JFK Assassination Forum

Of course, you're not going to join in a discussion like a grown man. Keep on trolling.

Says the KGB-approved King of the Trolls.

Dear danny BOY o'meara,

Who said they were?

-- Tom

 
That's the best response you can muster?
Really?
What a waste of time.
Note how many of the witnesses you tried to cobble together to prop up your "z124" nonsense, actually support a first shot at z222/z223. Weird that, isn't it?

How can you still be peddling the debunked Scearce/Roselle study whilst ignoring the mountain of evidence Speer lays out destroying the notion of such an early shot?
Why do you prefer one over the other?
Is it just a troll thing?

I'm asking you to join in with a grown up discussion of the issues raised.
What are your opinions about the issues I'm raising in this thread?

Dear danny BOY o'meara,

Have you reached out to Bart, yet?

Maybe he'll tell you.

But of course, you won't believe him because he doesn't support your particular tinfoil-hat JFKA CT.

LOL!

-- Tom

Dear danny BOY o'meara,

Not to mention your refusing to deal with those witnesses who either explicitly place the first shot near the turn (see above), or their descriptions of reactions and timing anchor unmistakably to Z150 – Z170.

1. Governor John Connally

Heard the first shot as the car straightened after the turn

Before he was hit

One of the strongest anchors for Z-160 timing

2. Nellie Connally

“Just after the turn” / “as we straightened out”

First shot clearly precedes her husband’s injury

3. William Greer

First shot immediately after completing the turn onto Elm

Before slowing or turning around

4. Roy Kellerman

First shot as limousine came onto Elm

Distinguished from later shots by spacing and reaction

5. Mary Moorman

Heard a shot before seeing the President’s visible distress

Her Polaroid timing places her auditory perception near Z-160

6. Jean Hill

Heard a shot almost immediately after the turn

Before any obvious head injury

7. James Tague

Heard the first shot while the limousine was still relatively close to the turn

Before he was struck by debris (associated with later shot)

8. Lee Bowers

First loud report occurred early, before “commotion”

His tower vantage gives strong spatial/timing context

9. Marrion Baker

Heard first shot as motorcade passed the Depository area

Before running inside


-- Tom

NELLIE CONNALLY
"As Mrs. Connally recalls, just before they reached the triple underpass, the shot rang out," [11-22-63 press conference by Connally aide Julian Read ]

  “then I heard a loud, terrifying noise…I turned and looked toward the President just in time to see him clutch his neck and see him sink down in his seat." [(Notes written on 12-2-63, as reprinted in her book From Love Field, 2003]

Nellie is certain the first shot hit JFK and caused the reaction we see in the Z-film, indicating a shot at z222/z223
You've lost Nellie

KELLERMAN
“As we turned off Houston onto Elm and made the short little dip to the left going down grade, as I said, we were away from the buildings, and where there was a sign on the side of the road which I don’t recall what it was and what it said, but we no more than passed that and you are out in the open, and there is a report like a firecracker" [11-29-63 report, 18H724-727)]

"Away from the buildings" and "out in the open".
As Speer points out - " His recollection of a sign being on the side of the road is possibly a reference to the Thornton Freeway sign, adjacent to Kennedy around Z-207, but also possibly a reference to the Stemmons Freeway sign, somewhat further down the road."
You've lost Kellerman

GREER
"The President’s automobile was almost past this building and I was looking at the overpass that we were about to pass under in case someone was on top of it, when I heard what I thought was the backfire of a motorcycle behind the President’s automobile" [(11-28-63 report, 18H 723]

Passing the end of the TSBD building and looking at the approaching underpass.
You've lost Greer

MOORMAN
"As President Kennedy was opposite me, I took a picture of him.  As I snapped the picture of President Kennedy, I heard a shot ring out. President Kennedy kind of slumped over." [11-22-63 statement to Dallas Sheriff’s Department, 19H487, 24H217]

Moorman states that the first shot occurred as the limo was opposite her and it caused JFK to slump over indicating a first shot as z222/z223.
You've lost Moorman.

HILL
(On what happened after the first shot) "Then the President looked up and just about that time he grabbed himself across the chest and looked like he was in pain. He fell toward Jackie across the seat." [ 11-22-63 article in the Dallas Times-Herald--as quoted in Hill's subsequent book, JFK: The Last Dissenting Witness. Note: this was presumably an Evening Edition]

Hill states that the first shot caused JFK to grab himself "across the chest" indicating a shot at z222/z223
You've lost Hill

Tague, Bowers and Baker were nowhere near the limo when the first shot rang out. Your interpretation of their statements is beyond desperate. You're clearly familiar with Speer's work (from which all the quotes I've used come from) so you must be familiar with the crushing amount of eye-witness testimony destroying your silly notions about an early first shot.
Why don't you follow the preponderance of evidence?
Why do you stick to your debunked and destroyed nonsense?
What's wrong with you?

[...]

Dear danny BOY o'meara,

Not to mention your refusing to deal with those witnesses who either explicitly place the first shot near the turn (see above), or whose descriptions of reactions and timing anchor unmistakably to Z150 – Z170.

1. Governor John Connally

Heard the first shot as the car straightened after the turn

Before he was hit

One of the strongest anchors for Z-160 timing

2. Nellie Connally

“Just after the turn” / “as we straightened out”

First shot clearly precedes her husband’s injury

3. William Greer

First shot immediately after completing the turn onto Elm

Before slowing or turning around

4. Roy Kellerman

First shot as limousine came onto Elm

Distinguished from later shots by spacing and reaction

5. Mary Moorman

Heard a shot before seeing the President’s visible distress

Her Polaroid timing places her auditory perception near Z-160

6. Jean Hill

Heard a shot almost immediately after the turn

Before any obvious head injury

7. James Tague

Heard the first shot while the limousine was still relatively close to the turn

Before he was struck by debris (associated with later shot)

8. Lee Bowers

First loud report occurred early, before “commotion”

His tower vantage gives strong spatial/timing context

9. Marrion Baker

Heard first shot as motorcade passed the Depository area

Before running inside


-- Tom