JFK Assassination Forum

JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => Topic started by: Jon Banks on December 06, 2018, 05:09:39 AM

Title: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Jon Banks on December 06, 2018, 05:09:39 AM
Officially, George HW Bush didn't work for the CIA until he became the CIA Director during the Gerald Ford Administration.

However, there's some evidence that he worked "with" or "for" the CIA years prior to becoming CIA director.

- Zapata Oil
Bush started the company in 1953 with CIA officer Thomas Devine

- FBI-CIA memo on the JFK assassination aftermath
http://deepstateblog.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/JEH-re-GHWB-112963.pdf

No one has ever confirmed that the "George Bush" referenced in Hoover's memo was the future President. However, it has all but been ruled out that low-level CIA employee, George William Bush could've been the person referenced in the Memo.

George HW Bush may have been cagey about his early work with the CIA for several reasons. The CIA did a lot of things abroad in the 1950's and 1960's (ie coups, assassinations, LSD tests, etc) that could ruin his political aspirations if he were connected to any of it. I think this history matters because if true, it paints a clearer picture of how the CIA operates. I'm not convinced that Bush's secrecy over his background with the CIA had anything to do with the Kennedy assassination...
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Tom Scully on December 06, 2018, 05:40:05 AM
You ask if it matters. Is not a better question whether it can be further developed?
The owners of the media are owned. This week they are fawning all over themselves,
even praising his public CIA tenure, loved by the Langley staff 21 years later as the new HQ
building was dedicated in his name.

After 15 years and expending a small fortune assisted by the rare experienced legal counsel in this
specialized niche.... the same attorney who represent Weissberg, Jeff Morley has been blocked at
every turn by Judge Richard Leon, minority counsel in 1992 who shut down the October Surprise reinvestigation.

I presume you know closer to the truth is a POTUS appointed by Nixon was alerted by his
handpicked, unelected V.P. Rockefeller that his cover up Op presented as a Commission to
examine the work product of the investigative body in the Senate led by Sen. Frank Church required
more distorting, discrediting, and disappearing than V.P. Rocky expected he could perform.

On CNN the universal description of this is that Bush turned around a demoralized agency,
How do you expect to go up against that? The vulnerable flaws in the veneer seem to be the
DeMohrenschildt, Devine, Dryer, Macomber dynamic.

Pick lower hanging fruit unless you are indifferent as to realistic likelihood of learning anything you
can prove, or you are indifferent to the impression you might make on reasonable people.

Or in the opposite alternative, declare that the BOP associated ship renamed Barbara J had any actual link to Bush.

Joe McBride took the Bush memo as far as it will impact, 30 years ago. Does that influence you at all to choose
a different tree?

Bush was a Bonesman, no more than 15 added per year, only males invited until 30 years ago,
They are influenced to never confess, or even explain.

That is the foundation for presenting his verfiable, grave shortcomings as far as what he owed to his countrymen
VS what he actually communicated.

I follow my own advice and cannot even spur a discussion. My presentation is not entertaining but it is solid.

I believe I succeed in fashioning Bush as unreasonable and dishonest, not even knowing right from wrong.

https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1429.0.html
Bush 2007 Ford Eulogy CT Taunts vs His Actual Knowledge & involved Acquaintances

You are not presenting anything new or, if McBride's then cutting edge research circa 30 years ago is an indication,
anything not too high up in the tree to ever reach and pick. BYP redux.


Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Richard Rubio on December 06, 2018, 10:36:36 AM
I heard that when GHW Bush went through hearings to become CIA director, he denied any prior connections.

I never knew about this "Thomas Devine", I will read up on that.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Walt Cakebread on December 06, 2018, 01:46:02 PM
You ask if it matters. Is not a better question whether it can be further developed?
The owners of the media are owned. This week they are fawning all over themselves,
even praising his public CIA tenure, loved by the Langley staff 21 years later as the new HQ
building was dedicated in his name.

After 15 years and expending a small fortune assisted by the rare experienced legal counsel in this
specialized niche.... the same attorney who represent Weissberg, Jeff Morley has been blocked at
every turn by Judge Richard Leon, minority counsel in 1992 who shut down the October Surprise reinvestigation.

I presume you know closer to the truth is a POTUS appointed by Nixon was alerted by his
handpicked, unelected V.P. Rockefeller that his cover up Op presented as a Commission to
examine the work product of the investigative body in the Senate led by Sen. Frank Church required
more distorting, discrediting, and disappearing than V.P. Rocky expected he could perform.

On CNN the universal description of this is that Bush turned around a demoralized agency,
How do you expect to go up against that? The vulnerable flaws in the veneer seem to be the
DeMohrenschildt, Devine, Dryer, Macomber dynamic.

Pick lower hanging fruit unless you are indifferent as to realistic likelihood of learning anything you
can prove, or you are indifferent to the impression you might make on reasonable people.

Or in the opposite alternative, declare that the BOP associated ship renamed Barbara J had any actual link to Bush.

Joe McBride took the Bush memo as far as it will impact, 30 years ago. Does that influence you at all to choose
a different tree?

Bush was a Bonesman, no more than 15 added per year, only males invited until 30 years ago,
They are influenced to never confess, or even explain.

That is the foundation for presenting his verfiable, grave shortcomings as far as what he owed to his countrymen
VS what he actually communicated.

I follow my own advice and cannot even spur a discussion. My presentation is not entertaining but it is solid.

I believe I succeed in fashioning Bush as unreasonable and dishonest, not even knowing right from wrong.

https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1429.0.html
Bush 2007 Ford Eulogy CT Taunts vs His Actual Knowledge & involved Acquaintances

You are not presenting anything new or, if McBride's then cutting edge research circa 30 years ago is an indication,
anything not too high up in the tree to ever reach and pick. BYP redux.


I believe I succeed in fashioning Bush as unreasonable and dishonest, not even knowing right from wrong.

He knew right form wrong...   Somewhere, I recall reading that George HW Bush said..." If the American people knew what we have done, we would all be in prison."
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Bill Chapman on December 06, 2018, 03:12:50 PM

I believe I succeed in fashioning Bush as unreasonable and dishonest, not even knowing right from wrong.

He knew right form wrong...   Somewhere, I recall reading that George HW Bush said..." If the American people knew what we have done, we would all be in prison."

Firstly, the quote was not about the assassination, it was about Iran-Contra affair, also referred to as Irangate, Contragate or the Iran?Contra scandal.

Secondly, the quote did not contain the word 'prison', although plenty of members of Reagan administration officials were eventually indicted (to the tune of 200 or so) and did time, To this day, the GOP continues to crap on America. No wonder they continue to be referred to as The Stupid Party

LOL

https://meagainstiniquity.wordpress.com/2015/01/01/george-herbert-walker-bush-sarah-if-the-american-people-ever-find-out-what-we-have-done-they-would-chase-us-down-the-street-and-lynch-us-that-is-a-famous-1992-quote-by-george-herbert-walker/
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Jerry Freeman on December 06, 2018, 07:20:16 PM
Somewhere, I recall reading that George HW Bush said..." If the American people knew what we have done, we would all be in prison."
Quote
?Sarah, if the American people ever find out what we have done, they would chase us down the street and lynch us.?
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2013/04/03/1199001/-Jeb-Bush-Oliver-North-and-the-Murder-of-CIA-Drug-Smuggler-Barry-Seal-in-1986
     
 
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Mark Wengler on December 06, 2018, 09:32:54 PM
The thing is this Bay of pigs was called operation Zapata Bush's oil company was called Zapata oil. Two of the ships used was called Huston. where Bush lived. The other was called Barbara . Bush's wife.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Jon Banks on December 06, 2018, 10:41:46 PM
The thing is this Bay of pigs was called operation Zapata Bush's oil company was called Zapata oil. Two of the ships used was called Huston. where Bush lived. The other was called Barbara . Bush's wife.

Worst Spy ever if Bush chose those names for those Covert things
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Joe Elliott on December 07, 2018, 02:53:55 AM

Questions:

Did any CTers, like Mark Lane, mention George H. W. Bush as taking part in the assassination before he was appointed the CIA Director?

What is the earliest mention of a CT author of Bush?s possible involvement?

Did this only start after he was made the CIA Director? After he became Vice President? After he became President?
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Jerry Freeman on December 07, 2018, 03:11:03 AM
Questions:
 
Is there an echo in here? Didn't you ask all that here?----
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1427.msg38268.html#msg38268
 
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Richard Rubio on December 07, 2018, 04:37:52 AM
The thing is this Bay of pigs was called operation Zapata Bush's oil company was called Zapata oil. Two of the ships used was called Huston. where Bush lived. The other was called Barbara . Bush's wife.

Boat was called Barbara J, Barbara Bush's maiden name, Barbara Pierce with no middle initial. Write up at MacAdams showed researchers said both of those boats, Houston and Barbara J were called that for some time before the Bay of Pigs.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/prouty.htm

It bothers me some though still, how GHW Bush didn't recall, seemed to have problems saying where he was on that day, "Somewhere in Texas", well, that includes a heckuva lot of area.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Jon Banks on December 07, 2018, 08:07:55 AM
Questions:

Did any CTers, like Mark Lane, mention George H. W. Bush as taking part in the assassination before he was appointed the CIA Director?

What is the earliest mention of a CT author of Bush?s possible involvement?

Did this only start after he was made the CIA Director? After he became Vice President? After he became President?

It probably started around the time George DeMorenschildt wrote a letter to him. Some time in the 1970s.

Bush and DeMorenschildt were aquatintences.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Tom Scully on December 07, 2018, 09:36:55 AM
Questions:

Did any CTers, like Mark Lane, mention George H. W. Bush as taking part in the assassination before he was appointed the CIA Director?

What is the earliest mention of a CT author of Bush?s possible involvement?

Did this only start after he was made the CIA Director? After he became Vice President? After he became President?

.......
It bothers me some though still, how GHW Bush didn't recall, seemed to have problems saying where he was on that day, "Somewhere in Texas", well, that includes a heckuva lot of area.

It probably started around the time George DeMorenschildt wrote a letter to him. Some time in the 1970s.

Bush and DeMorenschildt were aquatintences.

Jon, my intent is not to link you to the other two posters I quoted above my quote of your post, or to the
wording of their comments. I structured my post to attempt to kill a few birds with one stone in as small of
a foot print on this page as possible.

Everyone: Please search to confirm details before you post.

My posts are known to be long because I verify before I post and almost always include supporting cites
to the degree of overkill, but hopefully readers will consider and compare the comments I quoted  with
their own held beliefs and assumptions and the body of available, verifiable facts.

Joe, I cannot emphasize any more firmly than this that it amounts to working against the impression you will
make on reasonable readers at the expense of your own credibility if you link direct involvement in the Assassination
of JFK with Bush 41.


There is reasonable support for the opinion or analysis that people close to Bush and an gov. agency Tom Devine
was representing concealed and obstructed after the fact and behaved as if they had somethings to suppress
or conceal.
Supporting presentations, (Aside from the 11/22 call from Bush to his Houston FBI friend Graham Kitchel) :
Bush, Devine and Devine friends:
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1437.msg38781.html#msg38781

Billy Joe Lord's 1977 complaint letter about Bush and his close friend allegedly threatening his job security if
he refused an interview with Henry Hurt who was dispatched to Midland by Reader's Digest.:

Quote
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1439.0.html
Dec. 6 specially decorated Bush '41 Train engine, was Billy Joe Lord on board?

It is a myth that Bush 41 did not recall where he was or what he was doing when informed JFK had been shot.

Quote
https://whowhatwhy.org/2013/10/09/bush-and-the-jfk-hit-part-4-barbaras-hair-raising-day/
OCTOBER 9, 2013 | RUSS BAKER
BUSH AND THE JFK HIT, PART 4: BARBARA?S HAIR-RAISING DAY

....The Tyler story is borne out by the personal recollections of Aubrey Irby, then vice president of the local Kiwanis Club (and later president of Kiwanis International during Bush?s vice presidency). As Irby explained to the author Kitty Kelley, Bush had been waiting to deliver a luncheon speech to his organization ? to one hundred men gathered at Tyler?s Blackstone Hotel.....
.....In a 2007 interview with me, Irby described George H. W. Bush at the time of the news as matter-of-fact and supremely well composed. ...

Quote
Tom S. March 5, 2016 at 10:30 pm http://jfkfacts.org/exchange-on-the-bush-did-it-theory/#comment-861370
By the 20th anniversary, Bush had his response, ?in order.?
November 7, 1983 :
https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1916&dat=19831107&id=xChJAAAAIBAJ&sjid=iQYNAAAAIBAJ&pg=1438,1274908&hl=en
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-pvLAe-PLRnE/VtucPnMGfjI/AAAAAAAADGE/r84vY22Goyg/s512-Ic42/BushRecall112263.jpg)

The ?problem? is not where Bush was on November 22. It is that he had so many he was so close to who
had close contact with DeMohrenschildt, and in one example, with both DeMohrenschildt and with Garry Coit,
Priscilla Johnson?s CIA contact. In 1940, Bush lived in the small A.U.V. secret society house on the campus of Phillips Andover ? http://preservation.mhl.org/123-main-st

Denis has not been posting here lately, our loss, not his. He sets an example we all can use as an self improvement
benchmark.
Quote
Denis Morissette Posted August 6
The Allen photo of the Bush look-alike is Allen 5-3 a few minutes before the Tippit shooting was announced. M.N. McDonald is in the picture. The radio will report this later.

Quote
On 8/4/2018 at 10:58 PM, Denis Morissette said:
George H.W. Bush at the Kiwanis Club in Tyler, Texas, on November 22, 1963 (thanks to Steve Roe) and a letter from him detailing where he was on that day.
(http://content.invisioncic.com/r16296/monthly_2018_08/753764914_BushinTaylorTX.jpg.df342f30fea09ae15b97d20d756e2472.jpg)
(http://content.invisioncic.com/r16296/monthly_2018_08/735315773_Bushletter.jpg.156d7f0e34ec8ced649da8a42bcc2d73.jpg)

There is more evidence the vessel Barbara J was nsmed after the wife of JFK aid Col. Howard Burris than after
Barbara Bush.

Quote
Quixotic Joust: Excerpt from Manuscript by Richard Bartholomew
http://quixoticjoust.blogspot.com/2011/10/excerpt-from-manuscript-by-richard.html
Oct 4, 2011 - Howard Burris was Vice President Johnson's military representative and ..... Colonel Burris' wife, Barbara J. Burris, is the daughter of Governor ...

Bruce McAdams takes credit for publicly linking Bush to George Dem....
http://ciajfk.com/Letters.html

Quote
Quote
Our Man in Haiti: George de Mohrenschildt and the CIA in the ...
https://books=1936296535.google.com/books?isbn (https://books.google.com.ua/books?id=d_0BBAAAQBAJ&pg=PT63&dq=our+man+in+haiti+bush+conduit+anthony+kimery&hl=en&sa=X&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q&f=false)

Joan Mellen - 2012 - ‎Preview - ‎More editions
Sources in CIA's Directorate of Operations told Wall Street Journal reporter Anthony Kimery that Bush ?personally served as a conduit through which the Agency disbursed money for contracted services.? Asa ?parttime purchasing front
for CIA,? ...

Link to credits.... (https://books.google.com.ua/books?id=d_0BBAAAQBAJ&pg=PT5&dq="*j.+scully,+nathaniel"&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi-yt38uY3fAhUu1VkKHSFnCVUQ6AEIKjAA#v=onepage&q="*j.%20scully%2C%20nathaniel"&f=false)
 Author Joan Mellen book Acknowledgements:
(http://jfkforum.com/images/JoanMellenHaitiCreditsPage.jpg)

https://covertactionmagazine.com/index.php/2018/12/05/george-bush-and-the-cia-in-the-company-of-friends/
George Bush and the CIA: In the Company of Friends
by Anthony Kimery ? December 5, 2018
.......
Following the defeat of Nazi Germany, DeMohrenschildt appears to have been submerged as a deep cover CIA ?asset,? operating under the guise of a consulting petro?leum geologist specializing in making deals between U.S. oil companies and the East-bloc nations to which he was remarkably well-connected.13 Mallon personally introduced the Count to Bush at about the same time Mallon handed Bush the highly sensitive responsibility of negotiating East?-bloc deals. The officials with whom Bush dealt had detailed knowledge of Soviet-bloc oil and gas production and ex?ploration and drilling capabilities, as well as strategic ex?ploration and production plans outside the USSR. Bush convivially wheeled and dealed with the communists? pe?troleum experts without the slightest grimace by U.S. auth?orities. In fact, when a Yugoslavian oil industry official came to the U.S. in 1948 to talk to Dresser Industries, the State Department barely flinched and he went straight to neophyte salesman George Bush in Midland, Texas.14....
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Joe Elliott on December 07, 2018, 12:30:08 PM
Is there an echo in here? Didn't you ask all that here?----
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1427.msg38268.html#msg38268

Asked but not answered.

Were any CTers, Mark Lane, anyone else, accusing Bush of being involved in the assassination before he became the CIA Director?

Or was this a case that was first manufactured after he became well known, after he became the CIA Director?

Until some CTer here answers the question and provides a link, I am going to assume it was manufactured afterwards.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Walt Cakebread on December 07, 2018, 03:43:47 PM
https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2013/04/03/1199001/-Jeb-Bush-Oliver-North-and-the-Murder-of-CIA-Drug-Smuggler-Barry-Seal-in-1986
   

Thanks Jerry,    I was in error about the exact words and the occasion, but the point I was attempting to make is:...Bush knew he was involved in criminal endeavors...  He knew right from wrong......
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Tom Scully on December 07, 2018, 04:09:51 PM
Asked but not answered.

Were any CTers, Mark Lane, anyone else, accusing Bush of being involved in the assassination before he became the CIA Director?

Or was this a case that was first manufactured after he became well known, after he became the CIA Director?

Until some CTer here answers the question and provides a link, I am going to assume it was manufactured afterwards.
Manufactured afterwards?? Edward Hooker and William Macomber were not AUV society house Andover roommate of Bush 41 and Hooker the step nephew and circa 1950 business partner of George DeM until AFTER the WC investigation? Is that what
you threaten (in two of your posts) you will have to assume, Joe?


Quote
https://www.nytimes.com/1973/04/15/archives/miss-alexandra-mills-is-bride-of-t-j-devine.html
Miss Alexandra Mills Is Bride of T.J. Devine
APRIL 15, 1973

HOBE SOUND, Fla., April 14?Miss Alexandra Mills, daughter of Mr. and Mrs.
Samuel Wynne Mills of Locust Valley, L. I., and Hobe Sound, was married here this
afternoon to Thomas J. Devine, son of the late Mr. and Mrs. Adrian G. Devine of
Rochester. The ceremony was performed by Dean N.R.H. Moor in Christ Memorial
Episcopal Chapel.
Miss Barbara K. Mills was her sister's maid of honor, and the bridesmaids were
the Misses Marjorie K. Gerry, her cousin, and Susan C. Babcock and Lucy Bucknell,
niece of the bridegroom. William B. Macomber Jr., United States Ambassador to
Turkey, was best man
.,,,,,

In his book, Bush made this meeting up, and his CIA pal Devine and Gerge DeM never danced together several times from April 25, 1963, into May, 1963? and William Macomber was not Devine's best man?
Quote
Quote
The China Diary of George H. W. Bush: The Making of a Global President
https://books.google.com.ua/books?isbn=1400829615 (https://books.google.com.ua/books?id=jRvdwoKQOgQC&pg=PA311&dq=bush+china+diary+bemis+lias+anddevine&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwjKxu6Wt__eAhWDMewKHegRCRYQ6AEIKzAA#v=onepage&q=bush%20china%20diary%20bemis%20lias%20anddevine&f=false)

Jeffrey A. Engel - 2011 - ‎Preview - ‎More editions
But there is Mel Laird holding the behind-the-scenes press conference, saying, ?Well we'll keep Bush on till after the ... Bemis, Lias and Devine had a meeting regarding my political future?very thoughtful of them.5 All I know now is to do the ...
Bemis is not the Bush 41 lifelong pal described in early 1977 Billy Joe Lord letter to President Carter?
......
(http://jfkforum.com/images/BillyLordLetterDescriptionCrop.jpg)
....and an expanded version of the short form displayed above.: http://jfkforum.com/images/DevineLordHurt.jpg
......

Assume away! Your suspicion is incoherent because your (aka strawman)
INVOLVED....your wording....
Quote
...I am going to assume it was manufactured afterwards...
....is unreasonable, beyond the pale, as the evidence presented at my link below clearly proves, except for your provocative wording I chided you about in my last post. Bush is 41 reasonably (via verifiable evidence, i.e., no images in Dealey Plaza, pul-eeze) accused of being too close to DeMohrenschildt and DeMohrenschildt's WC testimony to avoid a public accounting to the American people. Instead, he ducked, gave no accounting, and used his 2007 Ford eulogy as an opportunity to call out and scold CT's. You either struggle with a reading comprehension challenge, avoid reading or are
merely attempting to inflame; and operate as if actual facts be damned.

A reasonable person would now process what I presented here.:
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1429.0.html
Topic: Bush 2007 Ford Eulogy CT Taunts vs His Actual Knowledge & involved Acquaintances
?.and plug this into what is presented at the link above this sentence!

Quote
http://jfkassassination.net/russ/testimony/demohr_g.htm
The testimony of George S. De Mohrenschildt was taken at 10 a.m. on April 22, 1964, at 200 Maryland Avenue N.E., Washington, D.C., by Mr. Albert E. Jenner, Jr., assistant counsel of the President's Commission. Dr. Alfred Goldberg, historian, was present....
....
Mr. JENNER. You entered the oil consulting business in Denver?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes. First of all, as just an ordinary consultant. I got helped by a friend of mine who has a small oil company in Denver.
Mr. JENNER. What was his name?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Jimmy Donahue. And he facilitated by giving his office, the secretary and so on. Because it is rather expensive to start on your own.
But very soon afterwards I started getting consulting jobs--doing evaluations on the wells and things like that. And one night--this will be interesting for you, how to start an oil business--one night I was driving through Oklahoma, tired as hell, and I said to myself, by God, everybody is making money in the oil business except me, I am just a flunky here for all these big operators--I should go in the oil business on my own, really in the oil business, drilling and producing, which was interesting to me. And then I recalled that my exnephew, Eddie Hooker, in New York, asked me to go in business with him. He had visited me in Colorado and was very much interested in the work I had done. I gave him a telephone call from some place in Oklahoma.
I said, "Eddie, how about it?"
He was working for Merrill Lynch at the time.
And he said, "George, I am ready. I am tired of Merrill Lynch."
Mr. JENNER. Merrill Lynch, Fenner and Beane at that time?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes. "I am tired of that Merrill Lynch, Fenner and Beane."
We formed a limited partnership together.
Mr. JENNER. And that is the partnership of Hooker and De Mohrenschildt?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. And that was when--1950?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes; I think so---1950.
Mr. JENNER. And did it last very long?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. It lasted, I think, 3 years.
Mr. JENNER. About 2 years?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. 2 or 3 years.
Mr. JENNER. And----
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Now, We made money, we lost money, but it was a pleasant relationship. We are still very good friends.
Mr. JENNER. What did you do in connection with that partnership?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Well, I did buying of the leases, doing the drilling, and helped him in New York, also, to raise money.
Mr. JENNER. He handled the financial end, or raising of money end?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. And you the field work?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes. Sometimes--we opened an office in New York, a small office. He was in New York most of the time. I was in Denver. Our first well was a dry hole, a disastrous dry hole. But our second well was a producer. We made some production. But never anything big.
Mr. JENNER. Now----
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Eventually I returned to Texas from Denver, because I had always retained some good friends in Texas, and they suggested, one of them who participated in our well, first venture suggested that, "George, you will do better in Texas, because Wyoming is too expensive"--a well costs $200,000 or $300,000 in Wyoming, you know--in Wyoming or Colorado.
Mr. JENNER. Now, when you were in partnership with Mr. Hooker, your field work and discovery work was in Wyoming and Colorado, is that correct?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. No. We started by drilling our first well in Wyoming, operating from Denver. And we had--we were snowbound there, we paid the rig time for a hell of a long time. To make the story short, our first venture was quite a failure. One of the reasons we finally split partnership with Eddie Hooker is that he is a very wealthy boy. He comes from a very wealthy family. And he wanted the oil business to make millions.
My reason to be in the oil business is to make a reasonable living, and eventually build up some production.
On our first venture in Wyoming, on the very first one, after we bought the leases, and before starting drilling, we got an offer from another company to sell out for a very substantial profit, without drilling a well--they would do it. Naturally, I told Ed we should do that instead of running a tremendous risk of drilling our own well. Well, he said if they want to buy it it means that we have something there, the usual story.
I was a little more conservative--I said better sell out and try to find something less risky.
He said if we hit it, we are millionaires right away--which was true--we had a huge block, of 12,000 acres, something like that.
Well, from then on, the next venture was in Texas, and we drilled quite a few successful wells, quite a few dry holes, too.
Mr. JENNER. You returned to Texas?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes.
Mr. JENNER. What year?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Abilene, Tex., we had the headquarters--that was the center of the small size independent operators at the time.
Mr. JENNER. What was the name of the hotel at which you stayed?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Wooten Hotel.
Mr. JENNER. And the partnership was still in existence?
Mr. De MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes. Our partnership was broken up after I married Miss Sharples. It was, frankly, a personal thing.
Mr. JENNER. I think this is a good time to stop, because that is the next phase I want to get into. We can go to lunch.

(Whereupon, at 12:35 p.m., the proceeding was recessed.)....

Joe, are you posting your inflammatory wording in your challenge to CTs twice in this thread
sarcastically or seemingly as a scoundrel likely would, or are you being sincere and struggling with some variety of a cognition challenge? I do not know the date the George DeM WC testimony above was publicly available or when the FBI 302 below was, but your painstaking to read premise is weasel BS.

FBI 302 questioning of DeMohrenschildt/Sharples single wedding party member (and why not the others?
Or were the other Shaples wedding party members interviews conducted but never made available?)
https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=196739&search=azamat#relPageId=12&tab=page
(http://jfkforum.com/images/HookerDemBrideSharplesQuotesAboutWeddingUshersGirayCONTRADICTION.jpg)

Topic: Bush 2007 Ford Eulogy CT Taunts vs His Actual Knowledge & involved Acquaintances
......
(http://jfkforum.com/images/BushHookerMeyer1951.jpg)
......
...article image above cuts off at word, PRINCE, and in text at this link:
Quote
https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/178139789/
.....Dmitri de Mohrenschildt acted as best man for his brother and the ushers were Edward Hooker, Willets Meyer, Philip Nash, Prince Azamat Guirey, Samuel Butler, Pierre Preyss, Henry Damon and Philip P. Sharpies. After a wedding trip Baron ae Mohrecschildt and his bride will reside in Dallas, Texas. ,,,,

https://www.maryferrell.org/showDoc.html?docId=56273&relPageId=492&search=azamat
(http://jfkforum.com/images/HookerDemBrideSharplesQuotesAboutWeddingUshers.jpg)
Joe, you leave little choice but to regard your "manufactured afterwards," as either an LN trolling taunt
or a plea for an intercession (help) from your personal intimates...
.

Doug Horne reacting to my discovery author Peter Janney's imaginary CIA assassin cum Ray Trumo murder trial
prosecution witness was not vanished since almost immediately after his 1965 DC court testimony.

I suggest readers marvel over the similarity of Cakebread and Horne reactions to my presentations of well
supported but inconvenient (to them) FACTS. If what I do seems negative to you, Walt, maybe you should
be wondering about your own relationship to truth vs alternative facts (thank you, KellyAnne Conway).
(http://jfkforum.com/images/JanneyHorneReacts.jpg)
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Walt Cakebread on December 07, 2018, 04:46:46 PM
Jon, my intent is not to link you to the other two posters I quoted above my quote of your post, or to the
wording of their comments. I structured my post to attempt to kill a few birds with one stone in as small of
a foot print on this page as possible.

Everyone: Please search to confirm details before you post.

My posts are known to be long because I verify before I post and almost always include supporting cites
to the degree of overkill, but hopefully readers will consider and compare the comments I quoted  with
their own held beliefs and assumptions and the body of available, verifiable facts.

Joe, I cannot emphasize any more firmly than this that it amounts to working against the impression you will
make on reasonable readers at the expense of your own credibility if you link direct involvement in the Assassination
of JFK with Bush 41.


There is reasonable support for the opinion or analysis that people close to Bush and an gov. agency Tom Devine
was representing concealed and obstructed after the fact and behaved as if they had somethings to suppress
or conceal.
Supporting presentations, (Aside from the 11/22 call from Bush to his Houston FBI friend Graham Kitchel) :
Bush, Devine and Devine friends:
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,1437.msg38781.html#msg38781

Billy Joe Lord's 1977 complaint letter about Bush and his close friend allegedly threatening his job security if
he refused an interview with Henry Hurt who was dispatched to Midland by Reader's Digest.:

It is a myth that Bush 41 did not recall where he was or what he was doing when informed JFK had been shot.

Denis has not been posting here lately, our loss, not his. He sets an example we all can use as an self improvement
benchmark.
There is more evidence the vessel Barbara J was nsmed after the wife of JFK aid Col. Howard Burris than after
Barbara Bush.

Bruce McAdams takes credit for publicly linking Bush to George Dem....
http://ciajfk.com/Letters.html

https://covertactionmagazine.com/index.php/2018/12/05/george-bush-and-the-cia-in-the-company-of-friends/
George Bush and the CIA: In the Company of Friends
by Anthony Kimery ? December 5, 2018
.......
Following the defeat of Nazi Germany, DeMohrenschildt appears to have been submerged as a deep cover CIA ?asset,? operating under the guise of a consulting petro?leum geologist specializing in making deals between U.S. oil companies and the East-bloc nations to which he was remarkably well-connected.13 Mallon personally introduced the Count to Bush at about the same time Mallon handed Bush the highly sensitive responsibility of negotiating East?-bloc deals. The officials with whom Bush dealt had detailed knowledge of Soviet-bloc oil and gas production and ex?ploration and drilling capabilities, as well as strategic ex?ploration and production plans outside the USSR. Bush convivially wheeled and dealed with the communists? pe?troleum experts without the slightest grimace by U.S. auth?orities. In fact, when a Yugoslavian oil industry official came to the U.S. in 1948 to talk to Dresser Industries, the State Department barely flinched and he went straight to neophyte salesman George Bush in Midland, Texas.14....

My posts are known to be long because I verify before I post and almost always include supporting cites
to the degree of overkill,


Yes, your strategy Mr Scully, is one of Hoover's favorites....  His idea was ....Dump so much information on the suckers that they will throw up their hands in despair.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Tom Scully on December 07, 2018, 06:04:56 PM
My posts are known to be long because I verify before I post and almost always include supporting cites
to the degree of overkill,


Yes, your strategy Mr Scully, is one of Hoover's favorites....  His idea was ....Dump so much information on the suckers that they will throw up their hands in despair.

Wow! And I thought Dallas was called nut country....you and Joe Elliott would fit right in. It seems too few are
eager to read what I post, I guess because I support (belabor) my points with over the top, extremists readers
such as you, Elliott, and yes, Horne, in mind.
Why do you suppose there is the  phrase, painful truth?

Doug Horne reacting to my discovery author Peter Janney's imaginary CIA assassin cum Ray Trumo murder trial
prosecution witness was not vanished since almost immediately after his 1965 DC court testimony.

I suggest readers marvel over the similarity of Cakebread and Horne reactions to my presentations of well
supported but inconvenient (to them) FACTS. If what I do seems negative to you, Walt, maybe you should
be wondering about your own relationship to truth vs alternative facts (thank you, KellyAnne Conway).
(http://jfkforum.com/images/JanneyHorneReacts.jpg)

And here is Doug Horne pal Peter Janney contradicting in his own book, Horne accusing me of not being up front.:

Quote
Mary's Mosaic: The CIA Conspiracy to Murder John F. Kennedy, Mary ...
https://books.google.com/books?isbn=1510708936 (https://books.google.com.ua/books?id=9TjlDAAAQBAJ&pg=PT368&dq=marys+mosaic+peter+janney+moderator+scully&hl=en&sa=X&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=marys%20mosaic%20peter%20janney%20moderator%20scully&f=false)

Peter Janney - 2016 - ‎Preview - ‎More editions
... to Murder John F. Kennedy, Mary Pinchot Meyer, and Their Vision for World Peace: Third Edition Peter Janney ... post of Mary's Mosaic in an email to a University of Georgia law professor, Scully identified himself as ?a moderator at the .
Is it not a symptom of unreasonable nuttery that you lack self awareness to the (severe) degree  you diminish
from the get go, your potential to make a favorable and convincing impression on reasonable people? Sheesh!
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Walt Cakebread on December 07, 2018, 06:53:12 PM
Wow! And I thought Dallas was called nut country....you and Joe Elliott would fit right in. It seems too few are
eager to read what I post, I guess because I support (belabor) my points with over the top, extremists readers
such as you, Elliott, and yes, Horne, in mind.
Why do you suppose there is the  phrase, painful truth?

Doug Horne reacting to my discovery author Peter Janney's imaginary CIA assassin cum Ray Trumo murder trial
prosecution witness was not vanished since almost immediately after his 1965 DC court testimony.

I suggest readers marvel over the similarity of Cakebread and Horne reactions to my presentations of well
supported but inconvenient (to them) FACTS. If what I do seems negative to you, Walt, maybe you should
be wondering about your own relationship to truth vs alternative facts (thank you, KellyAnne Conway).
(http://jfkforum.com/images/JanneyHorneReacts.jpg)

And here is Doug Horne pal Peter Janney contradicting in his own book, Horne accusing me of not being up front.:
Is it not a symptom of unreasonable nuttery that you lack self awareness to the (severe) degree  you diminish
from the get go, your potential to make a favorable and convincing impression on reasonable people? Sheesh!

It seems too few are eager to read what I post, I guess because I support (belabor) my points with over the top,

Since you know that your posts are generally ignored, because  they are "over the top" ( chock full of irrelevant information ) perhaps you'd try to use the kiss principle ( Keep it short and simple)
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Richard Rubio on December 07, 2018, 09:24:12 PM
Just for this one thread, I will say some good stuff posted. I won't patronize anyone and I may not mean every thread as I admit, I've been confused before.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Greg Bonkowski on December 07, 2018, 09:40:45 PM
No.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Joe Elliott on December 08, 2018, 02:00:28 AM
Joe, are you posting your inflammatory wording in your challenge to CTs twice in this thread
sarcastically or seemingly as a scoundrel likely would, or are you being sincere and struggling with some variety of a cognition challenge? I do not know the date the George DeM WC testimony above was publicly available or when the FBI 302 below was, but your painstaking to read premise is weasel BS.
 
And you and the other CTers are still dodging my one and only question.

When did a CTer first accuse George H. W. Bush of being a part of the conspiracy to assassinate President Kennedy.

And provide a site or link for this.

You and others post a lot of links to articles that have nothing to do with this question. Including the 1964 testimony of George DeM.

Either say, yes, here is something published in 1971 . . . or just admit that CTers didn?t start to look into the George H. W. Bush question until he was appointed the CIA director, or after he became Vice President, or after he became President. Which would be consistent with the CTers building a BS attack on someone famous.

Don?t give me a dozen links that have nothing to do with this question. Just give me one link that supports your answer.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Jon Banks on December 09, 2018, 01:24:19 PM
And you and the other CTers are still dodging my one and only question.

When did a CTer first accuse George H. W. Bush of being a part of the conspiracy to assassinate President Kennedy.

And provide a site or link for this.

You and others post a lot of links to articles that have nothing to do with this question. Including the 1964 testimony of George DeM.

Either say, yes, here is something published in 1971 . . . or just admit that CTers didn?t start to look into the George H. W. Bush question until he was appointed the CIA director, or after he became Vice President, or after he became President. Which would be consistent with the CTers building a BS attack on someone famous.

Don?t give me a dozen links that have nothing to do with this question. Just give me one link that supports your answer.

Howard Hunt wasn?t named in any JFK conspiracy theories before being named as a Watergate Conspirator. I imagine George Bush began to get suspected of being involved around the time he took over the CIA post-Watergate scandal...
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Tom Scully on December 09, 2018, 04:10:19 PM
Howard Hunt wasn?t named in any JFK conspiracy theories before being named as a Watergate Conspirator. I imagine George Bush began to get suspected of being involved around the time he took over the CIA post-Watergate scandal...
No shortage of presented links these past few days in several
threads with regard to former top staffer, (Macomber) of WC Commissioner
John Sherman Cooper of KY, Yale, S&B 1922, the same year I think,
Godfrey S Rockefeller, Yale, Scroll & Key, tapped in 1920 into that  same secret society
that tapped Jock Whitney, 5 years later. The background, monied
principals were Scroll & Key, Skull & Bones was fronting for them, Macomber
fronted for members of both those societies. Wm B Macomber knew
Devine and Joseph Dryer from their youth, all three were Rochester boys.
Macomber was best man in Bush sister Nancy 1946 wedding, and
in Devine 1973 wedding, and a one of less than 20 living with Bush
and Ed Hooker in the AUV house at Andover in the 1940 term.
Sen. Cooper was married to the widow of a McAdoo brother
of Nona McAdoo Von Mohrenschildt, widow of George DeM?s
uncle, diplomat Ferdinand Von Mohrenschildt.
(May 6, 1985 Lorraine Cooper, 79, leader.... Washington Post)
EH Hunt was assigned to the Mullen Co. and had an office
in The Nixon WH around the same time. May 2, 1973 NY Times
reported that Colson knew Hunt had forged a State dept cable.
On May 9, one week later, NY Times reported State Dept had granted
Hunt access to 240 secret cables related to point in time of assassination of Dirk brothers was n Vietnam in 1963. The forged cable was fashioned by Hunt once he acquired continuity
by reading all the secret cables. The cable caper was intended to discredit
the Kennedy bros. Macomber was an Asst Secretary of State authorizing
Hunt access to the cables in response to a Nixon WH request. During the
heat generated from Ellsberg and his P papers in 1971,
Macomber was called into the WH and agreed to assist
in the Nixon admin attempts to discredit Ellsberg.
To postpone the heat anticipated by the disclosure of
Hunt and the access granted to him by Macomber resulting
in the Hunt forgery, Macomber was sent to Turkey with the rank
of US ambassador. Macomber grudgingly admitted he responded
to a White House request and had not even verified EH Hunt had
security clearance level to access the 240 cables.
 Sorry, no ability to post links at the moment.

This past week, I witnessed the total abdication
of primary duty of journalists and historians to inform
the public and speak truth to power. Too busy obsessing
with BS like Drumpf and FLOTUS only dignitaries
at the public church service in DC not reading along
with everyone else visibly participating in the service.

Drumpf and his Mrs. were used by the establishment like
the fart noises kids make to mask the source of the rotten
egg stink of the actual stinker.

Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Joe Elliott on December 09, 2018, 08:45:12 PM

Still no answer as to when the CTers first started to name George H. W. Bush as a conspirator.

The CTers here, if they don?t want to answer this simple question, should at least post the reason why they want to dodge this question.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Joe Elliott on December 10, 2018, 12:37:30 AM
Howard Hunt wasn?t named in any JFK conspiracy theories before being named as a Watergate Conspirator. I imagine George Bush began to get suspected of being involved around the time he took over the CIA post-Watergate scandal...
I agree.
Neither Howard Hunt nor George H. W. Bush were ever mentioned as suspects in the JFK assassination conspiracy. Then, after they becomes famous, the CTers are able to manufacture a case against both.
Exactly as one would expect from a bogus movement.
Hence, the reluctance of CTers to specify the earliest date either Hunt or Bush were listed as a suspect in the assassination.
Title: Re: Was George HW Bush employed by the CIA on 11/22/63? Does it matter?
Post by: Robert Reeves on December 20, 2018, 08:30:08 PM
I agree.
Neither Howard Hunt nor George H. W. Bush were ever mentioned as suspects in the JFK assassination conspiracy. Then, after they becomes famous, the CTers are able to manufacture a case against both.
Exactly as one would expect from a bogus movement.
Hence, the reluctance of CTers to specify the earliest date either Hunt or Bush were listed as a suspect in the assassination.

lol Hunt was probably mentioned as likely a suspect in the JFK assassination when it came to light he was in Nixon's White House and carrying out illegal operations against Nixon's opposition. Obviously.

Nothing manufactured, Hunt was carrying out terrible, despicable, acts for uncle Sam. His own son has come to terms with and acknowledged these actions. So before you try and say otherwise, don't bother.

And for whatever it's worth ... on his lingering (3 year) death bed confession ... Hunt even admitted to being part of the assassination. ''A mid-level CIA payroll employee confesses to killing Kennedy'' should have been the headline around the world.