Prayer Woman

[Duncan MacRae]

I disagree totally,, but nevertheless, show us your calculations or proof, Duncan.

Matters not anyway, as the shadow is still caused by the vertical edge of the doorway whether the outside or the inner vertical.

I meant to say inner West side Pillar.

I was thinking Virtually again, silly me, so you were correct to disagree. .

[Alan Ford]

Barry is right!

If the dark border going down nearly half of Lovelady in Wiegman is a shadow cast by the west entrance pillar, then Stancak's calculations are not just wrong but OUTLANDISHLY wrong.

Here's Stancak's reconstruction of the entrance:




Ignore the Prayer Man avatar. Shrink the Frazier avatar to 5'8" and bring him down to the top step by the center railing
-----------It's a complete non-starter that he's going to catch any shadow from the west pillar, let alone the 'shadow' we see going down Lovelady. No way. No how.




So my question for those arguing for a shadow is this:
What are your grounds for disagreeing with Stancak's calculations so radically?

Have you, for instance, anything from the photo record to support your TOTAL dismissal of his reconstructed doorway? Like Barry, I have searched and can find not a single image to support even the possibility of this being a shadow on Lovelady!

[Barry Pollard]

Just a word on the Hughes "Lovelady" Alan.
You need to see the cropped, zoomed in version of it. I have an idea where I saw it last.
Also since I promised you, I only have this which you probably have already seen, but I liked that's why...

Arrows aren't mine, I think it cleans up the frame a little rather than distort it but my opinion... and I'm not going to convince you with this alone but it looks to me(or did) like "his" right arm is away from the body. Frazier's arms in the same footage are clearly folded, they have that recognisable form but PM, not so much.


I've seen other versions of this where the person got similar results, so I'm not sure yet if it's bare arm or shirt but we can all see what the results suggest.

[Barry Pollard]

Sorry for the lame Altgens crop btw, just came to hand quickest, y'all know it and where to get better.

[Barry Pollard]

The sketch below shows the entrance I was working to and the thick black line shows the line of the shadow at 12.30.

Ray, do you believe Billy was as far east as he could get in Wiegman without crossing the central rail?
I do, so it's not adding up for me but I still think you and Andrej have the shadow line correct fwiw.

[Alan Ford]

Just a word on the Hughes "Lovelady" Alan.
You need to see the cropped, zoomed in version of it. I have an idea where I saw it last.
Also since I promised you, I only have this which you probably have already seen, but I liked that's why...

Arrows aren't mine, I think it cleans up the frame a little rather than distort it but my opinion... and I'm not going to convince you with this alone but it looks to me(or did) like "his" right arm is away from the body. Frazier's arms in the same footage are clearly folded, they have that recognisable form but PM, not so much.


I've seen other versions of this where the person got similar results, so I'm not sure yet if it's bare arm or shirt but we can all see what the results suggest.

Ah, thanks for this, Barry! It's an ambiguous image, at least as suggestive of folded arms as of PrayerMan arms IMHO:



If folded arms, the phantom left arm I've cropped out above could even be something Roy Edward Lewis is holding as he stands behind the glass door...




If Prayer Man just kept his hands in the 'prayer' position, then how come
---------his RIGHT elbow in Wiegman is lower than in Darnell?
---------his LEFT elbow in Wiegman is a lot lower than 'it' is in Darnell?



The relationship between these two images suggests to me that that's not his left elbow in Darnell at all!

[Alan Ford]

Here's Lovelady at 12.30pm:



Here are some images from a little later in the day, when the sun has moved west, LENGTHENING the shadow cast by the west pillar. And yet, if we look at the Lovelady stand-ins...



===> NO SHADOW!


===> NO SHADOW!

 
===> NO SHADOW!

Was the sun dancing at 12.30 that day?