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91
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: The First Shot
« Last post by Andrew Mason on December 09, 2025, 01:42:51 AM »
Quote from: Tom Graves on December 08, 2025, 11:13:27 PM
JFK's turn and wave to Mary Woodward and her colleagues at Z-173 did come before the "horrible, ear-shattering noise" of Oswald's second shot at Z-222.

I know that is what you think occurred. But that is not what she said occurred.  You don’t seem to want to deal with what she, and others, said occurred.

She said that the horrible ear-shattering noise was the first of three shots that she distinctly recalled, the last two following that horrible ear-shattering noise after a pause of several seconds.   
Quote
Do you think she equated the backfire-like sound (which is how some other witnesses characterized the first shot and which she said she didn't think had hit anybody) with the "horrible ear-shattering noise" of the second shot?

??I am just going by what she said. She did not mention a backfire-like sound before they shouted to JFK and before he turned and waved and smiled at them and before he passed by where she was standing. She referred to only three shots. 

She later said that the one thing she was totally positive of was that there were three shots and the second and third shots were close together-the last coming before the sound of the second had died out.
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Oliver Stone Throws a Hissy Fit
« Last post by Tom Graves on December 09, 2025, 01:23:29 AM »
Quote from: Royell Storing on December 08, 2025, 04:51:21 PM
Bottom line, Oliver Stone is a "film maker". He's not a JFK Assassination expert by any measure. He's also 79 yrs old. I bring this up as "temperament" is also now being thrown into the Oliver Stone pot. As to Stone needing a "sidekick", people of Stone's age have an issue with staying "on track". Their maintaining a steady train of thought for more than 1 minute is often an issue. You throw in the brickbats hurled at Stone during a JFK Assassination "discussion", and this only complicates Stone's age/temperament issues. Hence his needing a sidekick. I watched JFK Assassination Expert Josiah Thompson do an interview on NewsNation about a year ago. Prior to that I watched his Sixth Floor Museum presentation concerning his 2nd Book. Thompson will turn 91 in January. Thompson needs a sidekick too.

Oliver Stone is a money-grubbing Vietnam War-traumatized Far-Left propagandist.
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Oliver Stone Throws a Hissy Fit
« Last post by Benjamin Cole on December 09, 2025, 01:18:50 AM »
FL-

I am uncomfortable with the relationship between Oliver Stone and Vladimir Putin.

Stone's personality is what it is, and let's face it, the CT and LN communities draw in some characters.
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: The First Shot
« Last post by Tom Graves on December 08, 2025, 11:13:27 PM »
Quote from: Andrew Mason on December 08, 2025, 11:07:28 PM
I quite agree. That is the turn and wave that she is referring to.   But she said it occurred before the "horrible ear-shattering noise" that was followed by a pause of a few seconds and then two more shots, the third coming rapidly after the second.

JFK's turn and wave to Mary Woodward and her colleagues at Z-173 did come before the "horrible, ear-shattering noise" of Oswald's second shot at Z-222.

Do you think she equated the backfire-like sound (which is how some other witnesses characterized the first shot and which she said she didn't think had hit anybody) with the "horrible ear-shattering noise" of the second shot?


EDIT ALERT FOR COMRADE STORING:

“At first we didn’t know what it was, if it was a car backfiring,” she said. “… Then there was the second shot and then the third. Then I saw [Kennedy’s] head just break open.”

https://www.timestelegram.com/story/news/2013/11/21/little-falls-resident-was-witness/41823236007/?gnt-cfr=1&gca-cat=p&gca-uir=true&gca-epti=z11xx71d00----v11xx71d--xx--b--xx--&gca-ft=119&gca-ds=sophi
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: The First Shot
« Last post by Andrew Mason on December 08, 2025, 11:07:28 PM »
Quote from: Tom Graves on December 08, 2025, 10:23:28 PM

My comment:

The only time JFK waved to Woodward and her colleagues was when he started raising his arm to do so in Z-173.

He's waving to them (and in the process of turning his head even farther to the right in order to look at them), and Jackie has turned her head in their direction, too, in Z-180.

I quite agree.  That is the turn and wave that she is referring to.   But she said it occurred before the "horrible ear-shattering noise" that was followed by a pause of a few seconds and then two more shots, the third coming rapidly after the second. 
96
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: The First Shot
« Last post by Tom Graves on December 08, 2025, 10:57:49 PM »
Quote from: Zeon Mason on December 08, 2025, 10:42:22 PM
Unlike the other Mason, I’m seeing that JFK, Jackie and SS agent Hickey are ALL reacting in sync from Z140-Z150. That’s quite a coincidence I have to admit but I’m not sure if it’s a loud shot from TSBD which is the cause of those 3 in snyc reactions.

Because why has not JC turned his head left also at Z140-Z150 since he said he recognized the 1st loud noise as a rifhe shot?

He did consciously react to the sound of Oswald's first, missing-everything, shot at "Z-124" by turning his head to his right (before quickly turning it to his left and be caught looking straight forward in Croft at Z-161) around Z-145.

Remember, he testified that he recognized the sound as a rifle shot and thought that it had come from behind him and to his right.
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Proof Rosemary Willis had started looking towards the TSBD by Z-145
« Last post by Zeon Mason on December 08, 2025, 10:50:16 PM »
Meanwhile Betzner is totally oblivious to the so called early Z124 shot. Maybe his camera causes him to go temporarily deaf? 🙄
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Proof Rosemary Willis had started looking towards the TSBD by Z-145
« Last post by Tom Graves on December 08, 2025, 10:47:16 PM »
Quote from: Royell Storing on December 08, 2025, 10:24:08 PM
Let's slow it up a little. YOU have no idea if they are looking, "towards the sniper's nest window....". That is your Opinion. It is Not Fact. And the waving of a hanky is a valid consideration here. Funny how the hanky has Not been mentioned during this discussion.

Comrade Storing,

She HAD the hanky IN her HAND already and was probably waving IT at JFK and Jackie WHEN she noticed Lee HARVEY Oswald in the WINDOW after he'd fired HIS first, MISSING-everything, shot at "Z-124," and CONTINUED waving it, HOPING the Secret Service guys would NOTICE her friend's POINTING to the WINDOW.

-- Tom
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: The First Shot
« Last post by Zeon Mason on December 08, 2025, 10:42:22 PM »
Unlike the other Mason, I’m seeing that JFK, Jackie and SS agent Hickey are ALL reacting in sync from Z140-Z150. That’s quite a coincidence I have to admit but I’m not sure if it’s a loud shot from TSBD which is the cause of those 3 in snyc reactions.

Because why has not JC turned his head left also at Z140-Z150  since he said he recognized the 1st loud noise as a rifhe shot?
 
100
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Proof Rosemary Willis had started looking towards the TSBD by Z-145
« Last post by Royell Storing on December 08, 2025, 10:24:08 PM »
Quote from: Charles Collins on December 08, 2025, 09:59:39 PM
The point is that they are both looking well behind the JFK limo towards the sniper’s nest window and pointing up high towards the sixth floor. And there is a large gap between the queen Mary and LBJ’s vehicle. So who the puck do you suppose they are waving at?

   Let's slow it up a little. YOU have no idea if they are looking, "towards the sniper's nest window....". That is your Opinion. It is Not Fact. And the waving of a hanky is a valid consideration here. Funny how the hanky has Not been mentioned during this discussion.
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