Robert Groden claims has original Wiegman film, says Prayerman is not LHO

[Gerry Down]

After watching the entire 47-minute video above, I find it really strange that we don't hear Bob Groden, at any point in the lengthy video, say a single word about the so-called "Prayer Man" figure in the TSBD doorway. Not a word. Bob only talks about the decades-old "Billy Lovelady / Doorway Man" controversy.

Based on the fact that Groden only brought up the topic of Lovelady as the man in the Depository doorway, I got the strong impression that Mr. Groden isn't even aware of the newer "Prayer Man" theory.

Is it possible that Bob actually thinks the reason that Jefferson Morley and others are so anxious to see the original versions of the Wiegman and Darnell films is to only focus on the Billy Lovelady figure in the films, rather than focus on the Prayer Man individual? Sure sounded that way to me in the above video interview. Very odd.

Groden would have seen the original Wiegman in the 1990s before the Prayerman theory was developed as far as I understand it. So Groden possibly never even looked for the Prayerman figure when he had the opportunity to do so.

Isn't Lovelady supposed to be walking down the elm street extension in the Wiegman/Darnell film? So no one is putting Lovelady at the doorway in the Wiegman film anyway.

This would mean that the only known living person to have viewed the original Wiegman film, Groden, quiet possibly never even looked at the figure in the doorway that later developed into the Prayerman theory.

[Gerry Down]

Groden would have seen the original Wiegman in the 1990s before the Prayerman theory was developed as far as I understand it. So Groden possibly never even looked for the Prayerman figure when he had the opportunity to do so.

Isn't Lovelady supposed to be walking down the elm street extension in the Wiegman/Darnell film? So no one is putting Lovelady at the doorway in the Wiegman film anyway.

This would mean that the only known living person to have viewed the original Wiegman film, Groden, quiet possibly never even looked at the figure in the doorway that later developed into the Prayerman theory.

Either that or he did look at the figure that would later become known as Prayerman and determined it was not Oswald and proceeded to mistake the figure as being Lovelady. 

[David Von Pein]

Groden would have seen the original Wiegman in the 1990s before the Prayerman theory was developed as far as I understand it. So Groden possibly never even looked for the Prayerman figure when he had the opportunity to do so.

Isn't Lovelady supposed to be walking down the elm street extension in the Wiegman/Darnell film? So no one is putting Lovelady at the doorway in the Wiegman film anyway.

This would mean that the only known living person to have viewed the original Wiegman film, Groden, quiet possibly never even looked at the figure in the doorway that later developed into the Prayerman theory.

Either that or he did look at the figure that would later become known as Prayerman and determined it was not Oswald and proceeded to mistake the figure as being Lovelady.

I doubt very much that anyone looking at the Dave Wiegman film in the 1990s would (or even could) have determined that there was even a human being standing in the "Prayer Man" position on the top TSBD step. And that's because the Wiegman copy presented by Mr. Groden on his 1995 DVD (which I just watched again this evening) is just too dark and shadowy in the area of the Prayer Man figure for any definitive conclusions to be made. It's much worse than Jimmy Darnell's film, that's for sure.

The Wiegman print presented on Groden's '95 DVD just barely allows us to tell that a person is even there in the shadowy doorway, let alone permitting any kind of positive identification. It's impossible to even identify the gender of the person. The same can be said, of course, for the Darnell Film as well. The gender of the Prayer Man figure in the Darnell copies we've got now cannot be definitely established either.

And even going on the assumption that the "camera original" of Wiegman's film (which Groden says he has stored in Long Island) is of better quality and can be enhanced and tweaked to some extent, I doubt very much that enough detail and clarity can be extracted from the shadowy indistinctness that exists in the doorway.

BTW, the copy of the Wiegman Film that I saved to my computer several years ago (linked below) is derived from Robert Groden's 1995 DVD, but this copy isn't as good as the version I watched on my DVD copy tonight. This copy below doesn't even permit us to see any kind of human figure in the Prayer Man spot at all. That area of the doorway contains nothing but pitch-blackness....

[Duncan MacRae]

Video: Frazier's interviewed Head turn, directed towards his right side, indicates that the mystery person is Sarah Stanton

"We looked at one another"

"We looked at one another"

"We looked at one another"