JFK Assassination Forum

Page 32 of the Warren Report indicates that a test run was performed on the 18th of November and the most practical route from Main Street to the Trade Mart was by using Elm street because as seen above, Main Street was blocked from a direct route to Stemmons Freeway.



JohnM

  ...and a map with a previous route that was published on the morning of.

There's too much John Mytton disinformation here to fix.  Read my 9/11 Science 101 posts.

1) Yes, Larry Silverstein slipped up when he admitted that he "told them to pull" WTC7 before it collapsed in a perfectly managed explosive demolition.

2) Yes, international demolitions expert, Danny Jowenko, confirmed that WTC7 collapsed in an expert explosive demolition.  Any idiot can see that.

      It collapsed abruptly to the ground in a symmetrical free fall.  No panicking of floors.

       Even Dan Rather called that no brainer on 9/11.

        Mytton doesn't realize that the NIST "pancake" commentary about WTC7 doesn't explain the free fall collapse to the ground.  The distance between upper floors remains constant during the collapse!

1) Yes, Larry Silverstein slipped up when he admitted that he "told them to pull" WTC7 before it collapsed in a perfectly managed explosive demolition.

That's what you're going with? A slip up? Really?
So on national TV, an interview that Silverstein has spent much time preparing let's "slip" that he is guilty of insurance fraud, wired his building with explosives, and in conversation with the Fire Department Commander talks about avoiding loss of life and incredibly lets the Fire Chief make the decision to "pull it" which "obviously" doesn't refer to keeping firemen alive but for some unknown reason, known only to you, is an authorization for the Fire Department to demolish WTC7 with silent explosives?!

2) Yes, international demolitions expert, Danny Jowenko, confirmed that WTC7 collapsed in an expert explosive demolition.

Okay, let's examine what Jowenko an effective outlier in this case, was aware of;

Jowenko wasn't aware of the construction of WTC7, not off to a good start, are we!



And again.



What did Jowenko have to make his analysis, a couple of top down plans......
 




....which didn't show the unique arrangements and weak points of the supporting structure.



Jowenko has trouble getting his head around exactly how the "controlled demolition" was carried out, he assumes that the fires were put out and then the explosives were inserted but when the interviewer tells him that there were raging fires within WTC7, Jowenko has difficulty understanding what happened because presumably it's clear to him that these fires would have a dramatic consequence for pre-planted wiring and explosives.



And finally Jowenko admits to guessing of certain aspects. Oops!



As can be seen in ALL the videos, the very heavy newly added penthouse collapses first due to multiple supports giving way because of the raging fires, then....





.....several seconds later the unique specially designed transfer trusses under increased strain give way causing the building to collapse.





JohnM

You see Officer Baker there [in Darnell]? Baker's timeline is that he was inside the TSBD 30 seconds after the kill shot. This means what we are seeing on this Couch still frame is happening roughly 20 seconds after the kill shot. 20 seconds is simply not enough time for Calvery to move down [sic] the Elm St sidewalk, talk with Shelley and Lovelady, and then for Shelley and Lovelady to begin walking down the Elm Street Extension. Now, if you want to change the 62+ yr old time stamping of DPD Officer Baker, I would be interested in hearing that.

Dear Royell,

I refer you to the Warren Commission testimony of Marrion L. Baker

Page 248

Mr. BELIN. After you parked your motorcycle, did you notice anything that was going on in the area?

Mr. BAKER. Yes, sir. As I parked here ---

Mr. BEIJN. You are pointing on Exhibit 361 to the place that you have marked with “B.”

Mr. BAKER. And I was looking westward which would be in this direction.

Mr. BELIN. By that, you are pointing down the entrance to the freeway and kind of what I will call the peninsula of the park there?

Mr. BAKER. Yes, sir.

Mr. BELIN. Toward the triple underpass.

Representative Boggs. Where is the underpass?

Mr. BAKER. The underpass is down here. This is really Elm Street, and this would be Main and Commerce and they all come together here, and there is a triple overpass.

Representative Boggs. Right.

Mr. BAKER.  At this point, I looked down here as I was parking my motorcycle and these people on this ground here, on the sidewalk, there were several of them falling, and they were rolling around down there, and all these people were rushing back, a lot of them were grabbing their children, and I noticed one, I didn’t know who he was, but there was a man who ran out into the crowd and back.

Mr. BELIN. Did you notice anything else?

Mr. BAKER. Except there was a woman standing --- well, all these people were running, and there was a woman [Gloria Calvery?] screaming, “Oh, they have shot that man, they have shot that man.”

Mr. BELIN. All right. Now, you are on Exhibit 361, and you are pointing to people along the area or bordering the entrance to that expressway and that bit of land lying to the west and north, as to where you describe these people, is that correct?

Mr. BAKER. That is correct, sir.

Mr. DULLES. Would you mark where the overpass would be, right at the end of those lines, just so we get oriented on it.

Mr. BELIN. I am trying to see down here.

Mr. DULLES. I just wanted to get a general idea.

Mr. BELIN. On Exhibit 361, sir, it wouldn’t show but it basically would be off in this direction coming down this way. The entrance to the freeway would go down here and the overpass would roughly be down here.

Mr. DULLES. As far as that?

Mr. BELIN. Yes, sir; I think Mr. Redlich is going to get a picture that will better describe it.

Mr. DULLES. All right.

Mr. BELIN. All right. Is there anything else you saw there, Officer Baker, before you ran to the building?

Mr. BAKER. No, sir; not at that time.

Mr. BELIN. All right. Then what did you do after surveying the situation?

Mr. BAKER. I had it in mind that the shots came from the top of this building here.

Mr. BELIN. By this building, you are referring to what?

Mr. BAKER. The Book Depository Building.

. . .  . .  .  .

Page 259

Mr. Baker. And then I ran, kind of running walk, and went all the way around [the TSBD roof]. First, I glanced over this side here, because the last thing I heard here on the radio was the Chief saying, “Get some men up on that railroad track.”

Mr. BELIN. Did you hear that on your police radio?

Mr. BAKER. Yes, sir; that was the last thing I heard.

Mr. BELIN. As you were getting off your motorcycle?

Mr. BAKER. Yes, sir.

. . . . . .

Page 266

Mr. BELIN. All right. Did any other officer say anything to you about what he saw or thought what happened?

Mr. BAKER. I talked to several of them, but I can’t remember exactly, you know, just what their story was.

Mr. BELIN. Was there anyone you talked to who thought the shots came from the front?

Mr. BAKER. No, sir; not except that the Chief of Police, that is the only one. Now, that, like I say, that is the last thing I heard over that radio is, “Get some men up on that railroad [sic].” Now, that could mean they either came from the side, which is due north, or right across in front of him. You know-

Mr. BELIN. Well, apart from the statement you testified to that the Chief of Police made over the radio about the underpass, was there any policeman or patrolman who was in the motorcade who in any way indicated to you that the shots came from the front?

Mr. BAKER. No, sir.

. . . . . . .

My comments:

About 35 seconds after the final shot (i.e., about the time Baker was entering the TSBD according to Mark Tyler), Chief of Police Curry said over the radio, “Get men on top of that over . . . underpass. See what happened up there. Go up to the overpass.”

. . . . . .
 

Of course, having Officer Baker enter the TSBD at a later point in time, also then changes when Baker confronts Oswald inside the TSBD 2nd floor lunchroom. And the later you put Baker on the stairwell inside the TSBD, the better the chance that Sandra Styles & Vicki Adams had completed coming down that same stairwell before Baker's even reached it.

Not if Baker entered the TSBD about 35 seconds after the final shot, and not if Adams underestimated by about thirty seconds the length of time she and Styles spent on the fourth floor before starting down. That way, Oswald, Baker and Truly could have been inside the lunchroom or its "vestibule" when Adams and Styles were transiting the North-West corner of the second floor.

This would then bolster the Adams/Styles claim of not hearing Oswald coming down that same stairwell from the 6th floor sniper's nest.

Correct.

-- Tom

   For future reference, I consider The Knoll to be the grass (E) of The Steps/ in front of The Pergola. The Grassy Knoll = Between The Steps & The Triple Underpass.

You completely missed the point. As far as Witt's testimony is concerned, the only important definition of Grassy Knoll is whatever he thought it was..