Lovelady in Darnell and it's Ramifications.

[Tom Graves]

Dealing with Tom has reminded me of how the lies of Lovelady evolved.

In his affidavit, given a couple of hours after the assassination, he states that he was on the steps at the time of the shots after which he re-entered the building. He didn't move from the steps, no mention of moving along the Elm St Ext, the little, old island, the railroad yard or the west door.

Later that same day he was interviewed by the FBI (this seems unusual as I can't recall any other employee of the TSBD being interviewed by the FBI on the day, but it must have happened. Lovelady cannot have been the only one). This is from that interview:
"He said immediately after hearing the shots he and Shelley started running towards the Presidential car but it sped away west on Elm Street under the triple underpass. He and Shelley then returned to the Texas School Book Depository."
No mention of the little, old island or the railroad yard. Instead, both men immediately race toward to limo in time to see it speed away.

On March 19th '64 Lovelady gave his CE1381 statement to the FBI. In it he repeats the nonsense about racing toward the area where the limo had "stopped" (presumably before it sped away):
"I recall that following the shooting, I ran towards the spot where President Kennedy's car had stopped. William Shelley and myself stayed in that area for approximately five minutes when we then re-entered the Depository building by the side door located on the west side of the building."
So, Lovelady isn't talking about making his way along the extension to the railroad yard. This early version of the lie has Lovelady and Shelley racing to the spot where the limo stopped and staying in that area for around 5 minutes.

On April 7th '64 Lovelady gave his WC testimony. Finally, he and Shelley have coordinated their stories - on the steps (for 3 minutes), Gloria, little old island (for an undisclosed amount of time), along the Elm Street extension, hanging around the railroad yard (a minute or so) entering through the west door.

In Lovelady's final version of events, given during an interview for the HSCA, he states that he didn't enter the TSBD building for around 20 minutes.

So, which version do we accept?
They can't all be true.
Considering we have an excellent witness in Vicki Adams, why not pick the version that allows him to be somewhere in the vicinity of the elevators approximately 60 seconds after the shooting.
That would be his very first statement on the matter, his same-day affidavit, in which he never left the steps before re-entering the building.

Dear Danny Boy O'meara,

Shelley’s and Lovelady’s early “running towards the limo” claims could be taken to mean that they ended up on the “little, old island” about 30 feet from the steps in the direction of limo.  If so, they may have intercepted “bellowing” TSBD employee Gloria Calvery there as she was running towards the TSBD steps, and it's reasonable to assume that she informed them there that JFK had been shot. If such was the case, Shelley and Lovelady may very well have started running down Elm Street Extension towards the railway yard at that point (pardon the pun), as is suggested by the actions of the slender, suit-wearing “Shelley” figure and the distinctive-shirt-wearing (and bald-spot-sporting!) “Lovelady” figure about 25 seconds after the final shot in Couch-Darnell.

-- Tom

[Dan O'meara]

Dear Danny Boy O'meara,

Shelley’s and Lovelady’s early “running towards the limo” claims could be taken to mean that they ended up on the “little, old island” about 30 feet from the steps in the direction of limo.  If so, they may have intercepted “bellowing” TSBD employee Gloria Calvery there as she was running towards the TSBD steps, and it's reasonable to assume that she informed them there that JFK had been shot. If such was the case, Shelley and Lovelady may very well have started running down Elm Street Extension towards the railway yard at that point (pardon the pun), as is suggested by the actions of the slender, suit-wearing “Shelley” figure and the distinctive-shirt-wearing (and bald-spot-sporting!) “Lovelady” figure about 25 seconds after the final shot in Couch-Darnell.

-- Tom

You've missed the point of the post, thomas (a favourite strategy of yours)
I was just outlining how the lies Lovelady told about his movements in the immediate aftermath of the assassination, evolved.
1] He started out staying on the steps before re-entering the building
2] He ran to where the limo stopped and stayed in that area for 5 minutes.
3] He went to the island AFTER Gloria, then down to the railroad yard etc., taking about 5 minutes to get back inside.
4] He didn't go back inside for 20 minutes.

There is no doubt he is lying about his movements (why would he be lying about his movements).
That was the point of the post.
Your desperate attempt to keep your dead theory afloat is no great surprise. Your interpretation of the evidence is laughable.
Why do you refer to Gloria as "bellowing"?

[Tom Graves]

You've missed the point of the post, thomas (a favourite strategy of yours)

Have you always been paranoiac, danny boy?

I was just outlining how the lies Lovelady told about his movements in the immediate aftermath of the assassination, evolved:

1] He started out staying on the steps before re-entering the building
2] He ran to where the limo stopped and stayed in that area for 5 minutes.
3] He went to the island after Gloria, then down to the railroad yard etc., taking about 5 minutes to get back inside.
4] He didn't go back inside for 20 minutes.

Why would Lovelady be lying about his movements?

The evil, evil "sham" Warren Commission, or the evil, evil CIA, or the evil, evil [fill in the blank] must have made him do it, right?

That was the point of the post.

I know it was, danny Boy o'meara.

Why do you refer to Gloria as "bellowing"?

Didn't Buell Wesley Frazier say she was "bellowing," or "howling," or "growling," or words to that effect?

[Dan O'meara]

Have you always been paranoiac, danny boy?

The evil, evil "sham" Warren Commission, or the evil, evil CIA, or the evil, evil [fill in the blank] must have made him do it, right?

I know it was, danny Boy o'meara.

Didn't Buell Wesley Frazier say she was "bellowing," or "howling," or "growling," or words to that effect?

It's good to see you agree Lovelady lied about his movements.
Frazier refers to a "low kind of hollering".

[Tom Graves]

It's good to see you agree Lovelady lied about his movements.

Nice trolling, danny Boy o'meara.

If Lovelady and Shelley lied about their movements, who made them do it?

The evil, evil "sham" Warren Commission, the evil, evil CIA, or the evil, evil [fill in the blank]?

Regaardless, do you still think the balding guy who's pivoting out of Baker's way about 25 seconds after the final shot in Darnell is William Shelley?

[Dan O'meara]

Nice trolling, danny Boy o'meara.

High praise indeed from this forum's #1 troll

If Lovelady and Shelley lied about their movements, who made them do it?

The evil, evil "sham" Warren Commission, the evil, evil CIA, or the evil, evil [fill in the blank]?

I don't understand the question.
Why do you think they were "made" to do it?
Why don't you explain why they lied about their movements after the assassination?
All I've done is demonstrate, beyond any reasonable doubt, that they did indeed lie about their movements after the assassination.
The only possible reason they had for doing this (as far as I can see) is to cover up the fact that immediately after the assassination both men made their way toward the back of the first floor where they were seen by Adams and Baker seconds after the assassination.
The question then becomes - why would they want to cover up their presence near the first floor elevators about 60 seconds after the assassination?

Regaardless, do you still think the balding guy who's pivoting out of Baker's way about 25 seconds after the final shot in Darnell is William Shelley?

I'm not like you, thomas. I don't change my opinion just to try and 'score a point'. My opinion is based on, what I regard to be, the most reasonable interpretation of the evidence.
At no point have I changed my mind about the identification of Shelley in Darnell. It fits perfectly with the identification of Lovelady on the steps.
Your ability to see bald spots and receding hairlines in such poor images is as laughable as everything else you've offered up in this thread. Almost every single piece of evidence related to this aspect of the case points away from your 'it looks like Lovelady to me' approach to the evidence. But here you are, still trollin' along 
                                                                               

[Tom Graves]

All I've done is demonstrate, beyond any reasonable doubt, that Shelley and Lovelady did indeed lie about their movements after the assassination.

You must be very proud of yourself!

The only possible reason they had for lying (as far as I can see) is to cover up the fact that immediately after the assassination both men made their way toward the back of the first floor where they were seen by Adams and Baker seconds after the assassination.

Why, then, don't you have the walking/running "Shelley" and "Lovelady" figures in Couch/Darnell be them?

Gotta have Calvery bellowing the news to Lovelady on the front steps 25 seconds after the final shot and with receding-hairline "Shelley" hovering nearby?

The question then becomes - why would they want to cover up their presence near the first-floor elevators about 60 seconds after the assassination?

Ah ha!

They must have been part of the conspiracy!!!

At no point have I changed my mind about the identification of Shelley in Darnell.

Why does your "Shelley" have a receding hairline like Ochus V. Campbell?

It fits perfectly with the identification of Lovelady on the steps.

Huh?