JFK Assassination Forum
JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => Topic started by: Royell Storing on March 08, 2024, 12:17:35 AM
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For 60+ yrs we have been told that the DPD Motorcycle Officer we see inside the train yard on the Darnell and Martin Films is Officer Haygood. I have discovered that the Haygood timeline proves his being identified as this man is simply Not physically possible. And at the same time, this also Proves a Conspiracy was used in the JFK Assassination.
During Haygood's WC Testimony, WC Attorney Belin introduced a police radio log which detailed Haygood making a 12:35 radio transmission. Haygood at that time Verified his having made that 12:35 radio transmission from his DPD Motorcycle which was sitting on the Elm St Curb. The Kill Shot being fired at 12:30 therefore gives Officer Haygood 5 minutes to physically be at his motorcycle to make his Documented/Verified 12:35 transmission. Let's examine the 60 year accepted 5 minute journey that Haygood allegedly took following the Kill Shot. Images show us Officer Haygood: (1) Knifing his motorcycle between moving Camera Cars at the corner of Houston/Elm as he heads down Elm St - *Darnell Film Footage*, (2) Moving down the (N) Elm St Curb as he approaches the Stemmons Sign - *Wiegman Film Footage*, (3) Struggling/Straightening his dumped motorcycle at the (N) Elm St curb, (W) of The Steps - *Couch Film Footage*, (4) Running Up and Across the Grassy Knoll toward the Triple Underpass - *Bell Film Footage*, (5) Standing ALONE at the railing atop the Triple Underpass - *Cabluck Photo*, (6) Standing Atop the Triple Underpass with a CROWD now gathered around him - *Cancellare Photo*, (7) WALKING across the entire train yard - *Darnell & Martin Film Footage*, 8. WALKING down the Elm St Ext toward the Texas School Book Depository - * Darnell & Martin Film Footage*. There is physically No Way that Officer Haygood could have done ALL of this in 5 minutes elapsed time and still be back at his DPD Motorcycle to make his Documented/Verified 12:35 radio transmission. By my estimation, it probably took Officer Haygood roughly 4 minutes alone to merely climb onto the top of the Triple Underpass. This REVELATION begs the questions: (1) Who is that DPD Motorcycle Cop WALKING across the train yard and then WALKING down the Elm St Ext toward the TSBD on the Darnell & Martin Films? (2) Where is this DPD Cop's motorcycle? (3) Is this really a legit DPD motorcycle Cop? To date, (other than Officer Haywood), there is No Known DPD Motorcycle Cop anywhere close to the train yard immediately after the 12:30 Kill Shot.
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For 60+ yrs we have been told that the DPD Motorcycle Officer we see inside the train yard on the Darnell and Martin Films is Officer Haygood. I have discovered that the Haygood timeline proves his being identified as this man is simply Not physically possible. And at the same time, this also Proves a Conspiracy was used in the JFK Assassination.
During Haygood's WC Testimony, WC Attorney Belin introduced a police radio log which detailed Haygood making a 12:35 radio transmission. Haygood at that time Verified his having made that 12:35 radio transmission from his DPD Motorcycle which was sitting on the Elm St Curb. The Kill Shot being fired at 12:30 therefore gives Officer Haygood 5 minutes to physically be at his motorcycle to make his Documented/Verified 12:35 transmission. Let's examine the 60 year accepted 5 minute journey that Haygood allegedly took following the Kill Shot. Images show us Officer Haygood: (1) Knifing his motorcycle between moving Camera Cars at the corner of Houston/Elm as he heads down Elm St - *Darnell Film Footage*, (2) Moving down the (N) Elm St Curb as he approaches the Stemmons Sign - *Wiegman Film Footage*, (3) Struggling/Straightening his dumped motorcycle at the (N) Elm St curb, (W) of The Steps - *Couch Film Footage*, (4) Running Up and Across the Grassy Knoll toward the Triple Underpass - *Bell Film Footage*, (5) Standing ALONE at the railing atop the Triple Underpass - *Cabluck Photo*, (6) Standing Atop the Triple Underpass with a CROWD now gathered around him - *Cancellare Photo*, (7) WALKING across the entire train yard - *Darnell & Martin Film Footage*, 8. WALKING down the Elm St Ext toward the Texas School Book Depository - * Darnell & Martin Film Footage*. There is physically No Way that Officer Haygood could have done ALL of this in 5 minutes elapsed time and still be back at his DPD Motorcycle to make his Documented/Verified 12:35 radio transmission. By my estimation, it probably took Officer Haygood roughly 4 minutes alone to merely climb onto the top of the Triple Underpass. This REVELATION begs the questions: (1) Who is that DPD Motorcycle Cop WALKING across the train yard and then WALKING down the Elm St Ext toward the TSBD on the Darnell & Martin Films? (2) Where is this DPD Cop's motorcycle? (3) Is this really a legit DPD motorcycle Cop? To date, (other than Officer Haywood), there is No Known DPD Motorcycle Cop anywhere close to the train yard immediately after the 12:30 Kill Shot.
By my estimation, it probably took Officer Haygood roughly 4 minutes alone to merely climb onto the top of the Triple Underpass.
What is this estimation based on?
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By my estimation, it probably took Officer Haygood roughly 4 minutes alone to merely climb onto the top of the Triple Underpass.
What is this estimation based on?
(1) The Darnell Film, + (2) The Wiegman Film, + (3) The Couch Film, + (4) The Cabluck Photo, + (5) The Cancellare Photo. These images time stamp Haygood from the point he drives his motorcycle onto Elm St, up to his climbing on top of the Triple Underpass. The Cabluck Photo shows Haygood at the Triple Underpass with NO BODY around him. The Cancellare Photo shows Haygood standing on Top of the Triple Underpass with a crowd of people Now standing around him. Tick, Tick, Tick for ALL these people to now reach the Triple Underpass. One of those people pictured in the Cancellare Photo was Robert MacNeil. He would later host the PBS MacNeil/ Leaher News Hour. That day, MacNeil was riding inside Press Bus #1. He got out of Press Bus #1 at the corner of Houston & Elm St and proceeded down Elm St until he eventually arrived at the Triple Underpass. His Press Bus #1 had just turned onto Houston St when Haygood was already traveling down Elm St on his motorcycle. Tick, Tick, Tick.
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(1) The Darnell Film, + (2) The Wiegman Film, + (3) The Couch Film, + (4) The Cabluck Photo, + (5) The Cancellare Photo. These images time stamp Haygood from the point he drives his motorcycle onto Elm St, up to his climbing on top of the Triple Underpass. The Cabluck Photo shows Haygood at the Triple Underpass with NO BODY around him. The Cancellare Photo shows Haygood standing on Top of the Triple Underpass with a crowd of people Now standing around him. Tick, Tick, Tick for ALL these people to now reach the Triple Underpass. One of those people pictured in the Cancellare Photo was Robert MacNeil. He would later host the PBS MacNeil/ Leaher News Hour. That day, MacNeil was riding inside Press Bus #1. He got out of Press Bus #1 at the corner of Houston & Elm St and proceeded down Elm St until he eventually arrived at the Triple Underpass. His Press Bus #1 had just turned onto Houston St when Haygood was already traveling down Elm St on his motorcycle. Tick, Tick, Tick.
My bad, Royell. I hadn't made myself clear enough.
When I asked how you came to the estimation of four minutes for Haygood to be at the Triple Underpass, I didn't mean what evidence did you use, I meant how did you use this evidence to come to an estimation of four minutes.
I'll give an example to show what I mean. The Bond pic below has Haygood circled and in the bottom left corner we can see the White House Press bus just about to enter the Underpass:
(https://i.postimg.cc/13V11NGq/Bond6-Crop1-Circle.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
The pic below is from the Mark Tyler Motorcade Mapping program. It shows us that the Bond pic above was taken 1:41 seconds after the headshot:
(https://i.postimg.cc/NMcxfZWc/Tyler-Bond6.png) (https://postimages.org/)
So, Haygood makes it to the Underpass in about one minute and forty seconds. What is more difficult to work out is how long he is there.
Below is a pic of a proposed route for Haygood. The star is where he parks his bike, he moves to the Underpass then into the railroad yard where he is pictured by Darnell. The last part of the route just shows the quickest path back to his bike.
(https://i.postimg.cc/3Jf54Z86/Haygood-Route.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)post a picture (https://postimages.org/)
Can this route be completed in a few minutes? Of course it could.
The question is, how long was Haygood at the Underpass before setting off.
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The 1:41 is WAY OFF. For starters, Haygood rode his motorcycle directly toward and passed Wiegman who was standing at the Elm St sidewalk/curb area. Wiegman at this point had already: (1) jumped out of Camera Car #1 because it was not moving, (2) run down Elm St, (3) moved onto the Knoll, (4) moved across the knoll, (4) Run UP the knoll (5) STOPPED and Filmed the Hesters laying on the ground, (6) run across the Top of the knoll, (6) Run Down the entire Knoll, (7) STOPPED and filmed the Newman family on the ground, 8. Film Camera Car #1 and Officer Haygood coming toward him and then pass by him. ALL of this alone ate up the bulk of Bond's alleged 1:41 time stamping. And, at this point, Haygood had NOT even dumped his bike at the curb. The best part of that Bond pic shows NOBODY around Haygood at that point in time vs the Cancellare Photo showing a crowd around him when he stood atop the Triple Underpass. Also, you take a good look at that Bond photo and those boys wearing the jackets with the White Stripes around the shoulders are NOT visible on the (N) side of the grassy knoll. Those same guys are clearly standing among the throng that surrounded Haygood as he stood atop the Triple Underpass on the Cancellare photo. And those 2 guys came from inside the Pergola Shelter that was behind the Hesters. Based on the documented movements of other assassination eyewitnesses, the 1:41 is WAY OFF. I have the Haygood issue Proven 5 Ways to Sunday. Even more to come when need be.
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Mark Tyler’s Motorcade 63 animation can be watched while following the various witness’ movements. It is fairly simple to make a note of the identification number (shown in the ever-changing list on the right side) of the witness you want to follow and watch it as it moves.The various witness’ movements and positions in the motorcade 63 animation that I have checked against the snapshots and films taken on 11.22.63 during the assassination and the immediate aftermath all appear to agree with what Mark Tyler shows in his animation. The motions are all fluid and at a reasonable pace.
Here is a screenshot of the animation at a split second after the headshot. Haygood (23) is just entering the intersection of Main and Houston. The time is shown (upper left corner) as less than a second after 12:30 (animation time).
(https://i.vgy.me/SbkxdQ.png)
From that point just run the animation and follow Haygood’s movements (or any of the other witnesses shown that you might be interested in) in real (animation) time. I think you will find that it didn’t take as much time as you are estimating (4-minutes) to get to the top of the underpass where he is photographed. The animation indicates it only took approximately 2-minutes. The following screenshot indicates that both Bond and Darnell captured his image at about the same time. Note the time as less than a second after 12:32.
(https://i.vgy.me/sQH1XP.png)
If you watch the animation (and note the various yellow fields of view of the various cameras as they flash in the animation) you can pause the animation if needed to identify the various photographers. Again, all the actual photographs and frames that I have checked agree 100% with Mark Tyler’s animation.
So, if after reviewing this you still think it took Haygood 4-minutes to get to the top of the underpass, please show us exactly where you think that Mark Tyler’s animation is in error.
Edit: To hopefully save some confusion, if you watch carefully when Haygood gets off of his motorcycle, his number changes to 38 and his motorcycle remains 23. This explains the different number of Haygood on the knoll.
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Charles - Thanks for posting that, but I was unable to put it into motion. Just curious, but what exactly is "Darnell 4"? I would have liked to see what the paths of Haygood, Darnell, Hargis, Wiegman, and Couch looked liked. Other than Darnell, ALL of these eyewitnesses have interlocking WC Testimony telling us where/when they went inside Dealey Plaza before, during, and after the Kill Shot. Being that a vehicle can Not talk, following any of their alleged "elapsed time" travel down Elm St is a faith based journey. Bearing in mind that Darnell filmed Officer Roger Craig back inside the train yard while simultaneously capturing the alleged DPD Motor Cycle Cop Haywood, I would also be interested in seeing the alleged "elapsed time" travel of Officer Roger Craig. Craig gave a very detailed description of his Dealey Plaza journey during his Clay Shaw testimony. There Is no way based on the Craig Testimony in conjunction with the Darnell Film that we are seeing Officer Haygood in that footage. Haygood's Documented 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle at the Elm St curb absolutes nixes that alleged DPD Cop inside the train yard being Haygood. The mountain of image evidence + sworn testimonies is overwhelming.
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For some inexplicable reason this forum refuses to let me post a link to a Vimeo video of the Motorcade 63 animation. It says it isn’t a valid Vimeo url!!!???
Not a valid vimeo URL
I suggest that you do a search on google for Motorcade 63. A Vimeo link should be in the results. Follow it and view it if you wish. In the meantime maybe Duncan can explain what the problem is? I will report this post to let Duncan know of the issue.
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(https://i.vimeocdn.com/video/1470710237-6e33046ba065160974d324387489d936f91cbe5d325cd99330f75d5ca7c90ef6-d?mw=1100&mh=619&q=70) (https://vimeo.com/363370647)
( Click on above image to go to Vimeo site ) ( Web Page with same Vimeo clip: https://www.marktyler.org/mc63.html )
Critics are making these huge reckless claims without being aware of the Tyler Animation or showing they mapped things out. Unbelievable.
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Vimeo appears to have changed its format for sharing Video on other Websites. I'll look into it further.
In the meantime, I can embed them using my Admin HTML facility, which for site security purposes is unavailable for members.
Here are the two Videos from Mark Tyler's Website.
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Thanks Jerry and Duncan. Yes, Jerry, Mark Tyler’s animation is a very useful and interesting resource. Royell, I am not sure what Mark Tyler means by “Darnell 4” unless it happens to be his fourth segment or something like that.
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(https://i.vimeocdn.com/video/1470710237-6e33046ba065160974d324387489d936f91cbe5d325cd99330f75d5ca7c90ef6-d?mw=1100&mh=619&q=70) (https://vimeo.com/363370647)
( Click on above image to go to Vimeo site ) ( Web Page with same Vimeo clip: https://www.marktyler.org/mc63.html )
Critics are making these huge reckless claims without being aware of the Tyler Animation or showing they mapped things out. Unbelievable.
There is absolutely nothing "reckless" regarding this find. It is backed up by both film and photo images in conjunction with the actual sworn testimonies of the individuals involved in this sequence of the JFK Assassination. There is No "animation" here, No conjecture, nothing conjured up with an artists sketch pen. My research has Proven this from many different directions. Let's start with The Man himself/Haygood. We allegedly see him heading Straight Down the Elm St Ext toward the TSBD on the Darnell/Martin Films. He is Not veering off toward Elm St where his motorcycle is parked at the curb near the Triple Underpass. He is heading Straight Down the Elm St Ext. This alleged DPD Motorcycle Cop is close enough to the TSBD Loading Dock to hit it with a rock. Yet, in his detailed WC Testimony, Officer Haygood makes absolutely NO MENTION of his inspection of the rail road yard leading him to WALK down the Elm St Ext, the TSBD Loading Dock, or the TSBD itself. In FACT, after making his Documented 12:35 and 12:37 radio transmissions from his motorcycle parked at the Elm St Curb, Haygood testified that he THEN went to the rear loading dock of the TSBD. WHY, if Officer Haygood had just walked past/inspected that same TSBD Rear Loading Dock would he now double back to it? Why would Haygood NOT testify as to having walked passed that same TSBD loading dock earlier, yet NOW go out of his way to Testify that he went there after making his 12:35 and 12:37 radio transmissions? I'll tell you why. Because Haygood NEVER previously WALKED down the Elm St Ext, Never previously WALKED passed the TSBD Loading Dock, and Never previously WALKED passed the TSBD itself before making his 12:35 and 12:37 radio transmissions. The Facts contained in Haygood's WC Testimony are just that. FACTS! Please examine the FACTS of this claim before immediately knee jerking into smear mode. And the FACTS above are merely the tip of this conspiracy iceberg that has been hiding in plain sight for 60+ years. - TO BE CONTINUED -
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The 1:41 is WAY OFF. For starters, Haygood rode his motorcycle directly toward and passed Wiegman who was standing at the Elm St sidewalk/curb area. Wiegman at this point had already: (1) jumped out of Camera Car #1 because it was not moving, (2) run down Elm St, (3) moved onto the Knoll, (4) moved across the knoll, (4) Run UP the knoll (5) STOPPED and Filmed the Hesters laying on the ground, (6) run across the Top of the knoll, (6) Run Down the entire Knoll, (7) STOPPED and filmed the Newman family on the ground, 8. Film Camera Car #1 and Officer Haygood coming toward him and then pass by him. ALL of this alone ate up the bulk of Bond's alleged 1:41 time stamping. And, at this point, Haygood had NOT even dumped his bike at the curb. The best part of that Bond pic shows NOBODY around Haygood at that point in time vs the Cancellare Photo showing a crowd around him when he stood atop the Triple Underpass. Also, you take a good look at that Bond photo and those boys wearing the jackets with the White Stripes around the shoulders are NOT visible on the (N) side of the grassy knoll. Those same guys are clearly standing among the throng that surrounded Haygood as he stood atop the Triple Underpass on the Cancellare photo. And those 2 guys came from inside the Pergola Shelter that was behind the Hesters. Based on the documented movements of other assassination eyewitnesses, the 1:41 is WAY OFF. I have the Haygood issue Proven 5 Ways to Sunday. Even more to come when need be.
It goes without saying that you're wrong.
Mark Tyler has taken every piece of footage from Dealey Plaza, every known photograph and every known eye-witness testimony and presented this vast amount of evidence in this animation. It is a truly monumental achievement, possibly the most impressive thing done by any researcher in this field of research. It might not be perfect in the smallest details but for the level of establishing when Haygood got to the fence it is easily capable of that. Haygood was already at the Triple Underpass 1:40 after the headshot.
You, on the other hand, have just made up a figure of four minutes. Just plucked it out of thin air based on nothing.
You think if you keep on insisting that you are right will somehow actually make you right.
You've not presented any kind of evidence to support your claim, just a lot of guessing and conjecture that you make up as you go along.
You have been proven wrong "five ways to Sunday".
Just because you don't want to accept it doesn't mean anything.
I notice in your last post you've started presenting Haygood walking down the Elm Street extension and passing the rear loading dock as a "Fact".
Again, this is something you've just made up. There is no evidence to support this "fact". You just make things up and believe they are true and nobody can convince you you're wrong.
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It goes without saying that you're wrong.
Mark Tyler has taken every piece of footage from Dealey Plaza, every known photograph and every known eye-witness testimony and presented this vast amount of evidence in this animation. It is a truly monumental achievement, possibly the most impressive thing done by any researcher in this field of research. It might not be perfect in the smallest details but for the level of establishing when Haygood got to the fence it is easily capable of that. Haygood was already at the Triple Underpass 1:40 after the headshot.
You, on the other hand, have just made up a figure of four minutes. Just plucked it out of thin air based on nothing.
You think if you keep on insisting that you are right will somehow actually make you right.
You've not presented any kind of evidence to support your claim, just a lot of guessing and conjecture that you make up as you go along.
You have been proven wrong "five ways to Sunday".
Just because you don't want to accept it doesn't mean anything.
I notice in your last post you've started presenting Haygood walking down the Elm Street extension and passing the rear loading dock as a "Fact".
Again, this is something you've just made up. There is no evidence to support this "fact". You just make things up and believe they are true and nobody can convince you you're wrong.
Just a suggestion, but I get the feeling that your copy of the Darnell and Martin films is not too good. Clearly, as this alleged cop walks down the Elm St Ext, behind him you can see the rail road tracks of the Railroad Spur that ran from behind the TSBD and stretched across the Elm St Ext. The TSBD Loading Dock is also visible on a good Darnell/Martin copy. Also, refresh your memory regarding Haygood's WC Testimony. I appreciate your adversarial approach, but I do Not want to take advantage of your currently inferior research tools.
Kindly remember that the visual aid you want to hang your hat on is dedicated to the movement of vehicles. It does Not factually detail the on-the-ground movement of Eyewitnesses inside Dealey Plaza. Specific Eyewitnesses such as: (1) Officer Haygood, (2) Darnell/Martin, (3) Robert MacNeil, (4) Hargis, (5) Wiegman, and (6) Roger Craig are critical. ALL of these eyewitnesses movements are important as they time stamp each other as they move ON FOOT across Dealey Plaza and some of them to the Top of the Triple Underpass.
Specifically, regarding DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood, there is absolutely NO EVIDENCE anywhere that we are seeing Officer Haygood on the Darnell/Martin footage as this alleged DPD Motorcycle Officer walks DOWN the Elm St Ext. The WC Testimony of Haygood himself makes No Mention of his being anywhere near the Elm St Ext during the short 5:00 minute time period immediately following the Kill Shot.
On the Cancellare Photo which shows DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood standing atop the Triple Underpass with a crowd of people around him, we see Haygood wearing BOTH RIDING GLOVES. The train yard images on the Darnell/Martin Films show a DPD Motorcycle Cop wearing ONLY 1 GLOVE. There is NO GLOVE on this alleged DPD Cop's (R) hand. This same NO Glove Cop is then seen WALKING down the Elm St Ext. What could possibly make Haygood REMOVE his (R) Riding Glove during his movement between the Top of the Triple Underpass and his first appearing on the Darnell film footage at that train caboose? We Now have 2 FACTS you need to address: (1) 5:00 Haygood time limit, and (2) Officer Haygood clearly wearing 2 GLOVES vs An alleged DPD Cop WALKING across the train yard and WALKING down the Elm St Ext wearing ONLY 1 GLOVE. My Evidence will only continue to mount. That is Not Haygood WALKING across the train yard and THEN WALKING down the Elm St Ext. - TO BE CONTINUED -
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Just a suggestion, but I get the feeling that your copy of the Darnell and Martin films is not too good. Clearly, as this alleged cop walks down the Elm St Ext, behind him you can see the rail road tracks of the Railroad Spur that ran from behind the TSBD and stretched across the Elm St Ext. The TSBD Loading Dock is also visible on a good Darnell/Martin copy. Also, refresh your memory regarding Haygood's WC Testimony. I appreciate your adversarial approach, but I do Not want to take advantage of your currently inferior research tools.
Kindly remember that the visual aid you want to hang your hat on is dedicated to the movement of vehicles. It does Not factually detail the on-the-ground movement of Eyewitnesses inside Dealey Plaza. Specific Eyewitnesses such as: (1) Officer Haygood, (2) Darnell/Martin, (3) Robert MacNeil, (4) Hargis, (5) Wiegman, and (6) Roger Craig are critical. ALL of these eyewitnesses movements are important as they time stamp each other as they move ON FOOT across Dealey Plaza and some of them to the Top of the Triple Underpass.
Specifically, regarding DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood, there is absolutely NO EVIDENCE anywhere that we are seeing Officer Haygood on the Darnell/Martin footage as this alleged DPD Motorcycle Officer walks DOWN the Elm St Ext. The WC Testimony of Haygood himself makes No Mention of his being anywhere near the Elm St Ext during the short 5:00 minute time period immediately following the Kill Shot.
On the Cancellare Photo which shows DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood standing atop the Triple Underpass with a crowd of people around him, we see Haygood wearing BOTH RIDING GLOVES. The train yard images on the Darnell/Martin Films show a DPD Motorcycle Cop wearing ONLY 1 GLOVE. There is NO GLOVE on this alleged DPD Cop's (R) hand. This same NO Glove Cop is then seen WALKING down the Elm St Ext. What could possibly make Haygood REMOVE his (R) Riding Glove during his movement between the Top of the Triple Underpass and his first appearing on the Darnell film footage at that train caboose? We Now have 2 FACTS you need to address: (1) 5:00 Haygood time limit, and (2) Officer Haygood clearly wearing 2 GLOVES vs An alleged DPD Cop WALKING across the train yard and WALKING down the Elm St Ext wearing ONLY 1 GLOVE. My Evidence will only continue to mount. That is Not Haygood WALKING across the train yard and THEN WALKING down the Elm St Ext. - TO BE CONTINUED -
I get the feeling that your copy of the Darnell and Martin films is not too good.
I have excellent copies of all assassination footage. And in none of them does Haygood walk past the loading dock. He walks towards it but we never see him pass it.
Maybe you have a special version of Darnell.
Or maybe you're just making it up, like you made up all your timings.
Kindly remember that the visual aid you want to hang your hat on is dedicated to the movement of vehicles.
You know literally nothing about the Tyler Mapping program so excuse me if I don't listen to your opinion about it.
It's like you just made it up.
Just like you made up all your timings.
there is absolutely NO EVIDENCE anywhere that we are seeing Officer Haygood on the Darnell/Martin footage
Apart from his testimony that he was in the same general area around the same general time.
Officer Haygood clearly wearing 2 GLOVES vs An alleged DPD Cop WALKING across the train yard and WALKING down the Elm St Ext wearing ONLY 1 GLOVE.
:D
Gloves come off.
They're designed that way.
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Everything you have said is just that. Nothing but verbiage. No real evidence. But, I expected that. There is absolutely Nothing per Image or in the WC Testimony of Haygood, (Real Evidence), placing Haygood on the Elm St Ext LESS than 5 minutes after the Kill Shot. Absolutely Nothing. You definitely need to familiarize your self with: (1) Haygood's WC Testimony and (2) Officer Roger Craig's Clay Shaw Testimony. The Cancellare photo explains Haygood's WC testimony regarding running into a "railroad detective". Roger Craig's Clay Shaw testimony details his very time consuming Dealey Plaza journey prior to our seeing him inside the train yard, (with the alleged Officer Haygood), on the Darnell Film. Roger Craig's lengthy journey prior to being filmed by Darnell at the train caboose totally DQ's the DPD Cop behind him being Officer Haygood. Like I said, I have a mountain of evidence ruling out DPD Officer Haygood as being that 1 GLOVE DPD Motorcycle Cop on the Darnell/Martin Films. To date and for the last 60+ years, NOBODY has submitted any Real Evidence that we are seeing Officer Haygood on the Darnell/Martin Films. The Haygood ID has always been an assumption that the JFK Assassination Research Community has simply rubber stamped as being a fact. Sorry Not Sorry to burst you guy's bubble. Call me Mr Duff, but a guy getting off his can and actually RESEARCHING this erroneous Haygood ID was bound to happen. Problem is, the erroneously rubber stamped Haygood ID has permitted a Conspiracy to stand for 60 yrs running. And my Discovery happens to come at the same time as the Knott Labs Laser 360 SCIENCE proclaimed the SBT "IS IMPOSSIBLE". The Conspiracy employed to assassinate JFK continues being exposed right before our very eyes. My Haygood challenge stands unmet as expected. And, I have even more evidence Proving this is NOT DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood on the Darnell/Martin Films. - TO BE CONTINUED -
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Bobby Hargis’ testimony indicates that he was in that area about the time that the TSBD was finally sealed. From his testimony to the WC:
… so, I came back to the Texas School Book Depository. At that time it seemed like the activity was centered around the Texas School Book Depository, so, that is when I heard someone say, one of the sergeants or lieutenants, I don't know, "Don't let any- one out of the Texas School Book Depository," and so, I went to a gap that had not been filled, which was at the southwest corner. Mr. STERN. And you remained there until you were relieved? Mr. HARGIS. Yes.
I have drawn a yellow circle around the area that is the southwest corner of the TSBD. Isn’t this the area where the motorcycle cop in question was filmed?
(https://i.vgy.me/8IXkAj.jpg)
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Mark Tyler’s animation Motorcade 63 indicates that Hargis had already ran to the top of the triple underpass to look and ran back to his motorcycle and was headed toward the underpass on his motorcycle within a minute of the headshot. I have circled Hargis (#3) in this screenshot of the animation:
(https://i.vgy.me/uglfkt.jpg)
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Bobby Hargis’ testimony indicates that he was in that area about the time that the TSBD was finally sealed. From his testimony to the WC:
… so, I came back to the Texas School Book Depository. At that time it seemed like the activity was centered around the Texas School Book Depository, so, that is when I heard someone say, one of the sergeants or lieutenants, I don't know, "Don't let any- one out of the Texas School Book Depository," and so, I went to a gap that had not been filled, which was at the southwest corner. Mr. STERN. And you remained there until you were relieved? Mr. HARGIS. Yes.
I have drawn a yellow circle around the area that is the southwest corner of the TSBD. Isn’t this the area where the motorcycle cop in question was filmed?
(https://i.vgy.me/8IXkAj.jpg)
Yes, that yellow circle is the area/Elm St Ext. To provide further context to the Hargis journey, after returning to his motorcycle sitting near the Elm St (S) curb, Hargis then rode his motorcycle (W) on Elm St and explored a wide area on the (W) side/other side of the Triple Underpass. It would be After doing all of this that Hargis returned to Dealey Plaza and that general area you have circled.
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Bobby Hargis’ testimony indicates that he was in that area about the time that the TSBD was finally sealed. From his testimony to the WC:
… so, I came back to the Texas School Book Depository. At that time it seemed like the activity was centered around the Texas School Book Depository, so, that is when I heard someone say, one of the sergeants or lieutenants, I don't know, "Don't let any- one out of the Texas School Book Depository," and so, I went to a gap that had not been filled, which was at the southwest corner. Mr. STERN. And you remained there until you were relieved? Mr. HARGIS. Yes.
I have drawn a yellow circle around the area that is the southwest corner of the TSBD. Isn’t this the area where the motorcycle cop in question was filmed?
(https://i.vgy.me/8IXkAj.jpg)
In the Darnell film, the motorcycle officer and Harkness are in the railyard west of the TSBD, roughly around the leftmost corner of the red pentagon. The Elm street extension (What a couple of longtime Big D OGs have told me is called "Old Elm," since the "extension" is actually the westernmost end of the original Elm street) only extends to the end of the TSBD lot. Anything to the west is part of the Union Terminal railyard.
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Thanks Mitch and Royell. It seems to me that the area around the west most corner of the red pentagon (outline) is reasonably close to where Hargis testified he positioned himself. Hargis said someone of rank (he didn’t remember who) wanted the TSBD sealed. And in the time between when the shots occurred and when the TSBD was sealed, there was a lot of police activity in the area of the railroad yard/parking lot. It appears to me that Hargis could have gone back to the vicinity TSBD and seen all the activity behind it and went towards that area of activity. I think that it could have been there (in the area that was filmed by Darnell) that he heard the request to seal off the TSBD. Whether or not anyone agrees that this is a possibility, to me it appears much more likely than the “mystery cop” that “equals conspiracy.”
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Thanks Mitch and Royell. It seems to me that the area around the west most corner of the red pentagon (outline) is reasonably close to where Hargis testified he positioned himself. Hargis said someone of rank (he didn’t remember who) wanted the TSBD sealed. And in the time between when the shots occurred and when the TSBD was sealed, there was a lot of police activity in the area of the railroad yard/parking lot. It appears to me that Hargis could have gone back to the vicinity TSBD and seen all the activity behind it and went towards that area of activity. I think that it could have been there (in the area that was filmed by Darnell) that he heard the request to seal off the TSBD. Whether or not anyone agrees that this is a possibility, to me it appears much more likely than the “mystery cop” that “equals conspiracy.”
As I said previously, after returning to his motorcycle there at the (S) Elm Curb area, Hargis rode off the the other side of the Triple Underpass and cruised around there looking for possible shooter(s). In my opinion, the time line of Hargis returning to Dealey Plaza would Not have permitted him to be filmed with Officer Roger Craig at the Train Caboose. I am almost certain that this is the same cop being filmed at the Caboose and walking down the Elm St. Ext due to: (1) his NOT WEARING a Glove on his (R) hand, and (2) his being continuously filmed Walking across the train yard from the Caboose to the Elm St Ext. If we are seeing Officer Hargis, exactly where is his motorcycle?
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Mark Tyler’s animation Motorcade 63 indicates that Hargis had already ran to the top of the triple underpass to look and ran back to his motorcycle and was headed toward the underpass on his motorcycle within a minute of the headshot. I have circled Hargis (#3) in this screenshot of the animation:
(https://i.vgy.me/uglfkt.jpg)
According to the Hargis WC Testimony, he ran to the the light post and then ran to, "....kind of a little wall, brick wall". Hargis makes no mention of ever running "to the top of the triple underpass". Hargis being at that low level wall, (that also becomes the Black Dog Man Nook), could have been easily verified by either Zapruder or Sitzman. Even if it took Officer Hargis 30-45 seconds to cross Elm St and reach that "little wall", Sitzman and Zapruder would have just finished climbing down from the Zapruder Perch. Hargis would have been very physically close to both of them. But of course, once again the JFK Assassination Research Community FAILED to ask this question of either Sitzman or Zapruder. A lot of the uncertainty surrounding the principle players in this assassination case should have been answered long ago.
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According to the Hargis WC Testimony, he ran to the the light post and then ran to, "....kind of a little wall, brick wall". Hargis makes no mention of ever running "to the top of the triple underpass". Hargis being at that low level wall, (that also becomes the Black Dog Man Nook), could have been easily verified by either Zapruder or Sitzman. Even if it took Officer Hargis 30-45 seconds to cross Elm St and reach that "little wall", Sitzman and Zapruder would have just finished climbing down from the Zapruder Perch. Hargis would have been very physically close to both of them. But of course, once again the JFK Assassination Research Community FAILED to ask this question of either Sitzman or Zapruder. A lot of the uncertainty surrounding the principle players in this assassination case should have been answered long ago.
The Bell film shows that Zapruder and Sitzman were off the wall and walking away within six seconds of the limo entering the underpass. Add on the 9 seconds it takes for the limo to reach the underpass after the headshot and you have Zap and Sitz away within 15 seconds.
Your ability to calculate how long it takes events to happen really leaves a lot to be desired.
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The Bell film shows that Zapruder and Sitzman were off the wall and walking away within six seconds of the limo entering the underpass. Add on the 9 seconds it takes for the limo to reach the underpass after the headshot and you have Zap and Sitz away within 15 seconds.
Your ability to calculate how long it takes events to happen really leaves a lot to be desired.
The ID of the 1 Glove DPD Motorcycle Cop filmed by Darnell/Martin is far too serious to now veer off topic. That alleged DPD Motorcycle Cop is Not Haygood. Haygood's Documented 5:00 timeline after the Kill Shot completely rules him out.
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In the Darnell film, the motorcycle officer and Harkness are in the railyard west of the TSBD, roughly around the leftmost corner of the red pentagon. The Elm street extension (What a couple of longtime Big D OGs have told me is called "Old Elm," since the "extension" is actually the westernmost end of the original Elm street) only extends to the end of the TSBD lot. Anything to the west is part of the Union Terminal railyard.
You look at good copies of the Darnell/Martin Films and BEHIND that 1 Glove DPD Cop, you can clearly see that railroad spur that ran behind the TSBD and stretched across the Elm St Ext. This landmark establishes that this alleged DPD Cop is firmly on the Elm Ext and WALKING toward the TSBD Loading Dock. You even get a brief look at a portion of that same loading dock.
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You look at good copies of the Darnell/Martin Films and BEHIND that 1 Glove DPD Cop, you can clearly see that railroad spur that ran behind the TSBD and stretched across the Elm St Ext. This landmark establishes that this alleged DPD Cop is firmly on the Elm Ext and WALKING toward the TSBD Loading Dock. You even get a brief look at a portion of that same loading dock.
Again, Old Elm ends at the Pergola. Anything beyond that to the west is (well, was at the time) private property, and not a public roadway. The rail yard begins where the bricks end.
Think of it this way, and you've kind of answered this yourself: you noted that there is an RR spur running across the way. If there's a spur line there, you're in a rail yard.
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Bobby Hargis’ testimony indicates that he was in that area about the time that the TSBD was finally sealed. From his testimony to the WC:
… so, I came back to the Texas School Book Depository. At that time it seemed like the activity was centered around the Texas School Book Depository, so, that is when I heard someone say, one of the sergeants or lieutenants, I don't know, "Don't let any- one out of the Texas School Book Depository," and so, I went to a gap that had not been filled, which was at the southwest corner. Mr. STERN. And you remained there until you were relieved? Mr. HARGIS. Yes.
I have drawn a yellow circle around the area that is the southwest corner of the TSBD. Isn’t this the area where the motorcycle cop in question was filmed?
(https://i.vgy.me/8IXkAj.jpg)
As I pointed out earlier, that Railroad Spur is BEHIND the 1 Glove DPD Cop as he WALKS toward the TSBD Loading Dock. There is no way this alleged DPD Cop is Officer Haygood. He simply does Not have enough time to reach the Haygood motorcycle at the Elm St Curb and make that Documented 12:35 transmission. Either: (1) This is an unknown DPD Motorcycle Cop, or (2) This is an imposture.
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After taking a closer look at the photographical record, with the aid of Mark Tyler’s Motorcade 63 animation, I have a better conception of Hargis’ actions in the first 60-seconds after the headshot. One interesting comment by Milton Wright (the driver of the car in which Mayor Cabell and party were riding) is worth noting:
He stopped the car because an officer had jumped off his motorcycle right in front of Wright's vehicle. The officer had his gun out and was aiming it toward the Texas Depository Building.
https://www.fbherald.com/news/as-a-young-dps-trooper-sheriff-milton-wright-was-in-jfks-motorcade/article_cc81964f-38b5-5a2b-b7e5-10aa30473b9f.html (https://www.fbherald.com/news/as-a-young-dps-trooper-sheriff-milton-wright-was-in-jfks-motorcade/article_cc81964f-38b5-5a2b-b7e5-10aa30473b9f.html)
Looking at the Motorcade 63 animation, it appears that there were actually three motorcycle officers in the road directly in front of Milton Wright. Hargis (37) had apparently already (within 10-seconds) dismounted his motorcycle and was in the middle of the road with his pistol drawn and pointing toward the TSBD.
(https://i.vgy.me/Xvkc4I.png)
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As I pointed out earlier, that Railroad Spur is BEHIND the 1 Glove DPD Cop as he WALKS toward the TSBD Loading Dock. There is no way this alleged DPD Cop is Officer Haywood. He simply does Not have enough time to reach the Haygood motorcycle at the Elm St Curb and make that Documented 12:35 transmission. Either: (1) This is an unknown DPD Motorcycle Cop, or (2) This is an imposture.
Who said that Haygood used the radio on his own motorcycle? By 12:35, both Harkness and King had their three-wheelers on top of the rail yard. One of them is seen riding around in the rail yard in the Hughes film. He could have just borrowed their radios
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The ID of the 1 Glove DPD Motorcycle Cop filmed by Darnell/Martin is far too serious to now veer off topic. That alleged DPD Motorcycle Cop is Not Haygood. Haygood's Documented 5:00 timeline after the Kill Shot completely rules him out.
I'm not veering off anything. I'm just highlighting that you completely make up all your timings out of thin air.
And that they are usually way off.
The four minutes you assign for Haygood to get to the underpass fence is a joke, completely made up by you.
You are shown real evidence demonstrating the time is actually half that and you just brush it off because it doesn't agree with your completely made up timings.
How can anything be proven to you if you don't accept actual evidence.
It's fair enough that some timings must be estimated, I have no problem with that, but these estimations must emanate from the evidence.
Saying "well, I think it's this" isn't good enough.
I've looked at the Darnell footage a lot more closely and realised the route I did for Haygood needs updating.
In the pic below:
1] Where Haygood leaves his bike
2] Haygood at the underpass fence
3] Haygood seen behind Roger Craig
4] Haygood seen walking towards the TSBD
From 4 back to 1 just shows Haygood's quickest route back to his bike after we see him in the Darnell film walking towards the TSBD building.
As Mitch has pointed out a couple of times, Haygood is not walking along the Elm Street extension, he is in the railroad yard. The extension ends at the yellow line on the pic below:
(https://i.postimg.cc/ZnnG5nkX/Haygood-Route2.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Haygood is at point 2 within one minute and forty seconds.
This gives him 3 to 4 minutes to walk the route outlined.
This is really easily done.
No need for impostors or any of that nonsense.
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Who said that Haygood used the radio on his own motorcycle? By 12:35, both Harkness and King had their three-wheelers on top of the rail yard. One of them is seen riding around in the rail yard in the Hughes film. He could have just borrowed their radios
During Haygood's WC Testimony, WC attorney Belin proffers a "police radio log" of Haygood having made a 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. Haygood under oath, then Verified that he did make that 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. This important Fact has been overlooked for 60+ years. I have been crossing the T's etc since discovering this Fact a couple months back. The Cabluck and Cancellare Photos of Haygood at the top of the Triple Underpass and the Darnell/Martin footage of a 1 Glove DPD Motorcycle Cop WALKING across the train yard and then WALKING down the Elm St Ext are simply NOT the same person. 5 Minutes is Not enough time for 1 person to follow the accepted 60+ yr old Haygood timeline and be back at that motorcycle to make the Documented 12:35 radio transmission. Plus, I still have other Evidence that Proves that 1 Glove DPD Cop is Not Haygood.
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Royell, I haven’t seen the footage that shows one glove missing from
Michael Jackson the officer in question. If you lack the ability to post an image, can you at least share which hand (right or left) has the missing glove?
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Royell, I haven’t seen the footage that shows one glove missing from Michael Jackson the officer in question. If you lack the ability to post an image, can you at least share which hand (right or left) has the missing glove?
CHARLES - (R) Hand. There's a lot of very fuzzy Darnell/Martin footage floating around. On a decent copy, there's No question. The (R) hand has No Glove while this alleged DPD Cop is WALKING across the train yard and then when he WALKS down the Elm St Ext toward the TSBD Loading dock/TSBD. Go to You Tube: "Raw Footage #69: All WBAP Footage (including Never Before Seen Darnell AND OWENS SCENES)" 26:33-26:50. The Cancellare Photo that shows DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood standing atop the Triple Underpass clearly shows him wearing Gloves on both (R) & (L) Hands. No question about it.
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Royell, I haven’t seen the footage that shows one glove missing from Michael Jackson the officer in question. If you lack the ability to post an image, can you at least share which hand (right or left) has the missing glove?
I haven’t seen the footage that shows one glove missing from Michael Jackson
:D :D
(https://i.postimg.cc/8kX5gvDT/Haygood-Walking.png) (https://postimages.org/)
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I haven’t seen the footage that shows one glove missing from Michael Jackson
:D :D
(https://i.postimg.cc/8kX5gvDT/Haygood-Walking.png) (https://postimages.org/)
Thanks Dan and Royell. This image appears to me to show that the cop’s holster is on his right thigh. Also, something is in his left hand (perhaps his glove?). I would assume that he removed his right glove with his left hand to be able to draw and handle his weapon better, if necessary. I suspect that this is standard operating procedure when a cop is walking towards a building with potentially an armed assassin inside. Just my opinion.
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Thanks Dan and Royell. This image appears to me to show that the cop’s holster is on his right thigh. Also, something is in his left hand (perhaps his glove?). I would assume that he removed his right glove with his left hand to be able to draw and handle his weapon better, if necessary. I suspect that this is standard operating procedure when a cop is walking towards a building with potentially an armed assassin inside. Just my opinion.
That alleged DPD Cop has his (R) glove Off well before the still frame you posted above. We also see this DPD Cop Not wearing a glove in the Darnell Train Yard/Caboose film segment as he WALKS behind Officer Roger Craig who is wearing a coat and tie. This rules out the, "..standard operating procedure when a cop is walking towards a building with potentially an armed assassin inside". With the Cancellare Photo showing Officer Haygood wearing Both Gloves while standing atop the Triple Underpass, this means from the Triple Underpass to the Train Caboose that for whatever reason Haygood decided to take his (R) glove off. He then kept that glove off as he WALKED across the entire train yard and then WALKED down the Elm St Ext toward the TSBD Loading Dock. The Haygood timeline issue alone DQ's the One Glove Cop from being Haygood. Now, we have a wardrobe irregularity between Officer Haygood and this guy. And, I have even more evidence that the One Glove Cop is NOT Haygood. - To Be Continued _
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Here’s a snip from Harkness’ testimony:
Mr. BELIN - Now you mentioned that you put something on the radio here, and I hand you here what has been marked as Sawyer Deposition Exhibit A. Before doing that, do you remember what call number you used, you were using on that day?
Mr. HARKNESS - I believe 260.
Mr. BELIN - Well, I notice here that there is a call with a notation at 12:36 p.m., 260 to 531. 531 is your office in the main station?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What does it say there on that transcript?
Mr. HARKNESS - "Witness says shots came from fifth floor, Texas Book Depository store at Houston and Elm. I have him with me now and we are sealing off the building."
Mr. BELIN - All right, that was at 12:36 p.m.?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Had the building been sealed off at that time?
Mr. HARKNESS - Not to my knowledge. There were several officers around it, but I don't know whether it had been sealed off or not.
Mr. BELIN - In the process of sealing off the building, what did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - Asked for a squad.
Mr. BELIN - How long did it take you after that to have the back part sealed off?
Mr. HARKNESS - The guard was arriving by the time I got off my motorcycle. There was already additional squads en route.
Mr. BELIN - How soon after 12:36 p.m., would you say the building was sealed off?
Mr. HARKNESS - It was sealed off then because I was back there and two other men.
Mr. BELIN - You are talking about the back part of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What about the front part of the building? When was that sealed off?
Mr. HARKNESS - Inspector Sawyer and two officers were there.
Mr. BELIN - By the time you got around to the front part of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir; by the time I put the witness in his car, I went immediately to the back.
Mr. BELIN - In other words, as I understand the sequence, you first went to the back of the building and had that sealed off first, or not?
Mr. HARKNESS - No, sir.
Mr. BELIN - You tell me what happened then.
Mr. HARKNESS - I had this witness with me. I didn't want to lose this witness.
Mr. BELIN - All right.
Mr. HARKNESS - So I took him to the car.
Mr. BELIN - To Inspector Sawyer's car?
Mr. HARKNESS - To Inspector Sawyer's car, which was right in front.
Mr. BELIN - Which was parked in front of the Texas School Book Depository?
Mr. HARKNESS - And left the witness there and went around to the back.
Mr. BELIN - On whose radio did you call? Did you call in before or after you left the witness in the car?
Mr. HARKNESS - I don't remember in exact sequence there, but it was in the process of going to the car there.
Mr. BELIN - Then what did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - See, here is the thing. The radio traffic was heavy at the time, and it depended on how long you had to wait to get in.
Mr. BELIN - All right, in any event, after you made the call, what did you do on the radio? And after you got the man in the car?
Mr. HARKNESS - Well---
Mr. BELIN - The witness in the car, what did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - Stayed at the back of the building until I was relieved by a squad.
Mr. BELIN - So you then went to the back of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes.
Mr. BELIN - When you were at Inspector Sawyer's car, did you see him there?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Was he at his car?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir; he was by his car, near his car.
Mr. BELIN - Do you know whether or not he had gone inside the building.
Mr. HARKNESS - No, sir.
Mr. BELIN - You mean you don't know?
Mr. HARKNESS - Don't know whether he had gone in or not. Actually, he was standing there in front taking information. All the information was being funneled to Inspector Sawyer.
Mr. BELIN - Did you tell him you had a witness?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - In his car?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - At that time, had the building been sealed off yet when you told him that?
Mr. HARKNESS - At that time?
Mr. BELIN - When you told Inspector Sawyer that you had a witness that said the shot came from the building, up to that particular moment, had the front part of the building been sealed off yet?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - It had already been sealed off?
Mr. HARKNESS - There was two officers with Inspector Sawyer at the front.
Mr. BELIN - Were they stopping people from going in and out?
Mr. HARKNESS - I don't know.
Mr. BELIN - You don't know?
Mr. HARKNESS - No, sir; I don't know that, because I didn't go up and talk to them.
Mr. BELIN - Did you notice whether or not people were coming in and out of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - No. I was interested in getting around to the back of the building to make sure it was.
Mr. BELIN - Then am I correct that your testimony is that you didn't notice whether people were coming in and out? Did you notice, or did you not notice whether people were coming out of the building at that time?
Mr. HARKNESS - Several officers at the area, and it was a lot of people around. I don't know whether they were going in or out or not. I couldn't say that.
Mr. BELIN - Then you went around to the back of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Was anyone around in the back when you got there?
Mr. HARKNESS - There were some Secret Service agents there. I didn't get them identified. They told me they were Secret Service.
Mr. BELIN - Then did you say around the back of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes; I stayed at the back until the squad got there.
Mr. BELIN - Then what did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - I went back to the front, and Inspector Sawyer---helped get the crowd back first, and then Inspector Sawyer assigned me to some freight cars that were leaving out of the yard, to go down and search all freight cars that were leaving the yard.
Harkness is identified in that image that Dan posted. Based on the sequence that Harkness says happened, it suggests to me that this image was taken shortly after 12:36.
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I'm not veering off anything. I'm just highlighting that you completely make up all your timings out of thin air.
And that they are usually way off.
The four minutes you assign for Haygood to get to the underpass fence is a joke, completely made up by you.
You are shown real evidence demonstrating the time is actually half that and you just brush it off because it doesn't agree with your completely made up timings.
How can anything be proven to you if you don't accept actual evidence.
It's fair enough that some timings must be estimated, I have no problem with that, but these estimations must emanate from the evidence.
Saying "well, I think it's this" isn't good enough.
I've looked at the Darnell footage a lot more closely and realised the route I did for Haygood needs updating.
In the pic below:
1] Where Haygood leaves his bike
2] Haygood at the underpass fence
3] Haygood seen behind Roger Craig
4] Haygood seen walking towards the TSBD
From 4 back to 1 just shows Haygood's quickest route back to his bike after we see him in the Darnell film walking towards the TSBD building.
As Mitch has pointed out a couple of times, Haygood is not walking along the Elm Street extension, he is in the railroad yard. The extension ends at the yellow line on the pic below:
(https://i.postimg.cc/ZnnG5nkX/Haygood-Route2.jpg) (https://postimages.org/)
Haygood is at point 2 within one minute and forty seconds.
This gives him 3 to 4 minutes to walk the route outlined.
This is really easily done.
No need for impostors or any of that nonsense.
For starters, between points #1 & #2, you have Officer Haygood running straight through the Ft Worth sign. Haygood, after righting his motorcycle at the Elm Curb, ran directly (N) toward the Picket Fence. He continued running in that direction and then eventually veered (W) toward the Triple Underpass. On the back end of your diagram, after #4, the "No Glove Cop" should be WALKING Directly Forward/toward the TSBD Loading Dock. The No Glove Cop does Not WALK toward the Pergola. Take the time and closely examine the Darnell/Martin Films. Through my research, I have untangled Officer Haygood's entire journey and how he was able to back at his motorcycle make his 12:35 radio transmission. The "No Glove Cop" is Not Haygood. Just ask Charles who has supplied further evidence to that end. The question now is: (1) Is the "No Glove Cop" a real DPD Motorcycle Officer? or (2) Is the "No Glove Cop" an imposture = Conspiracy? - To Be Continued -
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Here’s a snip from Harkness’ testimony:
Mr. BELIN - Now you mentioned that you put something on the radio here, and I hand you here what has been marked as Sawyer Deposition Exhibit A. Before doing that, do you remember what call number you used, you were using on that day?
Mr. HARKNESS - I believe 260.
Mr. BELIN - Well, I notice here that there is a call with a notation at 12:36 p.m., 260 to 531. 531 is your office in the main station?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What does it say there on that transcript?
Mr. HARKNESS - "Witness says shots came from fifth floor, Texas Book Depository store at Houston and Elm. I have him with me now and we are sealing off the building."
Mr. BELIN - All right, that was at 12:36 p.m.?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Had the building been sealed off at that time?
Mr. HARKNESS - Not to my knowledge. There were several officers around it, but I don't know whether it had been sealed off or not.
Mr. BELIN - In the process of sealing off the building, what did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - Asked for a squad.
Mr. BELIN - How long did it take you after that to have the back part sealed off?
Mr. HARKNESS - The guard was arriving by the time I got off my motorcycle. There was already additional squads en route.
Mr. BELIN - How soon after 12:36 p.m., would you say the building was sealed off?
Mr. HARKNESS - It was sealed off then because I was back there and two other men.
Mr. BELIN - You are talking about the back part of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What about the front part of the building? When was that sealed off?
Mr. HARKNESS - Inspector Sawyer and two officers were there.
Mr. BELIN - By the time you got around to the front part of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir; by the time I put the witness in his car, I went immediately to the back.
Mr. BELIN - In other words, as I understand the sequence, you first went to the back of the building and had that sealed off first, or not?
Mr. HARKNESS - No, sir.
Mr. BELIN - You tell me what happened then.
Mr. HARKNESS - I had this witness with me. I didn't want to lose this witness.
Mr. BELIN - All right.
Mr. HARKNESS - So I took him to the car.
Mr. BELIN - To Inspector Sawyer's car?
Mr. HARKNESS - To Inspector Sawyer's car, which was right in front.
Mr. BELIN - Which was parked in front of the Texas School Book Depository?
Mr. HARKNESS - And left the witness there and went around to the back.
Mr. BELIN - On whose radio did you call? Did you call in before or after you left the witness in the car?
Mr. HARKNESS - I don't remember in exact sequence there, but it was in the process of going to the car there.
Mr. BELIN - Then what did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - See, here is the thing. The radio traffic was heavy at the time, and it depended on how long you had to wait to get in.
Mr. BELIN - All right, in any event, after you made the call, what did you do on the radio? And after you got the man in the car?
Mr. HARKNESS - Well---
Mr. BELIN - The witness in the car, what did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - Stayed at the back of the building until I was relieved by a squad.
Mr. BELIN - So you then went to the back of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes.
Mr. BELIN - When you were at Inspector Sawyer's car, did you see him there?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Was he at his car?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir; he was by his car, near his car.
Mr. BELIN - Do you know whether or not he had gone inside the building.
Mr. HARKNESS - No, sir.
Mr. BELIN - You mean you don't know?
Mr. HARKNESS - Don't know whether he had gone in or not. Actually, he was standing there in front taking information. All the information was being funneled to Inspector Sawyer.
Mr. BELIN - Did you tell him you had a witness?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - In his car?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - At that time, had the building been sealed off yet when you told him that?
Mr. HARKNESS - At that time?
Mr. BELIN - When you told Inspector Sawyer that you had a witness that said the shot came from the building, up to that particular moment, had the front part of the building been sealed off yet?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - It had already been sealed off?
Mr. HARKNESS - There was two officers with Inspector Sawyer at the front.
Mr. BELIN - Were they stopping people from going in and out?
Mr. HARKNESS - I don't know.
Mr. BELIN - You don't know?
Mr. HARKNESS - No, sir; I don't know that, because I didn't go up and talk to them.
Mr. BELIN - Did you notice whether or not people were coming in and out of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - No. I was interested in getting around to the back of the building to make sure it was.
Mr. BELIN - Then am I correct that your testimony is that you didn't notice whether people were coming in and out? Did you notice, or did you not notice whether people were coming out of the building at that time?
Mr. HARKNESS - Several officers at the area, and it was a lot of people around. I don't know whether they were going in or out or not. I couldn't say that.
Mr. BELIN - Then you went around to the back of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Was anyone around in the back when you got there?
Mr. HARKNESS - There were some Secret Service agents there. I didn't get them identified. They told me they were Secret Service.
Mr. BELIN - Then did you say around the back of the building?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes; I stayed at the back until the squad got there.
Mr. BELIN - Then what did you do?
Mr. HARKNESS - I went back to the front, and Inspector Sawyer---helped get the crowd back first, and then Inspector Sawyer assigned me to some freight cars that were leaving out of the yard, to go down and search all freight cars that were leaving the yard.
Harkness is identified in that image that Dan posted. Based on the sequence that Harkness says happened, it suggests to me that this image was taken shortly after 12:36.
In Harkness' testimony, he first takes off West with King down Main to Industrial, then comes back and winds up in the rail yard, where he runs into Amos Euins. After hearing Euins' story, Harkness calls in at 12:36, plants Euins on the back of his trike then drives him to the front of the Depository. Harkness didn't run around to the back of the Depository until after depositing Euins in Sawyer's car. The Hughes film shows Harkness and King speeding west on Main, and later on has a DPD officer on a three-wheeler puttering around in the rail yard. The Martin film shows Harkness riding east on Old Elm with Euins on the back, while Sawyer pulls in at the front of the TSBD in he background.
Harkness doesn't ask for an extra squad until 12:41
The upshot is that Harkness appearance in the Darnell film would have been before Harkness went around to the back of the building.
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That alleged DPD Cop has his (R) glove Off well before the still frame you posted above. We also see this DPD Cop Not wearing a glove in the Darnell Train Yard/Caboose film segment as he WALKS behind Officer Roger Craig who is wearing a coat and tie. This rules out the, "..standard operating procedure when a cop is walking towards a building with potentially an armed assassin inside". With the Cancellare Photo showing Officer Haygood wearing Both Gloves while standing atop the Triple Underpass, this means from the Triple Underpass to the Train Caboose that for whatever reason Haygood decided to take his (R) glove off. He then kept that glove off as he WALKED across the entire train yard and then WALKED down the Elm St Ext toward the TSBD Loading Dock. The Haygood timeline issue alone DQ's the One Glove Cop from being Haygood. Now, we have a wardrobe irregularity between Officer Haygood and this guy. And, I have even more evidence that the One Glove Cop is NOT Haygood. - To Be Continued _
Again, not sure of the logic here.
It's okay for your mystery cop to remove one glove and carry it in the other hand but it's not okay for any other cop to do that?
Why has your mystery cop removed a glove? Whatever answer you come up with, apply that to Haygood.
The Haygood timeline issue alone DQ's the One Glove Cop from being Haygood.
Not really Royell.
Strong evidence has been presented that it is perfectly possible for Haygood to make it to the various stops he is pictured at with plenty of time to spare.
You just keep insisting you're right. And that's that. Nothing more to be said. Royell has spoken.
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For starters, between points #1 & #2, you have Officer Haygood running straight through the Ft Worth sign. Haygood, after righting his motorcycle at the Elm Curb, ran directly (N) toward the Picket Fence. He continued running in that direction and then eventually veered (W) toward the Triple Underpass. On the back end of your diagram, after #4, the "No Glove Cop" should be WALKING Directly Forward/toward the TSBD Loading Dock. The No Glove Cop does Not WALK toward the Pergola. Take the time and closely examine the Darnell/Martin Films. Through my research, I have untangled Officer Haygood's entire journey and how he was able to back at his motorcycle make his 12:35 radio transmission. The "No Glove Cop" is Not Haygood. Just ask Charles who has supplied further evidence to that end. The question now is: (1) Is the "No Glove Cop" a real DPD Motorcycle Officer? or (2) Is the "No Glove Cop" an imposture = Conspiracy? - To Be Continued -
For starters, between points #1 & #2, you have Officer Haygood running straight through the Ft Worth sign.
:D :D :D
You funny.
The No Glove Cop does Not WALK toward the Pergola. Take the time and closely examine the Darnell/Martin Films. Through my research, I have untangled Officer Haygood's entire journey and how he was able to back at his motorcycle make his 12:35 radio transmission.
Point#4 is where Haygood is filmed in Darnell walking towards the TSBD building. You don't have a clue what he does after this point.
If Haygood is to get back to his bike in time to make his radio call then this is an approximation of the route he took. We know after he is filmed in Darnell, Haygood is back at his bike making his 12:35pm radio call.
And you've untangled Haygood's entire journey??
I've yet to hear this.
Please explain his full journey from the time he gets off his bike to the time he makes his radio call, and the evidence this timeline is based on?
As I understand it you have Haygood at the Triple Underpass for at least 4 minutes (12:34pm). How does he get round the railroad yard and back to his bike for his 12:35pm radio call
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Your problem is you are trying to make the journey of the No Glove Cop fit into that 5 minute timeline. There is NOTHING to document Haygood being on the Elm Ext or walking along the rear of the Pergola less than 5 Minutes after the Kill Shot. If you act real nice, I will shortly take the time to explain the Haygood itinerary after he reached the Triple Underpass. ALL factually supported. Haygood is Not the No Glove Cop. That guy is an imposture.
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Your problem is you are trying to make the journey of the No Glove Cop fit into that 5 minute timeline. There is NOTHING to document Haygood being on the Elm Ext or walking along the rear of the Pergola less than 5 Minutes after the Kill Shot. If you act real nice, I will shortly take the time to explain the Haygood itinerary after he reached the Triple Underpass. ALL factually supported. Haygood is Not the No Glove Cop. That guy is an imposture.
If you act real nice, I will shortly take the time to explain the Haygood itinerary after he reached the Triple Underpass.
Thumb1:
I literally cannot wait Walk:
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Buddy Walther is also identified in the image/film in question. His testimony indicates he ran to the railroad yards and went over a fence then walked over to the area between Elm and Main streets to look for signs of bullets having been fired. There he encounters Tague. Here’s a snip from Tague’s testimony:
Mr. LIEBELER. Going on Elm Street under the triple underpass?
Mr. TAGUE. Right. Going on Elm. So I stood there looking around. I looked up---there was a motorcycle policeman, and he stopped and had drawn his gun and was running up the embankment toward the railroad tracks. A crowd of people; several people, were starting to come down into that area where he was running, and the people pointing, and excitement up there and so on, and about that time a patrolman who evidently had been stationed under the triple underpass walked up and said, "What happened?" and I said, "I don't know; something."
And we walked up to the---by this time the motorcycle policeman returned back close to where his motorcycle was, and we walked up there and there was a man standing there. Seeing that he was very excited--I don't remember his name at the time I did have it on the tip of my tongue very excited saying he was watching the President and it seemed like his head just exploded. This was a couple or 3 minutes after this happened. And the patrolman said, "Well, I saw something fly off back on the street."
We walked back down there, and another man joined us who identified himself as the deputy sheriff, who was in civilian clothes, and I guess this was 3 or 4 minutes after. I don't know how to gage time on something like that.
And I says, "Well, you know now, I recall something sting me on the face while I was standing down there."
And he looked up and he said, "Yes; you have blood there on your cheek."
And I reached up and there was a couple of drops of blood. And he said, "Where were you standing?"
And I says, "Right down here." We walked 15 feet away when this deputy sheriff said, "Look here on the curb." There was a mark quite obviously that was a bullet, and it was very fresh.
We turned around and we looked back up to see where this possibly could have come from, and the policeman thought he had seen something over here.
Tague’s testimony suggests that he saw Haygood draw his gun and run up the knoll toward the railroad tracks then return to his motorcycle a few minutes later. Also, Walthers appears in the same vicinity as Tague at about the same time that Haygood returns to his motorcycle. The Darnell film appears to show Walthers, the one gloved motorcycle officer in question, and Harkness in the same area in the railroad yard/Elm Street Extension vicinity.
Based on the above sequence, it appears that my assumption that the image was taken after Harkness had already deposited Euins in front of the TSBD was wrong. Based on Walthers’ and Tague’s accounts, it now appears to me that the Darnell film clip was taken earlier than I first thought. If Walthers can run from the Sheriff’s office area to the railroad yards, look around quickly, then walk back to Tague’s location all within about 5 or 6 minutes or so. And, similarly, Harkness can go where he did and get back to the railroad yards in time to be in the Darnell clip, then I see no reason to believe that Haygood couldn’t make it back to his motorcycle from the railroad yard in time to make the radio call.
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To fully understand the Haygood journey after he reached the Triple Underpass, you only need 2 things. (1) Haygood's WC Testimony, and (2) The Cancellare Photo
- OFFICER HAYGOOD WC TESTIMONY -
ATTORNEY BELIN - "Now, when you ran to the railroad yard, would that be North or South of Elm?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "The railroad yard would be located at the --- IT CONSISTS OF GOING OVER ELM ST. and back North of Elm ST."
ATTORNEY BELIN - " What did you do when you got there?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "Well there was nothing. There was quite a few people, spectators, and AT THAT TIME I WENT BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE it was on the street--to my radio."
ATTORNEY BELIN - "Did you talk to any people over there or not?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "In the railroad yard, I talked to one of the people I PRESUMED TO BE A RAILROAD DETECTIVE that was in the yard."
ATTORNEY BELIN - "Did he say anything to you, that you remember?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "Nothing that I remember."
ATTORNEY BELIN - - "Then what did you do?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "I WENT BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE, which was sitting on Elm St."
During his WC Testimony above, Haygood locates the railroad yard as "...going over Elm St....". By Haygood's specific definition, the railroad yard would therefore include the TOP of the Triple Underpass. If you look at the Cancellare Photo (colorized) that is included in our "Research Photo Gallery", you will see Haygood standing on Top of the Triple Underpass facing (W). Just feet away and facing him is a railroad attired individual. This in my opinion is the presumed "Railroad Detective" that Haygood sighted in his WC testimony. Never, at any point in his WC Testimony does Haygood mention checking out a caboose, train car(s), boxcar(s), WALKING across the railroad yard or WALKING toward the TSBD Loading Dock. Yet, this is exactly what we see the One Glove Cop doing on the Darnell/Martin films. Instead, Haygood consistently says only that, "I went back to my motorcycle".
I believe that after reaching the Triple Underpass, Haygood eventually stood atop it as we see on the Cancellare Photo. He then jumped down onto the other side which would immediately place him inside the railroad yard per his WC Testimony definition of the railroad yard = "Going OVER Elm St". Also, after jumping down from atop the Triple Underpass, Haygood is also then in contact with the Presumed "railroad detective" he referenced in his WC Testimony. At that point Haygood testified, "I went back to my motorcycle which was sitting on Elm St". Officer Heygood stood atop the Triple Underpass, dropped down onto the other side, saw that Presumed "Railroad Detective", probably looked around a little, and then jumped back over the Triple Underpass rail and back onto the Grassy Knoll. He then ran down the Grassy Knoll to his motorcycle. Before making his 12:35 radio transmission, Officer Heygood talked with 2 eyewitnesses. 1 of them was James Tague. It was the eyewitness accounts of these 2 people that prompted Haygood to make his 12:35 radio transmission. Conversing with these 2 eyewitnesses also consumed a portion of the Haygood 5 minute window between the Kill Shot and his Verified 12:35 radio call. There is No Way that 5 minutes was enough time for Haygood to: (1) drive his motorcycle down Houston St and then Elm St, (2) dump his motorcycle at the Elm curb, (3) struggle to straighten up his motorcycle, (4) run UP & Across the Grassy Knoll, (5) arrive at/climb atop the Triple Underpass, (6) travel back Deep into the train yard, (7) WALK across that train yard, 8. WALK down the Elm St Ext, (9) travel back to his motorcycle, (10) talk with 2 eyewitnesses and (11) then make that 12:35 radio transmission. ALL of this in only 5 Minutes? It's physically impossible! It is possible for Haygood to make that radio call if he simply went onto the other side of the Triple Underpass, (he's immediately inside the train yard as he defined), and then get back onto the grassy knoll and basically retrace his steps, "BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE". Haygood told the WC exactly what he did/where he went and his WC testimony fits into that 5 minute window following the Kill Shot. For 60 years running Officer Haygood was used to mask the "One Glove Cop" and his stalking of the Train Yard and then likewise the Elm St Ext/TSBD. I have Now exposed this "One Glove Cop" and at the same time Proven a Conspiracy was employed to assassinate JFK. Prove Me Wrong!
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To fully understand the Haygood journey after he reached the Triple Underpass, you only need 2 things. (1) Haygood's WC Testimony, and (2) The Cancellare Photo
- OFFICER HAYGOOD WC TESTIMONY -
ATTORNEY BELIN - "Now, when you ran to the railroad yard, would that be North or South of Elm?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "The railroad yard would be located at the --- IT CONSISTS OF GOING OVER ELM ST. and back North of Elm ST."
ATTORNEY BELIN - " What did you do when you got there?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "Well there was nothing. There was quite a few people, spectators, and AT THAT TIME I WENT BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE it was on the street--to my radio."
ATTORNEY BELIN - "Did you talk to any people over there or not?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "In the railroad yard, I talked to one of the people I PRESUMED TO BE A RAILROAD DETECTIVE that was in the yard."
ATTORNEY BELIN - "Did he say anything to you, that you remember?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "Nothing that I remember."
ATTORNEY BELIN - - "Then what did you do?"
OFFICER HAYGOOD - "I WENT BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE, which was sitting on Elm St."
During his WC Testimony above, Haygood locates the railroad yard as "...going over Elm St....". By Haygood's specific definition, the railroad yard would therefore include the TOP of the Triple Underpass. If you look at the Cancellare Photo (colorized) that is included in our "Research Photo Gallery", you will see Haygood standing on Top of the Triple Underpass facing (W). Just feet away and facing him is a railroad attired individual. This in my opinion is the presumed "Railroad Detective" that Haygood sighted in his WC testimony. Never, at any point in his WC Testimony does Haygood mention checking out a caboose, train car(s), boxcar(s), WALKING across the railroad yard or WALKING toward the TSBD Loading Dock. Yet, this is exactly what we see the One Glove Cop doing on the Darnell/Martin films. Instead, Haygood consistently says only that, "I went back to my motorcycle".
I believe that after reaching the Triple Underpass, Haygood eventually stood atop it as we see on the Cancellare Photo. He then jumped down onto the other side which would immediately place him inside the railroad yard per his WC Testimony definition of the railroad yard = "Going OVER Elm St". Also, after jumping down from atop the Triple Underpass, Haygood is also then in contact with the Presumed "railroad detective" he referenced in his WC Testimony. At that point Haygood testified, "I went back to my motorcycle which was sitting on Elm St". Officer Heygood stood atop the Triple Underpass, dropped down onto the other side, saw that Presumed "Railroad Detective", probably looked around a little, and then jumped back over the Triple Underpass rail and back onto the Grassy Knoll. He then ran down the Grassy Knoll to his motorcycle. Before making his 12:35 radio transmission, Officer Heygood talked with 2 eyewitnesses. 1 of them was James Tague. It was the eyewitness accounts of these 2 people that prompted Haygood to make his 12:35 radio transmission. Conversing with these 2 eyewitnesses also consumed a portion of the Haygood 5 minute window between the Kill Shot and his Verified 12:35 radio call. There is No Way that 5 minutes was enough time for Haygood to: (1) drive his motorcycle down Houston St and then Elm St, (2) dump his motorcycle at the Elm curb, (3) struggle to straighten up his motorcycle, (4) run UP & Across the Grassy Knoll, (5) arrive at/climb atop the Triple Underpass, (6) travel back Deep into the train yard, (7) WALK across that train yard, 8. WALK down the Elm St Ext, (9) travel back to his motorcycle, (10) talk with 2 eyewitnesses and (11) then make that 12:35 radio transmission. ALL of this in only 5 Minutes? It's physically impossible! It is possible for Haygood to make that radio call if he simply went onto the other side of the Triple Underpass, (he's immediately inside the train yard as he defined), and then get back onto the grassy knoll and basically retrace his steps, "BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE". Haygood told the WC exactly what he did/where he went and his WC testimony fits into that 5 minute window following the Kill Shot. For 60 years running Officer Haygood was used to mask the "One Glove Cop" and his stalking of the Train Yard and then likewise the Elm St Ext/TSBD. I have Now exposed this "One Glove Cop" and at the same time Proven a Conspiracy was employed to assassinate JFK. Prove Me Wrong!
On top of the underpass is not in the railroad yard.
I can't believe that this is the big reveal.
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On top of the underpass is not in the railroad yard.
I can't believe that this is the big reveal.
Officer Haygood came DOWN from standing atop the overpass and spoke with what he "presumed" to be a railroad detective. Based on Haygood's WC description of the railroad yard, "...going OVER Elm ST", he believed he was inside the railroad yard when he came down from standing atop the Triple Underpass. Take a good look at the Cancellare Photo of Haygood standing atop the Triple Underpass. In that photo to the (R) is a TREE BRANCH. That's your Landmark, you need to remember it. NOW, go to You Tube and search "JFK: Conspiracy Exposed (Director's Cut)" 36:08 - 36:30. This snippet displays the interview that Mark Lane did with Skinny Holland. During this segment they begin walking down the Triple Underpass. They eventually turn (R) and as they walk forward the viewer can see that same Tree Branch in the upper (L) of the picture. That branch is stretching over the point of the Underpass where it turns into wood fencing. This is the spot where Haygood jumped down from the Triple Underpass and landed inside the railroad yard. That spot is very close to the picket fence/parking lot. It is also very close to the large drainage grate. This Spot is well away from the stretch of train cars that Darnell/Martin filmed the alleged DPD Motorcycle Cop walking in front of. This Haygood landing spot is even further away from the Elm St Ext and the TSBD Loading Dock which Darnell and Martin also filmed this same alleged DPD Cop WALKING toward/down. In Haygood's WC testimony he NEVER MENTIONS train cars, the Elm St Ext, or the TSBD Loading Dock prior to making his 12:35 radio transmission. In fact, when asked what he did, Haygood simply says "I went BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE...". Haygood made a quick jump down into the railroad yard area close to the Picket Fence, spoke with a "presumed" railroad detective, (visible in the Cancellare Photo), and then climbed Back over the Triple Underpass, onto the grassy knoll and went back to his motorcycle. He spoke with 2 eyewitnesses down near his motorcycle, (1 of them being James Tague), and what they told him warranted his making his Documented 12:35 radio transmission. The DPD Motorcycle Cop we see on the Darnell/Martin films is NOT Officer Haygood. Haygood's WC Testimony proves this, as does the 5:00 minute window between the 12:30 Kill Shot and Haygood's Documented 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. My mountain of Proof Stands Tall and the Challenge I have issued remains unmet. Such is the case when The Truth is brought forward.
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Time for me to take my VICTORY LAP!
My Discovery stands as FACT due to being based on: (1) Photo Evidence, (2) Film Evidence, and (3) Sworn Testimony. And make No mistake, the "1 Glove Cop" captured on the Darnell/Martin Films NOT being Officer Haygood is a Major Discovery due to: (1) PROVING a Conspiracy was orchestrated to assassinate JFK, and (2) ALL of this Evidence having been in plain sight for roughly 60 years. And believe me when I tell you that if the JFK Assassination Research Community could prove me wrong, they would have circled the wagons and been All over me like "white on rice". I have seen this same group sound their Clarion Horn whenever others have attempted to traverse this same path that I now travel down. These "researchers" come outta the woodwork to bury anyone that steps forward to prove them wrong. Today, I am proud to expose the Officer Haygood ID on the Darnell/Martin Films as being Dead Wrong! And the now Unknown "1 Glove Cop" proves that a Conspiracy was used to assassinate JFK.
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Officer Haygood came DOWN from standing atop the overpass and spoke with what he "presumed" to be a railroad detective. Based on Haygood's WC description of the railroad yard, "...going OVER Elm ST", he believed he was inside the railroad yard when he came down from standing atop the Triple Underpass. Take a good look at the Cancellare Photo of Haygood standing atop the Triple Underpass. In that photo to the (R) is a TREE BRANCH. That's your Landmark, you need to remember it. NOW, go to You Tube and search "JFK: Conspiracy Exposed (Director's Cut)" 36:08 - 36:30. This snippet displays the interview that Mark Lane did with Skinny Holland. During this segment they begin walking down the Triple Underpass. They eventually turn (R) and as they walk forward the viewer can see that same Tree Branch in the upper (L) of the picture. That branch is stretching over the point of the Underpass where it turns into wood fencing. This is the spot where Haygood jumped down from the Triple Underpass and landed inside the railroad yard. That spot is very close to the picket fence/parking lot. It is also very close to the large drainage grate. This Spot is well away from the stretch of train cars that Darnell/Martin filmed the alleged DPD Motorcycle Cop walking in front of. This Haygood landing spot is even further away from the Elm St Ext and the TSBD Loading Dock which Darnell and Martin also filmed this same alleged DPD Cop WALKING toward/down. In Haygood's WC testimony he NEVER MENTIONS train cars, the Elm St Ext, or the TSBD Loading Dock prior to making his 12:35 radio transmission. In fact, when asked what he did, Haygood simply says "I went BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE...". Haygood made a quick jump down into the railroad yard area close to the Picket Fence, spoke with a "presumed" railroad detective, (visible in the Cancellare Photo), and then climbed Back over the Triple Underpass, onto the grassy knoll and went back to his motorcycle. He spoke with 2 eyewitnesses down near his motorcycle, (1 of them being James Tague), and what they told him warranted his making his Documented 12:35 radio transmission. The DPD Motorcycle Cop we see on the Darnell/Martin films is NOT Officer Haygood. Haygood's WC Testimony proves this, as does the 5:00 minute window between the 12:30 Kill Shot and Haygood's Documented 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. My mountain of Proof Stands Tall and the Challenge I have issued remains unmet. Such is the case when The Truth is brought forward.
You left off part of Haygood's description of the rail yard, and it's important. You relate it as "...going OVER Elm ST," but there's more to it than that. He actually says "the railroad yard would be located at the---it consists of going over Elm Street and back north of Elm Street." The italicized portion explicitly includes the yard north of the fence. This, in turn, kills your assertion that Haygood was only talking about the area on top of the triple overpass.
There is something else to consider, but it's not obvious. In fact, it's kind of hidden. In the "official" transcript, there is this exchange at 12:38:
22: Get some men up here to cover this school depository building. It's believed the shot came from, as you see it on Elm Street, it would be upper right hand corner, second window from the end.
Dispatcher: 10-4. How many do you have there?
22: I have one guy that was possibly hit by a ricochet from the bullet off the concrete and another one saw the President slump.
Dispatcher: 10-4.
The transcript attributes this to unit (really, patrol district) 22, a Patrolman named L.L. Hill. The problem is that Hill was a patrol division officer, and was assigned area was in far West Dallas, a few miles away from Dealey Plaza. As a patrol division officer, he would have been tuned into channel 1, not channel 2. In fact, when he chimes in at 12:47, it's on channel one. It's difficult to believe that he would have been tuned to channel 2, and dispatched himself to Dealey Plaza on his own as soon as the first reports of the shooting came in.
However, listening to the channel 2 recording tells a different story. While the officer responsible for the transmission calls in, it does indeed sound like he announces himself as "22." However, this "22" sounds exactly the voice behind Haygood's 12:35 transmission, including the odd halting speech pattern. The channel 1 22 has a voice pitched about a third higher than the channel 2 one as well. I figure that Haygood was a little slow on the transmit button in the second transmission, which caused the first part of his number, "142," to get cut off. It's interesting how well the contents of the second transmission match Haygood's testimony.
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You left off part of Haygood's description of the rail yard, and it's important. You relate it as "...going OVER Elm ST," but there's more to it than that. He actually says "the railroad yard would be located at the---it consists of going over Elm Street and back north of Elm Street." The italicized portion explicitly includes the yard north of the fence. This, in turn, kills your assertion that Haygood was only talking about the area on top of the triple overpass.
There is something else to consider, but it's not obvious. In fact, it's kind of hidden. In the "official" transcript, there is this exchange at 12:38:
22: Get some men up here to cover this school depository building. It's believed the shot came from, as you see it on Elm Street, it would be upper right hand corner, second window from the end.
Dispatcher: 10-4. How many do you have there?
22: I have one guy that was possibly hit by a ricochet from the bullet off the concrete and another one saw the President slump.
Dispatcher: 10-4.
The transcript attributes this to unit (really, patrol district) 22, a Patrolman named L.L. Hill. The problem is that Hill was a patrol division officer, and was assigned area was in far West Dallas, a few miles away from Dealey Plaza. As a patrol division officer, he would have been tuned into channel 1, not channel 2. In fact, when he chimes in at 12:47, it's on channel one. It's difficult to believe that he would have been tuned to channel 2, and dispatched himself to Dealey Plaza on his own as soon as the first reports of the shooting came in.
However, listening to the channel 2 recording tells a different story. While the officer responsible for the transmission calls in, it does indeed sound like he announces himself as "22." However, this "22" sounds exactly the voice behind Haygood's 12:35 transmission, including the odd halting speech pattern. The channel 1 22 has a voice pitched about a third higher than the channel 2 one as well. I figure that Haygood was a little slow on the transmit button in the second transmission, which caused the first part of his number, "142," to get cut off. It's interesting how well the contents of the second transmission match Haygood's testimony.
It was quite cruel of you to trip Royell up while he was taking his victory lap.
Interesting spot about the "22" transmission, this must surely be Haygood.
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You left off part of Haygood's description of the rail yard, and it's important. You relate it as "...going OVER Elm ST," but there's more to it than that. He actually says "the railroad yard would be located at the---it consists of going over Elm Street and back north of Elm Street." The italicized portion explicitly includes the yard north of the fence. This, in turn, kills your assertion that Haygood was only talking about the area on top of the triple overpass.
There is something else to consider, but it's not obvious. In fact, it's kind of hidden. In the "official" transcript, there is this exchange at 12:38:
22: Get some men up here to cover this school depository building. It's believed the shot came from, as you see it on Elm Street, it would be upper right hand corner, second window from the end.
Dispatcher: 10-4. How many do you have there?
22: I have one guy that was possibly hit by a ricochet from the bullet off the concrete and another one saw the President slump.
Dispatcher: 10-4.
The transcript attributes this to unit (really, patrol district) 22, a Patrolman named L.L. Hill. The problem is that Hill was a patrol division officer, and was assigned area was in far West Dallas, a few miles away from Dealey Plaza. As a patrol division officer, he would have been tuned into channel 1, not channel 2. In fact, when he chimes in at 12:47, it's on channel one. It's difficult to believe that he would have been tuned to channel 2, and dispatched himself to Dealey Plaza on his own as soon as the first reports of the shooting came in.
However, listening to the channel 2 recording tells a different story. While the officer responsible for the transmission calls in, it does indeed sound like he announces himself as "22." However, this "22" sounds exactly the voice behind Haygood's 12:35 transmission, including the odd halting speech pattern. The channel 1 22 has a voice pitched about a third higher than the channel 2 one as well. I figure that Haygood was a little slow on the transmit button in the second transmission, which caused the first part of his number, "142," to get cut off. It's interesting how well the contents of the second transmission match Haygood's testimony.
Generally, whether it be back in 1964 when Haygood gave his WC Testimony or Now, the Dealey Plaza "train yard" is automatically accepted as being the area (N) of Elm St behind the Pergola and stretching back behind the TSBD. Haygood went out of his way to include, "...going over Elm St" in his geographic description of the Train Yard. Why did he do this? He did this to Specifically designate his physical position on 11/22/63 after he jumped down from the Triple Underpass. (As pictured on the Cancellare Photo). Haygood was Inside the train yard as soon as he hit the ground. During his WC Testimony he then detailed talking with a "presumed" rail road detective. (Also pictured in the Cancellare Photo). At no point does Haygood mention his checking out a Caboose, train cars, boxcars, or even a string of railroad passenger cars as we see the "No Glove Cop" doing on the Darnell/Martin Films. Haygood also makes no mention of WALKING down the Elm St Ext or being within spitting distance of the TSBD Loading Dock (as filmed by Darnell/Martin), during this same time span. Why does Haygood Fail to mention any of this? Because that "No Glove Cop" we see on the Darnell/Martin Films doing ALL of this is NOT Officer Haygood. This "No Glove Cop" Not being Officer Haygood is a Major Discovery. This means we Now have: (1) An Unknown DPD Motorcycle Cop being inside the train yard Less than 5 minutes following the Kill Shot, or (2) An Imposture = A Conspiracy being employed to assassinate JFK.
During his WC Testimony, Officer Haygood confirmed his having made the Documented Police Radio Log calls at 12:35 and 12:37 from his motorcycle. That stands until dis-proven.
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Generally, whether it be back in 1964 when Haygood gave his WC Testimony or Now, the Dealey Plaza "train yard" is automatically accepted as being the area (N) of Elm St behind the Pergola and stretching back behind the TSBD. Haygood went out of his way to include, "...going over Elm St" in his geographic description of the Train Yard. Why did he do this? He did this to Specifically designate his physical position on 11/22/63 after he jumped down from the Triple Underpass. (As pictured on the Cancellare Photo). Haygood was Inside the train yard as soon as he hit the ground. During his WC Testimony he then detailed talking with a "presumed" rail road detective. (Also pictured in the Cancellare Photo). At no point does Haygood mention his checking out a Caboose, train cars, boxcars, or even a string of railroad passenger cars as we see the "No Glove Cop" doing on the Darnell/Martin Films. Haygood also makes no mention of WALKING down the Elm St Ext or being within spitting distance of the TSBD Loading Dock (as filmed by Darnell/Martin), during this same time span. Why does Haygood Fail to mention any of this? Because that "No Glove Cop" we see on the Darnell/Martin Films doing ALL of this is NOT Officer Haygood. This "No Glove Cop" Not being Officer Haygood is a Major Discovery. This means we Now have: (1) An Unknown DPD Motorcycle Cop being inside the train yard Less than 5 minutes following the Kill Shot, or (2) An Imposture = A Conspiracy being employed to assassinate JFK.
During his WC Testimony, Officer Haygood confirmed his having made the Documented Police Radio Log calls at 12:35 and 12:37 from his motorcycle. That stands until dis-proven.
Generally, whether it be back in 1964 when Haygood gave his WC Testimony or Now, the Dealey Plaza "train yard" is automatically accepted as being the area
This statement is simply not true. The rail yards extended well south of the triple overpass, and the deck on top of the TOP is part of the rail yard: even a cursory view of aerial photos of the area plainly shows the network of shunts and switches on top of the overpass. They wouldn't be there if it wasn't part of the yard.
Haygood went out of his way to include, "...going over Elm St" in his geographic description of the Train Yard. Why did he do this? He did this to Specifically designate his physical position on 11/22/63 after he jumped down from the Triple Underpass.
You may be right, but this doesn't preclude him from heading north immediately afterward.
a "presumed" rail road detective. Also pictured in the Cancellare Photo
I don't see an RR dick in the Cancellare photo with Haygood on the TOP ballusters. If you look closely at the photo, there are two men on top of the overpass in front of Haygood. One is a DPD officer, the other is wearing the hat of an RR laborer.
At no point does Haygood mention his checking out a Caboose, train cars, boxcars,
At no point does he deny doing so, either, so this proves nothing. You're expecting an unrealistic level of detail in his testimony.
Haygood also makes no mention of WALKING down the Elm St Ext or being within spitting distance of the TSBD Loading Dock
That's good, because the MC officer walking in the Darnell film is neither walking down the "Elm St extension" or is within "spitting distance" of the TSBD docks. The Darnell film shows the guy crossing the westernmost of the three railroad spurs west of the Depository, which would put him as far from the west corner of the TSBD annex as the west corner of the TSBD annex is from the SE corner of the building. That's quite a bit more than "spitting distance." And, as I've earlier noted, the sub of Elm street in front of the Depository ends at the Pergola. West of that point --that is, where the officer is seen-- is the RR yards.
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Generally, whether it be back in 1964 when Haygood gave his WC Testimony or Now, the Dealey Plaza "train yard" is automatically accepted as being the area
This statement is simply not true. The rail yards extended well south of the triple overpass, and the deck on top of the TOP is part of the rail yard: even a cursory view of aerial photos of the area plainly shows the network of shunts and switches on top of the overpass. They wouldn't be there if it wasn't part of the yard.
Haygood went out of his way to include, "...going over Elm St" in his geographic description of the Train Yard. Why did he do this? He did this to Specifically designate his physical position on 11/22/63 after he jumped down from the Triple Underpass.
You may be right, but this doesn't preclude him from heading north immediately afterward.
a "presumed" rail road detective. Also pictured in the Cancellare Photo
I don't see an RR dick in the Cancellare photo with Haygood on the TOP ballusters. If you look closely at the photo, there are two men on top of the overpass in front of Haygood. One is a DPD officer, the other is wearing the hat of an RR laborer.
At no point does Haygood mention his checking out a Caboose, train cars, boxcars,
At no point does he deny doing so, either, so this proves nothing. You're expecting an unrealistic level of detail in his testimony.
Haygood also makes no mention of WALKING down the Elm St Ext or being within spitting distance of the TSBD Loading Dock
That's good, because the MC officer walking in the Darnell film is neither walking down the "Elm St extension" or is within "spitting distance" of the TSBD docks. The Darnell film shows the guy crossing the westernmost of the three railroad spurs west of the Depository, which would put him as far from the west corner of the TSBD annex as the west corner of the TSBD annex is from the SE corner of the building. That's quite a bit more than "spitting distance." And, as I've earlier noted, the sub of Elm street in front of the Depository ends at the Pergola. West of that point --that is, where the officer is seen-- is the RR yards.
I am going to stick to the Photo/Film EVIDENCE and the Sworn WC Testimony of Haygood.
Officer Haygood - "The railroad would be located at the --- it consists of going over Elm St and back North of Elm St."
Attorney Belin - "What did you do when you got there?
Officer Haygood - "Well, there was nothing. There was quite a few people in the area, spectators, and at the time I WENT BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE it was on the street- to my radio."
Attorney Belin - "Did you see people running away from there?"
Officer Haygood - "No they was all going to it."
Attorney Belin - "Did you talk to any people over there or not?"
Officer Haygood - "In the railroad yard, I talked to one of the people I Presumed to be a detective that was in the yard."
Attorney Belin - "Had he been in the yard before or not?"
Officer Haygood - "No, he was just coming into the yard after I was."
Attorney Belin - "He was coming into the area after the shooting?"
Officer Haygood - "Yes"
Attorney Belin - "Did he say anything to you that you remember?"
Officer Haygood - "Nothing that I remember."
Attorney Belin - "Then what did you do?"
Officer Haygood - I WENT BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE which was sitting on Elm St."
The Darnell/Martin Films continuously show the "No Glove Cop" walking W-E across the train yard. He's paralleling a Caboose which is attached to several passenger train cars. At No point as he walks across the train yard is the "No Glove Cop" filmed talking with anyone, let alone a Presumed railroad detective. When Exactly do you believe this "No Glove Cop" talked with the presumed railroad detective and then immediately, "Went back to my motorcycle"? We do Not see this "No Glove Cop" engage anyone during his extended Darnell/Martin film coverage. You tell me. Exactly when did this alleged DPD Cop engage/talk with anyone?
We see on the Cancellare Photo that Officer Haygood is directly facing a railroad employee. I believe this is who Haygood "presumed" to be a railroad detective. After talking with him, Haygood did exactly what he said he did. "I went back to my motorcycle which was sitting on Elm St." Haygood basically retraced his steps. He went back over the fence to the Grassy Knoll and then down to his motorcycle below at the curb. Haygood then talked with 2 eyewitnesses, (James Tague being one of them), and immediately made his Documented 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. Officer Haygood's WC testimony regarding his actions fits within the 5 minute elapsed time window between the 12:30 Kill Shot and his 12:35 radio transmission. The Darnell/Martin filmed actions of the "No Glove Cop": (1) Are Contrary to the WC Testimony of Officer Haygood, and (2) Fail to meet Haygood's 5 minute elapsed time window. That "No Glove Cop" is Not Officer Haygood. The Film, Photo, and WC Testimony of Officer Haygood ALL prove this.
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I am going to stick to the Photo/Film EVIDENCE and the Sworn WC Testimony of Haygood.
Officer Haygood - "The railroad would be located at the --- it consists of going over Elm St and back North of Elm St."
Attorney Belin - "What did you do when you got there?
Officer Haygood - "Well, there was nothing. There was quite a few people in the area, spectators, and at the time I WENT BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE it was on the street- to my radio."
Attorney Belin - "Did you see people running away from there?"
Officer Haygood - "No they was all going to it."
Attorney Belin - "Did you talk to any people over there or not?"
Officer Haygood - "In the railroad yard, I talked to one of the people I Presumed to be a detective that was in the yard."
Attorney Belin - "Had he been in the yard before or not?"
Officer Haygood - "No, he was just coming into the yard after I was."
Attorney Belin - "He was coming into the area after the shooting?"
Officer Haygood - "Yes"
Attorney Belin - "Did he say anything to you that you remember?"
Officer Haygood - "Nothing that I remember."
Attorney Belin - "Then what did you do?"
Officer Haygood - I WENT BACK TO MY MOTORCYCLE which was sitting on Elm St."
The Darnell/Martin Films continuously show the "No Glove Cop" walking W-E across the train yard. He's paralleling a Caboose which is attached to several passenger train cars. At No point as he walks across the train yard is the "No Glove Cop" filmed talking with anyone, let alone a Presumed railroad detective. When Exactly do you believe this "No Glove Cop" talked with the presumed railroad detective and then immediately, "Went back to my motorcycle"? We do Not see this "No Glove Cop" engage anyone during his extended Darnell/Martin film coverage. You tell me. Exactly when did this alleged DPD Cop engage/talk with anyone?
We see on the Cancellare Photo that Officer Haygood is directly facing a railroad employee. I believe this is who Haygood "presumed" to be a railroad detective. After talking with him, Haygood did exactly what he said he did. "I went back to my motorcycle which was sitting on Elm St." Haygood basically retraced his steps. He went back over the fence to the Grassy Knoll and then down to his motorcycle below at the curb. Haygood then talked with 2 eyewitnesses, (James Tague being one of them), and immediately made his Documented 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. Officer Haygood's WC testimony regarding his actions fits within the 5 minute elapsed time window between the 12:30 Kill Shot and his 12:35 radio transmission. The Darnell/Martin filmed actions of the "No Glove Cop": (1) Are Contrary to the WC Testimony of Officer Haygood, and (2) Fail to meet Haygood's 5 minute elapsed time window. That "No Glove Cop" is Not Officer Haygood. The Film, Photo, and WC Testimony of Officer Haygood ALL prove this.
The Darnell/Martin Films continuously show the "No Glove Cop" walking W-E across the train yard
The motocop is seen in those films for a few seconds total. You try to extrapolate far too much from that.
We see on the Cancellare Photo that Officer Haygood is directly facing a railroad employee. I believe this is who Haygood "presumed" to be a railroad detective
RR police are Federally chartered police forces. They either wear police uniforms or (in the case of the detectives) are plain-clothesed, as in other police forces. The hat worn by the RR worker in the Cancellare photo marks him as a simple yard worker or a locomotive crewman. Not likely that Haygood would have mistaken him for an RR detective.
Haygood basically retraced his steps
Haygood doesn't actually say this. He didn't say what route he took after he reached the TOP. You just read it into his testimony, because you need it to be a certain way.
Haygood then talked with 2 eyewitnesses, (James Tague being one of them), and immediately made his Documented 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle
The Haygood transmission involving Tague and another man doesn't occur until 12:38. There is only one witness mentioned in the 12:35 report, and that witness is not Tague.
The Film, Photo, and WC Testimony of Officer Haygood ALL prove this
You take what little Haygood says, then read an immense amount out of it, far more than is warranted, bending facts all the way along.
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You're Not alone in being unable to supply Any Evidence what-so-ever that the "No Glove Cop" is DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood. You are now merely 1 more inna very long line that stretches back over the last 60+years. My discovery of the Officer Haygood 12:35 radio transmission, in conjunction with the Photo, Film, and his own WC Testimony, Conclusively Prove he is not the "No Glove Cop" filmed Walking across the train yard and then toward/down the Elm St Ext.
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Just a last update of the route Haygood took through the railroad yard.
Below is a pic by Jim Murray taken shortly after the assassination. Circled on the left is Haygood stood under a tree. Circled on the right is Harkness.
(https://i.postimg.cc/vT8gCMbR/Murray-Haygood-Circled.png) (https://postimages.org/)
There is only one tree in the railroad yard itself. Below is the updated route of Haygood.
1] Haygood gets off his bike
2] Haygood in Cancellare on the underpass
3] Haygood in Darnell behind Craig
4] Haygood in Darnell walking towards TSBD
5] Haygood in Murray pic under the tree
(https://i.postimg.cc/FK81DcnL/Haygood-Route3.png) (https://postimages.org/)
Can Haygood make this route in 5 minutes?
Easily.
Photographic evidence has Haygood at point [2] about 1 min 40 seconds after shooting. This gives him three to four minutes to walk the route. There is absolutely no reason to believe he could not complete the route in this given time. It's easily done.
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Just a last update of the route Haygood took through the railroad yard.
Below is a pic by Jim Murray taken shortly after the assassination. Circled on the left is Haygood stood under a tree. Circled on the right is Harkness.
(https://i.postimg.cc/vT8gCMbR/Murray-Haygood-Circled.png) (https://postimages.org/)
There is only one tree in the railroad yard itself. Below is the updated route of Haygood.
1] Haygood gets off his bike
2] Haygood in Cancellare on the underpass
3] Haygood in Darnell behind Craig
4] Haygood in Darnell walking towards TSBD
5] Haygood in Murray pic under the tree
(https://i.postimg.cc/FK81DcnL/Haygood-Route3.png) (https://postimages.org/)
Can Haygood make this route in 5 minutes?
Easily.
Photographic evidence has Haygood at point [2] about 1 min 40 seconds after shooting. This gives him three to four minutes to walk the route. There is absolutely no reason to believe he could not complete the route in this given time. It's easily done.
Good eye Dan! Looking at the image of Haygood in the Murray photo I see the white helmet. And it appears to me that there is another officer between Haygood and the camera. If I am looking at this correctly, Haygood would be to the right rear of this officer. I agree with your assessment of the walking distance versus time. My rough calculations indicate the round trip route to be a little over 700-feet. I am an old geezer with relatively short legs and can easily walk a casual mile (5280-feet) in about 20-minutes. There is no reason to believe Haygood couldn’t walk the ~700-feet route in 5-minutes. By the way, if you have access to “Pictures of the Pain” by Richard Trask, read about all the things Murray did before taking the photo you posted. He was inside the building near the intersection of Main & Houston (Haygood was just outside the same building on his motorcycle) when the shots were fired. He ran to his car parked near the TSBD loading dock on Houston Street. Then removed some film and reloaded his camera, took some photos near the corner of Elm & Houston, then went to the area where he took the photo you posted. There is another officer in this photo standing on the top of one of the railroad cars.
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You're Not alone in being unable to supply Any Evidence what-so-ever that the "No Glove Cop" is DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood. You are now merely 1 more inna very long line that stretches back over the last 60+years. My discovery of the Officer Haygood 12:35 radio transmission, in conjunction with the Photo, Film, and his own WC Testimony, Conclusively Prove he is not the "No Glove Cop" filmed Walking across the train yard and then toward/down the Elm St Ext.
You've been completely unable to demonstrate your contention that the motorcycle officer in the Darnell film is not Haygood. When we strip off your misconceptions, your misunderstandings, and your miscontruals, all we are left with is a base assertion that "Haygood didn't explicitly say he was in the rail yards behind the knoll." Which isn't really an argument. So now you want to shift the burden of proof, and declare yourself the victor. A quaint strategy, but the rest of us see right through it.
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The Sixth Floor Museum indicates this to be Haygood in the railroad yard/parking area (thanks to James Hackerott for the heads up):
(https://i.vgy.me/I4pbfY.png)
It is Skaggs’ 8th slide. While we have no reasonable way to determine the time of day of this photo, I think that Skaggs made a couple of photos of the entrance to the TSBD (that I assume were made shortly after the above #8 slide) which might be suitable for shadow study resulting in a time of day. And if it can be shown that Skaggs’ TSBD entrance photos were taken later than the above photo, we would have a “before this time” reference for the above photo. The Sixth Floor Museum does have the Skaggs photo collection, but (inexplicably) I am not able to access it online at this time.
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This (from the John Martin film) is reportedly Clyde Haygood with Charles Brehm just after Haygood’s walk through the railroad yard/parking area:
(https://i.vgy.me/cO300j.png)
https://jfkassassinationfiles.wordpress.com/2016/03/28/dca-film/ (https://jfkassassinationfiles.wordpress.com/2016/03/28/dca-film/)
When I viewed the Martin film, it appeared to me that Haygood’s right glove was not on his hand:
(https://i.vgy.me/4my5Zv.png)
8)
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Just a last update of the route Haygood took through the railroad yard.
Below is a pic by Jim Murray taken shortly after the assassination. Circled on the left is Haygood stood under a tree. Circled on the right is Harkness.
(https://i.postimg.cc/vT8gCMbR/Murray-Haygood-Circled.png) (https://postimages.org/)
There is only one tree in the railroad yard itself. Below is the updated route of Haygood.
1] Haygood gets off his bike
2] Haygood in Cancellare on the underpass
3] Haygood in Darnell behind Craig
4] Haygood in Darnell walking towards TSBD
5] Haygood in Murray pic under the tree
(https://i.postimg.cc/FK81DcnL/Haygood-Route3.png) (https://postimages.org/)
Can Haygood make this route in 5 minutes?
Easily.
Photographic evidence has Haygood at point [2] about 1 min 40 seconds after shooting. This gives him three to four minutes to walk the route. There is absolutely no reason to believe he could not complete the route in this given time. It's easily done.
Your posted Murray Photo was taken well after Haygood had already returned to his motorcycle at the Elm Curb. (Even if we ASSUME those DPD Cops are who you claim them to be). And your Haygood route remains incorrect. You still have him running through the Ft. Worth sign. And your #2 Spot on that same diagram is also Wrong regarding where Haygood climbed atop the fence and then came down onto into the railroad yard. I could go on, but even at this very early point in your refutation My Discovery Stands.
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You've been completely unable to demonstrate your contention that the motorcycle officer in the Darnell film is not Haygood. When we strip off your misconceptions, your misunderstandings, and your miscontruals, all we are left with is a base assertion that "Haygood didn't explicitly say he was in the rail yards behind the knoll." Which isn't really an argument. So now you want to shift the burden of proof, and declare yourself the victor. A quaint strategy, but the rest of us see right through it.
So once again you have Failed to provide EXACTLY WHERE Haygood ran into a "presumed" railroad detective, and then went straight back to his motorcycle? This is Not surprising as the "No Glove Cop" is Not Officer Haygood. And you need to consider that 5 Minute window he has. Like everyone else, you consistently FAIL to consider the Haygood tick/tock consumed while he questioned 2 eyewitnesses BEFORE making that 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. And then we also have the "No Glove Cop" not wearing a glove on his (R) Hand vs Officer Haygood clearly Wearing BOTH GLOVES in the Cancellare photo. Photo Evidence + Film Evidence + Haygood's WC Testimony +5 Minute Window + DPD Uniform Disparity PROVE this "No Glove Cop" is Not Haygood.
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Your posted Murray Photo was taken well after Haygood had already returned to his motorcycle at the Elm Curb. (Even if we ASSUME those DPD Cops are who you claim them to be). And your Haygood route remains incorrect. You still have him running through the Ft. Worth sign. And your #2 Spot on that same diagram is also Wrong regarding where Haygood climbed atop the fence and then came down onto into the railroad yard. I could go on, but even at this very early point in your refutation My Discovery Stands.
Your posted Murray Photo was taken well after Haygood had already returned to his motorcycle at the Elm Curb.
According to Richard Trask in his book “Pictures of the Pain”, page 494, the next photo that Murray took is the one that includes Amos Euins and also Hugh Betzner wandering around in the parking lot area. Going by memory, I believe that Harkness radioed about having Amos Euins as a witness and taking him to the car in the front of the TSBD building around 12:36. Therefore it appears that the Murray photo that Dan posted was taken well before 12:36. Trask backs up his information with a lot of references including interviews and correspondence with Murray.
Edit: corrected the time to 12:36.
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Your posted Murray Photo was taken well after Haygood had already returned to his motorcycle at the Elm Curb. (Even if we ASSUME those DPD Cops are who you claim them to be). And your Haygood route remains incorrect. You still have him running through the Ft. Worth sign. And your #2 Spot on that same diagram is also Wrong regarding where Haygood climbed atop the fence and then came down onto into the railroad yard. I could go on, but even at this very early point in your refutation My Discovery Stands.
Your posted Murray Photo was taken well after Haygood had already returned to his motorcycle at the Elm Curb.
What evidence do you have for this claim?
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Your posted Murray Photo was taken well after Haygood had already returned to his motorcycle at the Elm Curb.
According to Richard Trask in his book “Pictures of the Pain”, page 494, the next photo that Murray took is the one that includes Amos Euins and also Hugh Betzner wandering around in the parking lot area. Going by memory, I believe that Harkness radioed about having Amos Euins as a witness and taking him to the car in the front of the TSBD building around 12:36. Therefore it appears that the Murray photo that Dan posted was taken well before 12:06. Trask backs up his information with a lot of references including interviews and correspondence with Murray.
Ouch!
I think that pretty much wraps things up here.
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After leaving the RR yard Murray stood on the grassy knoll and photographed the crowd gathered on N Elm, including the area near the parked motorcycle of Clyde Haygood. His helmet is visible in the photo near his bike. Murray also caught the north peristyle wall with an advancing shadow moving southward about 3-4” per minute. Modeling this wall shadow allows an estimation of the time as 12:36.
(https://i.imgur.com/XwcN8Cr.jpeg)
My original posting on this technique can be found in this forum here.
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2013.msg54679.html#google_vignette
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After leaving the RR yard Murray stood on the grassy knoll and photographed the crowd gathered on N Elm, including the area near the parked motorcycle of Clyde Haygood. His helmet is visible in the photo near his bike. Murray also caught the north peristyle wall with an advancing shadow moving southward about 3-4” per minute. Modeling this wall shadow allows an estimation of the time as 12:36.
(https://i.imgur.com/XwcN8Cr.jpeg)
My original posting on this technique can be found in this forum here.
https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,2013.msg54679.html#google_vignette
Thanks James, excellent work as usual! A few photos later in Murray’s sequence we can see a time displayed on the clock on top of the TSBD as 12:39. Which further supports the accuracy of your shadow technique.
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So once again you have Failed to provide EXACTLY WHERE Haygood ran into a "presumed" railroad detective, and then went straight back to his motorcycle? This is Not surprising as the "No Glove Cop" is Not Officer Haygood. And you need to consider that 5 Minute window he has. Like everyone else, you consistently FAIL to consider the Haygood tick/tock consumed while he questioned 2 eyewitnesses BEFORE making that 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. And then we also have the "No Glove Cop" not wearing a glove on his (R) Hand vs Officer Haygood clearly Wearing BOTH GLOVES in the Cancellare photo. Photo Evidence + Film Evidence + Haygood's WC Testimony +5 Minute Window + DPD Uniform Disparity PROVE this "No Glove Cop" is Not Haygood.
So once again you have Failed to provide EXACTLY WHERE Haygood ran into a "presumed" railroad detective, and then went straight back to his motorcycle?
It was never my responsibility to determine where Haygood ran into his presumed railroad detective. The photographic evidence is sparse enough that there are plenty of opportunities for this that are not on film. It is up to you to show that he had to have run into the detective while on the ballustrade. All you are doing is trying to shift the burden of proof.
And you need to consider that 5 Minute window he has.
You have also singularly failed to show that he could not have been able to make it to the west spur and back to his motorcycle in 5 minutes. The window is also 4-6 minutes long, since we cant be certain of when in 12:30 the shots were fired and where in 12:35 Haygood hit the mic button on his radio.
Having failed all of that, all you can do is capitalize the word "PROVE" like it makes a difference.
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So once again you have Failed to provide EXACTLY WHERE Haygood ran into a "presumed" railroad detective, and then went straight back to his motorcycle?
It was never my responsibility to determine where Haygood ran into his presumed railroad detective. The photographic evidence is sparse enough that there are plenty of opportunities for this that are not on film. It is up to you to show that he had to have run into the detective while on the ballustrade. All you are doing is trying to shift the burden of proof.
And you need to consider that 5 Minute window he has.
You have also singularly failed to show that he could not have been able to make it to the west spur and back to his motorcycle in 5 minutes. The window is also 4-6 minutes long, since we cant be certain of when in 12:30 the shots were fired and where in 12:35 Haygood hit the mic button on his radio.
Having failed all of that, all you can do is capitalize the word "PROVE" like it makes a difference.
I appreciate your attempting to meet my challenge. As I told you, I have a mountain of evidence.
- WC TESTIMONY OF JAMES TAGUE -
Mr TAGUE - "..........After the third shot, I ducked behind the bridge abutment and was there for a second, and as I glanced out, and just as I looked out, the car following the President's car, the one with the Secret Service men was just flying past at that time.
LIEBLER - "Going on Elm St under the Triple Underpass?"
TAGUE - " Right, going on Elm. So I stood there looking around. I looked up--there was a motorcycle policeman, and he had stopped and drawn his weapon and was running up the embankment toward the railroad tracks. A crowd of people, several people were starting to come down into that area where he was running, and the people pointing and excitement up there and so on, and about that time a patrolman who evidently had been stationed under the triple underpass walked up and said "what happened?", and I said "I don't know, something". And we walked up to - by this time the Motorcycle Policeman RETURNED BACK CLOSE to where his motorcycle was, and we walked up there, and there was a man standing there. Seeing that he was very excited, I don't remember his name at this time, I had it on the tip of my tongue very excited saying he was watching the President and it seemed like his head just exploded. This was a COUPLE OR 3 MINUTES AFTER THIS HAPPENED". ...................
Obviously DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood was BACK at his motorcycle well before making that 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. He had to be in order to listen to the eyewitness stories that mandated his making his Documented 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. Officer Haygood was able to be BACK at his motorcycle this quickly due to his retracing his steps and going BACK over the Triple Underpass, jumping BACK onto the Grassy Knoll, and then going BACK Down the grassy knoll to his motorcycle. That is Not Officer Haygood on the Darnell/Martin films walking in front of the caboose, train cars and then Toward/Down the Elm St Ext. During his WC Testimony, Haygood NEVER mentions doing any of this. Per the WC Testimony of James Tague, Officer Haygood was back at his motorcycle within roughly 3 minutes following the Kill Shot.
This is a Major Discovery! My challenge stands due to being supported by a mountain of Evidence.
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Your posted Murray Photo was taken well after Haygood had already returned to his motorcycle at the Elm Curb.
What evidence do you have for this claim?
"Pictures Of The Pain" went into Detail regarding the Murray itinerary on 11/22/63. As with many of the witnesses chronicled in this book, their story jumps around/across many and sometimes hundreds of scattered pages. A dedicated "researcher" needs to follow this disjointed story telling to its' complete conclusion. To set the record straight, Murray was initially inside when the Kill Shot was fired. (5 minute Haygood clock begins running). Murray exited the building and then went to his car and retrieved his camera from the trunk. He then changed the film inside that same camera. After this, he then went Directly to Elm St and took photos. Any of the Murray photos posted on this thread would have been snapped after Officer Haygood's 5 minute window had Expired.
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"Pictures Of The Pain" went into Detail regarding the Murray itinerary on 11/22/63. As with many of the witnesses chronicled in this book, their story jumps around/across many and sometimes hundreds of scattered pages. A dedicated "researcher" needs to follow this disjointed story telling to its' complete conclusion. To set the record straight, Murray was initially inside when the Kill Shot was fired. (5 minute Haygood clock begins running). Murray exited the building and then went to his car and retrieved his camera from the trunk. He then changed the film inside that same camera. After this, he then went Directly to Elm St and took photos. Any of the Murray photos posted on this thread would have been snapped after Officer Haygood's 5 minute window had Expired.
Any of the Murray photos posted on this thread would have been snapped after Officer Haygood's 5 minute window had Expired.
This is apparently your opinion. Trask’s information based on documentation in “Pictures of the Pain” indicate that your opinion is clearly wrong. Here are Trask’s chapter notes (references) at the end of his chapter on Murray and his photos.
(https://i.vgy.me/zNSCnb.jpg)
I don’t know about anyone else, but I prefer to believe Trask has it right. James Hackerott’s work with the shadow-clock also supports Trask’s information.
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Any of the Murray photos posted on this thread would have been snapped after Officer Haygood's 5 minute window had Expired.
This is apparently your opinion. Trask’s information based on documentation in “Pictures of the Pain” indicate that your opinion is clearly wrong. Here are Trask’s chapter notes (references) at the end of his chapter on Murray and his photos.
(https://i.vgy.me/zNSCnb.jpg)
I don’t know about anyone else, but I prefer to believe Trask has it right. James Hackerott’s work with the shadow-clock also supports Trask’s information.
The above "Chapter Notes" says Nothing about Murray taking photos back inside the train yard within 5 Minutes following the Kill Shot. (Officer Haygood's 5 minute window). I guess you do Not have ready access to Trask's "Pictures Of The Pain" and the relevant portions that pertain to Murray. I do have the book and it does contribute to my confidence regarding my groundbreaking discovery that the "No Glove Cop" as filmed by Darnell/Martin is Not Officer Haygood.
I can/will help you. "Pictures Of The Pain" page 491- "Murray noted that the parking spaces on the main streets were off-limits due to the motorcade route. He found a space by the rear loading dock of the TSBD, parking probably illegally......." Page 493 - "Murray estimates that it took him about 3 MINUTES after hearing the 3 reports to get to his car and and prepare his cameras". Page 493- "With the 2 cameras around his neck, he quickly moved to the Elm and Houston street corner near the Book Depository front entrance. "In 3 of Murray's first 4 pictures, his camera jammed...." "The frames were completely over-exposed". " Murray's next frame shows another blank, and it was at this point that he switched lenses to a 35mm wide angle lens".... "I sort of worked my way off that corner, down toward the site of the grassy knoll..........." Page 494 - "Moving westerly along the DIRT Elm Street Extension road into the railroad parking area, Murray squeezed off 2 pictures..............". To recap, Murray consumed 3 minutes just getting to his car and retrieving his cameras from the trunk. From his car parked behind the loading dock, he then went to Elm St and consumed time taking 4 photos. After doing all of this, he then traveled down the DIRT section of the Elm St Ext and took pics in the train yard. Murray took 3 minutes alone to just get to his car and get his cameras out of the trunk. At this point, he only has 2 minutes remaining on Officer Haygood's 5 Minute Window. The Murray Tick/Tock detailed inside "Pictures Of The Pain" reveals his train yard photos to have been snapped More than 5 minutes following the Kill Shot. My discovery that the "No Glove Cop" as filmed by Darnell/Martin is Not Officer Haygood stands!
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The above "Chapter Notes" says Nothing about Murray taking photos back inside the train yard within 5 Minutes following the Kill Shot. (Officer Haygood's 5 minute window). I guess you do Not have ready access to Trask's "Pictures Of The Pain" and the relevant portions that pertain to Murray. I do have the book and it does contribute to my confidence regarding my groundbreaking discovery that the "No Glove Cop as filmed by Darnell/Martin is Not Officer Haygood.
I can/will help you. "Pictures Of The Pain" page 491- "Murray noted that the parking spaces on the main streets were off-limits due to the motorcade route. He found a space by the rear loading dock of the TSBD, parking probably illegally......." Page 493 - "Murray estimates that it took him about 3 MINUTES after hearing the 3 reports to get to his car and and prepare his cameras". Page 493- "With the 2 cameras around his neck, he quickly moved to the Elm and Houston street corner near the Book Depository front entrance. "In 3 of Murray's first 4 pictures, his camera jammed...." "The frames were completely over-exposed". " Murray's next frame shows another blank, and it was at this point that he switched lenses to a 35mm wide angle lens".... "I sort of worked my way off that corner, down toward the site of the grassy knoll..........." Page 494 - "Moving westerly along the DIRT Elm Street Extension road into the railroad parking area, Murray squeezed off 2 pictures..............". To recap, Murray consumed 3 minutes just getting to his car and retrieving his cameras from the trunk. From his car parked behind the loading dock, he then went to Elm St and consumed time taking 4 photos. After doing all of this, he then traveled down the DIRT section of the Elm St Ext and took pics in the train yard. Murray took 3 minutes alone to just get to his car and get his cameras out of the trunk. At this point, he only has 2 minutes remaining on Officer Haygood's 5 Minute Window. The Murray Tick/Tock detailed inside "Pictures Of The Pain" reveals his train yard photos to have been snapped More than 5 minutes following the Kill Shot. My discovery that the "No Glove Cop" as filmed by Darnell/Martin is Not Officer Haygood stands!
…I guess you do Not have ready access to Trask's "Pictures Of The Pain" and the relevant portions that pertain to Murray. I do have the book…
I have the book “Pictures of the Pain.” That is how I was able to take a photo of the Chapter notes and post it in this thread.
The Murray Tick/Tock detailed inside "Pictures Of The Pain" reveals his train yard photos to have been snapped More than 5 minutes following the Kill Shot.
Actually the photos conclusively show that you are wrong. The chapter notes and the detailed description of Murray’s actions clearly show that Trask had numerous communications directly with Murray, that Trask had access to original rolls of film (in which the photos are numbered sequentially) and similarly numbered contact sheets, and that the Murray photos in Trask’s book are in chronological order (the order in which they were taken). Take a look at the third photo with a caption below it that says: “Witnesses Amos Euins and Hugh Betzner are among those wandering around the parking lot area.” In that photo Amos Euins is clearly not being escorted by Harkness. Harkness’ radio message concerning his taking Euins to the front entrance area of the TSBD and depositing him in Sawyer’s car was around 12:36 (if I remember correctly). Therefore the Murray photo had to have been taken well before 12:36 (or else Euins wouldn’t be wandering around unescorted). Now, take a look at the Murray photo which was taken before the one with Euins in it. It is on the same page just above the one with Euins. There is a caption below it that says: “As one cop loos over the area from the top of a railroad car, other people walk among the parked cars.” This is the photo that clearly shows a cop (who is believed to be Haywood) with a white helmet walking near the tree on the left side of the photo. This photo was taken before the one with Euins in it, therefore it also would have to have been well before 12:36. Murray then made another photo looking east back up the Elm Street Extension. After the three photos taken in the parking/railroad yard area, Murray moved southwestward and took another photo of the crowd around Haywood’s motorcycle with Haywood’s helmet clearly showing. James Hackerott expertly timed this photo via the “shadow clock” as being taken at about 12:36. On top of all of Trask’s documentation of Murray’s actions, there is a close-up profile photo of Haywood in the railroad yard that was taken by Jay Skaggs (which I posted earlier in this thread). The Sixth Floor Museum (which has the Skaggs originals in it’s collection) identified this to be Haywood. Therefore, contrary to your opinion and totally unsupported theory of his route, Haywood DID go into the railroad yard.
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…I guess you do Not have ready access to Trask's "Pictures Of The Pain" and the relevant portions that pertain to Murray. I do have the book…
I have the book “Pictures of the Pain.” That is how I was able to take a photo of the Chapter notes and post it in this thread.
The Murray Tick/Tock detailed inside "Pictures Of The Pain" reveals his train yard photos to have been snapped More than 5 minutes following the Kill Shot.
Actually the photos conclusively show that you are wrong. The chapter notes and the detailed description of Murray’s actions clearly show that Trask had numerous communications directly with Murray, that Trask had access to original rolls of film (in which the photos are numbered sequentially) and similarly numbered contact sheets, and that the Murray photos in Trask’s book are in chronological order (the order in which they were taken). Take a look at the third photo with a caption below it that says: “Witnesses Amos Euins and Hugh Betzner are among those wandering around the parking lot area.” In that photo Amos Euins is clearly not being escorted by Harkness. Harkness’ radio message concerning his taking Euins to the front entrance area of the TSBD and depositing him in Sawyer’s car was around 12:36 (if I remember correctly). Therefore the Murray photo had to have been taken well before 12:36 (or else Euins wouldn’t be wandering around unescorted). Now, take a look at the Murray photo which was taken before the one with Euins in it. It is on the same page just above the one with Euins. There is a caption below it that says: “As one cop loos over the area from the top of a railroad car, other people walk among the parked cars.” This is the photo that clearly shows a cop (who is believed to be Haywood) with a white helmet walking near the tree on the left side of the photo. This photo was taken before the one with Euins in it, therefore it also would have to have been well before 12:36. Murray then made another photo looking east back up the Elm Street Extension. After the three photos taken in the parking/railroad yard area, Murray moved southwestward and took another photo of the crowd around Haywood’s motorcycle with Haywood’s helmet clearly showing. James Hackerott expertly timed this photo via the “shadow clock” as being taken at about 12:36. On top of all of Trask’s documentation of Murray’s actions, there is a close-up profile photo of Haywood in the railroad yard that was taken by Jay Skaggs (which I posted earlier in this thread). The Sixth Floor Museum (which has the Skaggs originals in it’s collection) identified this to be Haywood. Therefore, contrary to your opinion and totally unsupported theory of his route, Haywood DID go into the railroad yard.
Please post your "Evidence" regarding the time stamp you are placing on the Murray Photo. I posted Evidence that Murray took 3 pics on Elm St PRIOR to going back into the railroad yard. As I detailed, those photos did not develop due to a lens issue. Therefore, just because a Murray photo is posted as being "3rd", does NOT MEAN it was the 3rd photo that Murray took that day. The overall Tick/Tock does apply to the 3 Murray Photos that did Not develop. And remember, Murray took 3 minutes alone to just get to his car and retrieve his 2 cameras.
I never claimed that Officer Haygood Never went into the rail road yard. My claim is Haygood is Not the "No Glove Cop" as filmed by Darnell/Martin. If you look at Haygood's WC Testimony, he says at some point AFTER making his 12:37 radio transmission from his motorcycle, he THEN went to the back loading dock of the TSBD. Haygood could have been filmed/photographed in this general area at some point AFTER 12:37.
Again, please post your evidence regarding the time lines you are attaching to alleged Officer Haygood photographs or film images. You may not realize it, but your "evidence" may further support my Discovery that the "No Glove Cop" is NOT Officer Haygood.
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Please post your "Evidence" regarding the time stamp you are placing on the Murray Photo. I posted Evidence that Murray took 3 pics on Elm St PRIOR to going back into the railroad yard. As I detailed, those photos did not develop due to a lens issue. Therefore, just because a Murray photo is posted as being "3rd", does NOT MEAN it was the 3rd photo that Murray took that day. The overall Tick/Tock does apply to the 3 Murray Photos that did Not develop. And remember, Murray took 3 minutes alone to just get to his car and retrieve his 2 cameras.
I never claimed that Officer Haygood Never went into the rail road yard. My claim is Haygood is Not the "No Glove Cop" as filmed by Darnell/Martin. If you look at Haygood's WC Testimony, he says at some point AFTER making his 12:37 radio transmission from his motorcycle, he THEN went to the back loading dock of the TSBD. Haygood could have been filmed/photographed in this general area at some point AFTER 12:37.
Again, please post your evidence regarding the time lines you are attaching to alleged Officer Haygood photographs or film images. You may not realize it, but your "evidence" may further support my Discovery that the "No Glove Cop" is NOT Officer Haygood.
Please post your "Evidence" regarding the time stamp you are placing on the Murray Photo.
It is simple. Harkness radioed in that he had Amos Euins with him at approximately 12:36. Here is Harkness’ testimony to support this:
Mr. HARKNESS - This area.
Mr. BELIN - You are pointing to a place between what would be the extension of Elm that doesn't go down into the parkway but the actual extension of Elm?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes; to the plaza area.
Mr. BELIN - The plaza area?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What did you find there?
Mr. HARKNESS - I found a little colored boy, Amos Euins, who told me he saw the shots come from that building.
Mr. BELIN - Now you just picked out a little small book, one of those little pocket notebooks?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Or a notepad from your pocket here. Is that the original notation that you made?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - When did you make that notation?
Mr. HARKNESS - Immediately after the shooting.
Mr. BELIN - Is that your own record that you have kept in your possession since then?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir. I turned.
Mr. BELIN - You turned what?
Mr. HARKNESS - After I took his name and address and put this information on the radio, I then took him on the back of my three-wheel motorcycle and put him in Inspector Sawyer's car.
Mr. BELIN - Now you mentioned that you put something on the radio here, and I hand you here what has been marked as Sawyer Deposition Exhibit A. Before doing that, do you remember what call number you used, you were using on that day?
Mr. HARKNESS - I believe 260.
Mr. BELIN - Well, I notice here that there is a call with a notation at 12:36 p.m., 260 to 531. 531 is your office in the main station?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What does it say there on that transcript?
Mr. HARKNESS - "Witness says shots came from fifth floor, Texas Book Depository store at Houston and Elm. I have him with me now and we are sealing off the building."
Mr. BELIN - All right, that was at 12:36 p.m.?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
The third Murray photo in Trask’s book “Pictures of the Pain” (not Murray’s third attempt to make a photo, some attempts were completely over exposed) clearly shows Amos Euins wandering in the parking/railroad yard area unescorted by Harkness. Therefore this photo was taken well before Harkness found Euins, listened to his story, and got to his motorcycle and radioed his message in at approximately 12:36. Do you understand this logic?
The second Murray photo in Trask’s book was taken before the photo with Euins in it. Therefore this photo was also taken well before approximately 12:36. This photo shows a cop (who is believed to be Haygood) with a white helmet walking near the tree on the left side of the photo. Do you understand this logic?
Murray took one additional photo (the fourth Murray photo in Trask’s book) looking east up the Elm Street extension before he headed southwest to the grassy knoll and took another photo (the fifth Murray photo in Trask’s book) of the crowd including the people around Haygood’s motorcycle. Haygood’s helmet can be seen in this photo. James Hackerott verified via the shadow clock that this photo (the fifth Murray photo in Trask’s book) was taken at approximately 12:36. James’ work supports the above logical inferences that the first four Murray photos in Trask’s book were taken before 12:36. In other words: If the fifth photo in Trask’s book was taken at approximately 12:36 the previous four photos were taken before 12:36. Do you understand this logic?
Now, if you understand and apply the three logical inferences above. The Harkness testimony regarding the timing and the meaning of his radio message (confirms that it is regarding Amos Euins) and the actual radio tape recordings are the evidence that places the time stamp on Murray’s photos.
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Please post your "Evidence" regarding the time stamp you are placing on the Murray Photo.
It is simple. Harkness radioed in that he had Amos Euins with him at approximately 12:36. Here is Harkness’ testimony to support this:
Mr. HARKNESS - This area.
Mr. BELIN - You are pointing to a place between what would be the extension of Elm that doesn't go down into the parkway but the actual extension of Elm?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes; to the plaza area.
Mr. BELIN - The plaza area?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What did you find there?
Mr. HARKNESS - I found a little colored boy, Amos Euins, who told me he saw the shots come from that building.
Mr. BELIN - Now you just picked out a little small book, one of those little pocket notebooks?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - Or a notepad from your pocket here. Is that the original notation that you made?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - When did you make that notation?
Mr. HARKNESS - Immediately after the shooting.
Mr. BELIN - Is that your own record that you have kept in your possession since then?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir. I turned.
Mr. BELIN - You turned what?
Mr. HARKNESS - After I took his name and address and put this information on the radio, I then took him on the back of my three-wheel motorcycle and put him in Inspector Sawyer's car.
Mr. BELIN - Now you mentioned that you put something on the radio here, and I hand you here what has been marked as Sawyer Deposition Exhibit A. Before doing that, do you remember what call number you used, you were using on that day?
Mr. HARKNESS - I believe 260.
Mr. BELIN - Well, I notice here that there is a call with a notation at 12:36 p.m., 260 to 531. 531 is your office in the main station?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
Mr. BELIN - What does it say there on that transcript?
Mr. HARKNESS - "Witness says shots came from fifth floor, Texas Book Depository store at Houston and Elm. I have him with me now and we are sealing off the building."
Mr. BELIN - All right, that was at 12:36 p.m.?
Mr. HARKNESS - Yes, sir.
The third Murray photo in Trask’s book “Pictures of the Pain” (not Murray’s third attempt to make a photo, some attempts were completely over exposed) clearly shows Amos Euins wandering in the parking/railroad yard area unescorted by Harkness. Therefore this photo was taken well before Harkness found Euins, listened to his story, and got to his motorcycle and radioed his message in at approximately 12:36. Do you understand this logic?
The second Murray photo in Trask’s book was taken before the photo with Euins in it. Therefore this photo was also taken well before approximately 12:36. This photo shows a cop (who is believed to be Haygood) with a white helmet walking near the tree on the left side of the photo. Do you understand this logic?
Murray took one additional photo (the fourth Murray photo in Trask’s book) looking east up the Elm Street extension before he headed southwest to the grassy knoll and took another photo (the fifth Murray photo in Trask’s book) of the crowd including the people around Haygood’s motorcycle. Haygood’s helmet can be seen in this photo. James Hackerott verified via the shadow clock that this photo (the fifth Murray photo in Trask’s book) was taken at approximately 12:36. James’ work supports the above logical inferences that the first four Murray photos in Trask’s book were taken before 12:36. In other words: If the fifth photo in Trask’s book was taken at approximately 12:36 the previous four photos were taken before 12:36. Do you understand this logic?
Now, if you understand and apply the three logical inferences above. The Harkness testimony regarding the timing and the meaning of his radio message (confirms that it is regarding Amos Euins) and the actual radio tape recordings are the evidence that places the time stamp on Murray’s photos.
Thanks, but I am interested in FACTS. "Logical inferences"? "BELIEVED to be Haygood" and "Well Before" are Not facts. Same goes for the "Approximate" timeline resulting from the "shadow" work.
The 12:36 Harkness radio transmission is a Fact, but of course, this would be After the 12:35 radio transmission of Officer Haygood. This is my opinion, but that Murray photo'd White Helmeted cop is the "No Glove Cop". Haygood was Mis-ID'd walking across the train yard, and you are now compounding that Error with your echoing the erroneous Haygood ID on the Murray Photo. Remember, Murray said it took him 3 minutes alone to just get to his car and retrieve his cameras. Murray now has Only 2 Minutes to get back to Elm St and shoot 4 pics there BEFORE heading down the Elm Ext and taking the Euins photo. And during this same 2 Minute time period, Murray is slowly coming to the realization that shots were fired/ JFK has been shot. Up to this point, Murray thought the pops he heard were fire crackers. Murray is in No Hurry as he walks back from his car and eventually begins taking the 4 photos on Elm St. With Officer Haygood having made No Mention of walking across the train yard and then down the Elm Ext, his being ID'd as this cop on the Darnell/Martin Films is either an Egregious Error or like the Warren Report itself, part of the effort to button up the JFK Assassination ASAP. Haygood's WC Testimony is a FACT. He makes No Mention of ever checking out a caboose, train cars, passenger train cars, or helping with crowd control back in the train yard. He also says Nothing about walking down the Elm Ext. Haygood says he spoke with what he "Presumed" was a rail road detective. We see part of this convo in the Cancellare Photo as Haygood stood atop the Triple Underpass. The Cancellare Photo is a FACT. Haygood making that 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle is a FACT. The WC Testimony of James Tague and his detailing that he saw Haygood BACK at his motorcycle at roughly 3:00 AFTER the Kill Shot further supports My Groundbreaking Discovery. Officer Haygood climbed onto the top of Triple Underpass, talked with a "presumed" railroad detective, saw nothing going on, and then went right back to his motorcycle. Tague cements this being the case. And remember, Officer Haygood has BOTH Gloves on in the Cancellare Photo as he stands atop the Triple Underpass. That "NO Glove Cop" in the Darnell/Martin Films is Not Haygood. My challenge stands!
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Thanks, but I am interested in FACTS. "Logical inferences"? "BELIEVED to be Haygood" and "Well Before" are Not facts. Same goes for the "Approximate" timeline resulting from the "shadow" work.
The 12:36 Harkness radio transmission is a Fact, but of course, this would be After the 12:35 radio transmission of Officer Haygood. This is my opinion, but that Murray photo'd White Helmeted cop is the "No Glove Cop". Haygood was Mis-ID'd walking across the train yard, and you are now compounding that Error with your echoing the erroneous Haygood ID on the Murray Photo. Remember, Murray said it took him 3 minutes alone to just get to his car and retrieve his cameras. Murray now has Only 2 Minutes to get back to Elm St and shoot 4 pics there BEFORE heading down the Elm Ext and taking the Euins photo. And during this same 2 Minute time period, Murray is slowly coming to the realization that shots were fired/ JFK has been shot. Up to this point, Murray thought the pops he heard were fire crackers. Murray is in No Hurry as he walks back from his car and eventually begins taking the 4 photos on Elm St. With Officer Haygood having made No Mention of walking across the train yard and then down the Elm Ext, his being ID'd as this cop on the Darnell/Martin Films is either an Egregious Error or like the Warren Report itself, part of the effort to button up the JFK Assassination ASAP. Haygood's WC Testimony is a FACT. He makes No Mention of ever checking out a caboose, train cars, passenger train cars, or helping with crowd control back in the train yard. He also says Nothing about walking down the Elm Ext. Haygood says he spoke with what he "Presumed" was a rail road detective. We see part of this convo in the Cancellare Photo as Haygood stood atop the Triple Underpass. The Cancellare Photo is a FACT. Haygood making that 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle is a FACT. The WC Testimony of James Tague and his detailing that he saw Haygood BACK at his motorcycle at roughly 3:00 AFTER the Kill Shot further supports My Groundbreaking Discovery. Officer Haygood climbed onto the top of Triple Underpass, talked with a "presumed" railroad detective, saw nothing going on, and then went right back to his motorcycle. Tague cements this being the case. And remember, Officer Haygood has BOTH Gloves on in the Cancellare Photo as he stands atop the Triple Underpass. That "NO Glove Cop" in the Darnell/Martin Films is Not Haygood. My challenge stands!
. "Logical inferences"?
Yes, absolutely, logical inferences are an essential part of the fact finding process. Here is a snip from a pattern jury instruction regarding this process:
In considering the evidence, you are permitted to draw such reasonable inferences from the testimony and exhibits as you feel are justied in the light of com- mon experience. In other words, you may make deduc- tions and reach conclusions that reason and common sense lead you to draw from the facts which have been established by the evidence.
(https://www.lb5.uscourts.gov/juryinstructions/fifth/crim2015.pdf)
Courts are interested in finding the truth in order to try to conduct fair trials. Are you interested in finding the truth? Or are you only interested in considering whatever “facts” you think promote your ideas?
If you think the logic or conclusions I presented are faulty, then present your argument against the logic or conclusions. Otherwise:
(https://i.vgy.me/Xp1cgQ.jpg)
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. "Logical inferences"?
Yes, absolutely, logical inferences are an essential part of the fact finding process. Here is a snip from a pattern jury instruction regarding this process:
In considering the evidence, you are permitted to draw such reasonable inferences from the testimony and exhibits as you feel are justied in the light of com- mon experience. In other words, you may make deduc- tions and reach conclusions that reason and common sense lead you to draw from the facts which have been established by the evidence.
(https://www.lb5.uscourts.gov/juryinstructions/fifth/crim2015.pdf)
Courts are interested in finding the truth in order to try to conduct fair trials. Are you interested in finding the truth? Or are you only interested in considering whatever “facts” you think promote your ideas?
If you think the logic or conclusions I presented are faulty, then present your argument against the logic or conclusions. Otherwise:
(https://i.vgy.me/Xp1cgQ.jpg)
".....from the FACTS which has been established by the EVIDENCE". This is the Bar to which I hold myself and the foundation of the the Discovery I have established as Now being Fact. The FACT of DPD Motorcycle Officer Haygood making a 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle at the Elm St curb has NEVER Previously been considered with regard to the timeline of the "No Glove Cop" captured on the Darnell/Martin Films. The FACT of there being Only a 5 Minute Window between the 12:30 Kill Shot and Officer Haygood's 12:35 radio transmission rules Haygood out as being the "No Glove Cop" captured on the Darnell/Martin Films. The WC Testimony of James Tague seeing Officer Haygood BACK at his motorcycle within 3 minutes following the Kill Shot, corroborates Officer Haygood NOT being the "No Glove Cop" filmed by Darnell/Martin back inside the train yard and then walking down the Elm St Ext. My Fact Based Challenge to this Forum stands!
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And while we are on the subject of Boner ID's, my Discovery/Challenge Stands!! That is Not Officer Haygood on the Darnell/Martin Films.
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I have Proven that the DPD Motorcycle Officer we see on the Darnell and Martin Films is NOT OFFICER HAYGOOD. My putting this Urban Legend to bed after 60+ yrs has resulted in suddenly silencing the entire LN Community that inundates this forum 24/7. My discovery in conjunction with the Knott Labs Laser 360 SCIENCE recently Proving that the SBT "IS IMPOSSIBLE", now provides the foundation for declaring that a Conspiracy was used to assassinate JFK. With respect to my having Proven that Officer Haygood is not the alleged DPD Motorcycle Cop on the Darnell and Martin films, I now ask the suddenly silent LN Community: (1) Specifically WHO is this alleged DPD Cop on the Darnell & Martin Films?, (2) Where is his Motorcycle?, and (3) Why is he wearing Only 1 Glove? (Officer Haygood clearly wore 2 gloves as he stood atop the Triple Underpass on the Cancellare Photo). I await answers to these questions from the "cat got their tongues" LN Community.
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Buddy Walther is also identified in the image/film in question. His testimony indicates he ran to the railroad yards and went over a fence then walked over to the area between Elm and Main streets to look for signs of bullets having been fired. There he encounters Tague. Here’s a snip from Tague’s testimony:
Mr. LIEBELER. Going on Elm Street under the triple underpass?
Mr. TAGUE. Right. Going on Elm. So I stood there looking around. I looked up---there was a motorcycle policeman, and he stopped and had drawn his gun and was running up the embankment toward the railroad tracks. A crowd of people; several people, were starting to come down into that area where he was running, and the people pointing, and excitement up there and so on, and about that time a patrolman who evidently had been stationed under the triple underpass walked up and said, "What happened?" and I said, "I don't know; something."
And we walked up to the---by this time the motorcycle policeman returned back close to where his motorcycle was, and we walked up there and there was a man standing there. Seeing that he was very excited--I don't remember his name at the time I did have it on the tip of my tongue very excited saying he was watching the President and it seemed like his head just exploded. This was a couple or 3 minutes after this happened. And the patrolman said, "Well, I saw something fly off back on the street."
We walked back down there, and another man joined us who identified himself as the deputy sheriff, who was in civilian clothes, and I guess this was 3 or 4 minutes after. I don't know how to gage time on something like that.
And I says, "Well, you know now, I recall something sting me on the face while I was standing down there."
And he looked up and he said, "Yes; you have blood there on your cheek."
And I reached up and there was a couple of drops of blood. And he said, "Where were you standing?"
And I says, "Right down here." We walked 15 feet away when this deputy sheriff said, "Look here on the curb." There was a mark quite obviously that was a bullet, and it was very fresh.
We turned around and we looked back up to see where this possibly could have come from, and the policeman thought he had seen something over here.
Tague’s testimony suggests that he saw Haygood draw his gun and run up the knoll toward the railroad tracks then return to his motorcycle a few minutes later. Also, Walthers appears in the same vicinity as Tague at about the same time that Haygood returns to his motorcycle. The Darnell film appears to show Walthers, the one gloved motorcycle officer in question, and Harkness in the same area in the railroad yard/Elm Street Extension vicinity.
Based on the above sequence, it appears that my assumption that the image was taken after Harkness had already deposited Euins in front of the TSBD was wrong. Based on Walthers’ and Tague’s accounts, it now appears to me that the Darnell film clip was taken earlier than I first thought. If Walthers can run from the Sheriff’s office area to the railroad yards, look around quickly, then walk back to Tague’s location all within about 5 or 6 minutes or so. And, similarly, Harkness can go where he did and get back to the railroad yards in time to be in the Darnell clip, then I see no reason to believe that Haygood couldn’t make it back to his motorcycle from the railroad yard in time to make the radio call.
Where are the FACTS that lead you to claim that, 'Walthers appears in the same vicinity as Tague at about the same time that Haygood returns to his motorcycle"? I know of a photo showing Walthers over by that manhole cover at 12:39. What FACT(s) do you have to get him down on Elm St by Haygood's 12:35 radio transmission?
It is a FACT that Tague gave WC Testimony that he saw Officer Haygood BACK at his motorcycle within 2-3 Minutes. It is a FACT that Officer Haygood was wearing GLOVES on Both hands in the Cancellare Photo showing him standing atop the Triple Underpass. The alleged motorcycle cop WALKING in front of the passenger train cars and then toward/down the Elm St Ext is NOT wearing a glove on his (R) Hand. Officer Haygood during his WC Testimony did NOT mention EVER walking alongside passenger train cars, or walking behind Roger Craig or Buddy Walthers, or anything close to that. It is a FACT that to the contrary, Haygood said "WELL,THERE WAS NOTHING" with regard to what was inside the train yard. These are HARD FACTS which support my Groundbreaking Discovery. Haygood had already consumed 2:00 when he came down from standing atop the Triple Underpass and landed inside the railroad yard. This leaves him ONLY 3:00 MINUTES remaining on his 5:00 window. He still would need to travel down to that line of passenger train cars, WALK along them as we see him doing on the Darnell/Martin Films, then WALK toward/down the Elm St Ext, and even then he still needs to get to his motorcycle. Even at that point, he would Still need to interview the witnesses that prompted him to make his 12:35 radio transmission. That "No Glove Cop" is Not Officer Haygood. This "No Glove Cop" needs to be ID'd. Short of an official ID, he is an imposture and we have a Conspiracy that has been hiding in plain sight for 60+ years.
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For starters, between points #1 & #2, you have Officer Haygood running straight through the Ft Worth sign.
:D :D :D
You funny.
The No Glove Cop does Not WALK toward the Pergola. Take the time and closely examine the Darnell/Martin Films. Through my research, I have untangled Officer Haygood's entire journey and how he was able to back at his motorcycle make his 12:35 radio transmission.
Point#4 is where Haygood is filmed in Darnell walking towards the TSBD building. You don't have a clue what he does after this point.
If Haygood is to get back to his bike in time to make his radio call then this is an approximation of the route he took. We know after he is filmed in Darnell, Haygood is back at his bike making his 12:35pm radio call.
And you've untangled Haygood's entire journey??
I've yet to hear this.
Please explain his full journey from the time he gets off his bike to the time he makes his radio call, and the evidence this timeline is based on?
As I understand it you have Haygood at the Triple Underpass for at least 4 minutes (12:34pm). How does he get round the railroad yard and back to his bike for his 12:35pm radio call
Please read the WC Testimony of Officer Haygood. He tells us EVERYTHING he did. He ran up the Grassy Knoll with his gun drawn because he saw a couple of people running back in that direction. When Haygood got to the top of the Grassy Knoll/Triple Underpass and could see into the railroad yard, (Cabluck Photo), his testimony is, "Well, there was nothing". He then climbs atop the Triple Underpass, (Canncellare Photo), and jumps down into the railroad yard. He then encounters what he "presumed" to be a railroad detective, and then, "I went back to my motorcycle, which was sitting on Elm St". He makes No Mention of WALKING across the train yard behind the Pergola or WALKING Toward/Down the Elm St Extension. On the Darnell and Martin Films, we do Not see that alleged DPD Motorcycle Cop encounter the "presumed" railroad detective that Officer Haygood mentioned in his WC Testimony. I believe after climbing over the Triple Underpass and then encountering the "presumed" railroad detective right there in the train yard, Haygood did exactly what he said he did, "I went back to my motorcycle, which was sitting on Elm St". Officer Haygood went back over the top of the Triple Underpass and moved down the Grassy Knoll to his motorcycle there at the Elm St curb. The Officer Haygood timeline of returning to his motorcycle is verified by the Warren Commission testimony of James Tague when he said, "This was a couple or 3 minutes after this happened". Then Haygood began interviewing eyewitnesses which mandated his making his documented 12:35 radio transmission from his motorcycle. The Haygood ID of being that DPD motorcycle cop on the Darnell and Martin Films is flat-out wrong. The Haygood and Tague WC testimonies proves this, both cops being dressed differently proves this, and the 5 Minute Window between the 12:30 Kill Shot and Haygood's 12:35 radio transmission proves this too. I have proven from many different directions that the Officer Haygood ID on the Darnell & Martin films is wrong. "No Brag, Just FACT"!