Author Topic: Lifton to DiEugenio - You're a conspiracy nut!  (Read 33630 times)

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Offline David S Lifton

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Re: Lifton to DiEugenio - You're a conspiracy nut!
« Reply #98 on: July 01, 2013, 10:24:48 AM »
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DVP has given an excellent rebuttal to DSL's theory on body alteration.  Simple, direct, specific in detail.  There is so much evidence contrary to this theory that reasonable credible individuals can only shake their heads.  I believe most people who have followed this case, whether CT or LN have or had a high regard for JFK.  This is what makes the issue of his death so emotional.  For DSL to accuse DVP of having no respect for JFK is insulting.  While I believe DSL has promoted a theory right out of a Hollywood Sci Fi movie, I have no doubt he too respects JFK. 

More "clean-up" to DVP's garbage. He writes:
"Any casket that arrived at Bethesda Naval Hospital at 6:35 PM EST quite obviously did NOT and could NOT have contained the body of John F. Kennedy. Any such 6:35 casket entry must have been associated with some other case entirely. Especially if it involved a plain "shipping casket"."

The casket that arrived at 6:35 PM obviously contained the body of John F. Kennedy, because:

(a) The report that it arrived at 6:35 PM is that of USMC Sgt Roger Boyajian, whose ten-man team was assigned to the morgue specifically for the purpose of providing morgue security, in connection with the arrival of the President's body.

(b) THe document was found because of another at the Gerald Ford Library stating that Boyajian's unit had been nominated for a commendation for the good work they had done.

(What do you think, DVP: That they wrote a report about the arrival of another body??  what kind of assinine position is that?)

(c ) The group that actually carried the casket into the morgue included Donald Rebentisch, and they were organized by Dennis David. I interviewed both men. They carried the casket they were told contained President Kennedy's body to the morgue entrance.

(d) Inside the morgue, that casket was received by Bethesda medical technician Paul O'Connor, and opened by him and others.

(e) Inside the casket was a body bag.

(f) That body bag was opened by O'Connor.

(g) Inside the body bag was the body of JFK.

(h) When Humes was asked, under oath, by the ARRB when he first saw the body, he said approximately 6:45 PM.

So that's the evidence, DVP. Of course, you can make a hobby of lying about these facts on the Internet, and be under the illusion (or delusion) that you are convincing someone. . but those are the facts.

Now please tell me whose body you think was delivered to the morgue at 6:35 PM if it wasn't Kennedy's?  Do you have a name?  Do you have any credible witnesses who will say that any other body was brought to the morgue?

Why don't you call up your pal --you know, you're "playpal" (rhymes with "paypal") and ask him for suggestions?

That's what lawyers are trained to do, you know: to sell evidence to juries, and to bend reality.

So if you think Kennedy's body wasn't delivered to the morgue, at 6:35 pm, in a shipping casket, as all the evidence clearly indicates, then tell us whose body was delivered?

DSL
7/1/13; 2:25 AM PDT
Los Angeles, California

Offline James Gordon

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Re: Lifton to DiEugenio - You're a conspiracy nut!
« Reply #99 on: July 01, 2013, 10:46:46 AM »
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The casket that arrived at 6:35 PM obviously contained the body of John F. Kennedy,

David, 

Is such a timing realistic.

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Doing  a search on the internet I see that the straight line distance between the two is 18 Miles as the crow flies.

However traveling by car is 28 mines.

Manchester states that the plane arrived at 6:05. From that time has to be added the time to off load and enter the cars and ambulance.

At best if you add 5 minutes, which is probably too short, to the change over you then have 28 miles to drive in 25 minutes.

Does that seem realistic to you?

James

Online David Von Pein

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    • THE ASSASSINATION OF JOHN F. KENNEDY: A LONE-GUNMAN VIEWPOINT
Re: Lifton to DiEugenio - You're a conspiracy nut!
« Reply #100 on: July 01, 2013, 02:40:57 PM »
@James Gordon,

And let's also remember, too, that according to David Lifton's theory, it's an ALREADY ALTERED BODY of John Kennedy that arrived at Bethesda at 6:35 PM EST.

Lifton doesn't think the "alterations" to JFK's body were performed at Bethesda, which means (unless Lifton has decided to crawl into bed with Doug Horne regarding WHERE the alleged body altertions were done) that the body had to be secretly removed from Air Force One by a team of conspirators at Andrews AFB (without a single person noticing this activity on the other side of the aircraft), and then the body had to travel to Walter Reed (or wherever) for the lickety-split wound alterations, and then after placing JFK into a casket that looks nothing like the expensive ornamental casket the plotters earlier removed JFK's body from (and also after putting JFK into a body bag, for some idiotic reason that only the bumbling plotters could possibly explain), they travel the XX miles to Bethesda. (How far is it from Walter Reed to Bethesda? I'm not sure and I really don't care, but David Lifton sure should.) *

And all of the above is accomplished, per David Lifton (unless he's changed his theory in the last few years), in roughly 20 to 25 minutes.

Can anybody say -- No way, Jose?!


* EDIT -- Distances (per Vincent Bugliosi's book, "Reclaiming History", page 1063) ---

Andrews Air Force Base to Walter Reed Hospital -- 13 miles (by air).

Walter Reed Hospital to Bethesda Naval Hospital -- 5 miles.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2013, 04:02:16 PM
by David Von Pein
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Online David Von Pein

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Re: Lifton to DiEugenio - You're a conspiracy nut!
« Reply #101 on: July 01, 2013, 02:56:52 PM »
Quote from: David Lifton
The casket that arrived at 6:35 PM obviously contained the body of John F. Kennedy.

Impossible.

"Lifton's scenario couldn't possibly be more insane." -- Vincent T. Bugliosi; Page 1061 of "Reclaiming History"

Vince is right (as usual).
« Last Edit: July 01, 2013, 03:34:49 PM
by David Von Pein
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Online Ray Mitcham

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Re: Lifton to DiEugenio - You're a conspiracy nut!
« Reply #102 on: July 01, 2013, 03:41:42 PM »
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The casket that arrived at 6:35 PM obviously contained the body of John F. Kennedy,

David,  

Is such a timing realistic.

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Doing  a search on the internet I see that the straight line distance between the two is 18 Miles as the crow flies.

However traveling by car is 28 mines.

Manchester states that the plane arrived at 6:05. From that time has to be added the time to off load and enter the cars and ambulance.

At best if you add 5 minutes, which is probably too short, to the change over you then have 28 miles to drive in 25 minutes.

Does that seem realistic to you?

James

James, that's by car, however the scene changes if the shipping casket was taken by helicopter to Walter Reed and then onto Bethesda by ambulance
« Last Edit: July 01, 2013, 03:42:20 PM
by Ray Mitcham
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Offline James Gordon

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Re: Lifton to DiEugenio - You're a conspiracy nut!
« Reply #103 on: July 01, 2013, 04:38:19 PM »
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James, that's by car, however the scene changes if the shipping casket was taken by helicopter to Walter Reed and then onto Bethesda by ambulance

Yes, Ray I agree.

But that is the big "IF”.

Unlike some, I am not adverse to David's body alteration scenario. However I did not find his argument about the helicopter very persuasive. I always felt it was never fully tied down.

When the coffin is off-loaded it always looked to me as if it was a heavy load.

That said, I feel the point I have made is central to this problem. If the coffin can be proved that it did not travel by helicopter, then it had to travel by road.

And if it traveled by road there appears there was not time for it to get to Bethesda in time.

Basically, if it cannot be proved that it traveled by helicopter, then there is a serious question about the coffin arriving at 6.35. There simply does not appear to be time  for a car to get from Andrews to Bethesda in that time.


James

Online Ray Mitcham

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Re: Lifton to DiEugenio - You're a conspiracy nut!
« Reply #104 on: July 01, 2013, 04:44:27 PM »
Jerrol Custer deposition to AARB Page 36/37

‘This was the first series of films. The only reason why this clicked is, because I remember I was told by the duty  officer that the corpse was taken to Walter Reed Hospital first - compound=Walter Reed compound first, and then brought to Bethesda…….
Q:  Did anyone besides the duty officer make any references to Walter Reed?
Custer: Yes, that one gentleman who was in the picture with Reed and myself, that was at the end there.
Q: On the far - the one on the far left?

Custer:Far left: right. He was the duty officer. No not there. The other picture.

Q Yeah. In addition to the duty officer, was there anyone else?

Custer: The chief on duty that night. There was two.

Q: Okay

Custer There was a duty officer and a duty chief.

Q: Okay. And they both said that the body had been to Walter Reed?

Custer: Right; Walter Reed compound. They didn’t say “hospital”. They said “compound”……….."


If it had gone by car, why would it have been taken to Walter Reed first?
« Last Edit: July 01, 2013, 04:45:49 PM
by Ray Mitcham
»