Did Roy Truly and/or Marion Baker Lie?

[Michael T. Griffith]

The key point is that Roy Truly was running ahead of Baker on the stairs, that Truly did not see or hear anyone on the stairs when he reached the second-floor landing, and that Baker said that he saw Oswald through the window of the foyer door.

If Oswald had gone through the second-floor foyer door before Truly reached the top of the stairs, he would have been several feet beyond the door by the time Baker reached the landing, and thus would not have been visible to Baker through the window. And, if Oswald had entered the door "only a second or two" before Baker reached the top of the stairwell, as the WC claimed, then Truly could not have missed seeing him.

Truly told the WC that he had already started up the stairs to the third floor when he noticed that Baker was no longer running behind him. Truly also said there was slightly more distance between him and Baker on the second floor than there was on the first floor. So, it is reasonable to assume that Truly gained a view of the second-floor landing a minimum of 2 seconds before Baker did. Truly's account suggests that Baker was beginning to tire on his way up the stairs. (This is understandable, given the fact that Baker had been running very fast virtually every second after he got off his bike.) Baker himself said that when he arrived to the landing and began to scan it, Truly "had already started around the bend to come to the next elevation going up" (3 H 255).

Thus, if Oswald had gone through the foyer door "a second or two" before Baker spotted him, Truly could not possibly have missed seeing Oswald coming off the stairs, or approaching the door, or starting to open the door.

Clearly, Oswald had already gone through the foyer door well before Truly reached the second-floor landing, which is further proof that he could not have been on the sixth floor during the shooting. Baker encountered Oswald in the second-floor lunchroom, and Oswald had a coke in his hand when Baker entered the lunchroom because Oswald had come down from the sixth floor at least 15 minutes earlier.

The Baker-Oswald Encounter: Proof that Oswald Did Not Shoot JFK?
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vFu2SyC373LpYKZRp6v5vtCDGzlri4N0/view

[Tom Graves]

The most glaring problem with this video is that Mrs. Reid was most definitely not inside the building making change for LHO at the time of the shots. She said she was outside when the motorcade went by. I believe she has been identified standing outside the building in at least one of the photographs taken that day. And she said LHO did not ask for change or anything, just kept on walking towards the front steps/elevator area.

IIRC, she said he was carrying a full bottle of Coca-Cola.

[Michael T. Griffith]

A few other inconvenient facts for the WC's version of events:

-- In his first-day statement, Officer Baker never mentioned an encounter with Oswald, though he did mention a similar encounter with another man on a different floor. You'd think he would have mentioned an encounter with the man taken into custody.

-- In Hosty and Bookout's first report on Oswald's interrogation, dated 11/23/63, Oswald said nothing about encountering a police officer after the shooting.

-- Officer Baker supposedly made a mad dash for the TSBD, and up the steps in time to encounter Oswald on the second floor. But the Darnell film makes it is easy to prove that he wasn't headed toward the TSBD door at all. He was headed toward the corner of Houston and Elm. But the WC had to make Baker enter the TSBD quickly to get their timing right.

-- Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady kept changing their stories regarding seeing Vickie Adams as she reached the first floor. And there is proof of some of their lies. For example, Shelley first said that he ran across to the concrete island where he met Gloria Calvery. The Darnell film is consistent with that. But for the WC he said that he stayed on the steps for ~3 minutes for Calvery to arrive at the steps. This is inconsistent with the Darnell film, but it helped the WC discredit Vicki Adams.

-- The Darnell film shows that Gloria Calvery arrived at the TSBD stairway within 30 seconds after the last shot. Yet both Shelley and Lovelady estimated the time to be 3 minutes. I can see people getting the time wrong, but having it off by exactly the same number sounds like witness coaching. Not surprisingly, Vickie Adams told Barry Ernest that she did not see Shelley and Lovelady upon reaching the first floor.

-- The Martha J. Stroud document, found by Barry Ernest in the National Archives in 1999, shows how the WC's version of the second-floor encounter introduced a new unforeseen problem. Stroud informed the WC that "Miss Garner, Miss Adams’ supervisor, stated this morning, that after Miss Adams went downstairs she (Miss Garner) saw Truly and the policeman come up." This proves that Adams was on the stairs far earlier than the WC falsely said she was, which in turn proves Oswald did not come down the stairs before Adams went down them and before Baker and Truly came up them. This blows to pieces the idea that Oswald was on the sixth floor during the shooting and casts serious doubt on the Baker-Oswald-encounter story.

https://www.pennlive.com/entertainment/2016/11/harrisburg_man_appears_in_docu.html

[Royell Storing]

A few other inconvenient facts for the WC's version of events:

-- In his first-day statement, Officer Baker never mentioned an encounter with Oswald, though he did mention a similar encounter with another man on a different floor. You'd think he would have mentioned an encounter with the man taken into custody.

-- In Hosty and Bookout's first report on Oswald's interrogation, dated 11/23/63, Oswald said nothing about encountering a police officer after the shooting.

-- Officer Baker supposedly made a mad dash for the TSBD, and up the steps in time to encounter Oswald on the second floor. But the Darnell film makes it is easy to prove that he wasn't headed toward the TSBD door at all. He was headed toward the corner of Houston and Elm. But the WC had to make Baker enter the TSBD quickly to get their timing right.

-- Bill Shelley and Billy Lovelady kept changing their stories regarding seeing Vickie Adams as she reached the first floor. And there is proof of some of their lies. For example, Shelley first said that he ran across to the concrete island where he met Gloria Calvery. The Darnell film is consistent with that. But for the WC he said that he stayed on the steps for ~3 minutes for Calvery to arrive at the steps. This is inconsistent with the Darnell film, but it helped the WC discredit Vicki Adams.

-- The Darnell film shows that Gloria Calvery arrived at the TSBD stairway within 30 seconds after the last shot. Yet both Shelley and Lovelady estimated the time to be 3 minutes. I can see people getting the time wrong, but having it off by exactly the same number sounds like witness coaching. Not surprisingly, Vickie Adams told Barry Ernest that she did not see Shelley and Lovelady upon reaching the first floor.

-- The Martha J. Stroud document, found by Barry Ernest in the National Archives in 1999, shows how the WC's version of the second-floor encounter introduced a new unforeseen problem. Stroud informed the WC that "Miss Garner, Miss Adams’ supervisor, stated this morning, that after Miss Adams went downstairs she (Miss Garner) saw Truly and the policeman come up." This proves that Adams was on the stairs far earlier than the WC falsely said she was, which in turn proves Oswald did not come down the stairs before Adams went down them and before Baker and Truly came up them. This blows to pieces the idea that Oswald was on the sixth floor during the shooting and casts serious doubt on the Baker-Oswald-encounter story.

https://www.pennlive.com/entertainment/2016/11/harrisburg_man_appears_in_docu.html

    Personally, I even doubt the elevator was "stuck" forcing Officer Baker and Roy Truly to use the stairwell. I tend to believe the elevator was Up above them because people/TSBD employees were using it ahead of Baker and Truly. DPD Officer Luke Mooney had no problem using that freight elevator after he walked through the "wide open" Huge Gates and then entered the TSBD right there at the freight elevator. Baker and Truly went up those stairs far later than their WC testimony indicated. Officer Luke Mooney's WC testimony of using that freight elevator without an issue blows that story up. Yeah, we allegedly see Truly and Baker going up the steps of the TSBD on the Darnell Film, but what they did after entering the building is anybody's guess. For a fact we know they even had trouble unlocking the swinging gate/door that ran along the 1st Floor front counter. And knowing that Roy Truly parked his car way down the Elm St Ext in front of that dock near the railroad yard, and then entered the TSBD after walking ALL THE WAY DOWN from there, (Billy Lovelady WC Testimony), Truly most likely seldom used the TSBD Front Door or was familiar with the pathway between the TSBD front door and the freight elevator in the opposite corner of the building. And the TSBD is a very large building, meaning the diagonal pathway between the TSBD front door and the freight elevator was not a short/direct walk.   

[Tom Graves]

The key point is that Roy Truly was running ahead of Baker on the stairs, that Truly did not see or hear anyone on the stairs when he reached the second-floor landing, and that Baker said that he saw Oswald through the window of the foyer door.

Maybe Oswald passed Truly on the stairs and Truly, recognizing Oswald as one of his workers, thought nothing of it.

If Oswald had gone through the second-floor foyer door before Truly reached the top of the stairs, he would have been several feet beyond the door by the time Baker reached the landing and thus would not have been visible to Baker through the window.

Unless, of course, he heard Truly and Baker coming up the stairs and, sipping on his bought-before-the-assassination bottle of Coca-Cola (not his favorite soft drink, but the only one that was available in the Second-floor lunchroom and therefore necessary for him to buy in advance as a "prop") hung out by the window to see who it was.

And, if Oswald had entered the door "only a second or two" before Baker reached the top of the stairwell, as the WC claimed, then Truly could not have missed seeing him.

The WC was basically guessing on how long it took Truly and Baker to reach the second floor.

Truly told the WC that he had already started up the stairs to the third floor when he noticed that Baker was no longer running behind him. Truly also said there was slightly more distance between him and Baker on the second floor than there was on the first floor. So, it is reasonable to assume that Truly gained a view of the second-floor landing a minimum of 2 seconds before Baker did. Truly's account suggests that Baker was beginning to tire on his way up the stairs. (This is understandable, given the fact that Baker had been running very fast virtually every second after he got off his bike.) Baker himself said that when he arrived to the landing and began to scan it, Truly "had already started around the bend to come to the next elevation going up" (3 H 255).

Point being?

Thus, if Oswald had gone through the foyer door "a second or two" before Baker spotted him, Truly could not possibly have missed seeing Oswald coming off the stairs, or approaching the door, or starting to open the door.

Neither the WC nor you know for sure how many seconds before Baker spotted him Oswald had gone through the foyer (why not call it the vestibule?) door.

Clearly, Oswald had already gone through the foyer door well before Truly reached the second-floor landing, which is further proof that he could not have been on the sixth floor during the shooting.

How so?

Do you know exactly how long it took Oswald to come down from the sixth floor with his "prop" bottle of Coca-Cola, and how long it took Truly to reach the second floor?

Didn't think so.

Baker encountered Oswald in the second-floor lunchroom, and Oswald had a coke in his hand when Baker entered the lunchroom because Oswald had come down from the sixth floor at least 15 minutes earlier.

Did the self-described Marxist and former Marine sharpshooter walk past the machine on the first floor that sold his favorite soft drink, Dr. Pepper, and go up to the second-floor lunchroom to buy a bottle of his second-favorite (or third-favorite, or . . . ) soft drink, Coca-Cola?

Is that it, Comrade Griffith?

LOL!