JFK Assassination Forum

Off Topic => Off Topic => Topic started by: Tim Nickerson on April 25, 2019, 02:27:38 AM

Title: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on April 25, 2019, 02:27:38 AM

Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Matt Grantham on May 01, 2019, 06:43:07 PM
Hi Tim

           Processed, factory raised meats are still bad, So is browning them and cooking them over barbecues
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on May 04, 2019, 10:31:53 PM
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Hi Tim

           Processed, factory raised meats are still bad, So is browning them and cooking them over barbecues

Matt, I'm not entirely convinced that processed meat is bad for us. Although, I do keep my intake of it to a minimum. Just bacon and Kolbassa. As far as factory raised meats go, it really depends on what you mean by factory. Chickens are mostly raised in factories but cattle are not. I eat very little chicken. Actually, rarely. I eat mostly beef, and lot of it is raised locally. I do eat bacon once a week. I also eat Lamb a couple of times a month. If it wasn't so expensive I'd eat a lot more of it. Although, Lamb liver is quite cheap. I had some of that the other day. I also eat a lot of salmon and mollusks. Browning meat is safe , as is cooking over barbecues as long as you avoid charring the meat.
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Denis Pointing on May 12, 2019, 03:16:49 PM
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Hi Tim

            cooking them over barbecues

Yeah, I guess that's why all those cavemen died off.  :D :D
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Bill Chapman on June 17, 2019, 07:30:46 AM
The caveman diet was great if you only wanted to live 30-35 years  That's the average life expectancy in those days. Very few people lived past 40. Why would anyone want to follow a diet that shortens your life?

People's favorite food over all is pizza, apparently. I'm down with that re veggy pizza for sure, but to me meat-based pizza is a heart attack in-a-box.

Bon appetite!
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Denis Pointing on June 17, 2019, 10:43:23 PM
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The caveman diet was great if you only wanted to live 30-35 years  That's the average life expectancy in those days. Very few people lived past 40. Why would anyone want to follow a diet that shortens your life?

People's favorite food over all is pizza, apparently. I'm down with that re veggy pizza for sure, but to me meat-based pizza is a heart attack in-a-box.

Bon appetite!

Bill, you're not seriously suggesting a caveman's low life expectancy was due to his diet!? I would argue their diets were far healthy than ours. I suggest their hard lifestyle, lack of medicine, hunting sabre tooths and mammoths had more to do with that. I've eaten meat every day for decades and I've only ever had three heart attacks. lol JOKING.
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Bill Chapman on June 21, 2019, 05:23:16 PM
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Bill, you're not seriously suggesting a caveman's low life expectancy was due to his diet!? I would argue their diets were far healthy than ours. I suggest their hard lifestyle, lack of medicine, hunting sabre tooths and mammoths had more to do with that. I've eaten meat every day for decades and I've only ever had three heart attacks. lol JOKING.

The article I was reading was concerned with current meat-centric diets, not the differences between having to run after your lunch, as against going to a drive-thru.

Our ancestors didn't live long enough to get colon cancer it seems, but it sure scares the shit out of me. The second biggest killer next to lung cancer if I'm not mistaken. No steaks or burgers in decades for me. Salmon; and lamb occasionally. Lots of veggie and whole wheat fiber

Don't dig your own grave with a knife & fork.
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on June 24, 2019, 04:52:27 AM
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People's favorite food over all is pizza, apparently. I'm down with that re veggy pizza for sure, but to me meat-based pizza is a heart attack in-a-box.


It's not the meat on the pizza that I'd be worried about.
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on June 24, 2019, 04:55:39 AM
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No steaks or burgers in decades for me. Salmon; and lamb occasionally. Lots of veggie and whole wheat fiber

Don't dig your own grave with a knife & fork.

Steaks, burgers, Lamb and Salmon are all good for you. Some veggies are good for you. Whole wheat is ok as a treat but it's not good for you.

Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Bill Chapman on June 24, 2019, 05:36:47 AM
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Steaks, burgers, Lamb and Salmon are all good for you. Some veggies are good for you. Whole wheat is ok as a treat but it's not good for you.

Colon Cancer: Symptoms, Signs, Screening, Stages
https://www.emedicinehealth.com/slideshow_colorectal_cancer/article_em.htm#
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on June 24, 2019, 06:24:40 AM
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Colon Cancer: Symptoms, Signs, Screening, Stages
https://www.emedicinehealth.com/slideshow_colorectal_cancer/article_em.htm#

Where is the evidence that eating red meat causes colon cancer?
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on June 24, 2019, 06:29:44 AM

Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Bill Chapman on June 24, 2019, 04:11:18 PM
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Where is the evidence that eating red meat causes colon cancer?

Your risks are higher with high meat consumption
With meat and a high fiber diet your risks are more moderate
I always manage to eat extra fiber after consuming meat
Otherwise bowl passage is delayed

I'm no vegan and I use skim dairy, I don't run around preaching this or that. But I find it strange that the people in those vids you posted are laughing a lot. Are you sure that's not some kind of nervous 'whistle-in-the-dark' defensive mechanism?

Re cattle, I saw a spot cartoon of God, during creation, sitting on a cloud looking over a herd of cattle saying 'now I have to create somebody to eat you guys'

Red Meat and Colon Cancer
https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/red-meat-and-colon-cancer
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on June 24, 2019, 05:18:39 PM
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Your risks are higher with high meat consumption

There's no real evidence of that.

Quote
With meat and a high fiber diet your risks are more moderate
I always manage to eat extra fiber after consuming meat
Otherwise bowl passage is delayed

I consume plenty of fiber. I don't know how important is it though. Some studies have shown that it isn't helpful at all.

Quote
I'm no vegan and I use skim dairy.

I don't drink milk. I use full fat cream in my coffee and I often use it on my berries. I also eat cheddar cheese.

Quote
Red Meat and Colon Cancer
https://www.health.harvard.edu/staying-healthy/red-meat-and-colon-cancer

The article references epidemiological studies. Such studies are not worth considering unless the risk estimates that they come up with are enormous. Anything less than 2.0 can be dismissed. Anything above that might be worth considering.  0.28 and 0.20 are easily dismissed.
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Bill Chapman on June 24, 2019, 06:12:57 PM
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There's no real evidence of that.

I consume plenty of fiber. I don't know how important is it though. Some studies have shown that it isn't helpful at all.

I don't drink milk. I use full fat cream in my coffee and I often use it on my berries. I also eat cheddar cheese.

The article references epidemiological studies. Such studies are not worth considering unless the risk estimates that they come up with are enormous. Anything less than 2.0 can be dismissed. Anything above that might be worth considering.  0.28 and 0.20 are easily dismissed.

Somebody is always writing a book claiming this or that
Which organizations are promoting meat? Oh, yeah... meat producers.
You wouldn't happen to be in cattle production would you?
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on June 24, 2019, 11:47:49 PM
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Somebody is always writing a book claiming this or that
Which organizations are promoting meat? Oh, yeah... meat producers.
You wouldn't happen to be in cattle production would you?

The better question to ask would be ,which organizations are railing against the consumption of animal products?

Do you eat real butter? If not, why not? Do you cook with lard or other animal fat? If not,why not? I have no investment in cattle production. As a natural omnivore, I am very thankful for cattle production.  Beef is loaded with nutrients. It's all good for you. When is the last time you had beef liver?
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Bill Chapman on June 25, 2019, 01:34:14 AM
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The better question to ask would be ,which organizations are railing against the consumption of animal products?

Do you eat real butter? If not, why not? Do you cook with lard or other animal fat? If not,why not? I have no investment in cattle production. As a natural omnivore, I am very thankful for cattle production.  Beef is loaded with nutrients. It's all good for you. When is the last time you had beef liver?

Why would that be the better question?

The better question might be are you fine in considering yourself to be merely a part of the broad, faceless average, or an individual who gets regular checkups and knows the history of illness at in at least nearby forebearers?

'I wouldn't join any organization that would have me as a member', said Woody Allen IIRC
If you think I'm pushing some sort of food agenda you'd be wrong.

Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on June 25, 2019, 02:21:50 AM
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Why would that be the better question?

Because it's been animal products that have been under attack for 60 years, not plants, that's why. Beginning in the 80s, people en masse abandoned butter, lard and other animal fats in favor of vegetable oils like margarine, canola oil, soy bean oil, corn oil, etc.. Why do you suppose that happened?  Have you ever taken the time to look into how much sugar you are consuming on a daily basis? How much of it were people eating on average in the 1970s?
 
Quote
'I wouldn't join any organization that would have me as a member', said Woody Allen IIRC

I believe that Groucho Marx was the originator of that statement. Worded a little differently though.
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Denis Pointing on June 26, 2019, 10:58:58 PM
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I believe that Groucho Marx was the originator of that statement. Worded a little differently though.

From Thomas Gorsky. GOOGLE GROUP; "In "Nice Guys Finish Seventh" by Ralph Keynes, Groucho states in his
autobiography that he resigned from a group called the Delaney Club:
"Please accept my resignation.  I don't want to belong to any club
that will accept me as a member."  However his brother and son used
the more popular version, "I don't want to belong to any club that
would have me as a member."
I recall that Woody Allen quoted Groucho using this quotation in one
of his movies, but I can't recall which one.  Perhaps Annie Hall."
Title: Re: How we tricked the world into thinking meat was bad
Post by: Tim Nickerson on June 27, 2019, 02:39:25 AM
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From Thomas Gorsky. GOOGLE GROUP; "In "Nice Guys Finish Seventh" by Ralph Keynes, Groucho states in his
autobiography that he resigned from a group called the Delaney Club:
"Please accept my resignation.  I don't want to belong to any club
that will accept me as a member."  However his brother and son used
the more popular version, "I don't want to belong to any club that
would have me as a member."
I recall that Woody Allen quoted Groucho using this quotation in one
of his movies, but I can't recall which one.  Perhaps Annie Hall."


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