A factoid regarding George DeMohrenschildt for Benjamin Cole

[Tom Graves]

Dear Benjamin,

Perhaps you'd like to mention this factoid in your ongoing conversation with tinfoil-hat JFKA conspiracy theorist Robert Morrow at the so-called JFK Assassination Debate -- Education Forum:

In his 1992 book, The Man Who Knew Too Much, Richard Russell says CIA Counterintelligence analyst Clare Edward Petty determined, by reading some WW II VENONA decrypts in the early 1970s, that George DeMohrenschild was very probably a long-term KGB "illegal."

Specifically, the decrypts said that a certain "illegal"

1) Was born in Poland (GdM was born 300 miles away in Mazyr, Belarus)

2) Emigrated to the U.S. before WW II (George and his brother, Dmitry, emigrated to the U.S. in 1938)

3) Lived in Mexico during WW II (GdM and his girlfriend, Lillia Larin, lived in Mexico in for several months in 1942)

4) Was a real wheeler-dealer (GdM was an insurance salesman, a speculator in oil and sugar, a film producer, a marketer of his own artwork, etc.)

-- Tom

[Benjamin Cole]

TG

Thanks for this. Yes, evidently there were suggestions, and evidence, that deMohrenschildt was a Moscow asset, or perhaps a double agent.

From afar, and with biases, my view is that deM was an oily self-dealer. But we see this often in people who lived in war-zones or through wars. Loyalty and virtues become luxuries, and then that becomes a habit.

BTW, Mazyr was on and off part of Poland.

"Yes, Mazyr was part of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth until the first and second partitions of Poland in the late 18th century, at which point it was annexed by Russia. Poland briefly recaptured the city during the Polish-Soviet War in 1920, but it soon returned to Soviet control." --AI

Mark Groubert had an interesting segment on deM.

Evidently, the guy had a successful exhibition of his own watercolors, in NYC. Some of his oil paintings look nice, which you can find by googling.

[Tom Graves]

TG

Thanks for this. Yes, evidently there were suggestions, and evidence, that deMohrenschildt was a Moscow asset, or perhaps a double agent.

From afar, and with biases, my view is that deM was an oily self-dealer. But we see this often in people who lived in war-zones or through wars. Loyalty and virtues become luxuries, and then that becomes a habit.

BTW, Mazyr was on and off part of Poland.

"Yes, Mazyr was part of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth until the first and second partitions of Poland in the late 18th century, at which point it was annexed by Russia. Poland briefly recaptured the city during the Polish-Soviet War in 1920, but it soon returned to Soviet control." --AI

Mark Groubert had an interesting segment on deM.

Evidently, the guy had a successful exhibition of his own watercolors, in NYC. Some of his oil paintings look nice, which you can find by googling.

If he was the subject of some VENONA decrypts, he was probably more than just an "oily self-dealer."

[Benjamin Cole]

TG-

Oh, I am entirely open to the idea that deM played both or all sides of the fence, whenever a dollar or ruble was offered.

He may have been a KGB-minder on LHO, while the CIA believed he was working for the CIA. See Marchetti's take on the swirl between KGB moles and CIA officers.

Or maybe deM was another Bruce Solie cat's paw?

I wonder if the VENONA decrypts are online? I would like to see them myself.

I have suspected it was deM who put LHO up to the Walker shooting, though I suspect LHO intended to miss.

[Steve M. Galbraith]

All of the Venona intercepts/decrypts (about 3000) have been released. You can read them here: https://www.nsa.gov/Helpful-Links/NSA-FOIA/Declassification-Transparency-Initiatives/Historical-Releases/Venona/

The chief problem, even now some 80 years later, is identifying the code or cover names. That is, who they were. Almost all of this, as I understand it, has been done by historians, led by John Haynes and Harvey Klehr who have written several books on Venona (obviously the FBI and CIA also tried to figure out who they were; the Cambridge Five spy ring was uncovered using Venona). But there's still a dispute as to some of the names and what the cables mean. See the Alger Hiss/Venona controversy on this.

Haynes and Klehr have a list of over 300 names in their book (linked below). Not all were agents. Robert Oppenheimer is mentioned (cover name: Veksel) as someone the KGB/GRU were interested in approaching (to, ahem, "share information") but the cables indicate that because of the tight security they couldn't directly or even indirectly contact him. So some of the names could be people simply caught up, potential recruits, in Soviet espionage or operations and not agents.

I would think, okay guess, that if DeMorenschildt's name was hinted at they or some historian would have found it. After all, these historians spend years and decades of their lives on these events. They study them inside and out.

The Haynes/Klehr book can read read online here: https://archive.org/details/venona-decoding-soviet-espionage-in-america

[Tom Graves]

All of the Venona intercepts/decrypts (about 3000) have been released. You can read them here: https://www.nsa.gov/Helpful-Links/NSA-FOIA/Declassification-Transparency-Initiatives/Historical-Releases/Venona/

The chief problem, even now some 80 years later, is identifying the code or cover names. That is, who they were. Almost all of this process, as I understand it, has been done by historians, led by John Haynes and Harvey Klehr who have written several books on Venona. But there's still a dispute as to some of the names and what the cables mean. See the Alger Hiss/Venona controversy on this.

Haynes and Klehr have a list of over 300 names in their book (linked below). Not all were agents. Robert Oppenheimer is mentioned (cover name: Veksel) as someone the KGB/GRU were interested in approaching (to, ahem, "share information") but the cables indicate that because of the tight security they couldn't directly or even indirectly contact him. So some of the names could be people simply caught up, potential recruits, in Soviet espionage or operations and not agents.

I would think, okay guess, that if DeMorenschildt's name was hinted at they or some historian would have found it. After all, these historians spend years and decades of their lives on these events. They study them inside and out.

The Haynes/Klehr book can read read online here: https://archive.org/details/venona-decoding-soviet-espionage-in-america

Dear Steve M.,

If DeMohrenschildt was hinted at, or his name was hinted at?

-- Tom

[Benjamin Cole]

All of the Venona intercepts/decrypts (about 3000) have been released. You can read them here: https://www.nsa.gov/Helpful-Links/NSA-FOIA/Declassification-Transparency-Initiatives/Historical-Releases/Venona/

The chief problem, even now some 80 years later, is identifying the code or cover names. That is, who they were. Almost all of this process, as I understand it, has been done by historians, led by John Haynes and Harvey Klehr who have written several books on Venona (obviously the FBI and CIA were involved as well). But there's still a dispute as to some of the names and what the cables mean. See the Alger Hiss/Venona controversy on this.

Haynes and Klehr have a list of over 300 names in their book (linked below). Not all were agents. Robert Oppenheimer is mentioned (cover name: Veksel) as someone the KGB/GRU were interested in approaching (to, ahem, "share information") but the cables indicate that because of the tight security they couldn't directly or even indirectly contact him. So some of the names could be people simply caught up, potential recruits, in Soviet espionage or operations and not agents.

I would think, okay guess, that if DeMorenschildt's name was hinted at they or some historian would have found it. After all, these historians spend years and decades of their lives on these events. They study them inside and out.

The Haynes/Klehr book can read read online here: https://archive.org/details/venona-decoding-soviet-espionage-in-america

SMG-

Thanks

I downloaded the book from Internet Archives, and did a word search, but nothing popped up for Mohrenschildt.

The JFKA is not addressed at all in this book, from my word searching.

I don't think this book does much to answer the question if deMohrenschildt was a CIA asset, or a KGB asset, or smarmy double-dealer or what.