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31
Good morning, afternoon or evening, lads.

You can call me Matt.

I've been interested in researching the assassination after I was slacking off from math homework one day and decided to watch the video of JFK's assassination. At first, the name 'Zapruder' wasn't familiar to me at all. I honestly assumed it was some obscure film from some weird news station. Obviously, I later learned that wasn't the case.

I wasn't really disgusted or disturbed by the film when I first saw it. What caught my attention was the footage itself. After a while, I kept going back to it, and then I started finding more films: Nix, Muchmore, Martin, Hughes. None of these names meant anything to me at first, but I kept digging.

Then I started finding all the different eyewitness claims and interpretations: people talking about smoke, flashes, wounds, the grassy knoll, and everything else surrounding the assassination. Eventually I got deep enough into it that I even built my own JFK video archive. I had to take it off Google Drive when it went past the 15 GB limit, so now it's hosted on my own machine instead.

More recently, I got my hands on the MPI DVD of the Zapruder film, and it looks fire, frankly. Best R$98,00 i've ever spent.

So what am I actually planning to do?

I'm interested in learning how to enhance and work with frames from the home movies. I think having the best possible copies and frames available is important before we start drawing conclusions from them. A lot of the material is scattered around, and sometimes researchers don't clearly credit where their individual frame images or enlargements came from. On top of that, getting high-quality archival material directly can be expensive.
*cough* Emailing the Sixth Floor Museum and NARA and getting no answer back *cough*

I'm not claiming to have everything figured out. I'm new to this.

What I'd like to do is learn, organize the material I can get access to, improve the quality of frames where possible, and hopefully contribute something useful to the research. I'm interested in the footage first, and the conclusions second.

Someone get me off the Oliver Stone coke, that stuff cannot be good for me.
I'll probably be banned for this post anyway.
32
Since you are unable to explain the alleged absurdity with a rational, evidence based argument, there are two possible reasons: 1. There is no rational, evidence based explanation to support your claim or 2. laziness. I know it is not due to laziness.

Did the people who heard your Z-190-ish and the Z-313 shots describe them as being "Bang-Bang," "a couple of seconds apart," or how, exactly?
33
I don't need to do anything. Your drawing is so absurd it refutes itself. You don't need my help.
Since you are unable to explain the alleged absurdity with a rational, evidence based argument, there are two possible reasons: 1. There is no rational, evidence based explanation to support your claim or 2. laziness. I know it is not due to laziness.
34
Right, but you know the response: JFK was just saying that until he got re-elected, he was appeasing the "national security war state." Once he was re-elected the "real" JFK would emerge and expose all of this war hysteria and end the Cold War. And it was for that that he had to be killed. How did they know this? That this real JFK was going to do all of that? Something that RFK and McNamara and Rusk and Bundy didn't know? Don't ask, what are you a CIA apologist?, just go with it.

The conspiracy crowd has created an alternate universe. It's the only way their conspiracy can work. Two Oswalds, fake this and fake that, witnesses being killed, coverups for decades, a compliant media, and here, in effect, two different JFKs.

Yes, conspiracies happen; governments engage in them and then lie. But sometimes they don't happen and sometimes the government isn't lying. You need to be able to tell the difference.

The CT revisionists would have us believe JFK was as liberal as his brother Teddy. Neither JFK nor RFK were leftists. Although JFK's views morphed over his years in public office, he was never a favorite of the left wing of the Democrat Party which is why they fought so hard to deny him the nomination in 1960. If I were to put a label on JFK as President, centrist would be the best fit.
35
    Knott Labs forensic technology traces bullet trajectories. Get the connection to the SBT?

Ditto for Dale Myers.

Myers has put his animations on display for all to judge. I have seen the Knott Lab website which contains a link to their YouTube animation:

https://knottlab.com/cases/knott-lab-presents-digital-reconstruction-and-findings-on-the-assassination-of-president-john-f-kennedy/

The website states they started by taking a laser scan of Dealey Plaza. So far, so good. That's what Myers did too. Then they explained the used just 25 photos and 7 frames of the Z-film to sync their animation. That is a fraction of what Myers did. Then we get to the animation on YouTube:


Compared to Myers' animation, its primitive. It looks like they were using 1980s technology. There is very little actual animation. Mostly it moves the perspective around and shows still shots from various angles. Most interesting were their various looks at the trajectory through JFK into JBC beginning the 1:38 mark. For starters they have JBC facing almost straight ahead which is not how he was aligned when the bullet struck. Then they slide him to the left. At 1:38 they show the bullet striking the left side of JBC's back. At 1:40, they show the bullet striking JBC where it actually did hit him. The continue sliding JBC leftward so at 1:42, it appears the bullet would have struck the inside of his right arm and at 1:44 it appears to strike him on the outside of his arm. Because they show this view from the side as opposed to either directly behind the limo or better yet and overhead view, we can't see where JBC is actually aligned in relation to JFK. However, since we know where the bullet actually struck JBC, that should tell them that is where he was positioned when the bullet struck. We know the bullet did not strike JBC on the left side of his back and we know it did not strike him in his right arm so that should eliminate those two as possible positions JBC could have been in at the time the two men were shot.

What I found to be most telling was this statement near the bottom of their webpage:

"This case is ongoing, but evidence strongly suggests there is more to the story in this historic event. Modern science refutes the Warren Commission’s findings on the assassination of President John F. Kennedy."

They seem to be saying their analysis is a work in progress. Sorry, but that hardly refutes either Myers work or the WCR. I would grade them with an incomplete for their efforts.
36
If you want to suggest that it is impossible you need to show that what I have portrayed in my model is beyond the range of what is possible. You can’t do that by ball parking. I have JBC’s shoulders turned to a bit less than a 2 o’clock or 60 degree position - certainly past the angle of the forward car direction to the sight line to Zapruder.  What do you determine to be the maximum possible angle he is turned at z193?  And explain why. I have the angle of the bullet relative to the direction of the car at z193 at about 16 degrees.  What do you determine to be the maximum possible angle at z193?  And explain why.  That would be a start.

Then you can start to explain what evidence makes it impossible for JBC to have his left leg out to the side. Try sitting on a seat cushion on the floor and keep your legs together. Hint: you will find it uncomfortable if not painful.

I don't need to do anything. Your drawing is so absurd it refutes itself. You don't need my help.
37
Tague's injury didn't change anything. It's likely the WC would have arrived at the SBT without it. The Secret Service recreations showed that at the moment JFK was first struck, JBC was directly in line to be hit by the bullet exiting JFK's throat. It would have taken a magic bullet to miss hitting JBC.

The WC considered the possibilities and could not reach a conclusion as to which stray shot had caused Tague's injury. What they did opine is that the mark on the curb contained lead and antimony indicating it was unlikely a whole FMJ bullet had struck the curb. That would mean it could have been the first missed shot that ricocheted and continued down range to strike the curb in front of Tague or it could have been a fragment from the head shot. I lean toward the first explanation but it cannot be proven conclusively that it was a fragment from the first shot that caused Tague's injury.

MTG has proposed a missed shot fired from the Dal-Tex building could have struck the curb near Tague but has offered no evidence of any shot fired from the Dal-Tex or any location other than the TSBD sniper's nest. He demands that the LNs prove every last detail of the shooting but doesn't apply the same standard to his own hypotheses. He offers theories completely devoid of supporting evidence.
His motto seems to be, "One rule for me, another for thee".
38
Your model does not even pass the eyeball test. Not only do you grossly exaggerate JBC's shoulder turn, you also have him leaning toward the right side of the car to get him out of the way of the bullet exiting JFK's throat. On top of that, you keep his left leg flared out in an unnatural position for someone who you showing making and extreme turn to the right. It is a joke as anyone who compares Z193 to your goofy drawing can easily see. The fact you have to exaggerate JBC's position to make your theory seem possible demonstrates that it is not.
If you want to suggest that it is impossible you need to show that what I have portrayed in my model is beyond the range of what is possible. You can’t do that by ball parking. I have JBC’s shoulders turned to a bit less than a 2 o’clock or 60 degree position - certainly past the angle of the forward car direction to the sight line to Zapruder.  What do you determine to be the maximum possible angle he is turned at z193?  And explain why. I have the angle of the bullet relative to the direction of the car at z193 at about 16 degrees.  What do you determine to be the maximum possible angle at z193?  And explain why.  That would be a start.

Then you can start to explain what evidence makes it impossible for JBC to have his left leg out to the side. Try sitting on a seat cushion on the floor and keep your legs together. Hint: you will find it uncomfortable if not painful.
39
FBI tests indicated 2.3 seconds was the minimum amount of time to fire an aimed shot. While theoretically possible, it is hard to believe that Oswald would rush his shot that quickly. He would have understood that accuracy was far more important the speed. He had only one more round left after that shot so he would want to make every shot count. One well aimed shot gave him a better chance of succeeding than two rushed shots would have. There was 4.9 seconds between the two shots that hit JFK. That's more than double the theoretical minimum so clearly Oswald was taking careful aim before squeezing off the fatal shot.
40


I can only judge Maher's views on the JFKA based on his comments. His skepticism about the SBT parrots the objections to it that were presented in Oliver Stone's fictitious movie. It's possible he could have got his ideas from other sources which have raised the same invalid objections and which are also based on the false premises that JBC was directly in front of JFK, at the same height, and facing straight ahead and also that JBC reacted to being shot at a different time than JFK.
To the best of my knowledge, there has never been a court case where Myers' 3D virtual recreation of the shooting would be relevant. The same could be said of the Knott Lab reconstruction of the shooting. Do you know of such a case?

For what it's worth, Dale Myers did win an Emmy for his work on ABC's documentary which aired around the 40th anniversary of the JFKA.

    Knott Labs forensic technology traces bullet trajectories. Get the connection to the SBT? 
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