JFK Assassination Forum
JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => Topic started by: David Von Pein on February 11, 2020, 07:49:24 AM
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This very high-quality KRLD-TV clip comes from the excellent 2009 History Channel documentary "JFK: 3 Shots That Changed America". This footage, I wager, could be studied and debated for centuries, with "new" things being discovered (i.e., imagined) by conspiracy theorists probably every day. IMO, the most dramatic thing in this extraordinary footage is when both of Lee Oswald's feet completely leave the basement floor just after Jack Ruby's bullet hits its mark:
Looped GIF clip (courtesy of Chris Davidson):
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-v-rYyZmuEDA/XkCNg0-AbYI/AAAAAAABTlY/SrTpfC0CmGIrfhLFjQNEfA36y6L5AThIgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Lee-Harvey-Oswald-Is-Shot-By-Jack-Ruby.gif)
http://kennedy-photos.blogspot.com/2020/02/kennedy-gallery-483.html
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wLzcFEs6Ikw/Xew0nsrh0oI/AAAAAAABTPQ/W-MMiF4q3ycyLYtO6XDyncizrq8Ji3YlQCLcBGAsYHQ/s490/YouTube-JFK-Channel-Logo.png) (http://youtube.com/DavidVonPeinJFK/videos)
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This very high-quality KRLD-TV clip comes from the excellent 2009 History Channel documentary "JFK: 3 Shots That Changed America". This footage, I wager, could be studied and debated for centuries, with "new" things being discovered (i.e., imagined) by conspiracy theorists probably every day. IMO, the most dramatic thing in this extraordinary footage is when both of Lee Oswald's feet completely leave the basement floor just after Jack Ruby's bullet hits its mark:
Looped GIF clip (courtesy of Chris Davidson):
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-v-rYyZmuEDA/XkCNg0-AbYI/AAAAAAABTlY/SrTpfC0CmGIrfhLFjQNEfA36y6L5AThIgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Lee-Harvey-Oswald-Is-Shot-By-Jack-Ruby.gif)
http://kennedy-photos.blogspot.com/2020/02/kennedy-gallery-483.html
(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-wLzcFEs6Ikw/Xew0nsrh0oI/AAAAAAABTPQ/W-MMiF4q3ycyLYtO6XDyncizrq8Ji3YlQCLcBGAsYHQ/s490/YouTube-JFK-Channel-Logo.png) (http://youtube.com/DavidVonPeinJFK/videos)
Thanks David, the looped gif clip appears to be put into rewind mode before looping back to the beginning. Is this correct? Also, remarkable is what I assume are the effects of the flash from Bob Jackson’s camera when he took his Pulitzer Prize winning photo. (The cables stretched across the driveway above the car backing down appear to jump.) And it also shows, more clearly than I have seen before, how close the bottom corner of the bumper comes to hitting Ruby’s leg.
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Never realized Jim Leavelle was bouncing LHOs head on and off the ground before like that - inside job?
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Never realized Jim Leavelle was bouncing LHOs head on and off the ground before like that - inside job?
Being handcuffed to him...a difficult strain to be sure. The clip demonstrates the awkwardness of trying to shoot Oswald in the head as has been suggested.
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Being handcuffed to him...a difficult strain to be sure. The clip demonstrates the awkwardness of trying to shoot Oswald in the head as has been suggested.
Then why would they try then? Why didn't they do it when he wasn't handcuffed to a cop from any of the numerous times he was walked out in front of the public in the previous 48 hours?
Ruby could've easily aimed for his head here. He got within 6 inches of Oswald before anyone even noticed him there! Yet he clumsily shoots him in the stomach. Oswalds arm is across his side protecting it, covering a lot of his abdomen, its a side shot with L. C. Graves in the way too.
Yet people seem to believe Ruby knew he would kill him and the plotters, after all this effort, were happy with this massive massive risk.
(https://worldofwonder.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/11-24Lee_Harvey_Oswald_being_shot_by_Jack_Ruby_as_Oswald_is_being_moved_by_police_1963.jpg)
No one seems to be able to answer this though, to 100% guarantee that hes dead - why not wait until he got to jail and kill him there?
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Then why would they try then? Why didn't they do it when he wasn't handcuffed to a cop from any of the numerous times he was walked out in front of the public in the previous 48 hours?
Ruby could've easily aimed for his head here. He got within 6 inches of Oswald before anyone even noticed him there! Yet he clumsily shoots him in the stomach. Oswalds arm is across his side protecting it, covering a lot of his abdomen, its a side shot with L. C. Graves in the way too.
Yet people seem to believe Ruby knew he would kill him and the plotters, after all this effort, were happy with this massive massive risk.
(https://worldofwonder.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/11-24Lee_Harvey_Oswald_being_shot_by_Jack_Ruby_as_Oswald_is_being_moved_by_police_1963.jpg)
No one seems to be able to answer this though, to 100% guarantee that hes dead - why not wait until he got to jail and kill him there?
Ruby might have realized that moving one's head out of the way quickly is far easier than moving the entire body. Looking at the angles here, if the attack came at the head, the smart move for Oswald would be to snap his head back, and to the left. Back, and to the left. Back... and to the left.
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Then why would they try then? Why didn't they do it when he wasn't handcuffed to a cop from any of the numerous times he was walked out in front of the public in the previous 48 hours?
Ruby could've easily aimed for his head here. He got within 6 inches of Oswald before anyone even noticed him there! Yet he clumsily shoots him in the stomach. Oswalds arm is across his side protecting it, covering a lot of his abdomen, its a side shot with L. C. Graves in the way too.
Yet people seem to believe Ruby knew he would kill him and the plotters, after all this effort, were happy with this massive massive risk.
(https://worldofwonder.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/11-24Lee_Harvey_Oswald_being_shot_by_Jack_Ruby_as_Oswald_is_being_moved_by_police_1963.jpg)
No one seems to be able to answer this though, to 100% guarantee that hes dead - why not wait until he got to jail and kill him there?
Ruby had no access to the county jail, only DPD bldg.
The guy shot was quite effective, obviously. Hit the descending aorta, liver, spleen and diaphragm.
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Ruby had no access to the county jail, only DPD bldg.
Do you have a source for that? that he had no access to the county jail? It would help explain why he tried to shoot him in the DPD.
I think i read somewhere that Ruby told the police afterwards that he intended on firing a number of shots, possibly 3, but was stopped from firing any more than the one he did fire.
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Ruby had no access to the county jail, only DPD bldg.
So why not get someone else to kill him in the jail? Surely such a wide reaching conspiracy could have organised that.
The guy shot was quite effective, obviously. Hit the descending aorta, liver, spleen and diaphragm.
So he was such a good shot (miraculous) that he was able to hit the aorta, liver, spleen and diaphragm while missing Oswalds arm, Graves hand and some of Graves body as a car was driving withing a few inches of him, but he wasn't able to hit Oswald in the head (a much bigger target) from 6 inches away?
Again, explain the logic in a "kill shot" where 90% of people survive?
The risk is huge. A tiny percentage of people are unconscious after an abdomen pistol shot. A tiny percentage. How were "they" to know Oswald wouldnt just have blabbed in the ambulance on the way to the hospital? Oswald knowing they were trying to kill him anyway.
Show me another assassination of such importance - ie the target needs to be silenced immediately with no margin for error- where the assassin has used a single shot to the stomach from a .38?
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Any argument that's premised on "a conspiracy surely would have done X" is a failure right out of the gate.
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So why not get someone else to kill him in the jail? Surely such a wide reaching conspiracy could have organised that.
So he was such a good shot (miraculous) that he was able to hit the aorta, liver, spleen and diaphragm while missing Oswalds arm, Graves hand and some of Graves body as a car was driving withing a few inches of him, but he wasn't able to hit Oswald in the head (a much bigger target) from 6 inches away?
Again, explain the logic in a "kill shot" where 90% of people survive?
The risk is huge. A tiny percentage of people are unconscious after an abdomen pistol shot. A tiny percentage. How were "they" to know Oswald wouldnt just have blabbed in the ambulance on the way to the hospital? Oswald knowing they were trying to kill him anyway.
Show me another assassination of such importance - ie the target needs to be silenced immediately with no margin for error- where the assassin has used a single shot to the stomach from a .38?
Not that Ruby needs one, but a viable explanation has already been presented to you but you don't like it. The DPD didn't want Ruby to shoot anyone but Oswald and a head shot was way too risky for that. The DPD also wanted it to be Ruby in plain sight and they could only control his access to their building. Hoover & Johnson also didn't want the shot to be immediately fatal because they were after a false confession from him on the way to the hospital. After that, he would be readily taken out at any point without suspicion. Anything he said about a conspiracy and the Big Event would be chalked up to delusional talk from a dying man. He would have been spilling his guts to conspirators anyway.
So if this was a conspiracy, which it was, then this made perfect sense. You are under the mistaken impression that conspirators would have done it your way. But how were they going to get a fake confession out him with a head shot? As it was, Ruby's gut shot didn't allow Oswald to speak so they couldn't claim he made a confession. But you can't blame Ruby for that. He did his job by the book. If he had been told to shoot Oswald in the head he would have attempted to, with much riskier results and you can forget about any confession.
Otherwise, we are left to believe that Ruby shot Oswald because of his love for JFK and his motive was revenge for the Kennedys. Why on earth would you buy that explanation just because he didn't take a head shot? Is it because it better fits your LN narrative?
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Otherwise, we are left to believe that Ruby shot Oswald because of his love for JFK and his motive was revenge for the Kennedys. Why on earth would you buy that explanation just because he didn't take a head shot? Is it because it better fits your LN narrative?
Oswald easily could have ducked. It would take a brave (ie stupid) man to take a head shot while he was lunging forward and off to the left and off balance and a car backing in towards you.
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So he was such a good shot (miraculous) that he was able to hit the aorta, liver, spleen and diaphragm while missing Oswalds arm, Graves hand and some of Graves body as a car was driving withing a few inches of him, but he wasn't able to hit Oswald in the head (a much bigger target) from 6 inches away?
Again, explain the logic in a "kill shot" where 90% of people survive?
The risk is huge. A tiny percentage of people are unconscious after an abdomen pistol shot. A tiny percentage. How were "they" to know Oswald wouldnt just have blabbed in the ambulance on the way to the hospital? Oswald knowing they were trying to kill him anyway.
Show me another assassination of such importance - ie the target needs to be silenced immediately with no margin for error- where the assassin has used a single shot to the stomach from a .38?
The cops most likely expedited Oswald's passing......Even though Ruby fired only one shot, in the lower abdomen, the bullet ruptured two main arteries carrying blood to the heart. It also tore through the spleen, liver, pancreas and Oswald’s right kidney. Oswald remained conscious for a few minutes after being shot. The police gave Oswald mouth to mouth resuscitation, ‘trying’ to save his life. What they were really doing was killing him. A man with abdominal wounds is not helped if somebody is pushing on his abdomen as hard as he can.
from...This Is Not America ---The assassination of President John F. Kennedy---Philip Coppens