JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion & Debate > JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate
Who Were the Two Men Heading *Down* the Stairs at NLT 12:50?
Michael T. Griffith:
--- Quote from: Royell Storing on September 07, 2025, 06:54:21 PM --- I would Not go as far as to say, "..could not have been law enforcements of any kind...". During his WC Testimony, Mooney detailed his encountering 2 women prior to his boarding the "Freight Elevator" to go up to the 7th floor. These women worked inside the TSBD and went up with Mooney on the freight elevator. Point is, there were people such as these women inside the TSBD during this time period. Therefore, it is "possible" that a couple of plain clothes cops entered the building and went up into the TSBD before these women entered the building.
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I don't see how Mooney's seeing the two women before boarding the elevator means it is possible that two plain clothes law enforcement officers entered the building and went upstairs before Mooney got on the stairs. None of the law officers interviewed by the WC said they were in the building during that time. The WC went to considerable lengths to determine if Mooney was the first one on the sixth floor after the shooting. Baker did not go to the sixth floor after he allegedly encountered Oswald.
Another point: Mooney had been on the sheriff's force for nearly six years but did not recognize the two men on the stairs.
--- Quote from: Royell Storing on September 07, 2025, 06:54:21 PM ---Mooney detailed that the power went out while he was on the freight elevator with these 2 women. Mooney then took these women to their office, made sure their office was secure, and then he took the "Stairs" Up to the 7th floor. This is when Mooney saw the 2 suits on the stairwell. If you can pin down when the power went out inside the TSBD, you would have a fairly good idea as to when Mooney saw these 2 suits coming down the stairwell.
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We already have an almost exact time for when Mooney was on the stairs. Barry Krusch discusses this in volume 3 of Impossible: The Case Against Lee Harvey Oswald. We know that it was 1:00 PM, give or take a minute, when Mooney yelled down to Fritz from the sixth-floor window and told him to get some crime-scene officers up to the sixth floor. We know that Day and Studebaker arrived at right around 1:10. Making reasonable allowances for the actions that Mooney performed before he yelled down to Fritz would put him on the stairs no later than 12:50 and probably several minutes earlier.
Oswald could not have been the one moving boxes around in the sniper's nest within two minutes of the shooting.
Royell Storing:
The main thing I do not like about the 2 men in suits is that Officer Mooney did not describe either of them wearing a hat. I do not recall seeing images of anyone connected to DPD wearing a suit and Not wearing a hat of some kind. Deputy Roger Craig was Not wearing a hat in the Darnell Film, but he was Off Duty that day. To me, both of these guys wearing No Hat is a serious concern.
Michael T. Griffith:
--- Quote from: Royell Storing on September 08, 2025, 08:05:35 PM --- The main thing I do not like about the 2 men in suits is that Officer Mooney did not describe either of them wearing a hat. I do not recall seeing images of anyone connected to DPD wearing a suit and Not wearing a hat of some kind. Deputy Roger Craig was Not wearing a hat in the Darnell Film, but he was Off Duty that day. To me, both of these guys wearing No Hat is a serious concern.
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I think the fact that he assumed they were plain clothes deputy sheriffs implies they were dressed in accordance with the sheriff department's dress code. He never got a chance to give any description of their clothing or to explain why he assumed they were plain clothes deputy sheriffs because Ball, incredibly enough, ignored his startling statement and did not ask any questions about the two men.
Royell Storing:
--- Quote from: Michael T. Griffith on September 09, 2025, 01:49:20 PM ---I think the fact that he assumed they were plain clothes deputy sheriffs implies they were dressed in accordance with the sheriff department's dress code. He never got a chance to give any description of their clothing or to explain why he assumed they were plain clothes deputy sheriffs because Ball, incredibly enough, ignored his startling statement and did not ask any questions about the two men.
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The key here is knowing exactly when did the TSBD power go out and prevent Mooney from using the freight elevator beyond the 2nd floor? Knowing this would timeline Mooney and those 2 "plain clothes" guys that he encountered coming DOWN the stairwell. It is hard to believe these 2 possible Sheriffs could have entered and gone up into the TSBD and actually investigated anything within roughly 10 minutes after the Kill Shot.
Michael T. Griffith:
--- Quote from: Royell Storing on September 09, 2025, 05:08:34 PM --- The key here is knowing exactly when did the TSBD power go out and prevent Mooney from using the freight elevator beyond the 2nd floor? Knowing this would timeline Mooney and those 2 "plain clothes" guys that he encountered coming DOWN the stairwell. It is hard to believe these 2 possible Sheriffs could have entered and gone up into the TSBD and actually investigated anything within roughly 10 minutes after the Kill Shot.
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And that's the rub: There just doesn't seem to be a plausible innocent explanation for two well-dressed men coming down the stairs at 12:40-12:50. They obviously were not common laborers or else Mooney would not have assumed they were plain clothes law officers. The WC went of its way to establish that Mooney was the first law officer on the sixth floor. Yet, Ball simply ignored Mooney's account of two law officers on the stairs at a time when none were there and when none should have been there, and the Commission showed no interest in Harkness's encounter at the rear of the TSBD with men who claimed they were Secret Service agents.
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