JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion & Debate > JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate
Why I Believe in the JFKA Conspiracy
Benjamin Cole:
Well, no one ever asked, but then I live in rural Thailand.
At bottom, it comes down to this:
(Gov.) Connally: "I was knocked over, just doubled over by the force of the bullet. It went in my back and came out my chest about 2 inches below and the left of my right nipple. The force of the bullet drove my body over almost double and when I looked, immediately I could see I was just drenched with blood. (1 HSCA 42)"
My layman's read on the Z-film is JFK is struck ~Z-209, when he "goes behind" the Stemmons Freeway sign, from the perspective of the film.
Connally's testimony is that he heard the first shot, looked over his own right shoulder (and is seen in Z-film facing backwards), could not see JFK, then turned forward to begin to look over his left shoulder, but was interrupted by the second shot, one that he did not hear (accurately, as the bullet traveled more quickly than sound).
We see Connally pushed forward ~Z-295, about 4.5 seconds after JFK appears to have been shot.
The third shot struck JFK at Z-313.
Thus, JFK is shot perhaps one second after Connally was shot. That is too rapid a sequence to have been accomplished by a lone-gunman armed with a single-shot bolt-action rifle.
Witness testimony (as anyone who worked the courts knows) is very iffy. But there is a tendency to believe someone who says what happened to them after they were shot in the back.
Could Connally have been shot at the same time as JFK, and then 4.5 seconds later is pushed forward for some reason, but only believes he had been impacted by a bullet at that later time? Seems like a stretch. What else would push him forward? That is not an illusion; it is seem in the Z-film.
Some have argued that bullets do not push victims in a direction, and indeed many hunters will tell you that often deer just slump to he ground after being shot.
True, bullets that do not meet resistance are sometimes seen to pass through the body, without moving the body much.
However, Dr. Robert Shaw, who worked on Connally at Parkland, testified before the WC:
Dr. SHAW. The bullet, in passing through the Governor’s chest wall struck the fifth rib at its midpoint and roughly followed the slanting direction of the fifth rib, shattering approximately 10 cm. of the rib.
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh6/pdf/WH6_Shaw.pdf
The bullet that struck the Governor traveled along and shattered the rib, meeting resistance, and pushing Connally forward. The bullet also punctured Connally's lung.
----
There are as many narratives of the JFKA as there are narrators, including endless theories about the true perps.
I do not know who were the true perps, though I suspect a very small conspiracy, possibly just two people and Lee Harvey Oswald.
As LHO's confederates were never apprehended, captivating theories have been fabricated, including the CIA, Mafia, KGB, LBJ, G-2, anti-Castro exiles, and others as the true perps, leading up to the very highest levels of government and enterprise.
Almost inevitably, the ideology drives the agenda, and the agenda drives the JFKA narrative. Tehran stooges and anti-Semitic crackpots are recently promoting the "Mossad did it" narratives on the JFKA.
However...WC supporters should keep in mind the HSCA did come down on the side of that there was a conspiracy in the JFKA. And WC bashers should remember the HSCA concluded LHO fired the lethal shots on 11/22.
Someday I will post my "Vatican Perped the JFJA" narrative. It will show how easy it is to put together a narrative based on "facts" and motives, and circumstantial evidence.
I do not believe the Vatican had anything to do with the JFKA.
Who was behind the JFKA? I am not sure.
Tom Graves:
--- Quote from: Benjamin Cole on September 14, 2025, 12:29:34 PM ---[...]
--- End quote ---
Your analysis is seriously flawed.
If I had to guess, I'd say you have a deep psychological need to believe the JFKA was a conspiracy by the evil, evil "Deep State" (whatever that is).
Tom Graves:
--- Quote from: Benjamin Cole on September 14, 2025, 12:29:34 PM ---Well, no one ever asked, but then I live in rural Thailand.
At bottom, it comes down to this:
(Gov.) Connally: "I was knocked over, just doubled over by the force of the bullet. It went in my back and came out my chest about 2 inches below and the left of my right nipple. The force of the bullet drove my body over almost double and when I looked, immediately I could see I was just drenched with blood. (1 HSCA 42)"
My layman's read on the Z-film is JFK is struck ~Z-209, when he "goes behind" the Stemmons Freeway sign, from the perspective of the film.
Connally's testimony is that he heard the first shot, looked over his own right shoulder (and is seen in Z-film facing backwards), could not see JFK, then turned forward to begin to look over his left shoulder, but was interrupted by the second shot, one that he did not hear (accurately, as the bullet traveled more quickly than sound).
We see Connally pushed forward ~Z-295, about 4.5 seconds after JFK appears to have been shot.
The third shot struck JFK at Z-313.
Thus, JFK is shot perhaps one second after Connally was shot. That is too rapid a sequence to have been accomplished by a lone-gunman armed with a single-shot bolt-action rifle.
Witness testimony (as anyone who worked the courts knows) is very iffy. But there is a tendency to believe someone who says what happened to them after they were shot in the back.
Could Connally have been shot at the same time as JFK, and then 4.5 seconds later is pushed forward for some reason, but only believes he had been impacted by a bullet at that later time? Seems like a stretch. What else would push him forward? That is not an illusion; it is seem in the Z-film.
Some have argued that bullets do not push victims in a direction, and indeed many hunters will tell you that often deer just slump to he ground after being shot.
True, bullets that do not meet resistance are sometimes seen to pass through the body, without moving the body much.
However, Dr. Robert Shaw, who worked on Connally at Parkland, testified before the WC:
Dr. SHAW. The bullet, in passing through the Governor’s chest wall struck the fifth rib at its midpoint and roughly followed the slanting direction of the fifth rib, shattering approximately 10 cm. of the rib.
https://www.history-matters.com/archive/jfk/wc/wcvols/wh6/pdf/WH6_Shaw.pdf
The bullet that struck the Governor traveled along and shattered the rib, meeting resistance, and pushing Connally forward. The bullet also punctured Connally's lung.
--- End quote ---
Connally eventually admitted that, despite what his wife told him (LOL), he and JFK may have been hit by the second shot that was fired.
--- Quote ---There are as many narratives of the JFKA as there are narrators, including endless theories about the true perps. [emphasis added]
I do not know who were the true perps, though I suspect a very small conspiracy, possibly just two people and Lee Harvey Oswald. [emphasis added]
As LHO's confederates were never apprehended, captivating theories have been fabricated, including the CIA, Mafia, KGB, LBJ, G-2, anti-Castro exiles, and others as the true perps, leading up to the very highest levels of government and enterprise. [emphasis added]
--- End quote ---
You make it sound as though it's a given that the JFKA was a conspiracy.
PS
I can't find the bit in Dr. Shaw's testimony in the link you provided where he allegedly said that the bullet could have pushed Connally dramatically forward, but I did find this jewel:
Mr. SPECTER. Dr. Shaw, would you think it consistent with the facts that you know as to Governor Connally’s wounds that he could have been struck by the same bullet which passed through the President Kennedy, assuming that a missile with the muzzle velocity of 2,000 feet per second, a 6.5 millimeter bullet, passed through President Kennedy at a distance of 160 to 250 feet from President, striking only soft tissue and exiting Kennedy’s body, entering on his back and exiting on his neck; could that missile have also gone through Governor Connally’s chest in your opinion?
Dr. SHAW. Yes, taking your description of the first wound sustained by the President, which I, myself, did not observe, and considering two men in the limousine, I think it would be perfectly possible for the first bullet to have passed through the soft tissues of the neck of President Kennedy and produced the wounds that we found on Governor Connally. Mr.
Mr. SPECTER. Could that bullet then have produced all the wounds that you found on Governor Connally?
Dr. SHAW. Yes, I would still be postulating that Governor Connally was struck by one missile.
Lance Payette:
Ben, have you read John Orr's "Analysis of Gunshots in Dealey Plaza"?
http://www.mountainrivercabins.com/JohnOrrReport.pdf
I was severely chastised for not hating it, but he has four shots, with the headshot coming from a Mafia pro on the roof of the Dal-Tex Building (where a casing was much later found). He has a fragment from the head shot causing Connally's wrist injuries, which would explain why CE 399 is not more damaged and would seemingly explain two separate reactions by Connally. I can't remember it all, but I recall those who thought it was silly focused on him having the shot that caused the throat wound traveling upwards and striking the windshield frame. (I said on a thread yesterday that he basically accepts the SBT with the exception of JBC's wrist wounds, but that was incorrect.)
What I liked was the very limited nature of his proposed conspiracy and only one additional shot coming from the rear on a trajectory that could plausibly be attributed to Mr. Patsy. I have also always thought that the Mafia was the most plausible candidate - motive, means, pretty much business as usual - and I recall Pat Speer agreeing with me (as well, I now realize, as Orr and Larry Schnapf). Even a pro-Castro patsy would have fit perfectly into the Mafia's plans. Eliminating JFK and neutralizing RFK would have been the principal objective, while an invasion of Cuba and the restoration of the Mafia's lucrative Cuban empire would have been icing on the cake.
My problem, as always, is Mr. Patsy. His actions leading up to the assassination, his actions in going to Ruth's on Thursday, and his post-JFKA actions just don't suggest to me someone who was, or thought he was, involved in a conspiracy. I could see how he might have been talked into what he thought was a pro-Castro conspiracy that would facilitate his entry into Cuba, but I just don't see any evidence that occurred. (There could have also been a conspiracy where Oswald was the only shooter, which I call LN+, but that's no fun at all.)
Jesus, WHAT AM I SAYING??? The LN narrative is rock-solid and there is no doubt!!! Arlen Specter rules! I am well-known for saying crazy things before I've had my second cup of coffee and cannot be held responsible for any of the above.
Tom Graves:
--- Quote from: Lance Payette on September 14, 2025, 02:06:45 PM ---Ben, have you read John Orr's "Analysis of Gunshots in Dealey Plaza"?
http://www.mountainrivercabins.com/JohnOrrReport.pdf
I was severely chastised for not hating it, but he has four shots, with the headshot coming from a Mafia pro on the roof of the Dal-Tex Building (where a casing was much later found). He has a fragment from the head shot causing Connally's wrist injuries, which would explain why CE 399 is not more damaged and would seemingly explain two separate reactions by Connally. I can't remember it all, but I recall those who thought it was silly focused on him having the shot that caused the throat wound traveling upwards and striking the windshield frame. (I said on a thread yesterday that he basically accepts the SBT with the exception of JBC's wrist wounds, but that was incorrect.)
What I liked was the very limited nature of his proposed conspiracy and only one additional shot coming from the rear on a trajectory that could plausibly be attributed to Mr. Patsy.
--- End quote ---
Dear Lance,
What seemingly unsurmountable technical issues with the Lonenutter's "Shooting Myth" does Orr's theory make moot for you?
The fact that CE-399 is "virtually pristine"?
The fact that JBC reacted so much later than JFK to being shot?
The fact that the angles of entrance and exit in JFK and JBC seem so doggone unworkable?
The fact that CE-399 didn't fragment but the Z-313 bullet did?
What?
-- Tom
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