JFK Assassination Forum
JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => JFK Assassination Discussion & Debate => Topic started by: Charles Collins on May 01, 2023, 03:30:32 PM
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In the immediate aftermath of the assassination there were various human reactions. From Alyea’s reactions to Zapruder’s reactions (A to Z) and everything in between, the reactions were varied. Some people tend to react to crisis situations with calmness, while others tend to have emotional breakdowns. Much has (understandably) been written about Jack Ruby’s reactions. But there was almost universal human reaction to the assassination around the world. Initially, there was a lot of confusion, uncertainty, and speculation. And the resulting fear was widespread. From the Secret Service’s response (keeping LBJ out of sight and rushing him away from Dallas, etc.), to Governor Connally’s large security forces that were stationed at Parkland Hospital, the fear was real and widespread.
This thread is intended for discussion of some of the reactions. I will begin with one that most people have probably never heard of:
Thirty-two miles to the west of Dallas, Ft. Worth Chamber of Commerce President Raymond Buck, a prominent insurance executive, was plunged into deep depression at the shocking news. Only hours earlier, after all, he had presided over a triumphant high point of the Texas tour. Now, having been one of the civic leaders who had pleaded with the president to come to Fort Worth and other Texas cities, he felt a personal responsibility for his death. His despondency was so deep that he refused to go in to his office for three months, according to his daughter, Kay Buck McDermott.
Julian Read, “JFK’s Final Hours In Texas”, page 80.
Your turn…
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Saturday morning at Parkland confirmed that all that had happened was not just a bad dream. Newspaper headlines, radios, and television screens still screamed the shock that we had just lived through and continued to face.
Evidence of the nightmare continued to abound. Armed state troopers seemed to be everywhere.
Still uncertain about a possible larger security threat, they had painted the hospital windows black in Governor Connally’s area and had installed thick steel plates to deflect any incoming gunfire. …
Julian Read, “JFK’s Final Hours In Texas”, page 92
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Jack Ruby would get a lot of fan mail. Surprised there weren't wholesale public lynchings of "commies".
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Jack Ruby would get a lot of fan mail. Surprised there weren't wholesale public lynchings of "commies".
There was a lot of emotional reactions. Many people have said that some of the crowd gathered in front of the Texas Theater when LHO was arrested was ready to lynch him…
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Dr. Shaw and other dedicated staff members at Parkland had worked their medical magic by now, and thanks to their skills, the governor had survived a very close call. Beyond physical trauma, he experienced recurring nightmares in which a gunman always chased him.
Julian Read, “JFK’s Final Hours In Texas”, page 99.
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Many declared Dallas the “City of Hate” for the first crime. It’s police department was derided as “Keystone Cops” for permitting the second.
There were quick, broad, and brutal expressions of anger. Dallas Mayor Earle Cabell received death threats and required police protection when he and San Antonio Mayor Walter McAllister attended the Kennedy funeral services in Washington D.C. Texas Attorney General Waggoner Carr was forcefully pinned against the back of a hotel elevator by an antagonistic crowd when he represented Texas at the same events.
A prominent Dallas business leader was thrown out of a New York taxicab when the driver learned he was from Dallas.
As further evidence of the fury toward Dallas, Southern Methodist University historian Darwin Payne points to a sheaf of letters in the school’s DeGolyer Library attacking Cabell for the two murders. Payne covered the assassination as a young reporter for the Dallas Times Herald.
A current Dallas leader remembers that as a youngster he and fellow Boy Scouts were warned in advance about reaction they might receive on an upcoming visit to Pennsylvania when people saw the Dallas patch on their uniforms.
Then twelve-year old Robert Decherd, now a chairman of Dallas’s Belo Corporation, had a similar experience on a trip with his parents to England and Ireland.
“When they found out you were from Dallas, their entire expressions changed, and in clear indications… they let you know they didn’t want to know you,” he recalls.
A Dallas business owner dependent on direct-mail orders was forced to change her postal address to nearby Arlington, Texas, when her orders dropped 90 percent following the assassination.
Julian Read, “JFK’s Final Hours In Texas”, pages 105-106.
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Apart from emotional reactions, it is very interesting to see that very few people dunked or made any sudden move when heard gun shots in the very near distance. Gun shots are very loud, making people to dunk, ley down, search for cover, look at the sound direction... Very few reactions like this after three fun shots.
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Apart from emotional reactions, it is very interesting to see that very few people dunked or made any sudden move when heard gun shots in the very near distance. Gun shots are very loud, making people to dunk, ley down, search for cover, look at the sound direction... Very few reactions like this after three fun shots.
Yes, it is interesting to see the various reactions. I think it was very sudden and unexpected and was finished within only a short time. Many people apparently didn’t realize they were gunshots until after it was over. Zapruder, Altgens, Dillard, and some others kept right on taking their images. While some of the others “hit the dirt”, etc. And then there was some others who ran towards the area where they thought the shots came from. Definitely a varied response.
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One of the early conspiracy books, "Who Killed Kennedy?" (May 1964) by Thomas Buchanan, promoted the idea that the City of Dallas and Texas were behind the assassination. Oswald had been given a job in a "municipal" building (ie: the Texas School Depository Bldg, which is actually a private concern). A Texas oilman was behind the assassination. Officer Tippit (supposedly a right-wing member of the right-wing Dallas Police) fired from the Oswald window while a co-conspirator fired from the rail-bridge. Then Tippit was himself murdered to further frame young Lee. Buchanan based much of his "research" on newspaper articles that he had read while working in France.
Sylvia Meagher wrote one of the most influential books for CTs, called "Accessories After the Fact" in which she argued the Dallas Police were complicit in the assassination and alleged cover-up (though she didn't use the word alleged). Meagher was a NYC "Liberal" with a bias towards the South and conservatives. Penn Jones Jr. wrote of the "big league boys in Dallas".
Dallas, at the time, was largely ruled by the Dallas Citizens Council, a group of several hundred businessmen, most of whom were in banking and insurance. The City Council and Mayor were secondary. The Dallas Citizens Council should not be confused with the segregationist White Citizens Councils. The Dallas Citizens Council weighed the consequences of resisting integration of its schools and produced a film ("Dallas at the Crossroads" 1961) promoting integration, which went ahead in Dallas. The "shadowy" "ultra-conservative" Dallas Citizens Council (even if their measured decisions were mainly meant to ensure prosperity and keeping the races from each others' throats) became the basis for some conspiratorati that the city facilitated the assassination and much of the "cover-up".
The Shaw Trial suggested that the seeds of the assassination could have occurred in another city. Then came the King assassination in Memphis and the RFK assassination in Los Angeles, and it seemed rather silly to blame a city per se. It would be like saying nothing changed in NYC after the murder of Kitty Genovese, in Beantown after the Boston Strangler, and Chicago after Richard Speck. Today's JFK assassination "conspirators du jour" go way beyond the municipal level and the power of one oilman. It's almost quaint that the city was once singled out.
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Apart from emotional reactions, it is very interesting to see that very few people dunked or made any sudden move when heard gun shots in the very near distance. Gun shots are very loud, making people to dunk, ley down, search for cover, look at the sound direction... Very few reactions like this after three fun shots.
There were say instant reactions from say 2 public near Oswald at shot-1 & shot-2 (Brennan, Euins)(diving for cover), & say 8 instant reactions from say 10 public near Hickey at shots-3-4-5-6-7 (laying down, running away).
Why weren't there any instant reactions near Oswald at Oswald's supposed shot-3? Koz there woz no Oswald shot-3.
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It does SEEM like most of the people were not reacting to 3loud rifle shots in the timely response that we as observers 60 years later, are speculating they theoretically should have.
One would think the combat veteran Brehm at least would have recognized the very FIRST loud noise as a rifle shot and have reacted quicker in some way like diving to the ground.
It could be that the 1st loud shot everyone heard was not that different from some previous motorcycle backfires so they may have already been slightly desensitized to a loud noise by that.
However if there were 2 more shots that were equally spaced apart about 3 secs each and the total time was 8-9 secs, then is it not more probable that the Newmans and the 3 men on the GK steps and those women right near the JFK limo should be more animated than they appear to be?
So this suggests the 2/3rd ear witness descriptions of 2 shots very close together was an accurate evaluation and that 3 shots were fired more likely in about just 4.8 secs of time.
If so, then this might explain why the reactions which seem delayed are because of the ”shock effect” of an extremely horrifying stimulus being completed in such a short span of time.
This is why imo, 3 shots over 4.8 secs (substantiated by closest earwitness Harold Normans spacing demonstration) with the last 2 shots only about 1 sec apart leads to a higher probability that a semi auto rifle was the murder weapon rather than a bolt action MC rifle which with rate if fire at best only 2.5 secs per shot on average.
Note: there was ONE old guy on the CBS time trial shooting experiment that they CLAIM shot 3 shots with the MC rifle in only 5.1 secs and scored 3 hits on the moving target body ( but missed the head entirely)