JFK Assassination Forum

It has been a long time since we have discussed Ukraine. A couple of years ago, particularly after Trump won the 2024 election, some here were arguing that things were hopeless for Ukraine. Well, how are things going there? Russia gains have ground to a half. Their main efforts now seem to be to kill as many Ukrainian civilians as they can.

Will the Ukrainian civilians stand up to these drone attacks? I am confident that the answer is yes. So far, in four years of war, Russian has killed around 15,800 Ukrainian civilians, according to the UN's OHCHR estimates. How do these losses, in proportion to their population, rank with other civilian loses in the past and recently.

Germany, 1940-1945: One in 177 civilians killed
Great Britain, 1940-1945: One in 618 civilians killed
America, 2022-2026, One in 2,068 civilians killed in automobile accidents.
Ukraine, 2022-2026, One in 2,318 known civilians killed by Russia.

I expect America to throw in the towel and swear off driving cars before I see Ukraine throw in the towel.

Also, likely far more Ukrainians have died in face-to-face encounters with Russian troops than from drone or missile attack. Most of these deaths are unrecorded because they occur in Russian held territory. But when Ukraine recaptured a lot of territory in the spring of 2022, the bodies of 4,313 were found, killed not by drones but Russia troops. The true number of Ukrainians killed by drones or missiles is more like 12,000. And the number of Ukrainian civilians killed at close range by Russian troops is likely several times that. Giving in to Russia will likely not cause this death rate to stop but to greatly increase.

Ukraine has a wolf by the ears. They have no other choice. And as they stay the course, the wolf is getting weaker and weaker and must eventually whimper for mercy and abandon all Ukrainian territory. It will quickly turn into a strong wolf if they do otherwise.

Slava Ukraine!

This is a great post. Ukraine is near and dear to my heart, especially because my wife and I hosted an exchange student from Ukraine for a school year in 2017-2018, and then we visited her and her family in Ukraine in 2019. We totally fell in love with Ukraine.

I am utterly disgusted and sickened by Putin's unprovoked, criminal invasion of Ukraine. Our exchange student and her family had to spend time in bomb shelters in 2022 and 2023 because of Russian missile and artillery attacks.

I just reviewed that discussion, which extended over several threads over a period of months. No, I did not "storm off the forum" as a result of anything to do with your LBJ-Byrd theory. It seems to me, as I suggested back then, that the theory becomes progressively less plausible as we work our way down. LBJ and Byrd? OK, fine, plausible. Cason and Shelley? Why? Why would they risk execution by participating in the JFKA? Did Byrd have that sort of leverage over Cason and Cason over Shelley? Where is there any evidence that they benefitted in the slightest from their supposed participation? Dougherty - does he really seem like a plausible gunman? I also don't believe you emphasized at that time that you believed Oswald was actually involved, which was why I was making facetious (but exceedingly clever and humorous!)  remarks about Shelley having him in a headlock and administering noogies while some hitman did the deed. Flesh it all out and I'll listen, but on the surface it sounds less plausible to me than the Mafia or anti-Castro theories. Both of those merely required convincing Oswald he was part of a pro-Castro plot.

Your points of opposition are flimsy, to say the least.
Did Byrd have leverage over Cason, did Cason have leverage over Shelley???
What's with the leverage?
No one is being forced into this. Think of it as a small group of like-minded men who genuinely believe that JFK is something worse than the Anti-Christ (which a lot of evangelical Texans really did believe). The part of America we are talking about seems to specialise in a very extreme and violent way of looking at the world.

Who benefitted from the assassination? Do you mean financially?
If you genuinely believe you are protecting your family, your state, your country and your God, where do benefits come into it? The only people exposed in this plot are Shelley and Dougherty. These are expendable foot soldiers who believe in their own version of the Greater Good.
There is zero exposure for LBJ, Byrd and Cason.
Saying that, LBJ avoided political disgrace and prison thanks to the assassination. Not to mention becoming the most powerful man in the world.
Byrd made untold millions from it.
And Cason's wife had her fantasy of JFK being shot and killed finally fulfilled.

Dougherty - does he really seem like a plausible gunman?

100% he does.
The assassination is sloppy and unprofessional. Its success rested on a gigantic slice of luck. It was an easy shot and the assassin almost blew it. Why not Dougherty? He was in the building at the time. His movements unaccounted for. His own account of his movements is beyond belief. He freely admits to being on the 6th floor minutes before and after the assassination (amazingly, he never has to give an account of what he saw at those times).
On top of that, he seems to have had some sort of mental health issue which might have worked in the conspirators favour if he had been arrested. All Dougherty would have known about the conspiracy is Shelley. If he talked (which I doubt he would) it would have been his word against the word of Bill Shelley.

This theory is tight and plausible.
The only weak point is how Oswald fitted into it.

   "CT Rabbit Hole.............."?  I Proved the Huge Gates were "wide open".

So? What does that prove?

I proved this "getaway" car was Not on the Wiegman Film.

You haven't even proved there was a getaway car. You just made that part up.

This car was Not parked alongside the Island when the JFK Limo turned onto Elm St. 20 seconds later it is parked alongside the Island on the Couch/Darnell Films. These are Not RABBIT HOLES. These Legit Issues should have been Exposed decades ago.

I guess until you came along, there was nobody with enough imagination to dream them up.

And the same goes for the Bogus Motorcycle Cop that we see on the Darnell Film walking around the train yard after the Kill Shot.

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As I was saying...

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These ISSUES should have been fleshed out a long time ago.

We were waiting for the right person to come along. Seombody who wouldn't be emgarrassed to propose them.

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Personally, I think there are those that did recognize these Issues way back when.

You could be right. There have always been very silly people looking into the JFKA.

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Their avoidance of these "Conspiracy" Issues speaks to the validity of: (1) "wide open" Huge Gates, (2) a "getaway" car right across the street from these same gates, and, (3) a Bogus Motorcycle Cop deep inside the train yard. ALL of this was/is contrary to the Official Narrative that the assassination was conducted by 1 Lone Nut.

Silly shit will always be contrary to the truth.

Do you really think Biden planned anything during his presidency. I doubt Biden could even plan what he would have for lunch. I wonder if we will ever find out who the puppet masters were who pulled Joe's strings.

His plan was no having plan except to send more and more money.  The US bankrolls the entire effort while "Europe" sits back and does nothing.  Most countries try to avoid these situations and spend money on their own citizens.  Our politicians want to control the flow of billions to military contractors who kick back the funds in the form of donations and cushy jobs for supporters and family.  This creates an endless cycle of war and spending that brought us Vietnam, Afghanistan, and Iraq.

I'm not sure how sloppy and unprofessional it was if the M-C was the weapon.

If the weapon really was the M-C it could not have been any more sloppy and unprofessional. What professional would use that rifle??!!
It is interesting to note that both witnesses who had a good look at the rifle while it was being used failed to notice a scope. Euins, in particular, as he goes into quite some detail about what he could see of the rifle and that he could only see the assassins bald spot as he lowered his head to the rifle to take the shot (indicating the head was tilted to the left indicating a left handed shooter. Perhaps).

Well, yes, no professional would use that weapon. I was merely saying that, considering the weapon, the back and head shots were pretty good. If Oswald was a patsy gunman, of course, then it would only make sense to have him use the weapon he actually owned and that would be easily traceable to him. Maybe he'd get lucky and actually accomplish the mission. If he didn't, then our Mafia pro in the County Records Building would do so with ammunition and on a trajectory plausibly attributable to the patsy. Where I actually like this scenario is that (1) it provides us with bad guys with a far, far stronger motive than Oswald would have had, and (2) it doesn't require Oswald to be a half-crazy sociopath, which I don't think he was. I'm not planting my flag in it, but I do see it as a plausible, not-entirely-evidence-free alternative to the LN narrative.