JFK Assassination Forum

General Discussion & Debate => General Discussion & Debate => Topic started by: Tom Scully on February 26, 2018, 10:46:55 PM

Title: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tom Scully on February 26, 2018, 10:46:55 PM
(http://jfkforum.com/images/OswaldHowardBrennanBrothersDTC1963.jpg)

Two of Howard Brennan's brothers were Dallas Transit Co. employees. DTC bus driver McWatters allegedly gave departing
bus passenger Oswald a transfer that did not wrinkle and hopped from his work shirt pocket into his arrest shirt where it did
not turn up when he was booked into DPD and presumably searched. Nathaniel Weinberg was managing DTC for his brother,
Harry Weinberg. Nathaniel and other Weinberg brothers made a preassassination  trip to Ruby's carousel club.

Harry Weinberg's first municipal transit company assets stripping OP was in Scranton, PA in 1953. Scranton was the population
center of the Bufalino crew. That branch of Cosa Nostra was dominated by men born in one tiny Sicilian town, Montedoro, population,
1741.....

At the same time he had finished stripping DTC of real estate assets and was in the process of selling the DTC hollowed out shell to
the City of Dallas, Weinberg was up to the same OP with Fifth Avenue Transit in Manhattan,NY. Roy Cohn was Weinberg's lawyer and
had a seat on the board of Fifth Avenue Transit .
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on February 26, 2018, 10:52:36 PM
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Two of Howard Brennan's brothers were Dallas Transit Co. employees. DTC bus driver McWatters allegedly gave departing
bus passenger Oswald a transfer that did not wrinkle and hopped from his work shirt pocket into his arrest shirt where it did
not turn up when he was booked into DPD and presumably searched. Nathaniel Weinberg was managing DTC for his brother,
Harry Weinberg. Nathaniel and other Weinberg brothers made a preassassination  trip to Ruby's carousel club.

Harry Weinberg's first municipal transit company assets stripping OP was in Scranton, PA in 1953. Scranton was the population
center of the Bufalino crew. That branch of Cosa Nostra was dominated by men born in one tiny Sicilian town, Montedoro, population,
1741.....

Tom, the transfer did wrinkle.

(https://i.imgur.com/cz4F5A5.jpg)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on February 26, 2018, 10:56:22 PM
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(http://jfkforum.com/images/OswaldHowardBrennanBrothersDTC1963.jpg)

Two of Howard Brennan's brothers were Dallas Transit Co. employees. DTC bus driver McWatters allegedly gave departing
bus passenger Oswald a transfer that did not wrinkle and hopped from his work shirt pocket into his arrest shirt where it did
not turn up when he was booked into DPD and presumably searched. Nathaniel Weinberg was managing DTC for his brother,
Harry Weinberg. Nathaniel and other Weinberg brothers made a preassassination  trip to Ruby's carousel club.

Harry Weinberg's first municipal transit company assets stripping OP was in Scranton, PA in 1953. Scranton was the population
center of the Bufalino crew. That branch of Cosa Nostra was dominated by men born in one tiny Sicilian town, Montedoro, population,
1741.....

His work shirt and his arrest shirt were one and the same.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on February 26, 2018, 10:58:00 PM
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Tom, the transfer did wrinkle.

(https://i.imgur.com/cz4F5A5.jpg)



Bugger, you just beat me!


Usually when taking photos of paper evidence it is secured flat and well lit which makes minor anomalies difficult to distinguish but even under these conditions the back of Oswald's Bus Transfer shows definite signs of being folded. The Pristine Bus Transfer is yet another Urban Legend.

(https://s17.postimg.org/rydfsu5wv/Back_of_bus_transfer.jpg)



JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on February 26, 2018, 11:04:42 PM
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Bugger, you just beat me!


Usually when taking photos of paper evidence it is secured flat and well lit which makes minor anomalies difficult to distinguish but even under these conditions the back of Oswald's Bus Transfer shows definite signs of being folded. The Pristine Bus Transfer is yet another Urban Legend.

(https://s17.postimg.org/rydfsu5wv/Back_of_bus_transfer.jpg)

JohnM

The fastest draw in the East, John. A legend in my own mind.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tom Scully on February 27, 2018, 12:38:16 AM
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His work shirt and his arrest shirt were one and the same.

How do you know that....from witness "testimony"?

https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth338458/m1/1/
(http://jfkforum.com/images/MaryBledsoeAffidavit.jpg)

Quote
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/10606-another-bledsoe-lie/
Posted July 31, 2007
In her testimony before the Warren Commission, Mary Bledsoe spoke of meeting Lee Harvey Oswald on October 7, 1963 when he came to rent a room from her.
During her testimony, she said, "
Mrs. BLEDSOE - And so, that give me a lead, something to talk about, and I said, "Well, what kind of work do you do? "Oh, I do electronics," he said, and I said, "Well, there is some good jobs because you are young, and you can get a good job a young man like you."
And then went on. Then something about him being in the Marines, and I said, "Well, that is wonderful. My son was in the Navy." And talking about him, you know, just getting to know him, and--but, "here is a picture of my wife, and picture of the girl, and the baby." And I said, "Oh, she has got a baby, hasn't she?" And he said, "Yes."
http://jfkassassination.net/russ/testimony/bledsoe.htm
The only problem is, Rachel Oswald wasn't born until October 20th.
Was the man seeking to rent a room LHO whose baby hadn't been born yet, or a double agent with a manufactured past?
Steve Thomas

Quote
Testimony Of Mary E. Bledsoe: Vol. VI, p. 400 - Mcadams.posc.mu.edu?
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/bledsoe.htm

Mrs. BLEDSOE - What day did I make them? Miss DOUTHIT - When Mr. Sorrels and I were talking about her going to Washington, he made the suggestion that she put all the things down on paper because she might forget something, and I said, "Mary, you put everything on a piece of paper so that you can remember it and ...
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on February 27, 2018, 06:19:58 AM
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How do you know that....from witness "testimony"?

https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth338458/m1/1/
(http://jfkforum.com/images/MaryBledsoeAffidavit.jpg)

Mr. JENNER - But, he volunteered the picture of his wife and child?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Yes; he did that. Showed me that picture.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on February 27, 2018, 12:09:37 PM
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His work shirt and his arrest shirt were one and the same.

No, that's not true.......  Lee went to his room at the rooming house and changed his clothes.   Mary Bledsoe said that the shirt he was wearing when she saw him on the bus had a torn or worn hole at the elbow......

We've all seen the photo of Lee holding up his handcuffed arms and there is NO HOLE in the elbow of the arrest shirt.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on February 27, 2018, 04:48:36 PM
(http://iacoletti.org/jfk/oswald-shirt-hole.gif)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Jerry Organ on February 27, 2018, 05:26:58 PM
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No, that's not true.......  Lee went to his room at the rooming house and changed his clothes.   Mary Bledsoe said that the shirt he was wearing when she saw him on the bus had a torn or worn hole at the elbow......

We've all seen the photo of Lee holding up his handcuffed arms and there is NO HOLE in the elbow of the arrest shirt.

Problem with that photo is that the right sleeve of the shirt worn by Oswald is twisted so that the hole would be out of sight.

Unfortunately, that doesn't prove there was a hole in the right sleeve.

(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/07/22/article-2373793-1AED2DED000005DC-431_634x541.jpg)  (https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth184854/m1/1/med_res/)

Above: Cuff button visible on left forearm but not on right forearm. Right sleeve was twisted.

(https://jfkinvestigators.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/baker-tl-3.jpg)

Above: Photo of the remorseless ferret-like double-murderer Oswald possibly shows the area where the twist occurred (wrinkly area above the elbow) on his right sleeve.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on February 27, 2018, 05:33:51 PM
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Above: Photo of the remorseless ferret-like double-murderer Oswald possibly shows the area where the twist occurred on his right sleeve.

Why do LNers always resort to rhetoric like this?  Is it supposed to make up for a lack of sufficient real evidence?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on March 01, 2018, 07:02:34 PM
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Problem with that photo is that the right sleeve of the shirt worn by Oswald is twisted so that the hole would be out of sight.

Unfortunately, that doesn't prove there was a hole in the right sleeve.

(http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/07/22/article-2373793-1AED2DED000005DC-431_634x541.jpg)  (https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth184854/m1/1/med_res/)

Above: Cuff button visible on left forearm but not on right forearm. Right sleeve was twisted.

(https://jfkinvestigators.files.wordpress.com/2016/02/baker-tl-3.jpg)

Above: Photo of the remorseless ferret-like double-murderer Oswald possibly shows the area where the twist occurred (wrinkly area above the elbow) on his right sleeve.

Don't you ever get tired of making a fool of yourself by lying when the truth is right before us?  You know perfectly well that I referred you to the photo of Lee holding up his handcuffed wrists....
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Jerry Organ on March 01, 2018, 07:07:53 PM
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Don't you ever get tired of making a fool of yourself by lying when the truth is right before us?  You know perfectly well that I referred you to the photo of Lee holding up his handcuffed wrists....

There's no visible cuff button on the right sleeve in that picture, either. Meaning the right sleeve was twisted and the area with the hole wasn't visible.

I can't find any hallway pictures that clearly show that area.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on March 01, 2018, 07:17:30 PM
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There's no visible cuff button on the right sleeve in that picture, either. Meaning the right sleeve was twisted and the area with the hole wasn't visible.

I can't find any hallway pictures that clearly show that area.

We both know that you Warren Commission apologists have used the photo of Lee with handcuffs on his wrists as proof that he was a socialist giving the "clinched fist " salute..  So don't lie and claim that you don't know of" any hallway pictures that clearly show that area"
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Jerry Organ on March 01, 2018, 07:31:48 PM
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We both know that you Warren Commission apologists have used the photo of Lee with handcuffs on his wrists as proof that he was a socialist giving the "clinched fist " salute..  So don't lie and claim that you don't know of" any hallway pictures that clearly show that area"

In that case, yes, there are hallway pictures that show "Lee with handcuffs on his wrists".

Sorry to have lied about that.  ::)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on March 01, 2018, 07:49:13 PM
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In that case, yes, there are hallway pictures that show "Lee with handcuffs on his wrists".

Sorry to have lied about that.  ::)

The "clinched fist" photo clearly shows that there was NO HOLE in the elbow of the shirt when Lee Oswald was escorted through the hallway of the police station at about 4:00 pm......
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Jerry Organ on March 02, 2018, 10:50:21 PM
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The "clinched fist" photo clearly shows that there was NO HOLE in the elbow of the shirt when Lee Oswald was escorted through the hallway of the police station at about 4:00 pm......

I don't think it was the point that I've been trying to impress onto you, but yes, that photo shows no hole alright.

So ... that means I'm wrong about the right sleeve being twisted?

That the elbow area seen in the "clinched fist" photo includes where the hole should have been?

You CTs are soooo sure of that, well then I'll concede the point. I must have got something wrong.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 02, 2018, 11:19:30 PM
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No, that's not true.......  Lee went to his room at the rooming house and changed his clothes.   Mary Bledsoe said that the shirt he was wearing when she saw him on the bus had a torn or worn hole at the elbow......

We've all seen the photo of Lee holding up his handcuffed arms and there is NO HOLE in the elbow of the arrest shirt.

Lee went to his room at the rooming house and changed his clothes

I believe this is likely true, simply because when you work in a dusty warehouse and you get home it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to change your trousers and not your shirt.

Mary Bledsoe said that the shirt he was wearing when she saw him on the bus had a torn or worn hole at the elbow......

Yes she did say that in her testimony, but the information witten by Steve Thomas on the Ed forum and posted here as a quote by Tom Scully indicates that Bledsoe easily gets - let's be nice and say - confused. How can she claim Oswald showed her a picture of his new born baby when, on that date, the child had not yet been born? That's strange to say the least, right?

With that in mind, the problem with Bledsoe's testimony is that prior to her giving it investigators visited her at her home and showed her the actual arrest shirt, so she got to see the shirt (and the hole) up close and perhaps "refresh her memory".

I don't believe Bledsoe saw Oswald on the bus, at least not on that Friday, and I firmly believe she talked in her testimony about the shirt she had seen Oswald wearing on television after his arrest. The same shirt she was shown and thus could "identify".
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on March 03, 2018, 12:14:35 AM
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I don't believe Bledsoe saw Oswald on the bus, at least not on that Friday, and I firmly believe she talked in her testimony about the shirt she had seen Oswald wearing on television after his arrest. The same shirt she was shown and thus could "identify".








Bledsoe's second day affidavit is way too accurate for random guesses.

Was it public knowledge that Oswald got on the Bus about Murphy Street?
Was it public knowledge that Oswald got off the Bus after a few blocks?
Was it public knowledge that while the bus was stuck in traffic at the same time as Oswald was on the Bus that a man said the President was shot?
Was it public knowledge that Oswald even caught a Bus?
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/bledsoe1.htm

And in Bledsoe's testimony she goes into detail about a woman who also got off at the same time as Oswald who wanted to get to the train station which along with the above Bledsoe recollections can be confirmed by cross referencing with Bus Driver McWatters testimony.
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/bledsoe.htm
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/mcwatters.htm



JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 03, 2018, 12:22:46 AM
McWatters got Oswald confused with Milton Jones.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on March 03, 2018, 12:30:48 AM
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McWatters got Oswald confused with Milton Jones.




Oswald was on the Bus.

(https://i.imgur.com/cz4F5A5.jpg)



JohnM

Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 03, 2018, 12:34:48 AM
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Oswald was on the Bus.

Somebody certainly was.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 03, 2018, 12:53:27 AM
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Bledsoe's second day affidavit is way too accurate for random guesses.

Was it public knowledge that Oswald got on the Bus about Murphy Street?
Was it public knowledge that Oswald got off the Bus after a few blocks?
Was it public knowledge that while the bus was stuck in traffic at the same time as Oswald was on the Bus that a man said the President was shot?
Was it public knowledge that Oswald even caught a Bus?
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/bledsoe1.htm

And in Bledsoe's testimony she goes into detail about a woman who also got off at the same time as Oswald who wanted to get to the train station which along with the above Bledsoe recollections can be confirmed by cross referencing with Bus Driver McWatters testimony.
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/bledsoe.htm
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/mcwatters.htm



JohnM

Was it public knowledge that Oswald got on the Bus about Murphy Street?
Was it public knowledge that Oswald got off the Bus after a few blocks?
Was it public knowledge that while the bus was stuck in traffic at the same time as Oswald was on the Bus that a man said the President was shot?
Was it public knowledge that Oswald even caught a Bus?


I have no idea and neither do you what the media was reporting on and when....
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on March 06, 2018, 08:47:11 PM
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Somebody certainly was.

As I recall Cecil Mc Watters tore a transfer from his pad of transfers and punched it to demonstrate for the police how a transfer that he issued  would look.....   This exhibit could very well be that sample transfer.....
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tom Scully on March 07, 2018, 02:32:47 AM
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Mr. JENNER - But, he volunteered the picture of his wife and child?
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Yes; he did that. Showed me that picture.


Objection, yer Honor.....leading the witness!
Mr. Jenner - Your Honor, I'll rephrase the question..... he volunteered the picture of whom? Who were included in
the image?

(http://jfkforum.com/images/ThomasAbsalomBledsoe1930census.jpg)
(http://jfkforum.com/images/ThomasAbsalomGermanSon1919marriage.jpg)
(http://jfkforum.com/images/ThomasAbsalomGermanSon1919AdelaideSenterSSapp.jpg)

Uhhh....Rob? Take your gameboy and go play in the other room for a while and let the adults relate in the facts based universe.:
(http://jfkforum.com/images/ThomasAbsalomGermanySonJewell1958.jpg)

Matthew's mother's 2002 findagrave link: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/6382620
Quote
http://educationforum.ipbhost.com/topic/20316-rd-matthews-from-steve-thomas/
.........
A recently deceased friend, Dallas Attorney Spider Bynum lived across the street
from R.D. Matthews' mother and more or less took care of her in her late years
and kept in touch with R.D. , always by telephone.  He flew into Dallas on a
private airplane at 2:10 a.m. the following day after his mother's death, met
with the funeral director at Love Field
, completed his business and flew back
to Las Vegas a few hours later.

Spider tried on many occasions to  ascertain what R.D. was so frightened of in
Dallas, but he refused to talk about it.  I do know Spider, who did a lot of
legal work for the Campisi family and offered to accompany Joe ( Joseph) Campisi
to Washington when he was called to test ify before the House Select Committee
on Assassinations .  Joe told him it was not necessary, but if R.D. Matthews was
called, he sure might need him and may never see Dallas again.

Spider swore to the day he died, R.D. Matthews was somehow involved in Kennedy's
assassination, I guess we will never know now.
Funny how evil people live so damn long---------------- "

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk9/hscv9c.htm#matthews

Tim, just in case you are wondering about the relevance.....Adelaide Germany, head of household in the 1930 US Census
image was the ex-wife of Jewell Ralston Germany. This is an image of the death certificate of Jewell Ralston Germany, Sr's
big brother. (Jewell R Germany, Sr. was the uncle of both Mary Germany Bledsoe and RD Matthews) :
(http://jfkforum.com/images/JohnWarrenGermany1938.jpg)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on March 07, 2018, 04:16:14 PM
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Objection, yer Honor.....leading the witness!
Mr. Jenner - Your Honor, I'll rephrase the question..... he volunteered the picture of whom? Who were included in
the image?

(http://jfkforum.com/images/ThomasAbsalomBledsoe1930census.jpg)
(http://jfkforum.com/images/ThomasAbsalomGermanSon1919marriage.jpg)
(http://jfkforum.com/images/ThomasAbsalomGermanSon1919AdelaideSenterSSapp.jpg)

Uhhh....Rob? Take your gameboy and go play in the other room for a while and let the adults relate in the facts based universe.:
(http://jfkforum.com/images/ThomasAbsalomGermanySonJewell1958.jpg)

Matthew's mother's 2002 findagrave link: https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/6382620
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/jfkinfo/jfk9/hscv9c.htm#matthews

Tim, just in case you are wondering about the relevance.....Adelaide Germany, head of household in the 1930 US Census
image was the ex-wife of Jewell Ralston Germany. This is an image of the death certificate of Jewell Ralston Germany, Sr's
big brother. (Jewell R Germany, Sr. was the uncle of both Mary Germany Bledsoe and RD Matthews) :
(http://jfkforum.com/images/JohnWarrenGermany1938.jpg)

 How did  the transfer enter the evidence stream.....And due to it's pristine condition, I don't believe it was in Lee's pocket when he was dragged from the theater....
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tom Scully on March 09, 2018, 02:51:10 PM
edited......
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 09, 2018, 05:00:47 PM
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/mcwatersbus.jpg)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 09, 2018, 05:16:17 PM
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/milton%20jones.2.jpg)
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/milton%20jones.3.jpg)
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/miltonjones4.jpg)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Ray Mitcham on March 09, 2018, 05:35:30 PM
So Milton Jones and the bus driver, McWatters  both said that the guy they saw was wearing a blue jacket. Bledsoe, on the same bus,  said that "Oswald' was wearing brown shirt with a hole in the sleeve.

Sumtink stinks.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 09, 2018, 05:43:47 PM
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So Milton Jones and the bus driver, McWatters  both said that the guy they saw was wearing a blue jacket. Bledsoe, on the same bus,  said that "Oswald' was wearing brown shirt with a hole in the sleeve.

Sumtink stinks.

Ray, where are you getting that McWatters said that the guy he saw was wearing a blue jacket?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Ray Mitcham on March 09, 2018, 06:08:10 PM
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Ray, where are you getting that McWatters said that the guy he saw was wearing a blue jacket?

Apologies. Its was Whaley, the taxi driver, who said "Oswald" had a blue jacket on. McWatters, the taxi driver,  said "he (Oswald)   had on, I believe, some type of jacket, cloth jacket. "
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 09, 2018, 06:17:49 PM
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Apologies. Its was Whaley, the taxi driver, who said "Oswald" had a blue jacket on. McWatters, the taxi driver,  said "he (Oswald)   had on, I believe, some type of jacket, cloth jacket. "

FBI SA Robert Barrett described it as a brown jacket.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 13, 2018, 10:19:09 PM
"two police officers boarded the bus and checked each passenger to see if any were carrying firearms"

This shows that the Dallas police were in the habit of doing illegal searches.  Oswald stood up for his rights and paid the price.

Also, is there any record of any other buses being searched that day?  What made the police zero in on that particular bus, heading towards the crime scene?

(https://i.pinimg.com/564x/51/8d/13/518d13efdd100f44091c97f3fb627fb4.jpg)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 14, 2018, 02:44:55 AM
Just correcting my earlier statement. I said that Robert Barrett described the shirt that Oswald had on as a brown jacket. I now believe that I was mistaken. It was Bardwell Odum, not Barrett, who gave that description. He described it as a reddish brown jacket. Marrion Baker also described the shirt as being a brown jacket.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 14, 2018, 06:10:59 AM
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Just correcting my earlier statement. I said that Robert Barrett described the shirt that Oswald had on as a brown jacket. I now believe that I was mistaken. It was Bardwell Odum, not Barrett, who gave that description. He described it as a reddish brown jacket. Marrion Baker also described the shirt as being a brown jacket.

"Marrion Baker also described the shirt as being a brown jacket."

Marion Baker said he was wearing a light brown jacket when he saw him in the TSBD.

He said he was wearing different clothes when he saw him in the DPD a couple hours later.

Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 14, 2018, 06:19:27 AM
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"Marrion Baker also described the shirt as being a brown jacket."

Marion Baker said he was wearing a light brown jacket when he saw him in the TSBD.

He said he was wearing different clothes when he saw him in the DPD a couple hours later.

Not really.

Mr. BELIN - What about when you saw him in the School Book Depository Building, does this look familiar as anything he was wearing, if you know?
Mr. BAKER - I couldn't say whether that was--it seemed to me it was a light-colored brown but I couldn't say it was that or not.
............
Mr. BELIN - Was he wearing anything that looked like Exhibit 150 at the police station?
Mr. BAKER - He did have a brown-type shirt on that was out.
Mr. BELIN - Did it appear to be similar to any clothing you had seen when you saw him at the School Book Depository Building?
Mr. BAKER - I could have mistaken it for a jacket, but to my recollection it was a little colored jacket, that is all I can say.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 14, 2018, 06:40:24 AM
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Not really.

Mr. BELIN - What about when you saw him in the School Book Depository Building, does this look familiar as anything he was wearing, if you know?
Mr. BAKER - I couldn't say whether that was--it seemed to me it was a light-colored brown but I couldn't say it was that or not.
............
Mr. BELIN - Was he wearing anything that looked like Exhibit 150 at the police station?
Mr. BAKER - He did have a brown-type shirt on that was out.
Mr. BELIN - Did it appear to be similar to any clothing you had seen when you saw him at the School Book Depository Building?
Mr. BAKER - I could have mistaken it for a jacket, but to my recollection it was a little colored jacket, that is all I can say.


(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/baker4a.jpg)

Mr. DULLES - Do you recall whether or not he was wearing the same clothes, did he appear to you the same when you saw him in the police station as when you saw him in the lunchroom?
Mr. BAKER - Actually just looking at him, he looked like he didn't have the same thing on.
Mr. BELIN - He looked as though he did not have the same thing on?
Mr. BAKER - He looked like he did not have the same on.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 14, 2018, 06:49:32 AM
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(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/baker4a.jpg)

Mr. DULLES - Do you recall whether or not he was wearing the same clothes, did he appear to you the same when you saw him in the police station as when you saw him in the lunchroom?
Mr. BAKER - Actually just looking at him, he looked like he didn't have the same thing on.
Mr. BELIN - He looked as though he did not have the same thing on?
Mr. BAKER - He looked like he did not have the same on.

Mr. BELIN - What about when you saw him in the School Book Depository Building, does this look familiar as anything he was wearing, if you know?
Mr. BAKER - I couldn't say whether that was--it seemed to me it was a light-colored brown but I couldn't say it was that or not.
............
Mr. BELIN - Was he wearing anything that looked like Exhibit 150 at the police station?
Mr. BAKER - He did have a brown-type shirt on that was out.
Mr. BELIN - Did it appear to be similar to any clothing you had seen when you saw him at the School Book Depository Building?
Mr. BAKER - I could have mistaken it for a jacket, but to my recollection it was a little colored jacket, that is all I can say.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 14, 2018, 06:56:58 AM
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Mr. BELIN - What about when you saw him in the School Book Depository Building, does this look familiar as anything he was wearing, if you know?
Mr. BAKER - I couldn't say whether that was--it seemed to me it was a light-colored brown but I couldn't say it was that or not.
............
Mr. BELIN - Was he wearing anything that looked like Exhibit 150 at the police station?
Mr. BAKER - He did have a brown-type shirt on that was out.
Mr. BELIN - Did it appear to be similar to any clothing you had seen when you saw him at the School Book Depository Building?
Mr. BAKER - I could have mistaken it for a jacket, but to my recollection it was a little colored jacket, that is all I can say.


hypocrite

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O'Connor's much earlier recollection and signed diagram takes precedence over statements made to Law. That O'Connor would think that the bullet entering above C7 would have come out through JFK's heart and through his sternum suggests that he was definitely on the downslope as far as his mental faculties were concerned.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 14, 2018, 05:31:32 PM
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hypocrite

How so?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 14, 2018, 05:35:27 PM
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He really did, actually, as he did in his AFFIDAVIT and saw no reason to correct that when viewing Oswald at CH because he didn't recognize Oswald as the guy he saw on the 3rd or 4th floor. Or did he?

Representative BOGGS -Let me ask one other question. You later, when you recognized this man as Lee Oswald, is that right, saw pictures of him?
Mr. BAKER - Yes, sir. I had occasion to see him in the homicide office later that evening after we got through with Parkland Hospital and then Love Field and we went back to the City Hall and I went up there and made this affidavit.
Representative BOGGS -After he had been arrested?
Mr. BAKER - Yes, sir.


What are you talking about? Where in his affidavit does he say that Oswald was wearing different clothes when he saw him in the DPD a couple hours later?

Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 14, 2018, 07:23:20 PM
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You may want to rephrase that question.

CE 150 is not a jacket, as previously pointed out to you by Gary.

What part of  "I could have mistaken it for a jacket" don't you understand?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 14, 2018, 07:30:25 PM
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What part of but to my recollection it was a little colored jacket, that is all I can say. do you not understand?

I understand it perfectly. It doesn't negate the fact that he noted that he could very well have mistaken the shirt for a light jacket. Bardwell Odum also mistook the shirt for a jacket.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 14, 2018, 08:48:54 PM
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But there was no reason to write "jacket" when he saw Oswald in a shirt that was out at the Police Station:

Mr. BELIN - Was he wearing anything that looked like Exhibit 150 at the police station?
Mr. BAKER - He did have a brown-type shirt on that was out.


He could also have corrected his weight estimate that was 30 pounds over...

Right, he could have corrected the weight estimate but did not. There are a couple of possibilities here. One, the shirt that Oswald had on was mistaken by at least one other to be a jacket and Baker may have seen it like that at the time. Odum also estimated Oswald's weight to be 160 pounds. Two, the affidavit itself was essentially completed by the time that Baker saw Oswald at Homicide. Baker said that he was in the process of writing it when Oswald went by.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 15, 2018, 10:21:29 PM
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(1) seeing the shirt as a jacket is only relevant if Oswald wore the arrest shirt CE 150 at work . Do you have evidence he did?

The WC testimony of Mary Bledsoe and the bus transfer found inside the shirt pocket.

Quote
(2) Whaley had a couple of goes at his affidavit and even details of the lineup were later added so who would prevent Baker from amending his affidavit?

You're going to have to be more specific about what you mean by later. Were details added to the affidavit after Whaley had already signed it? That seems to be what you're suggesting. If not, then Whaley did not have a couple of goes at his affidavit.

Quote
(3) I see that Occam razors are not in high demand at the moment: Baker didn't describe Oswald. There was no mistaken jacket and there was no need to correct his affidavit because he didn't recognize Oswald at the homicide office.

How have you concluded that Baker didn't recognize Oswald at the homicide office?
 
Mr. BELIN - Would you state whether or not the man who was shown to you in the police station as Lee Harvey Oswald was or was not the same man that you saw and encountered on the second floor lunchroom of the Texas School Book Depository Building on that day?
Mr. BAKER - He was the same man.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 15, 2018, 10:38:01 PM
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The WC testimony of Mary Bledsoe and the bus transfer found inside the shirt pocket.

You're going to have to be more specific about what you mean by later. Were details added to the affidavit after Whaley had already signed it? That seems to be what you're suggesting. If not, then Whaley did not have a couple of goes at his affidavit.

How have you concluded that Baker didn't recognize Oswald at the homicide office?
 
Mr. BELIN - Would you state whether or not the man who was shown to you in the police station as Lee Harvey Oswald was or was not the same man that you saw and encountered on the second floor lunchroom of the Texas School Book Depository Building on that day?
Mr. BAKER - He was the same man.


The WC testimony of Mary Bledsoe

The only witness who was shown the actual evidence she was required to testify about (the shirt Oswald was wearing when he was arrested) at her home just prior to her deposition. That Mary Bledsoe?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 15, 2018, 10:42:22 PM
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The WC testimony of Mary Bledsoe

The only witness who was shown the actual evidence she was required to testify about (the shirt Oswald was wearing when he was arrested) at her home just prior to her deposition. That Mary Bledsoe?

Yup. That Mary Bledsoe. Why do you ask?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 15, 2018, 10:48:42 PM
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Yup. That Mary Bledsoe. Why do you ask?

Do you need to ask?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 15, 2018, 10:54:28 PM
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Do you need to ask?

Do you need to ask?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 15, 2018, 10:57:30 PM
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Do you need to ask?

Yes, I did... You, not really.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 15, 2018, 11:06:27 PM
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Yes, I did... You, not really.

Prove it.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 15, 2018, 11:10:41 PM
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Prove it.

Prove what?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 15, 2018, 11:21:54 PM
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Prove what?

That I didn't need to ask.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 15, 2018, 11:36:25 PM
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The WC testimony of Mary Bledsoe

The only witness who was shown the actual evidence she was required to testify about (the shirt Oswald was wearing when he was arrested) at her home just prior to her deposition. That Mary Bledsoe?

Mary Bledsoe positively identified the shirt well before her deposition. Well before she was ever asked to give a deposition actually. She was shown the shirt on Dec 4, 1963 by two FBI agents and was able to positively identify it for them. She did not receive notification that she was required to appear before the Commission until March 1964.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 16, 2018, 12:36:36 AM
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Mary Bledsoe positively identified the shirt well before her deposition. Well before she was ever asked to give a deposition actually. She was shown the shirt on Dec 4, 1963 by two FBI agents and was able to positively identify it for them. She did not receive notification that she was required to appear before the Commission until March 1964.

 ::)

(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/tippitm1.gif)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 16, 2018, 03:11:33 AM
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::)

(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/tippitm1.gif)

A brown jacket eh?

(https://i.imgur.com/5wfDQM5.png)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Zeon Wasinsky on March 16, 2018, 05:54:48 AM
How could Bledsoe have seen a hole in Oswald Brown shirt when it was underneath his jacket that Mcwatters said he had on?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 16, 2018, 06:29:04 AM
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How could Bledsoe have seen a hole in Oswald Brown shirt when it was underneath his jacket that Mcwatters said he had on?

Ah, McWatters thought that the shirt looked like a jacket as well? That's three. Baker, Odum and Mcwatters. I wonder if there are any others.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 16, 2018, 09:18:23 AM
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Ah, McWatters thought that the shirt looked like a jacket as well? That's three. Baker, Odum and Mcwatters. I wonder if there are any others.

Where did Odum see Oswald wearing either the arrest shirt or a jacket?

And how do you know McWatters really saw a shirt and not a jacket?

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Mary Bledsoe positively identified the shirt well before her deposition. Well before she was ever asked to give a deposition actually. She was shown the shirt on Dec 4, 1963 by two FBI agents and was able to positively identify it for them. She did not receive notification that she was required to appear before the Commission until March 1964.


In her testimony she was at best cryptic about the identification of the shirt. She recognized it as the shirt "secret service" men showed her in her home and as the shirt Oswald was wearing before he was shot. Even Ball had difficulty believing her;

Mr. BALL - In order to convince me that you did see it before you've got to tell me what there is about it that is the same, you see. Now, you try to convince me, or tell me why it is that you believe that this is the shirt that Oswald had on when you saw him on the bus?

Mrs. BLEDSOE - Well, I would say it was. That hole---

Mr. BALL ? Mostly the hole in the right sleeve?

Mrs. BLEDSOE ? Yes.


The problem is she saw the hole in the sleeve when the shirt was shown to her in her home.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 16, 2018, 02:19:00 PM
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Where did Odum see Oswald wearing either the arrest shirt or a jacket?

In the Texas Theatre.

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=10406#relPageId=89&tab=page

Quote
And how do you know McWatters really saw a shirt and not a jacket?

Deductive reasoning. Baker mistook the shirt for a jacket. Odum mistook the shirt for a jacket. Bledsoe positively identified the shirt that she saw him wearing. She would not have been able to see the elbow of that shirt if he had been wearing a jacket. The "some time of cloth jacket" that McWatters vaguely recalled was in actuality a brown shirt.

Quote
In her testimony she was at best cryptic about the identification of the shirt. She recognized it as the shirt "secret service" men showed her in her home and as the shirt Oswald was wearing before he was shot. Even Ball had difficulty believing her;

Mr. BALL - In order to convince me that you did see it before you've got to tell me what there is about it that is the same, you see. Now, you try to convince me, or tell me why it is that you believe that this is the shirt that Oswald had on when you saw him on the bus?

Mrs. BLEDSOE - Well, I would say it was. That hole---

Mr. BALL ? Mostly the hole in the right sleeve?

Mrs. BLEDSOE ? Yes.


The problem is she saw the hole in the sleeve when the shirt was shown to her in her home.

Her first positive identification of the shirt was made over three months prior to her WC testimony. She may not have been as clear about it during her testimony in March of 1964. However, it was because of the hole in the right elbow of the shirt that Bledsoe was able to positively identify it on Dec 4, 1963.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Ray Mitcham on March 16, 2018, 03:40:00 PM
Mr. McWATTERS - Well, I didn't pay any particular attention to him. He was to me just dressed in what I would call work clothes, just some type of little old jacket on, and I didn't pay any particular attention to the man when he got on- 


Whaley:- ?He stated that this may well be the shirt,since as he recalls Oswald was wearing grey workpants and a grey work jacket?

https://catalog.archives.gov/id/7461270

?Mr. WHALEY. "Then he had on a brown shirt with a little silverlike stripe on it and he had on some kind of jacket, I didn't notice very close but I think it was a work jacket that almost matched the pants.
[/b]"

To the W.C.

Seems not only the doctors at Parkland didn't see what they saw, but neither did, Odum, Baker, Whaley, and Watters idd the same.

How desperate can the Feluccas get?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 16, 2018, 04:04:56 PM
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A brown jacket eh?

Yeah, because Markham (who's Helen Marsille?) was totally looking at the jacket in a display case inside a museum.

 ::)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 16, 2018, 04:06:31 PM
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Ah, McWatters thought that the shirt looked like a jacket as well? That's three. Baker, Odum and Mcwatters. I wonder if there are any others.

No Baker and McWatters said the man was wearing a jacket.  It's you who assumes they actually saw a shirt.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Ray Mitcham on March 16, 2018, 04:07:45 PM
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Yeah, because Markham (who's Helen Marsille?) was totally looking at the jacket in a display case inside a museum.

 

Now lets see Ulrik having a go at Tim for the mis-spelling of Markham. ;)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 16, 2018, 04:13:38 PM
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The problem is she saw the hole in the sleeve when the shirt was shown to her in her home.

Why would they do this in advance if not to lead the witness for her later testimony?

Mr. BALL - But, before you go into that, I notice you have been reading from some notes before you.
Mrs. BLEDSOE - Well, because I forget what I have to say.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 16, 2018, 06:09:21 PM
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Yeah, because Markham (who's Helen Marsille?) was totally looking at the jacket in a display case inside a museum.

 ::)

Hmmm....you don't like that one eh?

Maybe it was this one then:

(https://i.imgur.com/jAROwQo.png)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 16, 2018, 06:14:30 PM
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Hmmm....you don't like that one eh?

Maybe it was this one then:

Same museum.  Same lighting.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 16, 2018, 06:36:59 PM
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Same museum.  Same lighting.

Not really. The first one was behind glass. Different lighting.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on March 16, 2018, 09:49:24 PM
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Same museum.  Same lighting.


Quote
Same museum.


How can you tell?

Quote
Same museum.


And I'm sure you can provide evidence for this claim?



JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 16, 2018, 10:27:26 PM
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Now lets see Ulrik having a go at Tim for the mis-spelling of Markham. ;)

I never misspelled Markham.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 17, 2018, 01:38:42 AM
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A brown jacket eh?

(https://i.imgur.com/5wfDQM5.png)

You just illustrated the exact point I was making.

I quoted the post of you saying Bledsoe positively identified the brown shirt LHO was allegedly   

wearing along with the same day affidavit from officer Poe quoting Markham's description of Tippit's

killer wearing a brown jacket. Your knee jerk reaction is to post a dimly lit picture of a white jacket

that insinuates Markham was wrong about Tippit's killer's jacket.

When it suits the LN did it narrative it's a positive ID.

When it contradicts the official line the witness is mistaken.

Classic!
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 17, 2018, 02:26:32 AM
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You just illustrated the exact point I was making.

I quoted the post of you saying Helen Markham positively identified the brown shirt LHO was allegedly   

wearing
along with the same day affidavit from officer Poe quoting Markham's description of Tippit's

killer wearing a brown jacket. Your knee jerk reaction is to post a dimly lit picture of a white jacket

that insinuates Markham was wrong about Tippit's killer's jacket.

When it suits the LN did it narrative it's a positive ID.

When it contradicts the official line the witness is mistaken.

Classic!

Gary, you are confused. I never said that Helen Markham positively identified the brown shirt LHO was wearing.  I said that Mary Bledsoe positively identified the brown shirt LHO was wearing.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 17, 2018, 02:30:16 AM
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Gary, you are confused. I never said that Helen Markham positively identified the brown shirt LHO was wearing.  I said that Mary Bledsoe positively identified brown shirt LHO was wearing.

You're right. I went back and corrected the name.

The point I was making stands though.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 17, 2018, 03:52:25 AM
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You're right. I went back and corrected the name.

The point I was making stands though.

What was the point you were making?
             
      (https://i.imgur.com/yZvyiNX.png)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 17, 2018, 01:14:02 PM
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What was the point you were making?
             
      (https://i.imgur.com/yZvyiNX.png)

I was gonna say quit playing stupid ....... .  .   .    .

Point is:

Witnesses whose observations support the WC narrative make positive ID's in LN fantasyland.

While witnesses who contradict the narrative are mistaken or mentally incompetent.


I quoted your post claiming Mary Bledsoe positively ID'd the brown shirt LHO was allegedly   

wearing. I included the 11/22/63 affidavit from officer Poe that has Helen Markham describing Tippit's

killer wearing a brown jacket. You immediately posted a dimly lit picture of a white jacket in a museum

case that insinuates Markham was mistaken about the color of the jacket.

Classic
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 17, 2018, 03:36:43 PM
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I was gonna say quit playing stupid ....... .  .   .    .

Point is:

Witnesses whose observations support the WC narrative make positive ID's in LN fantasyland.

While witnesses who contradict the narrative are mistaken or mentally incompetent.


I quoted your post claiming Mary Bledsoe positively ID'd the brown shirt LHO was allegedly   

wearing. I included the 11/22/63 affidavit from officer Poe that has Helen Markham describing Tippit's

killer wearing a brown jacket. You immediately posted a dimly lit picture of a white jacket in a museum

case that insinuates Markham was mistaken about the color of the jacket.

Classic

(https://i.imgur.com/5wfDQM5.png)

You call that white?  ???
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 18, 2018, 04:31:50 PM
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(https://i.imgur.com/5wfDQM5.png)

You call that white?  ???


(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/tippitm1.gif)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 18, 2018, 05:05:14 PM
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(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/tippitm1.gif)

A white jacket eh?

(https://i.imgur.com/FeYT84k.png)

(https://i.imgur.com/Rnmcx3F.png)

Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 18, 2018, 05:52:10 PM
This you tube video of the "white jacket" was taken at the time it was found and in the same light Markham

saw Tippit's killer wearing a "brown jacket".

Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 18, 2018, 09:23:56 PM
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This you tube video of the "white jacket" was taken at the time it was found and in the same light Markham

saw Tippit's killer wearing a "brown jacket".


Notice how the vehicles seen in that video all appear to be white? Also, what color was the uniform of that DPD officer?

The film showing the jacket was taken at a different time and at a different location than when and where Markham viewed it. The lighting may have differed considerably.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 18, 2018, 10:05:08 PM
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Notice how the vehicles seen in that video all appear to be white? Also, what color was the uniform of that DPD officer?

The film showing the jacket was taken at a different time and at a different location than when and where Markham viewed it. The lighting may have differed considerably.

Notice how the vehicles seen in that video all appear to be white?

Huh? You are aware that it is a black and white video, right?

The film showing the jacket was taken at a different time and at a different location than when and where Markham viewed it. The lighting may have differed considerably.

Now I know you are not being serious. Are you really claiming that the sunlight was different from street to street?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 18, 2018, 10:57:37 PM
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Notice how the vehicles seen in that video all appear to be white?

Huh? You are aware that it is a black and white video, right?

It's a black and white video? Really? Gee Martin, thanks for pointing that out.  ::)

Quote
The film showing the jacket was taken at a different time and at a different location than when and where Markham viewed it. The lighting may have differed considerably.

Now I know you are not being serious. Are you really claiming that the sunlight was different from street to street?

(https://s17.postimg.org/c19c1f99r/Oswaldsjacketlighterdarkerz_zpsb85ca9ed.jpg)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 18, 2018, 11:26:41 PM
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It's a black and white video? Really? Gee Martin, thanks for pointing that out.  ::)

(https://s17.postimg.org/c19c1f99r/Oswaldsjacketlighterdarkerz_zpsb85ca9ed.jpg)

It's a black and white video? Really? Gee Martin, thanks for pointing that out.  ::)

You're welcome... Always happy to help.

Btw... when the officer who called in the jacket as being white saw it, was it walking around like the guy in those pictures?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 19, 2018, 10:52:17 PM
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Btw... when the officer who called in the jacket as being white saw it, was it walking around like the guy in those pictures?

When Markham saw the jacket at East Tenth and Patton was it blowing around in the wind like it was in that video?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 19, 2018, 11:04:40 PM
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When Markham saw the jacket at East Tenth and Patton was it blowing around in the wind like it was in that video?

You are missing the point on purpose, aren't you?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 19, 2018, 11:08:19 PM
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You are missing the point on purpose, aren't you?

What is the point?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 19, 2018, 11:16:12 PM
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What is the point?

Really? Are you perhaps asking because you are not paying attention?

What's the point of posting photos of a guy walking through areas with shade and sunlight when the police officer who called in the jacket as being white saw it in one location only?

Perhaps your next argument will be that there was no sunlight at the parking lot where the jacket was found

Btw.. you never addressed my point that the officer calling in the discovery of the jacket said that the jacket the killer was wearing was believed to be white. Don't you think he would have double checked to make sure that the jacket that was found was also white?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Bill Brown on March 19, 2018, 11:29:58 PM
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Now I know you are not being serious. Are you really claiming that the sunlight was different from street to street?


Are you really claiming that the amount of sunlight is always the same from street to street?


(https://i.imgur.com/wmJFVTa.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/bIf7X9l.jpg)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 20, 2018, 12:02:53 AM
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Really? Are you perhaps asking because you are not paying attention?

What's the point of posting photos of a guy walking through areas with shade and sunlight when the police officer who called in the jacket as being white saw it in one location only?

Perhaps your next argument will be that there was no sunlight at the parking lot where the jacket was found

Martin, it seems that you're not the one paying attention here. Your mind has wandered on you. Mrs. Markham's description of the jacket. Remember that? Where was she at the time? Where was the jacket at that time? Was it in full blazing sunlight?

The point of posting photos of a guy walking through areas with shade and sunlight is to demonstrate that the jacket he had on can appear to be white when in full sunlight and brown or tan when in shaded areas.

Quote
Btw.. you never addressed my point that the officer calling in the discovery of the jacket said that the jacket the killer was wearing was believed to be white. Don't you think he would have double checked to make sure that the jacket that was found was also white?

To Griffin, the jacket appeared to be white. When he called in the discovery of what they believed to be the suspect's white jacket, he was going by the description of the suspect that had been called in to Dispatch by Patrolman R.W. Walker at 1:22.

"We have a description on this suspect over here on Jefferson. Last seen about 300 block of East Jefferson. He's a white male, about thirty, five eight, black hair, slender, wearing white jacket, a white shirt and dark slacks."

Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 20, 2018, 12:45:55 AM
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Martin, it seems that you're not the one paying attention here. Your mind has wandered on you. Mrs. Markham's description of the jacket. Remember that? Where was she at the time? Where was the jacket at that time? Was it in full blazing sunlight?

The point of posting photos of a guy walking through areas with shade and sunlight is to demonstrate that the jacket he had on can appear to be white when in full sunlight and brown or tan when in shaded areas.

To Griffin, the jacket appeared to be white. When he called in the discovery of what they believed to be the suspect's white jacket, he was going by the description of the suspect that had been called in to Dispatch by Patrolman R.W. Walker at 1:22.

"We have a description on this suspect over here on Jefferson. Last seen about 300 block of East Jefferson. He's a white male, about thirty, five eight, black hair, slender, wearing white jacket, a white shirt and dark slacks."

Martin, it seems that you're not the one paying attention here. Your mind has wandered on you. Mrs. Markham's description of the jacket. Remember that? Where was she at the time? Where was the jacket at that time? Was it in full blazing sunlight?


Tim, you need to read the previous posts again. When you do, you will find that I never mentioned Markham anywhere. You and I were discussing the jacket being found at the parking lot.

But, I'll answer your question nevertheless. It was a sunny afternoon in all of Dallas and to argue that the amount of sunlight was different from street to street is just plain stupid. The sun does not discriminate between streets and the shooting took place when the sun was just about at it's highest position. There can, however, be more shade in one location as the other because of objects blocking the sun, and in a street as 10th there were indeed trees that would provide shade in some areas. It may well have been that the shade could have made the jacket appear darker than it really was, but then again it may just as well be that she did indeed see a brown jacket in full sunlight.

The point of posting photos of a guy walking through areas with shade and sunlight is to demonstrate that the jacket he had on can appear to be white when in full sunlight and brown or tan when in shaded areas.

Nobody is disputing that, but we were talking about the parking lot and parking lots tend to be large open spaces. It would be a bit difficult to park a car there if they weren't, don't you think? But where as a bit a shade might let a jacket appear darker than it really was, I don't believe for a second that one would get the color wrong by seeing a jacket in one location and in bright sunlight.

To Griffin, the jacket appeared to be white. When he called in the discovery of what they believed to be the suspect's white jacket, he was going by the description of the suspect that had been called in to Dispatch by Patrolman R.W. Walker at 1:22.

"We have a description on this suspect over here on Jefferson. Last seen about 300 block of East Jefferson. He's a white male, about thirty, five eight, black hair, slender, wearing white jacket, a white shirt and dark slacks."


How do you know what Griffin was going by? But never mind, you are making my point for me. If Griffin believed the killer was wearing a white jacket, and he sees a jacket that is found at a brightly lit parking lot, he will want to make sure to check it is indeed white before he calls it in as the presumed jacket of the killer, right? And, indeed, to Griffin who saw the jacket in bright sunlight it appeared to be white.....

Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 20, 2018, 02:03:53 AM
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Martin, it seems that you're not the one paying attention here. Your mind has wandered on you. Mrs. Markham's description of the jacket. Remember that? Where was she at the time? Where was the jacket at that time? Was it in full blazing sunlight?


Tim, you need to read the previous posts again. When you do, you will find that I never mentioned Markham anywhere. You and I were discussing the jacket being found at the parking lot.

Martin, I referred to Markham and her viewing of the jacket in the post that you first responded to on this.  Here it is again:

The film showing the jacket was taken at a different time and at a different location than when and where Markham viewed it. The lighting may have differed considerably.


Your response was:

Quote
"Now I know you are not being serious. Are you really claiming that the sunlight was different from street to street?"

As I said, your mind has wandered on you here.

Quote
But, I'll answer your question nevertheless. It was a sunny afternoon in all of Dallas and to argue that the amount of sunlight was different from street to street is just plain stupid. The sun does not discriminate between streets and the shooting took place when the sun was just about at it's highest position. There can, however, be more shade in one location as the other because of objects blocking the sun, and in a street as 10th there were indeed trees that would provide shade in some areas. It may well have been that the shade could have made the jacket appear darker than it really was, but then again it may just as well be that she did indeed see a brown jacket in full sunlight.

You've just contradicted yourself in a single paragraph. "to argue that the amount of sunlight was different from street to street is just plain stupid" vs "It may well have been that the shade could have made the jacket appear darker than it really was"

Quote
The point of posting photos of a guy walking through areas with shade and sunlight is to demonstrate that the jacket he had on can appear to be white when in full sunlight and brown or tan when in shaded areas.

Nobody is disputing that, but we were talking about the parking lot and parking lots tend to be large open spaces. It would be a bit difficult to park a car there if they weren't, don't you think? But where as a bit a shade might let a jacket appear darker than it really was, I don't believe for a second that one would get the color wrong by seeing a jacket in one location and in bright sunlight.

The stills in the graphic put together by John Mytton would beg to differ.

(https://s17.postimg.org/c19c1f99r/Oswaldsjacketlighterdarkerz_zpsb85ca9ed.jpg)

Quote
To Griffin, the jacket appeared to be white. When he called in the discovery of what they believed to be the suspect's white jacket, he was going by the description of the suspect that had been called in to Dispatch by Patrolman R.W. Walker at 1:22.

"We have a description on this suspect over here on Jefferson. Last seen about 300 block of East Jefferson. He's a white male, about thirty, five eight, black hair, slender, wearing white jacket, a white shirt and dark slacks."


How do you know what Griffin was going by?

What else would he be going by?

Quote
But never mind, you are making my point for me. If Griffin believed the killer was wearing a white jacket, and he sees a jacket that is found at a brightly lit parking lot, he will want to make sure to check it is indeed white before he calls it in as the presumed jacket of the killer, right? And, indeed, to Griffin who saw the jacket in bright sunlight it appeared to be white.....

How do you know that Griffin would have bothered to double check on the color of the jacket before reporting it's discovery to dispatch? The jacket appeared to be white to him . He wasn't risking his job by reporting on what he saw and believed.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 20, 2018, 02:26:40 AM
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Martin, I referred to Markham and her viewing of the jacket in the post that you first responded to on this.  Here it is again:

The film showing the jacket was taken at a different time and at a different location than when and where Markham viewed it. The lighting may have differed considerably.


Your response was:

As I said, your mind has wandered on you here.


Now you are just playing games. Our discussion started when you posted the black and white video of a police officer holding the jacket in the parking lot. I never discussed Markham.

Quote
You've just contradicted yourself in a single paragraph. "to argue that the amount of sunlight was different from street to street is just plain stupid" vs "It may well have been that the shade could have made the jacket appear darker than it really was"

And now you pretend to be dense. There was no contradiction. Even if the shade limits the amount of sunshine coming through at some point, the sunshine itself is just the same as it is at another location where there is no shade. When you feel the need to argue at this level, you really have a weak case.

Quote
The stills in the graphic put together by John Mytton would beg to differ.

No, they don't... the pictures show the jacket at several different locations with different shades. I was talking about a jacket being seen at one location and in bright sunlight.

Quote

What else would he be going by?


I have no idea and it doesn't matter.


Quote
How do you know that Griffin would have bothered to double check on the color of the jacket before reporting it's discovery to dispatch? The jacket appeared to be white to him . He wasn't risking his job by reporting on what he saw and believed.

Really? I think you argue for argument's sake, but never mind. There was bright sunlight in the parking lot and Griffin saw a white jacket.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Bill Brown on March 20, 2018, 02:47:59 AM
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You've just contradicted yourself in a single paragraph. "to argue that the amount of sunlight was different from street to street is just plain stupid" vs "It may well have been that the shade could have made the jacket appear darker than it really was"

Weidmann is backpedaling instead of admitting he misspoke.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on March 20, 2018, 05:37:15 AM
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Martin, it seems that you're not the one paying attention here. Your mind has wandered on you. Mrs. Markham's description of the jacket. Remember that? Where was she at the time? Where was the jacket at that time? Was it in full blazing sunlight?

The point of posting photos of a guy walking through areas with shade and sunlight is to demonstrate that the jacket he had on can appear to be white when in full sunlight and brown or tan when in shaded areas.

To Griffin, the jacket appeared to be white. When he called in the discovery of what they believed to be the suspect's white jacket, he was going by the description of the suspect that had been called in to Dispatch by Patrolman R.W. Walker at 1:22.

"We have a description on this suspect over here on Jefferson. Last seen about 300 block of East Jefferson. He's a white male, about thirty, five eight, black hair, slender, wearing white jacket, a white shirt and dark slacks."

"The point of posting photos of a guy walking through areas with shade and sunlight is to demonstrate that the jacket he had on can appear to be white when in full sunlight and brown or tan when in shaded areas."

(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/hogwash.jpg)

BS It looks like a white jacket whether it's in the bright sunlight or in the shade.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 20, 2018, 06:58:43 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/lMHGO7i.png)


#82747f color description : dark magentaish gray/dark fuchsiaish gray.

https://www.beautycolorcode.com/82747f
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 20, 2018, 09:34:29 PM
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(https://s17.postimg.org/c19c1f99r/Oswaldsjacketlighterdarkerz_zpsb85ca9ed.jpg)

Two questions about your montage.

Is the jacket worn by the man in these photos CE 162?

Which photo in the montage do you think looks like a "brown jacket"?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 24, 2018, 01:07:09 AM
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Wow, what a detour on that speculation bus with Bledsoe having her answers written down prior to being interviewed!

Mary Bledsoe positively identified the shirt well before her deposition. Well before she was ever asked to give a deposition actually. She was shown the shirt on Dec 4, 1963 by two FBI agents and was able to positively identify it for them. She did not receive notification that she was required to appear before the Commission until March 1964.

Quote
Just to remind you: I asked about evidence of Oswald wearing the arrest shirt at work, meaning the TSBD.

Just to remind you: I already answered your question. Just to recap, with some additional detail, Mary Bledsoe positively identified CE 150 as being the shirt that she saw Oswald wearing on McWatter's bus. The bus transfer found in the pocket of that shirt after Oswald was arrested further attests that Oswald had that shirt on when on the bus. McWatters mistook the shirt for a jacket. As did Bardwell Odum. Officer Baker said he thought that Oswald had on a  light jacket that was brown in color but later admitted that it could very well have been a shirt. Oswald never owned a brown jacket. The brown attire that  Baker saw Oswald wearing in the second floor lunchroom of the TSBD was CE 150.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Richard Smith on March 24, 2018, 06:44:38 PM
The notion that fantasy conspirators somehow faked Oswald's presence on the bus is among one of the more puzzling CTers claims (which is saying a great deal).  Why would they fake a bus trip that takes Oswald nowhere?  Imagine the risk for no apparent gain.  Let's assume they faked the bus ride to cover up some other means that Oswald gets to his boarding house.  How do they know the bus gets stuck in traffic?  How do they arrange a fake cab ride?  Why bother if they wanted Oswald to be caught or killed in the aftermath?  How would they know they could convince those on a random bus to confirm, or at least not contradict, Oswald's presence?  The bus ride to nowhere is ludicrous as part of planned event as it achieves no real objective, entails significant risk, and requires real-time knowledge of the bus, its passengers etc.   
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 24, 2018, 07:02:48 PM
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Tony, you stole my REID move ;-)

The only way out for a true LN fanatic is to fabricate yet another absurdity, it deserves to be highlighted:

I doubt Richard Smith will ever top that one!

The most likely scenario is that Oswald had removed the shirt after the encounter with Baker and tucked it under his pants belt in the back. That's why Mrs Reid never saw it. If she had turned to face him after he had gone by she would have seen the shirt hanging off of his belt.

Tom, what is absurd about that? Can you come up with anything more reasonable? Let's see you try. Go ahead, give it your best shot. Just keep in mind the following facts:

- Oswald was wearing CE-150 when he was on McWatter's bus.

- CE-150 was mistaken to be a jacket by Cecil McWatters.

- CE-150 was mistaken to be a jacket by Bardwell Odum.

- Marrion Baker saw Oswald wearing what looked to be a "light brown jacket" in the second floor lunchroom of the TSBD.

- Lee Harvey Oswald did not own a brown jacket.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 24, 2018, 07:13:36 PM
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Tony, you stole my REID move ;-)

The only way out for a true LN fanatic is to fabricate yet another absurdity, it deserves to be highlighted:

I doubt Richard Smith will ever top that one!

Amazing guy, that Oswald...

He is supposed to have been in the sniper's nest at 12:15 yet BRW does not see or hear him. Witnesses see a man dressed in light clothing, so LNs think he must have removed his shirt. However, fibers of that shirt allegedly get stuck on the rifle. Instead of concentrating on the - already running late - motorcade arriving at any time, he finds the time to observe and track Norman and Jarman as they make their way to the back of the building. Could be important, right? Then, after firing the rifle, he is supposed to have run down the stairs, where he isn't seen by at least two girls who are known to have been on the stairs post shots or anybody else for that matter and when he is seen by Truly and Baker at the 2nd floor lunchroom, less than 90 seconds later, he is suddenly wearing his shirt again. But not for long, because as he leaves the building he takes it off again and hides it from view from Mrs. Reid only to put it back on for Bledsoe to see it on the bus.

Wow... just wow
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 24, 2018, 09:47:06 PM
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Amazing guy, that Oswald...

He is supposed to have been in the sniper's nest at 12:15 yet BRW does not see or hear him. Witnesses see a man dressed in light clothing, so LNs think he must have removed his shirt. However, fibers of that shirt allegedly get stuck on the rifle. Instead of concentrating on the - already running late - motorcade arriving at any time, he finds the time to observe and track Norman and Jarman as they make their way to the back of the building. Could be important, right? Then, after firing the rifle, he is supposed to have run down the stairs, where he isn't seen by at least two girls who are known to have been on the stairs post shots or anybody else for that matter and when he is seen by Truly and Baker at the 2nd floor lunchroom, less than 90 seconds later, he is suddenly wearing his shirt again. But not for long, because as he leaves the building he takes it off again and hides it from view from Mrs. Reid only to put it back on for Bledsoe to see it on the bus.

Wow... just wow

Speaking of amazing, how about the two speedsters in their three-inch-heeled shoes? Victoria Adams and Sandra Styles.  They managed to get from their window on the fourth floor down to the first floor in 45 seconds or less. Dem ladies sure was sumptin.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on March 24, 2018, 10:22:02 PM
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Speaking of amazing, how about the two speedsters in their three-inch-heeled shoes? Victoria Adams and Sandra Styles.  They managed to get from their window on the fourth floor down to the first floor in 45 seconds or less. Dem ladies sure was sumptin.


They managed to get from their window on the fourth floor down to the first floor in 45 seconds or less.

Did they?

But speaking of amazing, Dorothy Garner is quoted in the Stroud letter that "after Miss Adams went downstairs she (Miss Garner) saw Mr. Truly and the policeman come up".

But when Truly and Baker arrived on the 4th floor, they had already seen Oswald in the 2nd floor lunchroom.... Go figure!
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on March 24, 2018, 10:30:17 PM
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Amazing guy, that Oswald...

He is supposed to have been in the sniper's nest at 12:15 yet BRW does not see or hear him. Witnesses see a man dressed in light clothing, so LNs think he must have removed his shirt. However, fibers of that shirt allegedly get stuck on the rifle. Instead of concentrating on the - already running late - motorcade arriving at any time, he finds the time to observe and track Norman and Jarman as they make their way to the back of the building. Could be important, right? Then, after firing the rifle, he is supposed to have run down the stairs, where he isn't seen by at least two girls who are known to have been on the stairs post shots or anybody else for that matter and when he is seen by Truly and Baker at the 2nd floor lunchroom, less than 90 seconds later, he is suddenly wearing his shirt again. But not for long, because as he leaves the building he takes it off again and hides it from view from Mrs. Reid only to put it back on for Bledsoe to see it on the bus.

Wow... just wow

Thank you Martin.....   This is a very succinct summation of just a little of the utter nonsense what the LNer's believe.    And they have the audacity to call us critics...."Kooks"
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on March 25, 2018, 03:56:35 PM
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Amazing guy, that Oswald...

He is supposed to have been in the sniper's nest at 12:15 yet BRW does not see or hear him. Witnesses see a man dressed in light clothing, so LNs think he must have removed his shirt. However, fibers of that shirt allegedly get stuck on the rifle. Instead of concentrating on the - already running late - motorcade arriving at any time, he finds the time to observe and track Norman and Jarman as they make their way to the back of the building. Could be important, right? Then, after firing the rifle, he is supposed to have run down the stairs, where he isn't seen by at least two girls who are known to have been on the stairs post shots or anybody else for that matter and when he is seen by Truly and Baker at the 2nd floor lunchroom, less than 90 seconds later, he is suddenly wearing his shirt again. But not for long, because as he leaves the building he takes it off again and hides it from view from Mrs. Reid only to put it back on for Bledsoe to see it on the bus.


fibers of that shirt allegedly get stuck on the rifle.

No, that's not correct....  The tuft of fibers that the FBI found on the butt of the carcano matched the ARREST shirt......  Lee had gone to his room and changed clothes.... He had removed the dark brown shirt (not light colored khaki) that he had been wearing at the TSBD and put on a clean shirt before going to the theater.

Wow... just wow
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on March 25, 2018, 11:56:50 PM
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The notion that fantasy conspirators somehow faked Oswald's presence on the bus is among one of the more puzzling CTers claims (which is saying a great deal).  Why would they fake a bus trip that takes Oswald nowhere?  Imagine the risk for no apparent gain.  Let's assume they faked the bus ride to cover up some other means that Oswald gets to his boarding house.  How do they know the bus gets stuck in traffic?  How do they arrange a fake cab ride?  Why bother if they wanted Oswald to be caught or killed in the aftermath?  How would they know they could convince those on a random bus to confirm, or at least not contradict, Oswald's presence?  The bus ride to nowhere is ludicrous as part of planned event as it achieves no real objective, entails significant risk, and requires real-time knowledge of the bus, its passengers etc.

And as is the case with all of Richard?s straw men, nobody suggested that ?conspirators? faked the bus trip.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tim Nickerson on March 26, 2018, 04:20:17 AM
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They managed to get from their window on the fourth floor down to the first floor in 45 seconds or less.

Did they?

According to Victoria Adams, they did.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Jerry Freeman on August 16, 2018, 01:39:46 AM
Meanwhile back to the bus.....why would someone walk 6 or 7 blocks while observing obviously stalled traffic... board this particular bus and then get off because it's not going anywhere?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tom Scully on August 16, 2018, 02:36:34 AM
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Meanwhile back to the bus.....why would someone walk 6 or 7 blocks while observing obviously stalled traffic... board this particular bus and then get off because it's not going anywhere?

Since RD Matthews' aunt, Adelaide Seuter Germany, was married and had a son with Mary Bledsoe's uncle, Jewell
R Germany, and Mary was such a dubious witness,
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,771.msg25998.html#msg25998
along with her son, Porter Bledsoe, who allegedly made $4 selling the calendar
evidence supporting an recent Oswald/Bledsoe relationship, and bus driver McWatters likely mistook his passenger,
Roy Milton Jones for an allegedly irrationally present Oswald, the only solid evidence is the bus transfer.

Quote
RD Matthews HSCA file
https://www.aarclibrary.org/publib/jfk/hsca/reportvols/vol9/pdf/HSCA_Vol9_5Fvii_Matthews.pdf

If it is reasonable to expect jailers to screen carefully an incoming arrestee accused of killing a cop in the recent
90 minutes, it is reasonable to expect a bus transfer, live revolver rounds, no more often than a razor blade, would have escaped the intake/booking stage search regimen of the Dallas City jailers.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 16, 2018, 02:51:57 AM
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Meanwhile back to the bus.....why would someone walk 6 or 7 blocks while observing obviously stalled traffic... board this particular bus and then get off because it's not going anywhere?

Before you jump the gun, please first explain why Oswald who already had trouble finding a job and only got the TSBD job because he lied, left the building within 3 minutes of the assassination?

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Bill Chapman on August 16, 2018, 04:01:40 AM
 Thumb1:
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Before you jump the gun, please first explain why Oswald who already had trouble finding a job and only got the TSBD job because he lied, left the building within 3 minutes of the assassination?

JohnM

'jump the gun'

Good one... a perfect description of Iacoletti, who seems to have a need to try the case separately, on every single tree, while ignoring the forest. CTers conveniently ignore the fact that cases cannot be tried piecemeal; they need to be tried on the accumulated evidence.

I have high confidence that a reasonable person can see that the accumulated circumstantial  evidence would be worthy of being accepted as such at trial. It has been shown to my satisfaction that these many pieces regarding, for example, Oswald's first-time-ever actions (in several incidences) that day amount to more than mere coincidence.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Martin Weidmann on August 16, 2018, 04:31:50 AM
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Thumb1:
'jump the gun'

Good one... a perfect description of Iacoletti, who seems to have a need to try the case separately, on every single tree, while ignoring the forest. CTers conveniently ignore the fact that cases cannot be tried piecemeal; they need to be tried on the accumulated evidence.

I have high confidence that a reasonable person can see that the accumulated circumstantial  evidence would be worthy of being accepted as such at trial. It has been shown to my satisfaction that these many pieces regarding, for example, Oswald's first-time-ever actions (in several incidences) that day amount to more than mere coincidence.

A house burns down and the owner of the house, who is only two blocks away and is a heavy smoker, just happens to have a lighter on him.... now isn't that a coincidence?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 16, 2018, 05:30:36 AM
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A house burns down and the owner of the house, who is only two blocks away and is a heavy smoker, just happens to have a lighter on him.... now isn't that a coincidence?

That's interesting?

Was the man observed carrying into his neighbours house a lighter sized packag which he later lied about?
Was the lighter found in the house with the mans prints and matching shirt fibers?
Did the man have no alibi?
Were the mans prints found were the ignition started?
Was the man seen leaving just minutes later?
Did the man get on a bus then get off a bus then catch a taxi?
Did the man get out of the taxi wayyy past his house?
Was the man observed killing a cop?
Did the man resist arrest and try and kill another cop?

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Richard Smith on August 16, 2018, 07:47:23 PM
No one kook has ever explained why the conspirators would go to such great pains and risk to create a fake scenario that puts Oswald on a bus that goes nowhere.  If it had taken him to his boardinghouse and was being used to cover up some other movement like one of the conspirators driving him there, that would be one thing (but open up the question as to why the conspirators would assist or care about what Oswald does in the aftermath of the assassination).  But it didn't.  It is silly and improbable in any planned narrative context to create a fake scenario that does nothing to advance the plot.  Oswald was on the bus to nowhere.   The transfer proves it beyond any doubt.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on August 16, 2018, 08:11:11 PM
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No one kook has ever explained why the conspirators would go to such great pains and risk to create a fake scenario that puts Oswald on a bus that goes nowhere.  If it had taken him to his boardinghouse and was being used to cover up some other movement like one of the conspirators driving him there, that would be one thing (but open up the question as to why the conspirators would assist or care about what Oswald does in the aftermath of the assassination).  But it didn't.  It is silly and improbable in any planned narrative context to create a fake scenario that does nothing to advance the plot.  Oswald was on the bus to nowhere.   The transfer proves it beyond any doubt.

The transfer proves it beyond any doubt.

It does??   Perhaps a simple mind wouldn't question the evidential value that bus trans ......
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 10:55:57 PM
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Before you jump the gun, please first explain why Oswald who already had trouble finding a job and only got the TSBD job because he lied,

I'll bite.  What on his job application is a lie?

Quote
left the building within 3 minutes of the assassination?

Like you know when he left the building.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 16, 2018, 11:01:38 PM
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Like you know when he left the building.

Try to keep up John, events don't happen in a vacuum, Oswald walked/ran up Elm street, Oswald caught a bus, Oswald got off the bus, Oswald walked/ran to the cab stand, Oswald traveled wayyy past his rooming house, Oswald was seen about 1PM by the housekeeper.

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 11:01:46 PM
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Good one... a perfect description of Iacoletti, who seems to have a need to try the case separately, on every single tree, while ignoring the forest. CTers conveniently ignore the fact that cases cannot be tried piecemeal; they need to be tried on the accumulated evidence.

Says the guy who has yet to cite a single piece of evidence.

Quote
I have high confidence that a reasonable person can see that the accumulated circumstantial  evidence would be worthy of being accepted as such at trial.

Of course you do.  Everybody think his own opinion is the most reasonable.

Quote
It has been shown to my satisfaction that these many pieces regarding, for example, Oswald's first-time-ever actions (in several incidences) that day amount to more than mere coincidence.

Really.  Specify these "first-time-ever" actions and describe how they mean "murdered the president".  We already have the wedding ring.  What else?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 11:04:18 PM
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That's interesting?

Was the man observed carrying into his neighbours house a lighter sized packag which he later lied about?
Was the lighter found in the house with the mans prints and matching shirt fibers?
Did the man have no alibi?
Were the mans prints found were the ignition started?
Was the man seen leaving just minutes later?
Did the man get on a bus then get off a bus then catch a taxi?
Did the man get out of the taxi wayyy past his house?
Was the man observed killing a cop?
Did the man resist arrest and try and kill another cop?

Too bad most of these things don't apply to Oswald either.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 16, 2018, 11:06:43 PM
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Too bad most of these things don't apply to Oswald either.

You said yourself John, that all the evidence points to Oswald.

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 11:07:55 PM
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No one kook has ever explained why the conspirators would go to such great pains and risk to create a fake scenario that puts Oswald on a bus that goes nowhere.  If it had taken him to his boardinghouse and was being used to cover up some other movement like one of the conspirators driving him there, that would be one thing (but open up the question as to why the conspirators would assist or care about what Oswald does in the aftermath of the assassination).  But it didn't.  It is silly and improbable in any planned narrative context to create a fake scenario that does nothing to advance the plot.  Oswald was on the bus to nowhere.   The transfer proves it beyond any doubt.

How about "Richard" explaining what being on a bus has to do with who killed the president?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 11:11:47 PM
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Try to keep up John, events don't happen in a vacuum, Oswald walked/ran up Elm street, Oswald caught a bus, Oswald got off the bus, Oswald walked/ran to the cab stand, Oswald traveled wayyy past his rooming house, Oswald was seen about 1PM by the housekeeper.  Do the Math!

Let's see.  The actual evidence shows that the bus driver confused Roy Milton Jones for Oswald, Bledsoe's only evidence that Oswald was ever one of her tenants was "sold by her son", and Whaley picked up his passenger at 12:30.  How about you do the math?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 11:13:44 PM
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You said yourself John, that all the evidence points to Oswald.

Dishonestly quoting somebody out of context is just another lie by omission.  As usual, you should be ashamed.

What little evidence there is, is weak, circumstantial, and tainted.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 16, 2018, 11:20:34 PM
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How about "Richard" explaining what being on a bus has to do with who killed the president?

Are you joking, Oswald's frenzied flight from the scene of the crime is classic consciousness of guilt.

(https://s15.postimg.cc/jz323pnjv/flight_zps2prfpevd.gif)

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 16, 2018, 11:23:45 PM
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Dishonestly quoting somebody out of context is just another lie by omission.  As usual, you should be ashamed.

What little evidence there is, is weak, circumstantial, and tainted.

Well Johnny boy I wasn't the only one, your initial post on the subject was also noted by Caprio and your argument and subsequent weak attempt to defend yourself from the above comment went on for weeks.

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Bill Chapman on August 16, 2018, 11:24:09 PM
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A house burns down and the owner of the house, who is only two blocks away and is a heavy smoker, just happens to have a lighter on him.... now isn't that a coincidence?

To be fair, you'll have to extend the number of houses that burn down with your smoker standing near, in order to stack up numerically with the actions that Oswald took?for the first time ever?during those last couple of days.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Tom Scully on August 16, 2018, 11:26:42 PM
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No one kook has ever explained why the conspirators would go to such great pains and risk to create a fake scenario that puts Oswald on a bus that goes nowhere.  If it had taken him to his boardinghouse and was being used to cover up some other movement like one of the conspirators driving him there, that would be one thing (but open up the question as to why the conspirators would assist or care about what Oswald does in the aftermath of the assassination).  But it didn't.  It is silly and improbable in any planned narrative context to create a fake scenario that does nothing to advance the plot.  Oswald was on the bus to nowhere.   The transfer proves it beyond any doubt.

If all was as hunky dory as your deliberate incuriousity influences you to present .... Oswald = LN assassin, why
are a suprising number of things going unanswered, out of kilter? I am sorry if examples such as this do not occur to
you or cause you any concern.

Is this a matter of fact description accurately and relevently presenting John Connally family background,
considering Bobby Hale testified he attempted to slap away from Connally's daughter's head, the 20 ga. shotgun barrell
Bobby testified his wife Kathleen Connally Hale was encountered by him, aiming at her own head, just as she was pulling the trigger of?
And a WC exhibit reports Bobby's mother Virginia Hale of Fortune Rd., Fort Worth, and the Texas State Employment office as
contacting Oswald in 1962 to advise him of a job opening at Leslie Welding. May 13, 1964: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh22/pdf/WH22_CE_1389.pdf

And a 1962 FBI Los Angeles stakeout report described Bobby Hale and his twin brother forcing illegal entry into the apartment of Judith Exner and soon driving away in a Chevy Corvette with a Texas plate assigned to their father, director of security at General Dynamics and a former FBI agent.
(http://i.cdn.turner.com/ireport/sm/prod/2010/11/22/WE00504787/1475783/Ahalejpg-1475783_lg.jpg)

Quote
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Connally
....Personal Details.....Children   4
.....
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Connally#Early_life_and_education
.....Connally was born on February 27, 1917, into a large family in Floresville, the seat of Wilson County southeast of San Antonio. He was one of seven children....[1] His six siblings included four brothers: Golfrey, Merrill, Wayne, and Stanford Connally and sisters Carmen and Blanche.[2]
..... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Connally#Later_years
....Republican Kay Bailey Hutchison, for whom Connally's daughter had been employed in the state treasurer's office, won the seat by a wide margin....

The example wiki bio page was edited to remove any of the controversies I described above it.

Your demeanor and the sanitized article example are artificial constructs. One reliable result is they are both unreasonable
reactions, flying in the face of facts. At least some of the "kooks" are sincere, reasonable, honest people.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 11:28:47 PM
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Are you joking, Oswald's frenzied flight from the scene of the crime is classic consciousness of guilt.

Bugliosi rhetoric, right on cue.

"Frenzied".  LOL.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 11:30:37 PM
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Well Johnny boy I wasn't the only one, your initial post on the subject was also noted by Caprio and your argument and subsequent weak attempt to defend yourself from the above comment went on for weeks.

Sure, "Mytton".  What does that have to do with you dishonestly quoting me out of context?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 16, 2018, 11:33:02 PM
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Sure, "Mytton".  What does that have to do with you dishonestly quoting me out of context?

The whole point that you conveniently ignored is that your initial post couldn't have been very clear if Caprio came to the same conclusion as me and Caprio like a dog with a bone gave you a right chewing out.

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 16, 2018, 11:38:52 PM
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The whole point that you conveniently ignored is that your initial post couldn't have been very clear if Caprio came to the same conclusion as me and Caprio like a dog with a bone gave you a right chewing out.

Funny that Caprio is suddenly your best buddy now after the way you've treated him.

You've demonstrated time and time again that you misrepresent what people say just like you misrepresent the evidence.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 16, 2018, 11:44:52 PM
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Funny that Caprio is suddenly your best buddy now after the way you've treated him.

Another Iacoletti deception, where did I say or even imply that Caprio was my "best buddy"?

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Steve Taylor on August 17, 2018, 08:06:04 AM
I have to take issue with the term "frenzied flight".  According to the cab driver he offered his cab to a lady and was willing to wait.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on August 17, 2018, 08:17:28 AM
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I have to take issue with the term "frenzied flight".  According to the cab driver he offered his cab to a lady and was willing to wait.

So you don't take into account his leaving the building immediately, beating on the bus doors in the middle of the street,  while the bus wasn't at a bus stop, obviously panicking when the bus was stalled and got off and then jumped in a cab, and all you have a problem with is while Oswald was already in the cab and logically expected to stay there that he maybe offered a lady his cab? How does that negate the totality that Oswald wanted to get the heck out of there?
And don't forget that Oswald didn't stop at the rooming house but drove several blocks past, why would he do that?

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 17, 2018, 10:23:17 PM
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I have to take issue with the term "frenzied flight".

That's just "Mytton's" usual creating of "evidence" via false rhetoric.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 17, 2018, 10:25:16 PM
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So you don't take into account his leaving the building immediately, beating on the bus doors in the middle of the street,  while the bus wasn't at a bus stop, obviously panicking when the bus was stalled and got off and then jumped in a cab,

"Obviously panicking".  LOL.

Quote
And don't forget that Oswald didn't stop at the rooming house but drove several blocks past, why would he do that?

Your guess isn't any better than anyone else's.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Richard Smith on August 17, 2018, 10:27:38 PM
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If all was as hunky dory as your deliberate incuriousity influences you to present .... Oswald = LN assassin, why
are a suprising number of things going unanswered, out of kilter? I am sorry if examples such as this do not occur to
you or cause you any concern.

Is this a matter of fact description accurately and relevently presenting John Connally family background,
considering Bobby Hale testified he attempted to slap away from Connally's daughter's head, the 20 ga. shotgun barrell
Bobby testified his wife Kathleen Connally Hale was encountered by him, aiming at her own head, just as she was pulling the trigger of?
And a WC exhibit reports Bobby's mother Virginia Hale of Fortune Rd., Fort Worth, and the Texas State Employment office as
contacting Oswald in 1962 to advise him of a job opening at Leslie Welding. May 13, 1964: https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh22/pdf/WH22_CE_1389.pdf

And a 1962 FBI Los Angeles stakeout report described Bobby Hale and his twin brother forcing illegal entry into the apartment of Judith Exner and soon driving away in a Chevy Corvette with a Texas plate assigned to their father, director of security at General Dynamics and a former FBI agent.
(http://i.cdn.turner.com/ireport/sm/prod/2010/11/22/WE00504787/1475783/Ahalejpg-1475783_lg.jpg)

The example wiki bio page was edited to remove any of the controversies I described above it.

Your demeanor and the sanitized article example are artificial constructs. One reliable result is they are both unreasonable
reactions, flying in the face of facts. At least some of the "kooks" are sincere, reasonable, honest people.

Is there anything relevant here to my question regarding why the conspirators would to go to the time and risk of faking Oswald's appearance on a bus that goes nowhere?  All compulsive nuts are sincere in their delusions.  I never questioned that.  In fact it is one of the symptoms of kookdom.  Becoming obsessed with minutia such as the above and flying off in every direction. 
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on August 18, 2018, 01:44:34 AM
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Is there anything relevant here to my question regarding why the conspirators would to go to the time and risk of faking Oswald's appearance on a bus that goes nowhere?

"Nobody's responding to my strawman".

(https://us.123rf.com/450wm/webstocker/webstocker1709/webstocker170900040/86099396-crying-emoji-or-emoticon-vector-icon.jpg?ver=6)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Gary Craig on September 27, 2018, 05:03:40 PM
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Is there anything relevant here to my question regarding why the conspirators would to go to the time and risk of faking Oswald's appearance on a bus that goes nowhere?  All compulsive nuts are sincere in their delusions.  I never questioned that.  In fact it is one of the symptoms of kookdom.  Becoming obsessed with minutia such as the above and flying off in every direction.

"Is there anything relevant here to my question regarding why the conspirators would to go to the time and risk of faking Oswald's appearance on a bus that goes nowhere?"


There are witnesses who saw Oswald or a Ozzie look alike get into a vehicle on Elm, shortly after JFK's murder, driven by what would be an accomplice.. The LN narrative starts off with a thud if the suspect is picked up and driven from the scene of the crime.

The fact that the transfer tying LHO to the bus ride wasn't found until his pockets were allegedly searched over 2 hours after he was taken into custody indicates parts of his framing and the cover up were created as needed.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Rob Caprio on September 28, 2018, 03:58:22 AM
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Bledsoe's second day affidavit is way too accurate for random guesses.

Was it public knowledge that Oswald got on the Bus about Murphy Street?
Was it public knowledge that Oswald got off the Bus after a few blocks?
Was it public knowledge that while the bus was stuck in traffic at the same time as Oswald was on the Bus that a man said the President was shot?
Was it public knowledge that Oswald even caught a Bus?
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/bledsoe1.htm

And in Bledsoe's testimony she goes into detail about a woman who also got off at the same time as Oswald who wanted to get to the train station which along with the above Bledsoe recollections can be confirmed by cross referencing with Bus Driver McWatters testimony.
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/bledsoe.htm
http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/testimony/mcwatters.htm



JohnM

What evidence can you cite that shows Bledsoe knew LHO by sight?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Rob Caprio on September 28, 2018, 04:04:46 AM
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"two police officers boarded the bus and checked each passenger to see if any were carrying firearms"

This shows that the Dallas police were in the habit of doing illegal searches.  Oswald stood up for his rights and paid the price.

Also, is there any record of any other buses being searched that day?  What made the police zero in on that particular bus, heading towards the crime scene?

(https://i.pinimg.com/564x/51/8d/13/518d13efdd100f44091c97f3fb627fb4.jpg)

They stopped the bus near the Marsalis Street Library. LHO was known to spend a lot of time there. I am sure that it is just another coincidence.

This is why they thought LHO was the guy at the Jefferson Branch Library because he spent a lot of time at libraries.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Rob Caprio on September 28, 2018, 04:11:56 AM
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Before you jump the gun, please first explain why Oswald who already had trouble finding a job and only got the TSBD job because he lied, left the building within 3 minutes of the assassination?

JohnM

So what did LHO lie about on his TSBD application? Be specific.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Rob Caprio on September 28, 2018, 04:15:25 AM
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Are you joking, Oswald's frenzied flight from the scene of the crime is classic consciousness of guilt.

(https://s15.postimg.cc/jz323pnjv/flight_zps2prfpevd.gif)

JohnM

Frenzied flight? Doesn't your fairytale say that LHO offered his cab to an elderly woman?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on September 28, 2018, 04:20:18 AM
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So what did LHO lie about on his TSBD application? Be specific.

(https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth339871/m1/1/med_res/)

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Rob Caprio on September 28, 2018, 04:22:32 AM
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Another Iacoletti deception, where did I say or even imply that Caprio was my "best buddy"?

JohnM

You mean that I'm not? LOL.

I misunderstood Iacoletti back then. We both agree that the evidence in the twenty-six volumes does not convict LHO of the crimes he was accused of, but we don't always see things the same way and that is okay.

Only LNers walk in a lock step fashion.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Rob Caprio on September 28, 2018, 04:27:30 AM
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(https://texashistory.unt.edu/ark:/67531/metapth339871/m1/1/med_res/)

JohnM

Okay. This is why Truly should have checked him out. Why didn't he? What was the rush? LHO said that on a number of occasions he lost a chance at a  job because they were informed of his defection. Why wasn't Truly contacted about this?
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on September 28, 2018, 04:36:31 AM
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You mean that I'm not? LOL.

I misunderstood Iacoletti back then. We both agree that the evidence in the twenty-six volumes does not convict LHO of the crimes he was accused of, but we don't always see things the same way and that is okay.

Only LNers walk in a lock step fashion.

Quote
You mean that I'm not? LOL.

No, in the real world if I saw you I'd buy you a beer and try to talk some sense into you.

Quote
I misunderstood Iacoletti back then.

Fair enough, that was a time when Iacoletti attacked everyone but upon realizing that this tact was damaging his credibility he instead went full on Kook forgot his pledge to neutrality and only attacked the LNers.

Quote
We both agree that the evidence in the twenty-six volumes does not convict LHO of the crimes he was accused of,

Wrong.

Quote
but we don't always see things the same way and that is okay.

There is no one more fanatical than Walt yet you continually say he is a LNer, is Walt supposed to be your team's fallguy?

Quote
Only LNers walk in a lock step fashion.

It only happened one way and when it only happens one way there isn't a lot of variation.

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Mytton on September 28, 2018, 04:47:45 AM
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Okay. This is why Truly should have checked him out. Why didn't he? What was the rush? LHO said that on a number of occasions he lost a chance at a  job because they were informed of his defection. Why wasn't Truly contacted about this?

Sometimes you just take someone at face value and Oswald was a Marine, showed respect, the job was only for a short time and his wife was having a baby. I have been immediately accepted for a job or two in my time, when you come across as confident, knowledgeable and have the correct experience, the world's your oyster.

Mr. BELIN. Did he fill it out in front of you, or not?
Mr. TRULY. Yes; he did. And he told me I asked him about experience that he had had, or where he had worked, and he said he had just served his term in the Marine Corps and had received an honorable discharge, and he listed some things of an office nature that he had learned to do in the Marines.
I questioned him about any past activities. I asked him if he had ever had any trouble with the police, and he said, no. So thinking that he was just out of the Marines, I didn't check any further back. I didn't have anything of a permanent nature in mind for him. He looked like a nice young fellow to me--he was quiet and well mannered. He used the word "sir", you know, which a lot of them don't do at this time.
So I told him if he would come to work on the morning of the 16th, it was the beginning of a new pay period. So he filled out his withholding slip, with the exception of the number of dependents.
He asked me if I would hold that for 3 or 4 days, that he is expecting a baby momentarily.
So some 4 days or so later--I don't remember the exact day--he told me that he had this new baby, and he wanted to add one dependent.
He finished filling it out. And I sent it up to Mr. Campbell who makes out the payroll for the company.


Quote
Why wasn't Truly contacted about this?

Far out, Oswald did his time give a guy a break are they going to follow him around for the rest of his life and fcuk up every opportunity?

JohnM
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on September 28, 2018, 04:06:51 PM
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Fair enough, that was a time when Iacoletti attacked everyone but upon realizing that this tact was damaging his credibility he instead went full on Kook forgot his pledge to neutrality and only attacked the LNers.

 BS:

I don't "attack" anybody.  I dispute arguments that are invalid or not evidence based.
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: John Iacoletti on September 28, 2018, 04:07:26 PM
Oswald was discharged in 1959.

(http://iacoletti.org/jfk/oswald-discharge.jpg)
Title: Re: Howard Brennan, the unwrinkled bus transfer, Dallas Transit owner Harry Weinberg
Post by: Walt Cakebread on September 28, 2018, 04:30:36 PM
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Oswald was discharged in 1959.

(http://iacoletti.org/jfk/oswald-discharge.jpg)


There's something amiss....  An enlistee did NOT receive a discharge until he had completed six years of duty.   And this form indicates that he was transferred to the Marine Corp reserve where he would have completed the remainder of his six year obligation before receiving a discharge.    All enlistees that had not completed the obligated six years when they were released from active duty were transferred to a reserve unit where they fulfilled their tour and then they received a discharge.