JFK Assassination Forum

There were two themes that I hammered on at the Ed Forum to howls of protest: (1) the large body of psychological and sociological studies and literature that has accumulated over the past 20 years concerning the distinct conspiracy-prone mindset, and (2) the near-exact parallels between the UFO phenomenon and the JFKA and their respective communities of researchers, hobbyists and cultists.

No less a legend in his own mind than Jim DiEugenio said that my UFO analogy was the single most irritating thing about me for him. UFO believers are all wackos, you see, while he is a serious historian (albeit one who exemplifies the conspiracy-prone mindset to the nth degree).

I happen to think the UFO phenomenon is far, far more significant than the JFKA. It has the potential to alter our understanding of our place in the universe and even of the very nature of reality. If the LN narrative is correct, the JFKA is no more significant than the McKinley assassination. If certain conspiracy theories are correct, the JFKA might tell us something about the subsequent history and current state of the country – but not much, and pretty much nothing we couldn’t have figured out without worrying about the JFKA.

Like it or not, a truly vast body evidence, scientific studies and serious theorizing concerning the UFO phenomenon has accumulated over the past 75 or so years. Much of it has little or nothing to do with “space aliens,” and serious theories are all over the map. Even versions of the ET hypothesis are far more sophisticated and plausible than "space aliens" in nuts-and-bolts craft.

As with the JFKA, most people have no awareness whatsoever of this vast body of material. They glean their minimal understanding from the mainstream media and perhaps the occasional program on the Discovery Channel or video on YouTube. They either think the UFO phenomenon, like JFKA conspiracy theorizing, is all nonsense or they have some vague notion that “there must be something to it” but they don’t really know or care what this might be.

This near-complete lack of awareness is evident on this thread. For many, the term UFO conjures up nothing but images of wacky folks who think “space aliens” are visiting the planet in motherships and saucers from Zeta Reticuli and the Pleiades.

When the vast body of UFO material is viewed in the context of the latest thinking in the areas of physics, cosmology and consciousness, it becomes fascinating. Some of the more sophisticated UFO theories no longer seem nearly as far “out there” as they once did. As we see on this thread, however, most people have no clue. It’s all just “space aliens.”

As with the JFKA and every other area of weirdness and religion, the UFO community is absolutely plagued with hoaxsters, fraudsters, fast-buck artists, nutcase cultists, and folks deep in the grip of the conspiracy-prone mindset or even genuine mental illness. Indeed, in my opinion based on long experience and observation both the UFO and JFKA communities are dominated by these characters. (Don't come unglued, CTers. I'm talking about the LN side as well.) One has to work to find the serious and worthy-of-consideration aspect of either subject and separate the wheat from the chaff.

I find it slightly humorous that folks who think the JFKA is worth vast amounts of their time are so utterly clueless and cavalierly dismissive of a phenomenon that is potentially vastly more significant. We can’t all be equally informed about (or even interested in) everything, of course, but the knee-jerk dismissiveness by JFKA folks who obviously have no clue what they are talking about insofar as the UFO phenomenon is concerned is really kind of astonishing and vaguely humorous (or perhaps pathetic).

But on it goes, and always will.

You are spot on with this. This is legit but what exactly is it.

I grew up around Malmstrom AFB and UFO's were a constant subject with all the ICBM's in the area. One UFO was seen over a legion Baseball game in mid-day by a large group of people.

A AF security detail recently testified to Congress about one encounter and can be read online.

In the same sentence with UFO's were cattle mutilations. Both are very real and seem to go hand in hand with no explanation.

The day after the assassination, about 24 hours later, LBJ calls Hoover for an update on the investigation. Hoover is confused and provides LBJ, even about a day later, with astonishingly incorrect information.

Like this (he tells LBJ that Oswald killed a police officer during a gun battle in the theater):



Transcript is here: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/lbjlib/phone_calls/Nov_1963/html/LBJ-Nov-1963_0029a.htm

There clearly was a lot of confusion and speculation in those first 24 hours, because all sorts of people in law enforcement were making statements that simply did not match the actual facts and/or each other. Hoover was clearly misinformed. What is surprising and highly irresponsible is that he just passed on this unverified and incorrect information to Johnson. He should have known better or, alternatively, he had an agenda of his own.

Are there still people in this world who think Ed Hoffman and Beverley Oliver are credible witnesses?

What i did is i watched & read every thing that Hoffman said, & i read every thing that he supposedly said.
And i can clearly see that Hoffman was indeed on the overpass at that time.
But 99.9% of what he said was krapp.

Several years ago, I noticed that once he hit the floor, Oswald was lifted up by Jim Leavelle as he is struggling to stop Jack Ruby from shooting Oswald a second time.  I focused on Oswald in the films once he disappeared from view, and saw that he was raised from the floor during the scuffle.

 I notice, upon seeing the enhanced videos included within this post, that Jack Ruby (after being lightly struck by the vehicle that's back into place to carry Oswald across town) appears to lose his footing with his left foot as he hurriedly begins taking another step towards Oswald.  I also noticed that the coat tail on Ruby's suit coat can be seen against the tail light of the car as it's backing in. I also noticed that Oswald's feet completely leave the floor, once he's shot. I also notice that Ruby's gun, still in his hand along with the hand(s) of L.C. Graves, can be seen between Grave's legs from behind Graves as Grave's is trying to remove the gun from Ruby's hand.
 
 Just my own observation.

There were two themes that I hammered on at the Ed Forum to howls of protest: (1) the large body of psychological and sociological studies and literature that has accumulated over the past 20 years concerning the distinct conspiracy-prone mindset, and (2) the near-exact parallels between the UFO phenomenon and the JFKA and their respective communities of researchers, hobbyists and cultists.

No less a legend in his own mind than Jim DiEugenio said that my UFO analogy was the single most irritating thing about me for him. UFO believers are all wackos, you see, while he is a serious historian (albeit one who exemplifies the conspiracy-prone mindset to the nth degree).

I happen to think the UFO phenomenon is far, far more significant than the JFKA. It has the potential to alter our understanding of our place in the universe and even of the very nature of reality. If the LN narrative is correct, the JFKA is no more significant than the McKinley assassination. If certain conspiracy theories are correct, the JFKA might tell us something about the subsequent history and current state of the country – but not much, and pretty much nothing we couldn’t have figured out without worrying about the JFKA.

Like it or not, a truly vast body evidence, scientific studies and serious theorizing concerning the UFO phenomenon has accumulated over the past 75 or so years. Much of it has little or nothing to do with “space aliens,” and serious theories are all over the map. Even versions of the ET hypothesis are far more sophisticated and plausible than "space aliens" in nuts-and-bolts craft.

As with the JFKA, most people have no awareness whatsoever of this vast body of material. They glean their minimal understanding from the mainstream media and perhaps the occasional program on the Discovery Channel or video on YouTube. They either think the UFO phenomenon, like JFKA conspiracy theorizing, is all nonsense or they have some vague notion that “there must be something to it” but they don’t really know or care what this might be.

This near-complete lack of awareness is evident on this thread. For many, the term UFO conjures up nothing but images of wacky folks who think “space aliens” are visiting the planet in motherships and saucers from Zeta Reticuli and the Pleiades.

When the vast body of UFO material is viewed in the context of the latest thinking in the areas of physics, cosmology and consciousness, it becomes fascinating. Some of the more sophisticated UFO theories no longer seem nearly as far “out there” as they once did. As we see on this thread, however, most people have no clue. It’s all just “space aliens.”

As with the JFKA and every other area of weirdness and religion, the UFO community is absolutely plagued with hoaxsters, fraudsters, fast-buck artists, nutcase cultists, and folks deep in the grip of the conspiracy-prone mindset or even genuine mental illness. Indeed, in my opinion based on long experience and observation both the UFO and JFKA communities are dominated by these characters. (Don't come unglued, CTers. I'm talking about the LN side as well.) One has to work to find the serious and worthy-of-consideration aspect of either subject and separate the wheat from the chaff.

I find it slightly humorous that folks who think the JFKA is worth vast amounts of their time are so utterly clueless and cavalierly dismissive of a phenomenon that is potentially vastly more significant. We can’t all be equally informed about (or even interested in) everything, of course, but the knee-jerk dismissiveness by JFKA folks who obviously have no clue what they are talking about insofar as the UFO phenomenon is concerned is really kind of astonishing and vaguely humorous (or perhaps pathetic).

But on it goes, and always will.