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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: Mary Woodward said there were 3 shots and the 1st shot missed everything
« Last post by Andrew Mason on Today at 03:59:31 AM »
Quote from: John Corbett on Yesterday at 07:58:25 PM
No but you certainly implied that by insisting that JFK was looking at Woodward and her friends when the first shot was fired. You have constantly cited her account as evidence JFK was hit by the first shot.
Yes. Her account provides very strong evidence that JFK was hit by the first shot.

Her belief is not evidence. Her observations are the evidence. Her belief that no one was hit was not something she observed. She simply did not attribute what she saw-some movements of JFK and Jackie - to JFK being wounded.

You, on the other hand, insist on attributing more weight to beliefs that are hazy which are contradicted by the clear observations she made: 1. where JFK was when the first shot sounded and 2. her clear statement that the last two shots were more rapid. 

Her evidence was that the first shot was after the President passed by her at z190 and the second shot was closer to the last shot at z313. That puts the second shot after the midpoint, which is after z257.  Since JFK is obviously hit well before z257, her observations are evidence that JFK was hit on the first shot.
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: Why doesn't Admiral Burkley receive more attention?
« Last post by Lance Payette on Today at 03:40:42 AM »
Realized I'd had a brain fart and said HSCA in several places where I meant AARB in my original post, so I corrected that.

You will note that there was an unexplained 18-month gap between the time Burkley's daughter Nancy Danlea told Horne "sure, no problem" about granting the AARB access to the materials in Illig's office and the time she told Horne "no way." She had been intrigued by what Horne told her in their first conversation - Burkley had never said anything to anyone in the family about a conspiracy (or anything else JFKA-related), and Nancy made the Sprague memo part of the price for granting access. Since Horne really didn't have much to send her, it was surely all sent during the 18-month period. The Sprague memo must have made her eyes pop out. Since she could grant access to the Illig materials, she obviously had access to them herself as the executor of Burkley's estate. My guess is, she looked at the materials and saw something there that likewise made her eyes pop out. She either decided on her own, with the other family members and/or with legal advice that "You do NOT want to get involved in this." That's the only explanation for her complete about-face that makes sense to me. Alas, she died in 2002: https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/latimes/name/nancy-denlea-obituary?id=28129080.
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Last post by Royell Storing on Today at 02:32:21 AM »
Quote from: Dan O'meara on Today at 01:25:57 AM
Look at Truly's starting position.
Does it look like he's moving toward the TSBD front door?
How do you reconcile this?

   This is why I continue to question these accepted timelines. If you look at the Sixth Floor/Darnell Film opening frames, the driver for camera car #2 is already standing outside of the car. Not in the process of getting out of the car, but standing flatfooted on the ground. Those cars were stopped for an extended period of time. The WC did all they could to quickly get Officer Baker inside the TSBD in order for him to quickly confront Oswald inside the 2ND floor lunchroom. The longer it might take for Baker to confront Oswald, the more it would look like Oswald was casually sitting inside the Lunchroom drinking a soda pop, etc. Also, Wiegman filmed the JFK Limo going under the Triple Underpass. And Wiegman was inside Camera Car #1. Wiegman jumped out of that car because it was moving far too slow. The longer it takes for the JFK Limo to go under the Triple Underpass, the more it looks like there was a JFK Limo STOP. I believe the :20 second time stamp applied to Officer Baker crossing the Island and then his :30 second time stamp of entering the TSBD, was orchestrated with the possible JFK Limo STOP and the Oswald/Baker 2nd Floor confrontation in mind. 
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: Dr. Gary Aguilar's Two-Shot Analysis
« Last post by James Slater on Today at 02:14:52 AM »
The first time I was shot it was in the left calf. I was dropped to the floor as if hit with a bat, within milliseconds. The second time I was shot it shattered my right tibia, again I was down on the floor before a tenth of a second had completed. The third time I was shot was in my mid back. The bullet entered to the left of my spine and broke my rib, exiting on the left of my stomach area. it took an eight hour operation to repair the internal damage to my spleen and stomach. They cut about 40% of my spleen away and part of my stomach. Took me two years to recover.
Getting shot in the back dropped me like a sack of sh*t within milliseconds.
The circumstances in which I was shot are not important but suffice to say I was on the right side of the law on all three occasions.
What it does learn you is what happens when you get shot and you see your colleagues getting shot and I can assure you on the above image that JC isn't any where near being shot, not even close, not even a sniff.
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: Why doesn't Admiral Burkley receive more attention?
« Last post by Lance Payette on Today at 02:08:24 AM »
BC -

Thanks for the input. The beauty of Burkley to me is that he had both the Parkland perspective and the Bethesda perspective. If he of all people thought the medical evidence pointed to a conspiracy, I don't know how even the most gung-ho LN zealot can fail to find that troubling. We'll never know exactly what Burkley thought, but what we do know certainly suggests that those like Aguilar cannot be dismissed as kooks.
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: A question for John Corbett
« Last post by Tom Graves on Today at 01:47:30 AM »
Quote from: John Corbett on Today at 12:06:06 AM
I don't suppose anything. There are any number of reasons for the people in the limo to turn their heads. A reaction to a gunshot is just one possibility. Maybe that was the point in time when Nellie said to JFK, "You can't say Dallas doesn't love you" and JFK responded by saying, "No, you sure can't." According to Nellie, that first shot sounded just after that exchange. I'm not stating that as fact, only a possibility. Nellie wasn't the most reliable of witnesses.

Point taken, but the four other limo passengers did turn their heads (in different directions) within half-a-second of JFK's quick turn to his left in Z-144, and Rosemary Willis did turn her head away from JFK and Jackie and towards the TSBD right before JFK's head turn, and Secret Service Agents Bennett and Hickey did start leaning over far in the follow-up car during the same time frame -- the former, having heard a firecracker-like-sound, to look around Dave Powers, and the latter, having heard a firecracker-like-sound, to look down at the pavement where the thought the firecracker had exploded.
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: Dr. Gary Aguilar's Two-Shot Analysis
« Last post by James Slater on Today at 01:37:33 AM »
Quote from: John Corbett on Today at 12:13:07 AM
Nellie was of such sound mind sh told us JFK clutched his throat. That never happened. Great witness. JBC had no way of knowing whether JFK had been hit by the first or second shot. He didn't turn all the way around until he had been seriously wounded. I don't care how sound minded he was, he didn't have eyes in the back of his head.

As for there being two seconds between the shot that hit JFK and the one that hit JBC, which one of them was running the stop watch?

The Z-film gives us a much better indication. It shows they both reacted to their wounds at the exact same instant. There were roughly two milliseconds between the time the bullet hit JFK's back and it entered JBC's back
I don't place any value on Brennan's ID of Oswald. I place value on him establishing the location of the shooter. The forensic evidence tells us that Oswald was the assassin, not any eyewitness.
Here is Z230. Clearly we see Kennedy has already been hit. The time he takes to raise his hands upwards towards the wound or how ever he was reacting will have taken perhaps half a second and by that time Connally has been hit yes?. We see John Connally looking straight forward and according to YOU at this exact instant he has a bullet hole in his back which shattered his fifth rib, exited his chest and shattered his radius bone in his right arm and finally lodged in his right thigh.
Are you trying to tell this forum that on this frame John Connally has been absolutely shot to pieces? How stupid do you think people are Mr Corbett?
i've been shot three times and I can assure you on this image JC HAS NOT BEEN SHOT.

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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: A question for John Corbett
« Last post by Tom Graves on Today at 01:37:04 AM »
Quote from: Lance Payette on Today at 12:18:39 AM
This is so ridiculous it's embarrassing. After carefully monitoring myself on my drive to Walmart this morning, I am forced to conclude that I reacted to at least 14 shots. My wife thinks it was 17, but she's kind of a Nellie Connally if you get my drift. Honestly, does it get any sillier or more pointless than this?

Who asked you, MGFPR?

(Macho Genius Fancy Pants Rants)
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: How Did Bart Kamp Create The Lovelady Image?
« Last post by Dan O'meara on Today at 01:25:57 AM »
Quote from: Royell Storing on July 24, 2026, 05:07:56 PM
     Based on the timeline of Office Baker above, Shelley/Lovelady have 35 seconds at this point to arrive at the TSBD 1st Floor Loading Dock. And, as the above still frame makes clear, Shelley/Lovelady are Not even moving toward the TSBD front door. PLus, the steps leading up to the landing/front door are Jammed Packed with people. Whenever they do start toward the TSBD front door, Shelley/Lovelady would Not be moving toward the front door in a straight line. Their advancing toward the front door would be obstructed. The same goes for their advancing through the TSBD Lobby. The 1 Minute Tick/Tock does Not permit Shelley/Lovelady to reach the freight elevator.  Adams claiming that it took her 1 Minute MAX to go from the window to the 1st floor, has to be wrong for her to see Shelley and Lovelady at the freight elevator.

Look at Truly's starting position.
Does it look like he's moving toward the TSBD front door?
How do you reconcile this?
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: Why doesn't Admiral Burkley receive more attention?
« Last post by Benjamin Cole on Today at 01:19:28 AM »
LP--

I enjoyed your post.

AI version: Burkley's lawyer contacted the House Select Committee on Assassinations in 1977 to assert that Burkley possessed information indicating a multi-person participation in the assassination, but formal testimony was never recorded

Seems like an oversight on the part of the HSCA, a body that usually did good work.

There are reasons to have reasonable doubts regarding the WC narrative of the JFKA, foremost that the operating instructions from President LBJ were to find nothing that might trigger a nuke war.

The HSCA, also not staffed by kooks, concluded there had been a JFKA comspiracy.

My two cents: Where the JFKA research community has gone wrong is in relying on ideology to frame narratives--that is the CIA, or powerful US plutocrats perped the JFKA. Lately, it has been Mossad.

But why was President LBJ so concerned? More likely that LHO had ties to Moscow and Havana. Those leads were snuffed out early.

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