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21
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Zapruder film "fakery" and the ED Forum Kooks!
« Last post by Zeon Mason on Today at 03:29:53 AM »
Quote from: Royell Storing on Today at 01:30:04 AM
   And you also forgot the HSCA "4th shot". This is what happens when you present only hand picked portions of a story. That story is quickly dismantled piece-by-piece.

And Amos Euins said he heard 4 shots. He is a major close up witness who not only heard the shots but was looking AT the shooter AS the shooter fired the rifle.

And  Amos said the shooter was sticking the rifle OUT the window and yet Amos saw no scope on the rifle.

But Arnold Rowland from a block away , DID see a scope on the rifle in the hands of some person at the SW 6th floor at 12:15.

Eagle Eye Rowland  however completely missed seeing the SE window shooter sticking a rifle out the window while Amos was watching the shooter at 12:30.

So these witness DRIVE me crazy lolz
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Gov. John Connally Grips His White Stetson Hat at Z-272
« Last post by Zeon Mason on Today at 03:12:32 AM »
Quote from: Andrew Mason on Yesterday at 06:45:25 PM
Do you not see movement of JBC here:


The momentum transfer is in the direction the car is moving.

I see in this Z260-Z290 range  that JC’s right shoulder appears to be rotating in the opposite direction from what would normally be expected from an impact of a 2000ft/ sec bullet hitting (presumably) the right of his upper back and exiting the right side of chest . Hitting the mass to the right of center of mass will usually impart angular momentum causing that mass to spin about the vertical axis ( JCs vertical spine) in the direction the bullet is traveling.

But I am not a physics expert , nor do I know for  certain the angle of this Z270 bullet hitting JC. If the bullet deflected rightward  going out of his chest, that might induce  some % of counterspin which could cancel out the initial entry spin.

I think it’s going to require an experiment with some replica human bodies that include head  arms and legs ( and a hat in the right hand of the JC model) to prove this Z190 and Z270 shot theory.

Generally I think probably most of the LNs prefer Z224 as a shot because of the forward movement of JC and his right shoulder rotating counter clockwise at Z225-Z230 to be indicative of transfer of momentum caused by bullet impact.

Note: As JC begins to lean back into Mrs Cs Lap, I think Andrew might concede that the expression on JCs face is “painful “ especially if I suggest that he has just felt the “ impact of the Z270 bullet 🙂
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Lee Harvey Oswald's and the KGB's mind-blowing synchronicity (pardon the pun)
« Last post by Tom Graves on Today at 03:09:24 AM »
Quote from: Benjamin Cole on Today at 02:38:12 AM
TG-

In your conspiracy theory, what mechanisms or carrots did Bruce Solie use to induce Lee Harvey Oswald to suddenly quit the Marines, not that long before he would have received a discharge anyway, and try to enter Russia?

[The opportunity to live out his “I Led Three or Four Lives” fantasy?]

Who is a likely “cut-out” between Solie and LHO? How did LHO and Solie communicate?

[How much communication do you think was necessary?]

In your theorizing, did Solie coordinate with the KGB on allowing LHO into Russia?

[Letting it know he was coming is “coordinating”?]

If so, was the whole phony LHO wrist-slitting in the hot bath-tub drama a staged event, to make it appear to other CIA’ers that LHO was a “earnest” defector and a nut, and not a de facto KGB asset?

[One wrist or two? — the Botkin Hospital records and his “Historic Diary” contradict each other on this issue]

In other words, Solie, LHO and the KGB scrumptiously conspired to trick Angleton and others?

[Maybe, maybe not]

When LHO went to the Mexico City Russian Embassy [Consulate] in Sept. 1963, did LHO know he was meeting KGB officers? Had Solie advised him on that matter?

[What makes you think real-deal Oswald went to the Soviet Consulate?]

What is your theory on that?

[Should I have one?]

Dear "BC,"

I'm sorry, but I don't have a theory on everything.

Should I?

Neither do I know what Lee "I Led Four Lives" Oswald had for breakfast on 16 October 1959 -- the day he arrived in Moscow and the day that GRU Lt. Col. Pyotr Popov -- whose "U-2 Mole" Oswald was ostensibly trying to root out -- just happened to be publicly arrested after having been secretly arrested eleven months earlier and "played back" against the CIA in such a way that made it seem he'd been uncovered, not due to a mole in the CIA, but due to sloppy tradecraft by the Agency (specifically, George Winters) and superior KGB surveillance.

While I'm trying to figure out the answers to your questions, please look into Bruce Leonard Solie, Leonard V. McCoy, and Russia-born George Kisevalter (the guy who claimed in April 1958 that Popov told him he'd heard a drunken GRU colonel brag at a New Year's Eve party that the Kremlin had all of the top-secret specifications of the U-2 spy plane), won't you?

And also try to figure out why someone in the Office of Security's mole-hunting Security Research Staff (where Solie was Deputy Chief) arranged with the Records Integration Division and the Office of Mail Logistics to have all of the incoming non-CIA cables on Oswald's upcoming "defection" sent to it instead of where they would normally go -- The Soviet Russia Division.

Thanks!

-- "TG"

PS “Conspiracy theory”?

Are you suggesting that the world-class humanitarian organization formerly known as the KGB does conspiracies?

Perish the thought!


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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Lee Harvey Oswald's and the KGB's mind-blowing synchronicity (pardon the pun)
« Last post by Benjamin Cole on Today at 02:38:12 AM »
TG-

In your conspiracy theory, what mechanisms or carrots did Bruce Solie use to induce LHO to suddenly quit the Marines, not that long before he would have received a discharge anyway, and try to enter Russia?

Who is a likely "cut-out" between Solie and LHO? How did LHO and Solie communicate?

In your theorizing, did Solie coordinate with the KGB on allowing LHO into Russia?

If so, was the whole phony LHO wrist-slitting in the hotye bath-tub drama a staged event, to make it appear to other CIA'ers that LHO was a "earnest" defector and a nut, and not a de facto KGB asset?

In other words, Solie, LHO and the KGB surreptiuosly conspired to trick Angleton and others?

When LHO went to MC Russia embassy in Sept. 1963, did LHO know we was meeting KGB'ers? Had Solie advised him on that matter?

What is your theory on that?


25
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Are there any "researchers" here who started out as LNs but who are now CTs?
« Last post by Tom Graves on Today at 02:06:03 AM »
Quote from: Joffrey van de Wiel on May 06, 2026, 09:19:01 PM
Had I been on the jury in the Clay Shaw trial, I would have voted not guilty. I have not however read the Garrison book On the Trail of the Assassins and base this verdict on the Oliver Stone movie JFK, which is entertaining but for a large part speculation and fantasy.

Garrison lied in his 1988 book, On the Trail of the Assassins, when he said he didn't find out until after the 1969 trial that the (Communist-owned) Italian newspaper Paese Sera had published an article three days after he had arrested Clay Shaw in March 1967 (on suspicion of having masterminded a homosexual thrill-kill assassination of JFK!!!), which alleged that Shaw was a CIA agent and that he had tried to help it reinstate Fascism in Italy in the 1950s!!!

Factoid: Joan Mellen's ex-husband, far-left Ralph Schoenman (who was far-left Bertran Russell's secretary in London) had provided Garrison in 1967 with a translated-into-English knockoff version of the story that was published in the far-left French newspaper, L' Humanite.

Our very own Gary "Snideness" Aguilar debated Max Holland on this issue several years ago on C-Span and tried to destroy Holland's argument by pointing out that a far-left French newspaper had published an article on the 1961 "Generals' Plot" a day or two before Paese Sera had.

LOL!

https://www.c-span.org/program/american-history-tv/warren-report-the-garrison-investigation/136882
26
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Gov. John Connally Grips His White Stetson Hat at Z-272
« Last post by Andrew Mason on Today at 01:59:50 AM »
Quote from: John Corbett on Today at 01:06:55 AM
Your theory depends on 8 highly improbable to impossible events. It is not even close to being plausible. There is no talking any sense into you. You will continue to delude yourself no matter how many problems with your goofball theory are pointed out to you.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over an over again and expecting a different result. It appears no matter how many problems I point out to you, you will continue with your silly rationalizations to convince yourself the impossible occurred. There is no point in me bothering to dissuade you from your fantasy. It is a joke and the joke is on you.
If you had actually had read my reply you would realize that your items 2, 3 and 5 are patently wrong and your number would be 5 not 8.  And if you actually read and understood the other five you would have realized they required a response.

The only joke is your pretence of being serious about this discussion.   

There are objective evidentiary problems with the SBT - just the SBT not the WC conclusion.
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JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Zapruder film "fakery" and the ED Forum Kooks!
« Last post by Royell Storing on Today at 01:30:04 AM »
Quote from: John Corbett on Today at 01:10:35 AM
There was a clear consensus of the witnesses that 3 shots were fired. With 3 recovered shells and 2 recovered bullets, all positively traced to Oswald's rifle. Does it take a genius to figure out what the caliber of that lost bullet was and which rifle fired it?

   And you also forgot the HSCA "4th shot". This is what happens when you present only hand picked portions of a story. That story is quickly dismantled piece-by-piece.
28
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Zapruder film "fakery" and the ED Forum Kooks!
« Last post by John Corbett on Today at 01:10:35 AM »
Quote from: Royell Storing on Yesterday at 11:52:24 PM
   Nice attempted dodge. There is a "Lost Bullet".

There was a clear consensus of the witnesses that 3 shots were fired. With 3 recovered shells and 2 recovered bullets, all positively traced to Oswald's rifle. Does it take a genius to figure out what the caliber of that lost bullet was and which rifle fired it?
29
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: Gov. John Connally Grips His White Stetson Hat at Z-272
« Last post by John Corbett on Today at 01:06:55 AM »
Your theory depends on 8 highly improbable to impossible events. It is not even close to being plausible. There is no talking any sense into you. You will continue to delude yourself no matter how many problems with your goofball theory are pointed out to you.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over an over again and expecting a different result. It appears no matter how many problems I point out to you, you will continue with your silly rationalizations to convince yourself the impossible occurred. There is no point in me bothering to dissuade you from your fantasy. It is a joke and the joke is on you.
30
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate / Re: JFK's raised left arm identified at Bethesda
« Last post by Royell Storing on Today at 12:08:13 AM »
Quote from: Darragh McConville on Yesterday at 06:30:08 PM
Hello Everyone,

This is my first post - apologies if this topic has been broached before, I was unable to find it using the search feature.

I have followed and tracked the statements recorded by David Lifton and Doug Horne for many years.  I feel I have stitched together the - admittedly complex and at times hard to believe - timeline of events concerning the casket(s) and body from Parkland to Bethesda.

The one piece of the puzzle which I cannot fit is based on an "off the record" conversation between David Lifton and Richard Lipsey where no recording equipment was permitted or used.

Lipsey stated - and Lifton directly quoted him - that JFK's left arm was raised like a "Heil Hitler salute" when he saw the body at Bethesda.  Furthermore, Lipsey said that "Humes had to jump on the body and lower it with his knee."

Lifton has discussed this in a few online videos including this series -
Lifton proceeded to hypothesise why the left arm - and only the left arm - was raised.  He implied that this was due to storage conditions for the body aboard the luggage compartment of Air Force 1.

Irrespective of how it was raised, if we take Lipsey at his word, we assume the arm was as raised as it was, I have a major problem.

What I know to be true is that the body was delivered inside a "zipped body bag" inside a "shipping casket" by helicopter, then black cadillac hearse to the back door of the Bethesday morgue at rougly 6:35pm.

Looking at both the zipped body bag (as cofirmed by Paul O'Connor at Bethesday) and the grey shipping casket (as confirmed by Jim Jenkins at Bethesda) I can't physically see how JFK's arm could have been raised at all.  There just isn't the room inside the body bag NOR the casket.

I would warmly welcome this great community to challenge me on this and I am open to being convinced that this is simply a false statement from Lipsey - he is the only person as far as I know that stated this. Equally, I'm open to being told that the body bags have plenty of room for a raised arm - but logistically, I'm sceptical.

I'm looking forward to your comments.

Thank you.

  Welcome Darragh. Good to have you aboard.
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