One of the Warren Commission's findings was that the first shot to strike the President was fired between Z210 and Z225.
Thus the earliest that President Kennedy could have been struck was Z210, or 5.6 sec before Z313. 5.6 sec is also the maximum time span set by the WC if Z210 was the first shot of three fired. Such a scenario could mean:Some programs and books used the 5.6 sec span as a benchmark for the three shots.
- Shot struck Kennedy (and possibly Connally)
- Shot misses (or struck Connally no later than Z240, per WC)
- Shot strikes head
Phil Willis put a time stamp on the first shot by clicking the shutter on his camera when the sound
of that shot startled him. A shot at Z-223-5 would require a second gunman. The
alleged murder weapon couldn't be physically fired quick enough to be responsible for both.
The WC concluded JFK was reacting to being shot at Z-210 when he emerged from behind the Stemmons Freeway sign at Z-225.
Mr. WILLIS. No, sir; I took that picture just seconds before the first shot was fired, to get back close up. Then I started down the street, and the regular weekly edition of Life magazine came out and shows me in about three different pictures going down the street. Then my next shot was taken at the very--in fact, the shot caused me to squeeze the camera shutter, and I got a picture of the President as he was hit with the first shot. So instantaneous, in fact, that the crowd hadn't had time to react.
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/willis%205%20arrow.jpg)
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/willis%205_1.jpg)
| (https://dygtyjqp7pi0m.cloudfront.net/i/18492/17855810_8.jpg) | (https://dygtyjqp7pi0m.cloudfront.net/i/18492/17855810_11.jpg) | (https://dygtyjqp7pi0m.cloudfront.net/i/18492/17855810_12.jpg) |
Phil Willis put a time stamp on the first shot by clicking the shutter on his camera when the sound
of that shot startled him. A shot at Z-223-5 would require a second gunman. The
alleged murder weapon couldn't be physically fired quick enough to be responsible for both.
The WC concluded JFK was reacting to being shot at Z-210 when he emerged from behind the Stemmons Freeway sign at Z-225.
Mr. WILLIS. No, sir; I took that picture just seconds before the first shot was fired, to get back close up. Then I started down the street, and the regular weekly edition of Life magazine came out and shows me in about three different pictures going down the street. Then my next shot was taken at the very--in fact, the shot caused me to squeeze the camera shutter, and I got a picture of the President as he was hit with the first shot. So instantaneous, in fact, that the crowd hadn't had time to react.
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/willis%205%20arrow.jpg)
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/willis%205_1.jpg)
Gary Craig,
Any other witnesses corroborate Willis' recollection of the timing of the first shot?
-- MWT ;)
| (https://dygtyjqp7pi0m.cloudfront.net/i/18492/17855810_4.jpg) | (https://dygtyjqp7pi0m.cloudfront.net/i/18492/17855810_5.jpg) | (https://www.jfkassassinationgallery.com/albums/userpics/10001/normal_willis05crop.jpg) (https://sites.google.com/site/jfkforum/misc/newsgroup/spacers/dot_clear.gif) JFK arrowed; Mrs. Kennedy in pink pillbox hat. (https://sites.google.com/site/jfkforum/misc/newsgroup/spacers/dot_clear.gif) Mrs. Kennedy has already turned to her right in Willis 05. |
As the first shot missed and the timing is not known, it is the timings of the second shot that becomes important and that particular stop watch starts the millisecond the throat shot if fired.
Gary Craig,
Any other witnesses corroborate Willis' recollection of the timing of the first shot?
-- MWT ;)
Gary just blessed us once again with his favorite Phil Willis testimony cherry-pick.
Describing the Kennedys, Willis recalled:
"In slide No. 4 he was looking pretty much toward -- straight ahead, and
she was looking more to the left, which would be my side of the street.
Then when the first shot was fired, she turned to the right toward him
and he more or less slumped forward, and it caused me to wonder if he
were hit, although I couldn’t say."
(https://dygtyjqp7pi0m.cloudfront.net/i/18492/17855810_4.jpg) (https://dygtyjqp7pi0m.cloudfront.net/i/18492/17855810_5.jpg) (https://www.jfkassassinationgallery.com/albums/userpics/10001/normal_willis05crop.jpg)
(https://sites.google.com/site/jfkforum/misc/newsgroup/spacers/dot_clear.gif)
JFK arrowed; Mrs. Kennedy in pink pillbox hat.
(https://sites.google.com/site/jfkforum/misc/newsgroup/spacers/dot_clear.gif)
Mrs. Kennedy has already turned to her right in Willis 05.
"Describing the Kennedys, Willis recalled:
"In slide No. 4 he was looking pretty much toward -- straight ahead, and
she was looking more to the left, which would be my side of the street.
Then when the first shot was fired, she turned to the right toward him
and he more or less slumped forward, and it caused me to wonder if he
were hit, although I couldn’t say."
He had his finger on the shutter button of his camera when the 1st shot went off causing him to snap a photo at that instant. In effect creating a time stamp of the event - versus his recall of what he was seeing. ???
In the world I live in the photo he took at the instant of the shot is the better record of what was occurring.
Truth is that the official story changed as evidence come up that caused the previous story to be no longer sustainable.
3 casing can only be likely proof of more than 2 shots from 6th floor of TSBD.
As the sequence "eject shell, fire shot, eject shell, fire shot, eject shell and no shot" is as plausible as "shot, eject shell, shot, eject shell, shot, eject shell"
So now you are left with injuries... Initially Connally with multiple wounds from most likely 1 bullet and Kennedy with 2 wounds from clearly 2 different, with the both Connally's insistence on Kennedy injury from 1st shot followed by Connally's injury from 2nd second shot. So as we know the initial official story was Kennedy neck shot than Connally shot than Kennedy head shot.
Tague's testimony of a ricochet injury, from what he indicated was the 2nd shot, meant that there were either 4 shots (Kennedy, Tague, Connally, Kennedy or Kennedy, Connally, Tague, Kennedy ) or as is now the official story the first bullet that hit both Connally and then Kennedy. (Kennedy/Connally. Miss hitting Tague, Kennedy.)
If a bullet went through the President's neck (autopsy said no bullets or fragments in neck from either back and front wounds), where did it go? (ie: most likely into Connally but if not, where? Ice bullet?)
John "Where The Hell Did The Baby Go?" Iacoletti,
Why don't you read the below interview, watch the PBS-NOVA segment, and the go looking for that baby you threw out?
If you don’t know what happened to the bullet from the “first missed shot”, why don’t you just say so?
Not "scientific" enough for you? Or you don't like it because it gives a plausible explanation, convincingly presented with slow-motion photography, showing how that bullet could have "disappeared".
Well, if you’re going to play the “could have” game, then the throat shot could have hit the asphalt and disappeared.
Well, didn't Governor Connally and some other witnesses say in so many words that they heard a shot (or a "backfire" or a "firecracker") ring out when the limo had just come out of the infamous Elm Street turn?
Or it could be hype to help sell his slide set.
Willis thought his fifth slide corresponded to Z226 and that it showed what his slide didn't: that Kennedy "had already grabbed his throat". He testified at the Shaw Trail: "I cocked my camera for another picture and this loud shot went off ... so I became alarmed". He then added: " I was trying to take a picture at the moment and the reflex from the shot caused me to take one of these pictures." It was the "reflex from the shot" (shot reverberations?) that caused him to take his fifth slide.
And the reason for thinking that this was a first shot that missed and then disintegrated into the asphalt would be . . . ?
Connally thought the first shot hit Kennedy.
And the reason for thinking that this was a first shot that missed and then disintegrated into the asphalt would be . . . ?
Mr. LIEBELER. So, you were standing directly in front of the Texas School Book Depository Building and on the same side of Elm Street that the Texas School Book Depository is located?
Mrs. BAKER. Yes.
Mr. LIEBELER. Tell me what you saw?
Mrs. BAKER. Well, after he passed us, then we heard a noise and I thought it was firecrackers, because I saw a shot or something hit the pavement.
---------------
Mr. LIEBELER. As you went down Elm Street that you saw this thing hit the street--what did it look like when you saw it?
Mrs. BAKER. Well, as I said, I thought it was a firecracker. It looked just like you could see the sparks from it and I just thought it was a firecracker and I was thinking that there was somebody was fixing to get in a lot of trouble and we thought the kids or whoever threw it were down below or standing near the underpass or back up here by the sign.
Another mistaken eyewitness?
JohnM
''.....kids or whoever threw it were down below or standing near the underpass or back up here by the sign. "
Throwing from the underpass? That is a long way from the Z160 location.
Standing by the sign? Funny that is where the firt shot, supported by all the eyewitness testimony, took place.
Second of all, since when do you base a conclusion on what a single witness said? Only when it’s something that incriminates Oswald.
What has non-directional sparks have specifically to do with Oswald?
(https://i2.wp.com/www.prayer-man.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/PBS.JFK_.Breaking.the_.News_.720p.HDTV_.x264.AAC_.MVGroup.org_.mp4_20151001_112742.692.jpg?w=949)
Virginia Baker (née Rackley) thought a bullet might have struck the pavement behind the limousine by the "first sign" and in the middle of the lane nearest the infield. It's unclear what sign she meant with reference to the pavement strike she thought she saw; I would go with the Thornton Fwy sign. I think she was referring to the Stemmon Sign in reference to the location of teenage boys who might have thrown out a firecracker (some goof-ball thing they do for fun in Texas to see guns drawn).
The only way I can see her testimony working is if the bullet actually hit the pavement behind the "Queen Mary". The gap between the "Queen Mary" and the LBJ convertible is pretty wide (relative to Baker) for some time. The gap allows her to see the lane near the infield.
Baker: "It looked just like you could see the sparks from it"
Doubtful a copper jacketed lead bullet can even cause a spark hitting the asphalt.
What kids are even in the area to throw a firecracker. Let alone throw it from he first choice, the underpass, which is at least 75 yards away.
The eyewitnesses state where the car was located when the first shot occurred and that JFK reacted to it. There is no mystery to it.
Not a valid vimeo URL
Can't understand how Virgie Baker could see to the lane beside the infield while looking between the limousine and "Queen Mary". Using a map, I estimate the two cars are too close together for Baker to see between them Z125-onward.
(http://www.jfkfiles.com/jfk/images/news/lostBullet/FIG39_122111.jpg)
Baker marked her position "1" and where the "bullet" struck "2". She could only see such a strike if both the Presidential limousine and "Queen Mary" were ahead of her line-of-sight. And maybe that's what she meant by "behind" the limousine, that she saw behind both cars.
John,
Please tell us again how far down Elm Street you believe the limo was when Oswald fired his first of three shots.
Do you believe the "sparks" that were noticed by Virgie Baker were caused by a firecracker, or maybe by a second shooter?
Do you think it implausible that Oswald took a "potshot" through the foliage of a Southern Oak tree?
-- MWT ;)
PS Regarding the bullet that exited (or entered?) JFK's throat, how much time do you think had elapsed between the firing of that shot and the capturing of JFK's agony in Altgens-6?
Enough time for Secret Service agent George Hickey to stand up and turn towards the TSBD?
"After a very short distance [after coming out of the Elm Street turn?] I heard a loud report which sounded like a firecracker. It appeared to come from the right and rear and seemed to me to be at ground level. I stood up and looked to my right and rear in an attempt to identify it. Nothing caught my attention except people shouting and cheering." (11/30/63)
Fwiw, I rather doubt that Hinkey was reacting to the "throat shot" that was captured by Altgens.
I think Hickey reacted to hearing the first shot, the shot that nicked a tree branch or two, hit the asphalt at a thirty-something degree angle, and was pulverized.
Jerry,
Is the aerial photo you posted from the Warren Commission Report, or from somone's book?
If the former, does it have a CE number or somesuch thing?
-- MWT ;)
Individual shooters make unique sparks?
Jerry, Jerry, Jerry.
Your question is nonsensical. For example, what does "individual" have to do with it? Do multiple shooters make "unique sparks"?
LOL
Regardless, to help you get your head around this, you should watch this video, especially the part that starts at 02:16.
Virgie Baker didn't exactly describe what she saw as "sparks," but, in so many words, as something like sparks.
Which is what this would look like to her in the low, late November sunlight from where she was standing, i.e., something kinda like sparks, especially to someone who was probably not expecting to see a high-velocity bullet impact the street.
https://www.pbs.org/video/nova-shot-missed/
-- MWT ;)
Jerry, Jerry, Jerry.
Your question is nonsensical. For example, what does "individual" have to do with it? Do multiple shooters make "unique sparks"?