JFK Assassination Forum
JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => Topic started by: Martin Weidmann on July 27, 2023, 05:21:51 PM
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Good stuff. I was most interested in Harry Holmes at 1:20:20, where Oswald appears to place hizself on the 6th floor at the time of the shots.
But no mention of Agent Hickey accidentally shooting JFK with his AR15. The evidence around that saga would make good viewing.
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That video is very good indeed.
https://groups.google.com/g/alt.conspiracy.jfk/c/UFy86ovoHfY/m/Uf8tcHgPAgAJ
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That video is very good indeed.
https://groups.google.com/g/alt.conspiracy.jfk/c/UFy86ovoHfY/m/Uf8tcHgPAgAJ
It's interesting to see that in that group you present the video as being made by somebody who is not a conspiracy theorist without going so far as to claim he is a LNr.
The truth is that the video is trying to show both sides of the arguments in a fair and balanced way, leaving it up to the viewer to make up his own mind. The maker of the video has made all sorts of similar videos about other subjects, such as the Jack the Ripper murders, and seems to have a neutral position when it comes to the JFK case.
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The style of the video reminds me a little bit of the methods that Ken Burns typically employs in his documentaries. The usage of actors speaking the words of some of the testimonies, etc while showing photos, the 3D model of Dealey Plaza and the TSBD, etc is, in particular, what I would expect from Ken Burns. I once wrote to Ken Burns suggesting that he do a documentary on the JFK assassination. I got a reply saying that many others have also suggested it but Ken was way too busy with other projects to consider it. That’s a shame, because Ken Burns has a huge fan base and a documentary by him could be a much needed reality check and antidote to the JFK films by Oliver Stone.
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The style of the video reminds me a little bit of the methods that Ken Burns typically employs in his documentaries. The usage of actors speaking the words of some of the testimonies, etc while showing photos, the 3D model of Dealey Plaza and the TSBD, etc is, in particular, what I would expect from Ken Burns. I once wrote to Ken Burns suggesting that he do a documentary on the JFK assassination. I got a reply saying that many others have also suggested it but Ken was way too busy with other projects to consider it. That’s a shame, because Ken Burns has a huge fan base and a documentary by him could be a much needed reality check and antidote to the JFK films by Oliver Stone.
Much needed? The official “LN” narrative has dominated mainstream media coverage of the JFK assassination for the last 60 years. There have been movies, like “Parkland” for example, that promote the Warren Commission’s version of the events.
Belief in conspiracy in the assassination has remained high in spite of that. A Ken Burns documentary on the subject won’t make a difference.
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Much needed? The official “LN” narrative has dominated mainstream media coverage of the JFK assassination for the last 60 years. There have been movies, like “Parkland” for example, that promote the Warren Commission’s version of the events.
Belief in conspiracy in the assassination has remained high in spite of that. A Ken Burns documentary on the subject won’t make a difference.
Belief in conspiracy in the assassination has remained high in spite of that.
(https://i.vgy.me/9sZqne.png)
People believe what they want to believe. The widespread distrust of the authorities (Vietnam war, Watergate, etc only made it worse); and a preference towards intrigue and mystery versus the plain boring facts are powerful influences as to what people believe. People would rather be entertained by a movie or a documentary about a subject that interests them, than pay attention to the news. So, I think that a Ken Burns documentary would reach a lot more people, and provide some much needed in-depth education regarding the assassination for them, than a short segment on the six o’clock news or 60-minutes would.
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Maybe the question that needs to be answered is why do so many people believe it is a conspiracy. Originally people looked at it with a jaundiced eye. Is it because he was a president, in Dallas, a carcano, or the fact LHO was shot in the presence of so many cops in their police station and in their custody?
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Maybe the question that needs to be answered is why do so many people believe it is a conspiracy. Originally people looked at it with a jaundiced eye. Is it because he was a president, in Dallas, a carcano, or the fact LHO was shot in the presence of so many cops in their police station and in their custody?
Initially, I think the fact that LHO was murdered while in police custody led some people to suspect that there was a conspiracy. But the release of the Zapruder film in the 1970s is probably the biggest reason why questions of conspiracy in Kennedy's assassination became normalized and persist today.
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Why does Charles assume that a Burns documentary would be markedly different from a Stone documentary? It’s not like the underlying evidence is any different.
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Why does Charles assume that a Burns documentary would be markedly different from a Stone documentary? It’s not like the underlying evidence is any different.
Frankly, I don’t know how Ken Burns would approach the assassination. And, unless Ken has done a lot of research and contemplating on the assassination that I am unaware of, I doubt that even he knows how he would approach it. I have however seen enough of Ken and his works to have an opinion that Ken is much more of a realist than Oliver Stone could ever be. I don’t believe that Ken would ever be swayed enough by a story based upon suspicions, innuendo, and conjecture (like the one by Garrison that Stone based his movie upon) to try to make his audience beleive it. If you want to know a little about what Ken has said about JFK and the assassination, here are a couple of short videos:
Ken doesn’t appear until the last few minutes of the following one. But the entire video is worth watching.
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Maybe the question that needs to be answered is why do so many people believe it is a conspiracy. Originally people looked at it with a jaundiced eye. Is it because he was a president, in Dallas, a carcano, or the fact LHO was shot in the presence of so many cops in their police station and in their custody?
For many years, or even decades, I wasn't all that interested in the JFK assassination and I simply accepted the WC narrative that Oswald was the lone shooter. I had no real reason to doubt the official story, simply because I never looked into it. That all changed when I had a conversation with a friend I very much respected because of his logic and common sense approach to a wide range of issues. He was telling me that, although it could not be ruled out that Oswald was in fact the lone shooter, there simply were too many discrepancies and unresolved issues in the official narrative for it to be be true. The bottom line, according to him, was that the evidence in a simple murder case is (or should be) conclusive in such way that there is no room for reasonable doubt and in this case there were way too many issues that couldn't be resolved by simply putting it down to bad investigative conduct or human error.
That's what got me interested and on the recommendation of my friend I decided to read the Warren Report and check it against the known evidence, not only what's in the 26 volumes but also what came out since, and I couldn't believe what I was reading. What got me the most was what wasn't there! You had Specter introducing CE 399 into evidence, during the testimony of Dr. Humes, subject to later proof, that was never produced and not showing that bullet to Tomlinson, for identification, during his deposition. The way they tried to discredit Victoria Adams, without even taking testimony of Styles and Garner. And then there was the "search" of the limo, before Frazier and his team could get there. They were simply handed some fragments of bullet that - they were told - were found in the limo. And it goes on and on....
That's when it hit me; it may very well be that Oswald did in fact kill Kennedy, but with him being conveniently dead, they simply wrapped the case around him, which makes me wonder what really happened, because if it had been a simple case of a guy taking his rifle to work and shooting Kennedy the evidence should show it conclusively and it simply doesn't. There are way too many assumptions and jumps to conclusions that are not supported by the evidence. It turned out my friend, who now has sadly passed away, was right!
The best evidence of the weakness of the case against Oswald is that the LNs are desperate to color anybody who does not agree with them as a CT, because it's easier to dismiss or ridicule a CT than it is to convince with actual arguments a sceptic.
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The video looked closely at the timings etc on the stairs. But not closely enuff. There is a lot of other good info floating around re many such timings.
Me myself i have nailed the timings, in my posting on this forum. I will get the link.
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2947.0.html
My version of the timings would make a good movie -- i mean as a part of a documentary.
Two of my old skoolmates make documentaries & movies (i might see them at our next reunion in 2025).
At 44:10 -- LEMMiNO omits to tell us that Frazier saw Oswald walking south along the west side of Houston just north of Elm.
How did Oswald get into that position. My version tells us the answer. Oswald wanted to fetch his jacket from the Domino Room.
The video has cars moving along Commerce during the shooting -- no, Commerce was stationary.
The TSBD model was missing the internal ladderway (from the 7th floor to the roof) that Truly & Baker used to get onto the roof, & was missing the trapdoor (hatch) at the top of the ladderway.
The stairway (extn)(from 7th floor to roof) was locked -- that top section of the wooden stairway had rotted from the dripping from the water tank that used to sit over the stairway.
And, the stairway extn i think did not have a door to the roof, it had a trapdoor/hatch.
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The video looked closely at the timings etc on the stairs. But not closely enuff. There is a lot of other good info floating around re many such timings.
Me myself i have nailed the timings, in my posting on this forum. I will get the link.
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2947.0.html
My version of the timings would make a good movie -- i mean as a part of a documentary.
Two of my old skoolmates make documentaries & movies (i might see them at our next reunion in 2025).
At 44:10 -- LEMMiNO omits to tell us that Frazier saw Oswald walking south along the west side of Houston just north of Elm.
How did Oswald get into that position. My version tells us the answer. Oswald wanted to fetch his jacket from the Domino Room.
The video has cars moving along Commerce during the shooting -- no, cars were stationary.
The TSBD model was missing the internal ladderway (from the 7th floor to the roof) that Truly & Baker used to get onto the roof, & was missing the trapdoor (hatch) at the top of the ladderway.
The stairway (extn)(from 7th floor to roof) was locked -- that top section of the wooden stairway had rotted from the dripping from the water tank that used to sit over the stairway.
The maker of the video never pretended it to be all inclusive. Early in the video he clearly states that it wouldn't be possible to deal with all the different claims and opinions in one video. Being as it is, I am sure that everybody, be they LN or CT will have something to complain about.
Me myself i have nailed the timings, in my posting on this forum.
Which exposes that you have an agenda of your own.
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The maker of the video never pretended it to be all inclusive. Early in the video he clearly states that it wouldn't be possible to deal with all the different claims and opinions in one video. Being as it is, I am sure that everybody, be they LN or CT will have something to complain about.
Me myself i have nailed the timings, in my posting on this forum.
Which exposes that you have an agenda of your own.
My agenda is to learn more about what happened in Dealey Plaza. And to tell others.
Re what happened, i have solved the full story, as much as is possible (or at least solved some bits that had not yet been solved).
I have explained how Hickey accidentally shot JFK.
And this present thread (& my own thread -- link below) is about the other half of the mystery, ie Oswald's 2 shots, & his exit. Which i have solved also.
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2947.0.html
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In this video , Marina makes statement of having looked at the rolled up blanket in the garage very soon after she and Mrs Paine heard the news that JFK had been shot from the TSBD.
And Marina apparently perceived that the blanket roll was still of the same bulk as she had previously seen it and therefore she was “relieved” because she thought the rifle was still in the blanket.
IDK what to believe when it comes to Marina Oswald’s statements.
This blanket was supposedly originally a favorite blanket that Oswald’s kids played with, so it’s kind of odd that Oswald would have used such blanket as a make shift rifle bag.
Also, if the WC premise for leaving ring and money for Marina was a last gesture of a man embarked on committing a horrible act, then would not this special blanket have been unrolled, strings discarded , and folded carefully and left also as a final gesture?
So could it be just that the blanket was rolled up with strings tied around it and it was EMPTY because Oswald intended it to be a special item to be used when he played with his kids? This would be consistent with Buell W. Frazier opinion that Oswald cared for was fond of and liked playing with the kids.
Marina may have 1st sought to lie to help her husband and then later was fearful enough to lie against her husband fearing her own fate was in the hands of the government.
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In this video , Marina makes statement of having looked at the rolled up blanket in the garage very soon after she and Mrs Paine heard the news that JFK had been shot from the TSBD.
And Marina apparently perceived that the blanket roll was still of the same bulk as she had previously seen it and therefore she was “relieved” because she thought the rifle was still in the blanket.
IDK what to believe when it comes to Marina Oswald’s statements.
This blanket was supposedly originally a favorite blanket that Oswald’s kids played with, so it’s kind of odd that Oswald would have used such blanket as a make shift rifle bag.
Also, if the WC premise for leaving ring and money for Marina was a last gesture of a man embarked on committing a horrible act, then would not this special blanket have been unrolled, strings discarded , and folded carefully and left also as a final gesture?
So could it be just that the blanket was rolled up with strings tied around it and it was EMPTY because Oswald intended it to be a special item to be used when he played with his kids? This would be consistent with Buell W. Frazier opinion that Oswald cared for was fond of and liked playing with the kids.
Marina may have 1st sought to lie to help her husband and then later was fearful enough to lie against her husband fearing her own fate was in the hands of the government.
LHO was apparently an accomplished “very sneaky guy.” But it appears to me that he believed that he would eventually be caught as the assassin. I think that he intentionally replaced the blanket to make it look like it still contained the rifle. This would be to hopefully make Marina believe that the rifle was still there (in case she became suspicious in the morning of 11/22/63, before the motorcade arrived at Dealey Plaza and tried to stop him). Also, his ring was placed in a cup (if I remember correctly) where she wasn’t likely to discover it before he could do his dirty deed.
I don’t remember reading that the kids played with the blanket. I think that LHO needed something to conceal the rifle in when he loaded it into Ruth Paine’s station wagon for the trip back to Dallas (which LHO was not taking). And the blanket served that purpose.
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LEMMiNO believes that Worrell told the truth, & hence some of LEMMiNO's youtube (where he analyses Worrell's testimony) is a waste of our time.
Here is a link to my thread where i look at the stairs, & Worrell.
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2940.msg111987.html#msg111987
(https://i.postimg.cc/6QsPZSYt/romack-barnett-adams-styles-worrel-pate-osw-ald.jpg)
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..................................... Ok, here is how LEMMiNO should have did it....................
Oswald fires his shot-1 at pseudo Z105, the slug ricochets off a guy-rod of the overhead signal arm, the slug puts a hole in the floor of the limo, the fine lead splatter hits jfk on the back of his head, & jfk utters my god i have been hit.
Oswald fires his shot-2 at Z218, the magic bullet.
Oswald stands up & back from the window, he duznt fire his last bullet.
Oswald sees that Hickey accidentally fires an auto-burst of his AR15 at Z300 to Z312, hitting jfk in the head.
Oswald takes off.
Oswald gets to the 2nd floor after 48 sec.
Oswald just missed seeing Hines walking along the corridor & into the entrance hall at the lunch room & entering the office door from the hall at about 47 seconds.
Oswald stops. What to do next?
Should he continue down to the first floor?
Should he go to the first floor via the front stairs?
Should he lay low in the lunch room?
His jacket is in the Domino Room.
Uh Oh -- He hears Adams & Styles klomping down the stairs in a real hurry on a mission.
Best to visit the coke machine & hope that whoever it is goes clean past.
They pass. He comes back out. What to do next?
He can't decide. He will be less conspicuous if he takes the front stairs, but he would then have to walk back into & throo the storage area to get his jacket in the Domino Room.
He decides to continue down the back stairs.
He makes a start but then Truly hollers up the elevator shaft, so he goes back up.
Then he hears Baker & Truly galloping up the stairs, & he retreats to the coke machine a second time.
He walks slow & cool.
He would have been better off diving into the lunchroom in a hurry, & laying low, he knows there is no-one in there, but he knows that if seen rushing (by Truly & Co) it will be a sure sign that he is guilty of something.
He nearly makes it, another couple of slow steps & he will be out of sight.
But damn, Baker spots a bit of him throo the glass of the door & says to come back.
Truly says that Oswald works here, & Baker & Truly gallop off.
They get to the 5th floor & take the east elevator to the 7th floor.
Oswald gets a coke to look less guilty & more cool if confronted again. And assassinations go better with coke.
The back stairs are now dangerous. He heads for the front stairs, either forgetting about his jacket or deciding that his jacket is a dead duck.
But just in case more dumb cops are entering along the corridor he goes via the office.
Damn, he meets Jeraldean Reid as she returns to her desk. Mrs Hine is also in the office but she doesn't notice Oswald, or forgets.
Reid in 3 re-enactments took exactly 120 sec to get to her desk, which is about right (ie to meet Oswald).
She says something as they pass & he mumbles something back. Its not a good look. He has no business in the office, unless wanting change for the coke machine. Its not even a short cut to the stairs. Damn. Anyhow no big deal.
He goes down the front stairs & mixes with the growing throng in the lobby near the front door without raising any suspicion.
Someone asks him about a phone.
Ok, things aint so bad, praps he can take a chance & get his jacket from the Domino Room anyhow.
Hmmm – he can get his jacket by going out the front door & down the steps & around & entering via the Houston dock (like he does each morning), & walking 16 paces to the jacket.
Getting caught walking in shouldn’t result in getting bitten by a cop.
So, off he goes, but he gets a little ways up Houston & he sees Officer Barnett on sentry duty at the dock, & Barnett looks vicious.
So, a quick U-turn & back down Houston. Buell Frazier sees him walking south along Houston.
No, the jacket is a dead duck. He decides to get out of there asap, he crosses Houston & then crosses Elm.
Tippit is waiting.
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LEMMiNO should have shown how Geneva Hine could have been a problem for the Oswald timeline, lemmeseenow.
The phone lights in Hines office on the 2nd floor die out. [The time is now say -1:00]
She walks to an eastern window. [-0:50]
She sees the lead car coming along Houston St. [-0:30]
She sees the JFK limo turn into Elm St. [-0:05]
She hears a shot. [0:01]
She hears 2 more shots. [0:11].
She sees gawkers running & hitting the deck in Elm St (east end)(east end of east end). [0:20]
She walks south into the front Foyer to a locked office door & knocks, & yells, but no-one answers. [0:25]
She walks north up the corridor & then west along the corridor to another locked office door, & shakes the door & yells & yells, but is ignored. [0:40]
She walks west along the corridor & then north along the corridor, & opens a door to the lunchroom entrance hall, & enters the hall. [0:45]
She turns & opens a door into the north west corner of her office, & enters the office. [0:48]
Oswald exits the stairs & sees the door to the office closing behind Hine. [0:48]
Phew. That was a close shave (for both Oswald & for my Oswald timings). But my timeline works ok -- just.
Hmmmmm. Later, at 1:55, ie at 115 sec, Oswald enters that there same door, into that there office, instead of using the corridor.
We know that he enters at 115 sec koz he meets Jeraldean Reid at 118 sec, just before she gets to her desk at 120 sec.
Reid did 3 re-enactments of her traject from Elm St after the shots, & they all came to 120 sec.
Anyhow, i dont think that Oswald would have entered that there office if he knew for sure that someone was in there.
In which case Hine entered her office at 0:47, & Oswald didn't see her enter.
Re Hine versus Oswald, if u prefer, Hine entered her office at 0:48, & Oswald entered the 2nd floor at 0:49.
Yep, anyhow, one way or the other, Oswald was 1 sec later than Hine.
Hine walks to the phone desk. The 3 phone lines are going bezerk. [0:55]
Oswald enters Hine's office [1:55] & passes Jackalean Reid. [1:58]
Oswald walks past Hine & out of her office into the 2nd floor Lobby. [2:05]
Hine duznt notice Oswald, she is juggling the phones.
Reid's & Oswald's eyes met at 118 sec.
If Oswald had been a few seconds quicker, or if Hine had been a few seconds slower, then Hine's eyes would have met Oswald's eyes at 45 sec or at 51 sec.
I suppose that Oswald would have tried to look casual -- he might have partly followed Hine, & entered the lunchroom as if to get a coke -- or he might have continued casually down the stairs.
If he continued down the stairs then he would have been well ahead of Truly & Baker, but he might have seen them as he walked out the door to the Houston loading dock, after getting his jacket from the Domino Room, but i doubt that he would have seen Truly & Baker, Oswald would have been well outside the TSBD before they entered the 1st floor.
And Romack would have seen Oswald exiting the dock.
Now, if Oswald got to the 2nd floor at 48 sec, & if Baker & Truly got to the 2nd floor at 100 sec, then that means that Oswald dillyd for 52 sec.
And if he entered the office at 155 sec, then that means that he dallyd for another 55 sec, which adds to 107 sec of dillydally near the coke machine.
Anyhow it all turned out ok.
Except that he lost his jacket.
And a Carcano.
And one bullet.
And a brown paper bag.
And no curtain rods.
Which leaves us with one obvious question.
Where is Waxahachie?
Waxahachie might make a good Sister City for Wagga Wagga.
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I finally got around to watching the video. It is very well done visually, and he does a great job impartially presenting the known evidence and major points of controversy.
At least until the last half-hour or so when he goes completely off the rails into the very “Richard”-esque argument “I can’t imagine any Conspiracy intricately planning this sort of thing, therefore Oswald did it and we can just ignore all these discrepancies and contradictions to the officially spun narrative”.
For example, he just declares that Carolyn Arnold is “highly unreliable”, because…well, because she changed the details of her story. But it’s ok that Charles Givens changed the details of his story, because the way he did it does not make “conspiratorial” sense.
It’s the usual false dichotomy that says either Oswald did it just like the Warren Commission narrative decided, or there had to have been a conspiracy cast of thousands that pre-planned and perfectly executed every detail of what would happen not only that day but for months or even years prior to it. And the latter is too complex, therefore Oswald did it.
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I finally got around to watching the video. It is very well done visually, and he does a great job impartially presenting the known evidence and major points of controversy.
At least until the last half-hour or so when he goes completely off the rails into the very “Richard”-esque argument “I can’t imagine any Conspiracy intricately planning this sort of thing, therefore Oswald did it and we can just ignore all these discrepancies and contradictions to the officially spun narrative”.
For example, he just declares that Carolyn Arnold is “highly unreliable”, because…well, because she changed the details of her story. But it’s ok that Charles Givens changed the details of his story, because the way he did it does not make “conspiratorial” sense.
It’s the usual false dichotomy that says either Oswald did it just like the Warren Commission narrative decided, or there had to have been a conspiracy cast of thousands that pre-planned and perfectly executed every detail of what would happen not only that day but for months or even years prior to it. And the latter is too complex, therefore Oswald did it.
He made up for it at the end of the video...
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I finally got around to watching the video. It is very well done visually, and he does a great job impartially presenting the known evidence and major points of controversy.
At least until the last half-hour or so when he goes completely off the rails into the very “Richard”-esque argument “I can’t imagine any Conspiracy intricately planning this sort of thing, therefore Oswald did it and we can just ignore all these discrepancies and contradictions to the officially spun narrative”.
For example, he just declares that Carolyn Arnold is “highly unreliable”, because…well, because she changed the details of her story. But it’s ok that Charles Givens changed the details of his story, because the way he did it does not make “conspiratorial” sense.
It’s the usual false dichotomy that says either Oswald did it just like the Warren Commission narrative decided, or there had to have been a conspiracy cast of thousands that pre-planned and perfectly executed every detail of what would happen not only that day but for months or even years prior to it. And the latter is too complex, therefore Oswald did it.
"It’s the usual false dichotomy that says either Oswald did it just like the Warren Commission narrative decided, or there had to have been a conspiracy cast of thousands that pre-planned and perfectly executed every detail of what would happen not only that day but for months or even years prior to it."
Obviously, there is no scenario or narrative that accounts for all the evidence/witness testimony.
But what do you think is the most likely scenario?
Not the Absolute Truth.
A probability, based on the available evidence.
As you point out, there is a spectrum of possibilities from "Oswald did it" to the "conspiracy cast of thousands".
But in between these extremes there are a multitude of possible scenarios.
Which one do you think seems most probable?
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My opinion is that the available evidence points to a shooter from above and behind with a possible additional shooter from the front. There is no good reason, given the available evidence, to believe that Oswald was a shooter.
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My opinion is that the available evidence points to a shooter from above and behind with a possible additional shooter from the front. There is no good reason, given the available evidence, to believe that Oswald was a shooter.
My opinion is that the available evidence points to a shooter from above and behind
In a nutshell..... WHAT (Varified as authentic) "available evidence" would that be?
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@Walt Cakebread:
Walt, I’ve been revisiting your theory about the MC rifle being preplanted , wedged INSIDE of a pallet stacked with boxes.
Since there was no time for Oswald to post plant the MC rifle by wedging inside the pallet, then options are as follows as it seems to me in order of least probable to most probable (imo):
1. Oswald intentionally used and fired the MC rifle with a misaligned scope and left it that way dropping it between the boxes where Tom Aleya filmed it being lifted by Lt. Day. Weitzman was mistaken in his description of looking underneath a pallet and Will Fritz and Lt. Day simply failed to mention any details about gunpowder odor , or residue in the rifle grooves, breech or chamber of the rifle ,
2. Oswald pre planted an MC rifle and either knew the scope was out of alignment or somehow damaged the scope while pre planting it. Oswald did NOT previously fire any rounds a few hours prior to planting the rifle .
3. A conspirator shooter preplanted an MC rifle not knowing the scope was out of alignment and not firing any rounds recently from the rifle, (hence no mention by investigators of odor or gunpowder residue in the rifle barrel grooves or the breech or chamber)
4. A conspirator shooter INADVERTENTLY
damaged the scope while trying to wedge it inside the pallet of boxes, and never fired any rounds thru it because of waiting to steal the rifle only about an hour before the assassination.
5. Same as no.4 except that the rifle was stolen 8 or more hours before the assassination and the conspirator did not think it important to fire any rounds thru it , and that pre planting the rifle would be sufficient to cause a diversionary investigation of Oswald.
6. Similar to no.5, except that the MC rifle was mail ordered by the conspirator, given to Oswald and had Oswald photographed with rifle in hand, then took the rifle from Oswald at some point in time prior to Nov 22/63 with intent to eventuallyplant it to set up Oswald, which opportunity arrived on Nov 22/63 from the decision on Nov 21st at the secret meeting of LBJ that “After tonight, those !&@$ Kennedys will never bother me again”.