that he apparently had on when arrested. Therefore I can see why Marina thought the arrest shirt was the one he wore when he arrived in Irving on Thursday.







Thanks for posting those comparison photos, it seems to me that some of those shirt photos have been artificially enhanced, who would do such a thing and what would they have to gain??



JohnM

Offline Jerry Organ

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1000
    • Plaza 3D
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #243 on: January 25, 2018, 03:26:13 AM »

Thanks for posting those comparison photos, it seems to me that some of those shirt photos have been artificially enhanced, who would do such a thing and what would they have to gain??

JohnM

In the JFK case, I would say most CTs are into such manipulation, either producing or feeding on it.

But sometimes a bad image on the Internet is a combination of things from the past, such as: early-generation home scanners, cheap software, badly-calibrated gamma on computer monitors, the color table limitations of GIFs (when people wanted small file sizes because of low internet speeds) and so forth that made scans done in the 80s and 90s go all wacky.

Today there's higher-quality digital devices, easier monitor calibration, the PNG format and industry standards that maintain at least some degree of quality and consistency.

Offline Gary Craig

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 889
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #244 on: January 25, 2018, 05:07:28 AM »


I don't believe Oswald had a place for "dirty laundry" per se. I see in the photo above (of items seized at North Beckley) what the inventory calls:
  • "brown shirt"
  • "pair grey trousers"






Pat Speer obtained a color photo of the North Beckley rooming-house shirt from the National Archives.



( Speer webpage: http://www.patspeer.com/chapter-4b-threads-of-evidence )

Oswald's arrest shirt has been published on the web in some odd ways:



(Above: Image on the left was probably taken with a modern digital camera and may be the most accurate of the three. )



TV image that I think could be brighter.

So if Oswald did change his shirt at the rooming house (and the shirt found there is that shirt), he put on a very similar (tone and color) shirt that he apparently had on when arrested. Therefore I can see why Marina thought the arrest shirt was the one he wore when he arrived in Irving on Thursday.

Two different shirts.

The one from the rooming house was a solid color.

The arrest shirt wasn't.


He changed his shirt and trousers at his room.

The shirt he was arrested in wasn't the shirt he wore to work on 11/22/63.

Officer Baker testified to the WC that he was wearing different clothes when he saw him at the police

station than when he saw him in the TSBD.

Fibers matching the arrest shirt to the TSBD Carcano point to a frame up not Ozzie's guilt.

Offline Gary Craig

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 889
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #245 on: January 25, 2018, 05:36:49 AM »
Oswald wore that shirt when he was arrested.  If he was not wearing that shirt while shooting from the sniper's nest window, then he removed it while he was waiting for the motorcade to arrive and then used that shirt to quickly wipe down the rifle in hopes of removing his fingerprints.

It would have taken Oswald mere seconds to wipe down the rifle and then put the shirt on as he descended the first flight of stairs.

Patspeer.com

Chapter 4b: Threads of Evidence

~snip~

"Back to Stombaugh's discussion of the rust brown shirt. After prompting by WC counsel Melvin Eisenberg, he then added "down the face of the shirt I did find some wax adhering to it." Now this is interesting, as it suggests he took a good look at the shirt. Which makes what he doesn't say remarkable. He doesn't mention finding any grease on the shirt, or anything indicating it had been used to wipe down the rifle. (The proposition that Oswald wore his t-shirt during the shooting, and used the brown shirt to wipe down the rifle, is hereby reduced to the level of unsupported speculation, at odds with the available evidence.)"

 ~snip~

Offline John Iacoletti

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7498
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #246 on: January 25, 2018, 03:30:59 PM »
My definition is the correct one.  Your definition is way off base.  Learn the difference between match and similar.

You always think your opinions and definitions are the correct ones.  Learn the difference between opinion and fact.

Quote
However, don't try to pretend for a second that the fact that the fibers were a match means nothing.  The fiber match is yet another thing to present to the jury in an attempt to convince them that the jacket was Oswald's and in an attempt to change his appearance he ditched the jacket after killing a police officer only minutes ago.

Why would this convince anybody when you've just acknowledged that the fibers may or may not have come from that shirt?  Even if you were able to prove that this is his jacket (and you're not), your claim that he "ditched it" and why is pure speculation and not evidence of anything.

Offline John Iacoletti

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7498
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #247 on: January 25, 2018, 03:32:16 PM »
Translation:  I have no evidence whatsoever which points to someone other than Lee Oswald.

Again, so what?  Do you think that somehow proves that Oswald did it?

Offline Bill Brown

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1057
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #248 on: January 25, 2018, 11:27:04 PM »
Again, so what?  Do you think that somehow proves that Oswald did it?

Translation (again):  I have no evidence whatsoever which points to someone other than Lee Oswald.

Offline Bill Brown

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1057
Re: Oswald's Jacket
« Reply #249 on: January 25, 2018, 11:34:13 PM »
You always think your opinions and definitions are the correct ones.  Learn the difference between opinion and fact.

Were the fibers found in the sleeve of the jacket and the fibers from the arrest shirt similar or a match?

 

Mobile View