JFK Assassination Forum
JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion & Debate => JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate => Topic started by: Don Echols on September 19, 2018, 11:31:59 PM
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One question,that no one have asked,to my knowledge. Did the bullet that hit Connelly,go through the jumpseat first,ot no?
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One question,that no one have asked,to my knowledge. Did the bullet that hit Connelly,go through the jumpseat first,ot no?
No.
The ?Single Bullet?, most likely at z222, passed through JFK?s neck, went over the back of Connally?s jumpseat, passed through Connally?s torso, passed through Connally?s wrist and stopped after barely penetrating his thigh near his knee.
This bullet did not strike any part of the limousine. Just the clothes and bodies of JFK and Connally.
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One question,that no one have asked,to my knowledge. Did the bullet that hit Connelly,go through the jumpseat first,ot no?
To get to Connally, the bullet had to go through Kennedy.
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/DSBXW1-VGmM/hqdefault.jpg)
JohnM
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I am aware of the Warren Commission findings.But they did as they were told,Gerald Ford he is the one that move the bullet up 6 inches to make the story work.Doctors ,in the room,have always stated different fact,from the commission.And yet the doctors,that worked on Kennedy was never called to testify.
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I am aware of the Warren Commission findings.But they did as they were told,Gerald Ford he is the one that move the bullet up 6 inches to make the story work.Doctors ,in the room,have always stated different fact,from the commission.And yet the doctors,that worked on Kennedy was never called to testify.
?The doctors that worked on Kennedy?, by which I assume you mean the Parkland doctors, never saw the wound on the back of Kennedy?s neck/back, because Kennedy was on his back while they were working on him.
Question:
How could the Parkland doctors have reported that the location of the back wound was six inches lower than what Gerald Ford said, if they never saw the back wound?
It strikes me that CTers are bad at connecting the dots. If presented with a ?fact?, they don?t test the ?fact? out. They don?t think about what that ?fact? would imply. They simply accept the ?fact? as true.
If the neck/back wound was actually six inches lower than what Gerald Ford said, that would mean:
Gerald Ford?s location: 2 inches above the neck wound
Don Echols?s location: 4 inches below the neck wound
Using trigonometry, that would mean:
Gerald Ford?s vertical angle = arctan(-2/6) = -18 degrees
Don Echol?s vetical angle = arctan(4/6) = +33 degrees
Gerald Ford?s vertical angle makes sense, because that corresponds to the angle from the sniper?s nest to the neck. Don Echol?s vertical angle makes no sense, because that corresponds to a shot coming up from underneath the street, through the limousine and into Kennedy?s back.
Question:
How do you explain how it could be possible for Gerald Ford to have ?moved the bullet up 6 inches??
a. The back wound was an entrance wound and the neck wound was the corresponding exit wound. This would mean the bullet was angling upward at 33 degrees. Too steep even to have come from the lower part of the engine compartment of the following up Secret Service Limousine. Was the bullet fired from beneath the street, causing it to go through the pavement, go through the floor of the limousine, go through the seat that the Kennedy?s were sitting on and into Kennedy?s back? Was it fired from the trunk compartment?
b. The neck wound was an entrance wound, the neck wound was the corresponding exit wound. If so, this goes against the coat and shirt evidence that the Secret Service agents left at the Dallas Parkland Hospital. Plus, what tall building to the front could this bullet be fired from? Why didn?t the bullet that exited the back go on to strike the seat Kennedy was sitting on?
c. There is no connection between the back wound and the neck wound. If so, where are the corresponding exit wounds to these two bullets? Why are rifle bullets being used that don?t go through a body? This would mean bullets that are less accurate, since they lack the speed necessary to go all the way across a body. And also, less deadly, since they stop after only a few inches? Why didn?t these bullets show up on X-Rays? And is it not an amazing coincidence that both bullets hit at roughly the same level, the neck level, and roughly in the center of the body. Using these bullets betray multiple shooters, unless the shooters are lucky enough that whenever there is a hit from the front, there is also a hit from the back at near the same place to make it look like it could be a hit from one direction.
d. You have never given the matter any thought.
I suspect that ?d? is the real honest answer.
Looking at what a ?fact? means is the way one can judge which ?facts? may be true and which must be false. I believe that without the ability to ignore the implications of ?facts? is what allows a CTer to remain a CTer.
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Listen to Dr. Robert McCellum accout,of the events.
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Listen to Dr. Robert McCellum accout,of the events.
You mean Dr. Robert McClelland? What does he say about the location of the back wound? Did he even see it? If so, how? The President was on his back the whole time.
And, you did not answer my questions. What is the connection between the back wound and the neck wound? How could the back wound be four inches below the neck wound? Caused by the same bullet? Different bullets?
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There is
no connection between the wounds,that the point,shooting downward,how does a bullet then travel upward to exit the throat,he noticed the shot to the throat,saying it was a entrance wound because it was round before the other doctors. widen the opening Also said there had been a shot to the president side forehead at the hairline. Huge question,why wasn't any doctors in the trauma room,ever called to testify?I have a new computer ,and honestly haven't figured it out,but there are photos Kennedy on his stomach,1 shot in his back.
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There is
no connection between the wounds,that the point,shooting downward,how does a bullet then travel upward to exit the throat,he noticed the shot to the throat,saying it was a entrance wound because it was round before the other doctors. widen the opening Also said there had been a shot to the president side forehead at the hairline. Huge question,why wasn't any doctors in the trauma room,ever called to testify?I have a new computer ,and honestly haven't figured it out,but there are photos Kennedy on his stomach,1 shot in his back.
Don don't believe the photos you see of the autopsy. They have been shown by the people who took them to be either wrong or the ones they took missing.
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First reports,are the true facts,everything changes in days after,remember Kennedy's press agent saying as well as pointing this own head,to where Kennedy was shot.
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https://kennedysandking.com/john-f-kennedy-reviews/bugliosi-vincent-reclaiming-history-thompson
Vincent Bugliosi, Reclaiming History
Written by Josiah Thompson
Epic book resurrects finding that Oswald acted alone in killing JFK
Bugliosi picks only the evidence that backs his argument
~snip~
"...the FBI's review of the Zapruder film led them to conclude Connally and Kennedy were hit separately. He tells us that Dr. Malcolm Perry at Parkland Hospital estimated the size of the supposed bullet exit hole in JFK's throat to be "3 mm to 5 mm in diameter," but he neglects to tell us that wound ballistics experts at Edgewood Arsenal carried out experiments showing bullets from Oswald's rifle would cause exit wounds two to three times that size."
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/z225.jpg)
"Even more egregious is his handling of the trajectory through JFK's back and neck. A face-sheet on which notes were taken during the autopsy shows the supposed exit wound in the throat to be higher than the entry wound in the back."
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/autopsydescriptivesheet.png)
"When the autopsy photos were finally produced in the 1970s, a medical panel concluded that the course of the bullet through Kennedy was at an upward angle (the accepted number is 11 degrees). So how does Kennedy get shot from the sixth floor of a building when the bullet takes an upward path through his body?"
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/hsca8.jpg)
"The Warren Commission took the simplest course. The staff let the autopsy doctor instruct a medical illustrator to raise the back wound from the back to the neck. Commission member U.S. Rep. Gerald Ford then corrected a final draft of the panel's report to read "neck wound" rather than "back wound." Voila, a "back wound" had become a "neck wound."
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/backclark.jpg)
"Faced with that 11 degree upward angle, the House Select Committee on Assassinations took a more inventive approach in its 1978-79 investigation. It just leaned Kennedy forward at the time he was shot."
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/hsca9_1.jpg)
"And Connally, who took a shot at a 27-degree downward angle? His body position was leaned back a sufficient amount. Voila, an 11-degree upward angle through one body had become a 27-degree downward angle through a second body, thus a straight line had been maintained."
(http://i959.photobucket.com/albums/ae75/garcra/hmat-wcvols-20_0001_0053.jpg)
~snip~
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There is
no connection between the wounds,that the point,shooting downward,how does a bullet then travel upward to exit the throat,he noticed the shot to the throat,saying it was a entrance wound because it was round before the other doctors. widen the opening Also said there had been a shot to the president side forehead at the hairline.
But the neck was shored up by the buttoned collar. This will cause the exit wounds to be smaller than they otherwise would be. The coat and the shirt show the bullet in the back was an entrance wound and the neck wound was an exit wound. Such evidence has to be considered decisive. You will not find a single ballistic expert in the world who thinks the neck wound was an entrance wound.
Also, the doctor?s at Parkland gave the briefest possible look at the neck wound. Because the President was barely breathing, they thought that possibly an obstruction in the upper throat was blocking the breathing and so they must immediately cut the wound open to be much bigger and stick in a breathing tube. Most doctors did not see the neck wound until after it have been greatly modified by one of the other doctors.
Basically, to reach your conclusion, one would have to assume:
1. The coat and shirt left in Dallas were faked. This is strange because a basic premise of the CT argument was that they had to take the body of President Kennedy out of Dallas, because they could not get a fraudulent study of the evidence in Texas. But they had no problem suppressing the evidence of the clothes left in Dallas which could have been studied by the Parkland doctors or even the Dallas coroner, proving a shot from the front.
2. The shooters used bullets that only enter the body, but don?t go all the way through the body. Just like a handgun bullet. Such bullets are inherently less accurate, due to the low speed required of a bullet to only enter a body but not to exit it. And the less lethal nature of these bullets. This is hard to believe.
3. That these shooters got lucky. They didn?t end up with 2 entrance wounds in the back, which would indicate that Oswald could not have used a Carcano rifle. They didn?t end up with 2 entrance wounds in the front, which would indicate that Oswald didn?t fire these shots at all. Instead, they ended up with a frontal wound and a back wound, both of which on opposite sides of the body making it easy to say they were caused by the same bullet. Unbelievable the shooters would try this and hope things work out.
Huge question,why wasn't any doctors in the trauma room,ever called to testify?
It is normal to get the testimony of the autopsy doctors who studied the body for 3 hours, for the purpose of finding out what happened. And not the emergency room doctors who were only with the body for 10 minutes who were only concentrating on saving a life.
I have a new computer ,and honestly haven't figured it out,but there are photos Kennedy on his stomach,1 shot in his back.
Yes. This picture was taken at the autopsy, not at Parkland. The Parkland doctors never saw the wound in the back.
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trauma doctors are trained to notice more in seconds,than you could in 10 minutes,and why did they all,give the same,recalled memories,it's been 54 years,neither you or i will solve this,speculation is just this type conversation.
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First reports,are the true facts,everything changes in days after,remember Kennedy's press agent saying as well as pointing this own head,to where Kennedy was shot.
Press secretaries don?t know the difference between entrance wounds, exit wounds or explosive wounds. And as far as I know, did not see the President after he was struck by bullets.
First reports are very unreliable, as can be seen in many famous events, from Pearl Harbor (Messerschmitts taking part in the attack), 911 and the Kennedy assassination.
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But the neck was shored up by the buttoned collar. This will cause the exit wounds to be smaller than they otherwise would be. The coat and the shirt show the bullet in the back was an entrance wound and the neck wound was an exit wound. Such evidence has to be considered decisive. You will not find a single ballistic expert in the world who thinks the neck wound was an entrance wound.
No matter how bold you make it, Joe. It is all supposition.
Also, the doctor?s at Parkland gave the briefest possible look at the neck wound. Because the President was barely breathing, they thought that possibly an obstruction in the upper throat was blocking the breathing and so they must immediately cut the wound open to be much bigger and stick in a breathing tube. Most doctors did not see the neck wound until after it have been greatly modified by one of the other doctors.
More supposition, Joe.
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He along with other Kennedy people were allowed to see his body,before it was taken to Airforce1.That is a absolute fact.