How Do LNers Deal With Givens?

[Zeon Mason]

Present a single piece of credible evidence that places Oswald in the SN at 12:30pm.

I may be one the who 1st  floated that 12:16 BRW leaving earlier time , which was a mistake on my part if I’m going with Arnold Rowlands as a credible witness.

I looked up Arnold Rowland WC testimony and that’s when I found where  he was looking back about every 30 secs after he saw  BRW at 12:15 which means he saw BRW not just one more time at 12:20 but every 30 secs AFTER that until about 12:24 and THEN at 12:25 , he no longer saw BRW.

I generally agree with most of your arguments except the notion the shooter would not have assembled the MC rifle sometime earlier than 12:00 because imo the 7th floor was available ( which is like an attic)

If that’s the case, though the shooter had to have transported the rifle multiple times inside the bag for it to ever have wound  up in the SN. ( unless Bag was moved there after the fact by Fritz team)

So it’s possible after transporting rifle in bag to the SW 6th floor and taking rifle out of  bag such that he was seen by Rowland at 12:15, the shooter after backing away, put the rifle back in the bag, then he had to hide the rifle again (if he is Oswald ) and go back down to 2nd floor lunchroom to be seen
By Carolyn Arnold at 12:17.

However if the shooter is not Oswald then he wouldn’t have to go back down at all. In fact he could have found some spot on the NE corner of the floor where he could have hidden and taken his rifle with him in the bag once more.

This is where it gets into time trouble for the shooter to have arranged the 3 boxes before 12:25 if BRW is still on the floor till 12:24.

And once BRW did leave the floor that late , the shooter must have carried the rifle in the bag one last time to the SN and left it there.

For this hypothetical scenario to be plausible would require  the shooter was wearing gloves as he handled bag ( with he had gotten Oswald’s prints on ) and while the shooter fired the  rifle

[Jack Nessan]

Present a single piece of credible evidence that places Oswald in the SN at 12:30pm.

You're in luck there are two pieces. His rifle and his fingerprints.

[Jack Nessan]

I may be one the who 1st  floated that 12:16 BRW leaving earlier time , which was a mistake on my part if I’m going with Arnold Rowlands as a credible witness.

I looked up Arnold Rowland WC testimony and that’s when I found where  he was looking back about every 30 secs after he saw  BRW at 12:15 which means he saw BRW not just one more time at 12:20 but every 30 secs AFTER that until about 12:24 and THEN at 12:25 , he no longer saw BRW.

I generally agree with most of your arguments except the notion the shooter would not have assembled the MC rifle sometime earlier than 12:00 because imo the 7th floor was available ( which is like an attic)

If that’s the case, though the shooter had to have transported the rifle multiple times inside the bag for it to ever have wound  up in the SN. ( unless Bag was moved there after the fact by Fritz team)

So it’s possible after transporting rifle in bag to the SW 6th floor and taking rifle out of  bag such that he was seen by Rowland at 12:15, the shooter after backing away, put the rifle back in the bag, then he had to hide the rifle again (if he is Oswald ) and go back down to 2nd floor lunchroom to be seen
By Carolyn Arnold at 12:17.

However if the shooter is not Oswald then he wouldn’t have to go back down at all. In fact he could have found some spot on the NE corner of the floor where he could have hidden and taken his rifle with him in the bag once more.

This is where it gets into time trouble for the shooter to have arranged the 3 boxes before 12:25 if BRW is still on the floor till 12:24.

And once BRW did leave the floor that late , the shooter must have carried the rifle in the bag one last time to the SN and left it there.

For this hypothetical scenario to be plausible would require  the shooter was wearing gloves as he handled bag ( with he had gotten Oswald’s prints on ) and while the shooter fired the  rifle

Rowland was a complete clown. By the end of his testimony they were making fun of how ridiculous his answers were.

[Dan O'meara]

I may be one the who 1st  floated that 12:16 BRW leaving earlier time , which was a mistake on my part if I’m going with Arnold Rowlands as a credible witness.

I looked up Arnold Rowland WC testimony and that’s when I found where  he was looking back about every 30 secs after he saw  BRW at 12:15 which means he saw BRW not just one more time at 12:20 but every 30 secs AFTER that until about 12:24 and THEN at 12:25 , he no longer saw BRW.

I generally agree with most of your arguments except the notion the shooter would not have assembled the MC rifle sometime earlier than 12:00 because imo the 7th floor was available ( which is like an attic)

If that’s the case, though the shooter had to have transported the rifle multiple times inside the bag for it to ever have wound  up in the SN. ( unless Bag was moved there after the fact by Fritz team)

So it’s possible after transporting rifle in bag to the SW 6th floor and taking rifle out of  bag such that he was seen by Rowland at 12:15, the shooter after backing away, put the rifle back in the bag, then he had to hide the rifle again (if he is Oswald ) and go back down to 2nd floor lunchroom to be seen
By Carolyn Arnold at 12:17.

However if the shooter is not Oswald then he wouldn’t have to go back down at all. In fact he could have found some spot on the NE corner of the floor where he could have hidden and taken his rifle with him in the bag once more.

This is where it gets into time trouble for the shooter to have arranged the 3 boxes before 12:25 if BRW is still on the floor till 12:24.

And once BRW did leave the floor that late , the shooter must have carried the rifle in the bag one last time to the SN and left it there.

For this hypothetical scenario to be plausible would require  the shooter was wearing gloves as he handled bag ( with he had gotten Oswald’s prints on ) and while the shooter fired the  rifle

Rowland recalls seeing the man with the rifle and the black man in the SN around 12:16pm. He remembers this because just before he saw these men he heard a timestamp on a police motorcycles radio. The detail he gives about the time and Cedar Springs demonstrates how accurate his memory was as he had no way to know that the transcripts of the police transmissions confirm his account:

Mr. ROWLAND - Right afterwards. There was--just before I observed him there was a police motorcycle parked just on the street, not in front of us, just a little past us, and the radio was on it giving the details of the motorcade, where it was positioned...the dispatcher came on and gave the position of the motorcade as being on Cedar Springs. This would be in the area of Turtle Creek, down in that area.
I can't remember the street's name but I know where it is at. And this was the position of the motorcade and it was about 15 or 16 after 12.

The police transcripts confirm this timing:



Rowland states he looked back to the 6th floor around twice a minute trying to find the man with the rifle to show his wife.
If we stick to the Oswald-Did-It narrative, the evidence, as it stands, paints a picture of Oswald assembling the rifle in the SN (the long bag for carrying the disassembled rifle found in the southeast corner) and, for some unknown reason, making his way over to the west side of the building with the assembled rifle where he is seen by Rowland.
If the rifle was assembled elsewhere there would be no need to carry the long bag over to the southeast corner. Rowland saw the man carrying the rifle so it's not like he felt the need to carry the assembled rifle in the bag.

The main problem with this is BRW. How could Oswald assemble the rifle in the SN and wander around the 6th floor with it without BRW noticing him? And why would Oswald wander over to the west side with the rifle anyway?
Another problem is Rowland's description of the clothes worn by the man with the rifle - "open collared shirt, light-colored shirt". Oswald didn't even own such a garment, let alone wear it on the day of the assassination. Both Ronald Fischer and Robert Edwards also recall the man on the 6th floor wearing an open-neck shirt.
Another problem is the black man in the SN. Rowland scanned the 6th floor quite often looking for the man with the rifle and would have seen the black man every time until he disappeared around 12:25pm.