JFK Assassination Forum

Photographic Film Video & Audio Discussion & Debate => Photographic Film Video & Audio Discussion & Debate => Topic started by: Jake Maxwell on May 25, 2018, 01:22:30 AM

Title: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film with gif movement!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on May 25, 2018, 01:22:30 AM
NOTE correction: The Lost Bullet inserted a segment of the Bell film at the end of a NIX film segment. I've tried to correct my postings appropriately... Both images documented in this thread are from different sections of the Bell film)

This image is from an enhanced version of the Bell Film found in the video documentary, The Lost Bullet.
It comes just seconds after the assassination...
Finally...!!

(https://image.ibb.co/eVdwQ8/ezgif_com_crop_14.gif)

(https://image.ibb.co/iRzTO8/ezgif_com_resize_10.gif)(https://image.ibb.co/hSKx38/ezgif_com_gif_maker_16.gif)

(https://image.ibb.co/fiiBbT/ezgif_com_gif_maker_13.gif)

WHERE'S WALDO ??

(https://image.ibb.co/eSRQXo/ezgif_com_crop_9.gif)


gif movement!!

(https://image.ibb.co/hjYUaJ/ezgif_com_crop_22.gif)
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on May 25, 2018, 03:06:37 AM
Paul, It's a gif and might take a few seconds to load... No... I think the image server is down....

I was using Cubeupload... Here's another go at it....


(https://image.ibb.co/iRzTO8/ezgif_com_resize_10.gif)

(https://image.ibb.co/fiiBbT/ezgif_com_gif_maker_13.gif)
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Denis Morissette on May 25, 2018, 04:32:39 AM
Call the Dallas FBI office to let them know!
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Paul Ernst on May 25, 2018, 11:38:53 PM
Hi Jake.

It is too grainy!

You can discover several heads in those pictures, still frames.

Keep on searching, don't give up.

Best regards Paul.
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on May 27, 2018, 02:19:22 AM
This gif seems to show a very distinct image... behind a gun barrel....

(https://image.ibb.co/hSKx38/ezgif_com_gif_maker_16.gif)
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Steve Barber on June 03, 2018, 07:10:39 PM
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This image is from an enhanced version of the Bell Film found in the video documentary, The Lost Bullet.
It comes just seconds after the assassination...
Finally...!!

(https://image.ibb.co/iRzTO8/ezgif_com_resize_10.gif)(https://image.ibb.co/hSKx38/ezgif_com_gif_maker_16.gif)
(https://image.ibb.co/cyVSi8/Screen_Shot_2018_05_24_at_8_20_09_PM.png)
(https://image.ibb.co/fiiBbT/ezgif_com_gif_maker_13.gif)
(https://image.ibb.co/krg1bT/Screen_Shot_2018_05_25_at_12_52_43_PM.png)

There is no "helmet man".  The man in the Z film is none other than either Emmett Hudson, or the man in the red shirt standing on the stairs on the knoll.  I thought everyone knew this already.  I guess you didn't. 
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Royell Storing on June 03, 2018, 11:09:29 PM
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There is no "helmet man".  The man in the Z film is none other than either Emmett Hudson, or the man in the red shirt standing on the stairs on the knoll.  I thought everyone knew this already.  I guess you didn't.

   ...........Or the Black Dog Man, Or one of the alleged Young Black Couple, or Gordon Arnold............................
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Steve Barber on June 04, 2018, 02:29:09 AM
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   ...........Or the Black Dog Man, Or one of the alleged Young Black Couple, or Gordon Arnold............................

 Gordon Arnold wasn't there. He made that story up.  That is why  he isn't in any photographs or films.

  The woman of the black couple, according to the one witness, MArilyn Sitzman(whom you call a "liar) saw them "run back there" obviously away from the danger . You go ahead and disbelieve everything that proves the black couple was there.  There's no "alleged" about it. 
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: John Iacoletti on June 04, 2018, 04:15:50 AM
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Gordon Arnold wasn't there. He made that story up.  That is why  he isn't in any photographs or films.

Well with logic like that, Oswald wasn't there in the 6th floor window.  That is why he isn't in any photographs or films.
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Royell Storing on June 04, 2018, 04:34:05 PM
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Gordon Arnold wasn't there. He made that story up.  That is why  he isn't in any photographs or films.

  The woman of the black couple, according to the one witness, MArilyn Sitzman(whom you call a "liar) saw them "run back there" obviously away from the danger . You go ahead and disbelieve everything that proves the black couple was there.  There's no "alleged" about it.

         "Gordon Arnold wasn't there." "He made that story up" "That is why he isn't in Any photographs or films."  That rationale would mean you are also discrediting SA Lem Johns claiming: (1) he jumped out of the LBJ SS Follow Up Car, (2) he ran down Elm St toward the LBJ Convertible, and (3) he was left standing in Elm St as the JFK Motorcade sped away,  because  "That is why he isn't in Any photographs or films"
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Steve Barber on June 05, 2018, 01:52:06 PM
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         "Gordon Arnold wasn't there." "He made that story up" "That is why he isn't in Any photographs or films."  That rationale would mean you are also discrediting SA Lem Johns claiming: (1) he jumped out of the LBJ SS Follow Up Car, (2) he ran down Elm St toward the LBJ Convertible, and (3) he was left standing in Elm St as the JFK Motorcade sped away,  because  "That is why he isn't in Any photographs or films"

   There you go again "adding your own little spin" on things people said they did.
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Michael Walton on June 06, 2018, 12:02:27 AM
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This image is from an enhanced version of the Bell Film found in the video documentary, The Lost Bullet.
It comes just seconds after the assassination...
Finally...!!



The head in the bushes has already been debunked.  Bob Groden himself was used as a stand-in for the helmet man, photos were taken, and it showed it was one of the old guys running in the direction of Z as Z panned right to follow the car.

You can see the old guy running here.

Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Barry Pollard on June 07, 2018, 02:21:29 AM
Groden's early analysis of the area above the wall that I mentioned earlier Jake.
https://youtu.be/91RFpzp-2gM?t=1h22m10s (https://youtu.be/91RFpzp-2gM?t=1h22m10s)

Dale Myers looked into Badgeman and that general area near the wall and although his handling of the Bowers issue doesn't tell the full story, his analysis of the bottle on the wall is rather sweet.
http://www.jfkfiles.com/jfk/html/badgeman_5.htm (http://www.jfkfiles.com/jfk/html/badgeman_5.htm)
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on June 09, 2018, 07:51:45 PM

An interesting comparison to an Irish Helmet...

(https://image.ibb.co/jhpgso/ezgif_com_crop_17.gif)
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on June 14, 2018, 05:51:36 PM
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The head in the bushes has already been debunked.  Bob Groden himself was used as a stand-in for the helmet man, photos were taken, and it showed it was one of the old guys running in the direction of Z as Z panned right to follow the car.

You can see the old guy running here.


That could very well be the case... but it does leave open the question...
"Who is this person... who looks to have on a helmet... with a rifle or scope?"
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Michael Walton on June 15, 2018, 12:14:29 AM
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That could very well be the case... but it does leave open the question...
"Who is this person... who looks to have on a helmet... with a rifle or scope?"

Seriously, Jake. It only looks like his head is a "helmet." If there had been someone "sinister" there - pretty much in wide open space - don't you think he'd have been caught? If you think plausibly about it, it makes a lot more sense.
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on June 15, 2018, 01:25:36 AM


Michael, It looks like this figure is behind the fence, and mostly in the shadows. I don't know if this figure would have been an actual shooter, but it does look like a gunman... And I suppose, anyone with a law enforcement uniform on site with a gun, could easily argue that he's on a security detail, etc....
But the main concern here is this image that looks like a man with a helmet and a gun barrel... It just comes out of the shadows behind the grassy knoll... These are not random pixels... I just think this image should be taken into consideration before we draw a firm conclusion...
Jake
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Royell Storing on June 15, 2018, 04:16:34 PM
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Seriously, Jake. It only looks like his head is a "helmet." If there had been someone "sinister" there - pretty much in wide open space - don't you think he'd have been caught? If you think plausibly about it, it makes a lot more sense.

           Did anyone catch/stop that Tall & Wide Cleaning Truck that was stood right beside the Dal Tex Bld as the JFK Limo turned onto Elm? That thing was large enough to pass for a S.W.A.T. Vehicle & somehow it Immediately Disappeared following the shooting. Dealey Plaza was absolute pandemonium. 
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on June 15, 2018, 11:43:47 PM
MOVEMENT!!!!!!!

gif movement in Bell film!!!!



(https://image.ibb.co/fz2u9d/ezgif_com_crop_20.gif)(https://image.ibb.co/hjYUaJ/ezgif_com_crop_22.gif)
(https://image.ibb.co/e9teaJ/ezgif_com_gif_maker_28.gif)
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Michael Walton on June 17, 2018, 01:34:54 PM
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MOVEMENT!!!!!!!

Helmet Man confirmed in NIX film!!!!



(https://image.ibb.co/fz2u9d/ezgif_com_crop_20.gif)(https://image.ibb.co/hjYUaJ/ezgif_com_crop_22.gif)
(https://image.ibb.co/e9teaJ/ezgif_com_gif_maker_28.gif)

I found the debunking article that I mentioned above.  This should put this nonsense to rest, Jake.  No one was down there except the old guy running away after the last shot.

Read it over and over again until it sinks in and Bob Groden, a well-known CTer, is actually involved in this debunking:

http://www.jfklancer.com/miller/mysteryman.html (http://www.jfklancer.com/miller/mysteryman.html)

Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on June 17, 2018, 05:59:09 PM
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I found the debunking article that I mentioned above.  This should put this nonsense to rest, Jake.  No one was down there except the old guy running away after the last shot.

Read it over and over again until it sinks in and Bob Groden, a well-known CTer, is actually involved in this debunking:

http://www.jfklancer.com/miller/mysteryman.html (http://www.jfklancer.com/miller/mysteryman.html)


Michael, It is very possible, as I have mentioned above, that Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man is one of the three on the steps - or someone other than the person I have identified behind the fence in the Bell film.

This still leaves the question open: Who is this person that appears in the Bell film who seems to be wearing a helmet behind a barrel - and actually shows MOVEMENT in a gif?

I appreciate all the work of others who have studied these things before me, but Groden did not have the best digital versions of these films to work with. If you watch the National Geographic documentary, The Lost Bullet, you'll note that they claim to have enhanced the copies of the films they show, which are supposed to be virtually as clear or clearer than the original (their claim). I have found them to be very, very clear.

Again, we have to deal with these images that show up in the film, and it even shows movement. These are not random pixels - and not film artifacts.

Jake



Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Steve Barber on June 17, 2018, 07:54:11 PM
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Michael, It is very possible, as I have mentioned above, that Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man is one of the three on the steps - or someone other than the person I have identified behind the fence in the Bell film (now found in the NIX film).

This still leaves the question open: Who is this person that appears in the Bell film who seems to be wearing a helmet behind a barrel - and seems to correspond with a figure in the NIX film who actually shows MOVEMENT in a gif?

I appreciate all the work of others who have studied these things before me, but Groden did not have the best digital versions of these films to work with. If you watch the National Geographic documentary, The Lost Bullet, you'll note that they claim to have enhanced the copies of the films they show, which are supposed to be virtually as clear or clearer than the original (their claim). I have found them to be very, very clear.

Again, we have to deal with these images that show up in these films, that even show movement. They are not random pixels - and not film artifacts.

Jake

Jake,

  From which sequence of the Bell footage are you using the frame in question that you believe shows "Helmet Man"? 
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film!
Post by: Michael Walton on June 17, 2018, 09:38:00 PM
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Michael, It is very possible, as I have mentioned above, that Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man is one of the three on the steps - or someone other than the person I have identified behind the fence in the Bell film (now found in the NIX film).

This still leaves the question open: Who is this person that appears in the Bell film who seems to be wearing a helmet behind a barrel - and seems to correspond with a figure in the NIX film who actually shows MOVEMENT in a gif?

I appreciate all the work of others who have studied these things before me, but Groden did not have the best digital versions of these films to work with. If you watch the National Geographic documentary, The Lost Bullet, you'll note that they claim to have enhanced the copies of the films they show, which are supposed to be virtually as clear or clearer than the original (their claim). I have found them to be very, very clear.

Again, we have to deal with these images that show up in these films, that even show movement. They are not random pixels - and not film artifacts.

Jake

It's obvious you didn't even read the article I posted.  It tells you at the end of it. 
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film - confirmed by NIX gif movement!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on June 17, 2018, 10:04:07 PM
Steve, Yes, the documentary has two sequences of the Bell film... The image would come from the second sequence, the zoomed in segment. The Youtube copy is 1080p50 HD, and the best I could find... posted by Freeman SQ. However, this copy is apparently from a television showing, and has commercials. The image is found at 25:22. It might be even clearer from the original.

There seems to be the very same image appearing later in Bell and showing movement. The first gif (below) shows the image coming out of the shadows... the second shows definite movement of the image...
It begs for an explanation...

Thanks, Jake

(NOTE: the documentary seems to have placed a Bell segment at the end of a NIX segment...sorry for the confusion...)

(https://image.ibb.co/mPKhXy/ezgif_com_gif_maker_30.gif)

(https://image.ibb.co/fz2u9d/ezgif_com_crop_20.gif)
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film - confirmed by NIX gif movement!
Post by: Steve Barber on June 18, 2018, 02:20:22 AM
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Steve, Yes, the documentary has two sequences of the Bell film... The image would come from the second sequence, the zoomed in segment. The Youtube copy is 1080p50 HD, and the best I could find... posted by Freeman SQ. However, this copy is apparently from a television showing, and has commercials. The image is found at 25:22. It might be even clearer from the original.

In the NIX film, what seems to be the very same image appears and shows movement. The first gif (below) shows the image coming out of the shadows... the second shows definite movement of the image...
It begs for an explanation...


Thanks, Jake

(https://image.ibb.co/mPKhXy/ezgif_com_gif_maker_30.gif)

(https://image.ibb.co/fz2u9d/ezgif_com_crop_20.gif)


  Thank you, Jake.  Which sequence of the Nix film is the frame you refer to from?  Assassination or after? 
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film with gif movement!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on June 18, 2018, 02:51:11 AM
Steve, I was following the documentary that was showing the NIX film.
They apparently inserted a portion of the Bell film at the end.
So, I need to correct the information.
The figure I have been referencing apparently shows up twice in the Bell film... and the second time it shows movement... I'll try to correct my postings in this thread the best I can...
But it comes shortly after the assassination...
Thanks, Jake
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film with gif movement!
Post by: Steve Barber on June 18, 2018, 01:21:24 PM
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Steve, I was following the documentary that was showing the NIX film.
They apparently inserted a portion of the Bell film at the end.
So, I need to correct the information.
The figure I have been referencing apparently shows up twice in the Bell film... and the second time it shows movement... I'll try to correct my postings in this thread the best I can...
But it comes shortly after the assassination...
Thanks, Jake

   Okay, thank you for the information.

My next question is, do you believe this "Helmet-Hat man" to be an assassin? 
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film with gif movement!
Post by: Royell Storing on June 18, 2018, 04:23:01 PM

           As is made obvious by people streaming up the Knoll and The Steps, what we are seeing occurred over 1 Minute after the Kill Shot was fired. Depending on how quickly you believe that Sam Holland and the Railroad workers went from their Triple Overpass position to the backside of the picket fence/parking lot area, the alleged "Helmet Man" Might be one of those guys.
Title: Re: Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man found in Bell Film with gif movement!
Post by: Jake Maxwell on June 18, 2018, 09:25:27 PM
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   Okay, thank you for the information.

My next question is, do you believe this "Helmet-Hat man" to be an assassin?

Steve
 That is the question.
I don't really think this is the assassin.... I think the fatal bullet actually came more from the front IMO. Steve Thompson's great slo-mo masterpiece of Zapruder's head-shot seems to show this without question (if you haven't seen it, it is very well done..)...

However, I do think that we've been looking for years to find some answers and some images to "hang" them on.... There is a figure of a man with a helmet in the Bell film behind the fence on the grassy knoll where many thought shots were fired, I am fairly certain - and it shows up with more definition than Zapruder's Helmet-Hat Man and all the blotches of images we've been looking at for years, thanks to the digital age....

It is quite possibly not the same figure as Zapruder's. So, who is it? The fact that it shows movement just adds to the certainty that someone was there - and it is not a film artifact. Royell is correct... this would have been captured on film just a minute or so after the assassination (not sure exactly how long after).
I tend to think there was a conspiracy - and it was very wide, and included law enforcement.
J.E. Hoover's memo two days after the assassination that says he wants the public to believe Oswald was the assassin - a conclusion he makes without a thorough investigation - smells strongly of a cover-up - and a frame-up.
There were probably several scenarios ready to be constructed - a, b, c, and d - with other questionable characters around in the area to pin the assassination on, if the Oswald scenario were somehow foiled...

So, who is this figure wearing what appears to be a helmet - perhaps behind a gun barrel? Don't know for sure, but I think any theory of JFK's assassination needs to take it into consideration before coming to any firm conclusions...

Jake