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Investigative journalist Jack Cheevers' new book Kennedy's Coup: A White House Plot, a Saigon Murder, and America's Descent into Vietnam has many ultra-liberal JFKA conspiracy theorists in an uproar.

This is a bit ironic because Cheevers is no rock-ribbed conservative. His book repeats some of the standard liberal falsehoods about the Vietnam War (that Diem was losing the war effort at the time he was murdered, that Diem's government was behind the May 8 "massacre," that Diem treated Buddhists unfairly, etc.).

Cheevers' sin in the eyes of many ultra-liberals is that he (entirely correctly) argues that JFK's decision to green-light the coup against Ngo Dinh Diem was not only a failure of leadership but an enormous disaster for the war effort. Cheevers also argues that the disastrous coup led to greater U.S. involvement after the assassination.

When a book on JFK and the Vietnam War receives praise from all across the spectrum, from National Review to H. R. McMaster to Max Boot to Christopher Goscha, as Cheevers' book has received, you know it must be a credible work of scholarship.

But, not to the ultra-liberal camp of the JFKA research community. To them, the book is a "hatchet job" (Chad Nagle).

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MTG will buy into any version of the JFKA except the correct one.
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JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate / Re: The First Shot
« Last post by John Corbett on Today at 12:16:09 PM »
In this stupid story that you've swallowed down, like the moron you are, there is not a speck of evidence that CE399 was found in Parkland.
ZERO EVIDENCE
You don't even realise this.
You think that by repeating the Warren Commission's lies you are somehow presenting evidence.
You clearly don't understand what 'evidence' even means.
You are so brain-washed you think that by just saying what you have been told to think makes it true, and that everyone else should be able to see that.

THERE IS ZERO EVIDENCE THAT CE399 WAS DISCOVERED IN PARKLAND

ZERO

The other bullet recovered from the shooting was positively matched to the same rifle that fired CE399. Since Oswald's rifle was used to fire the shots that killed JFK, what reason would anybody have to plant another bullet from the same rifle? It makes no sense, but you don't care. You bought into the myth that CE399 was planted many years ago and no amount of reason or logic is going to dissuade you from that silly belief.
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MTG--

That, and I point out JFK was an ardent anti-communist, not the James Douglass-defined appeaser singing kumbaya.

Oh well, the world will have to survive without my 2 cents in EF-JFKA.

For a change, you got something right. Of the candidates running for the Democrat nomination in 1960, JFK was by far the most conservative. The liberal wing would have preferred anybody else. First Humphrey flamed out during the primaries. Their next choice was Stuart Symington. Some of them were hoping to draft Adlai Stephenson for a third bite of the apple. LBJ was the favorite of the Southern Democrats. Together, they couldn't muster the delegates to deny JFK a first ballot nomination. Neither Harry Truman nor Eleanor Roosevelt wanted JFK. Roosevelt even refused to support him until very late in the general election when she gave him a lukewarm endorsement.

Some things a lot of people forget about JFK:

He was elected to Congress at a time northeast Republicans were the liberals and the Democrats the more conservative option. Think Rockefeller.

JFK and Nixon were both friends and anti-communist allies.

In 1950 JFK donated $1000 to Nixon's Senate campaign against the far-left Helen Douglas.

In 1952, conservative JFK ran for the Senate and won against the liberal Henry Cabot Lodge.

After being elected, Joseph Kennedy called his friend Joe McCarthy and asked him to mentor JFK, even though McCarthy was a Republican.

McCarthy was very close with the Kennedys. RFK was a staff lawyer on McCarthy's committee. RFK ask McCarthy to be the godfather to his first child. Edward R. Murrow was the guest speaker at a Washington JayCees  dinner that was citing RFK as one of the top ten young men for the year. RFK walked out in protest when Murrow got up to speak. Joe McCarthy even dated one of the Kennedy sisters for a while.

When McCarthy had his fall from grace, JFK had to distance himself from McCarthy because he had presidential ambitions, but he held firm on his hardline anti-Communist positions.

Some people who aren't old enough to know better assume JFK was a staunch liberal like his youngest brother Teddy but the record paints a much different picture.
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MTG: I know why you're still banned: The conspiracy in your conspiracy theory is way too small!  :) :) :)

MTG--

That, and I point out JFK was an ardent anti-communist, not the James Douglass-defined appeaser singing kumbaya.

I pointed out the same thing, in spades, so I don't see how that could be a reason for not lifting your ban. I created two threads and posted many replies in other threads in which I vigorously argued and documented that JFK was determined to win the Vietnam War, that he was staunchly anti-communist and pro-national defense, that NSAM 263 does not prove JFK intended to unconditionally withdraw from Vietnam after the election (in fact, it refutes this notion), and that LBJ was hardly cuddly and cozy with the Joint Chiefs but bitterly attacked them for daring to try to persuade him to ditch his insane, communist-friendly rules of engagement.

I was also just as vigorous as you were about calling out the embarrassing anti-Israeli propaganda posted by some of the ultra-liberals there. Ditto when it came to pointing out what a fraud and crackpot L. Fletcher Prouty was.

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Forget Jack Kevorkian. Fauci is the real Dr. Death.
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Not at all. If you think the Altgens bullet hole "theory," is a "real doozy," perhaps you will explain the evidence that Doug Weldon, Doug Horne, Roy Schaeffer, and Dr. David Mantik have presented on the subject.

You guys constantly dismiss solid, valid evidence with bombastic verbiage but rarely get around to dealing with evidence itself.

The hole is visible in certain frames of the MPI large-format version of the Zapruder film. I can see it with my own eyes. The only response you guys have offered is that the apparent hole is an optical illusion.

Sorry, but you're the one making bombastic claims - and who keeps running away when asked to back them up. Disproving the SBT would be a fairly big deal, but all you seem to have is anecdotal evidence of some of your Fetzerite buddies claiming to be able to see something that resembles a bullet hole. Wow. Why can't you simply produce an actual image showing what you say it "undisputedly" does? (The answer should be obvious to anyone with half a brain.)
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Yeah, cousin Mary got hit on the head by a rock thrown towards one of Mayor Daley’s finest.  Gave her some ‘street cred’ lol.  But making matters worse for me was running into Peter’s mom at Hillwood, where my wife was a volunteer. We talked mostly about what was happening underneath the sea, and why we should start there instead of spending so much money in outer space.

Have you ever read this?

http://fkancestry.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/02/WillFinal3.jpg
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I don’t see why the WC investigators would want Bakers time to the  steps to be as soon as 20-25 secs post shots because they’ve got to make sure there was enough time for their suspected 6th floor shooter Oswald to be able to get down to the 2nd floor lunchroom. Likewise They were careful to assign 2 minutes as the time for Mrs Reid’s return to the 2nd floor office so she’s not seeing Oswald too early before Baker/Truly do.

Baker himself thought it probably was closer to 90 secs post shots when he finally got to the door of the 2nd floor lunchroom.

It’s all depending on Mrs Garner. What time did she follow behind Adams and Stiles. She never gave any specific time estimate other than to say she was “right behind them” and followed “ almost immediately”.
So is that less than 30 secs? If so  then there is no way a 6th floor shooter using the stairs could have gone past her unseen. (however he could have used one of the elevators like Jack Dougherty allegedly did)

Could it be as long as 1 minute post shots? If so a 6th floor shooter CAN get down it the 4th floor landing and start down the 4th floor stairs to 3rd floor without being seen by Garner.

From what excerpts I’ve read from Barry Ernest book pertaining to Garners statements one particular one being she changed her statement from seeing Adam’s and Stiles (A/S) go down the stairs to HEARING THEM go down.

I have not found any clarification of what exactly Garner heard. If she’s saying she “ heard them” then to me that implies she heard their voices. If so then she could not have waited 1 minute to follow A/S because A/S have exited the stairwell to the 1st floor and it’s improbable Garner have heard their voices then.

As to what reason Lovelady and Shelley are suddenly more interested in going back in to the TSBD quickly rather than go investigate  all the commotion on the GK, it does seem kind of strange. Maybe seeing Baker running to the steps with his gun in hand was more compelling than what was happening elsewhere.

   To me, if you hear someone "go down" any stairs, this applies to the sound their feet make on those stairs. If you hear someone "on" the stairs, this would be the voice of that person. "Down" implies someone being in motion.
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MTG--

That, and I point out JFK was an ardent anti-communist, not the James Douglass-defined appeaser singing kumbaya.

Oh well, the world will have to survive without my 2 cents in EF-JFKA. 
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