Did Garrison originally believe it was a homosexual "thrill kill" assassination?

JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion & Debate > JFK Assassination Plus General Discussion And Debate

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Tom Graves:

--- Quote from: Lance Payette on August 01, 2025, 09:49:46 PM ---Not sure what you think the passage from Phelan adds to the equation, but it's quoted in full in the Golightly piece I linked. The Rennaissance man of the lunatic fringe doesn't miss much.

--- End quote ---

Dear FP,

Do you think Phelan lied in his book about what Garrison told him, or maybe even made up altogether his story about rendezvousing with him in Vegas four days after he'd arrested Shaw?

It's interesting to note that they met in Sin City about the time the anti-CIA / anti-Shaw article was published in "Paese Sera," and about three weeks before Garrison received a translated-by-Schoenman knock-off copy of it.

In other words, Giant told Phelan his sorely mistaken homosexual thrill-kill theory about Shaw, et al., before he'd been set straight (pardon the pun) by the Kremlin via "Paese Sera" or "L' Humanite" or some-such Commie rag, and even, I've read, before he sent a copy of it to his local New Orleans States-Item newspaper for it to publish.

Factoid for Fancy Pants: Garrison (played by Kevin Cosner) confronts Shaw (played by Tommy Lee Jones -- who ironically plays the role of Pete Bagley in the BBC film, "Yuri Nosenko: KGB") with a put-together-by-Stone Italian-language hybrid fake copy of the anti-CIA / anti-Clay Shaw article in his movie (sic) "JFK."

Lance Payette:

--- Quote from: Tom Graves on August 01, 2025, 10:16:25 PM ---Dear FP,

Do you think Phelan lied in his book about what Garrison told him, or maybe even made up altogether his story about rendezvousing with him in Vegas four days after he'd arrested Shaw?
--- End quote ---

No, I simply think Garrison was insane.

--- Quote ---It's interesting to note that they met in Sin City about the time the anti-CIA / anti-Shaw article was published in "Paese Sera," and about three weeks before Garrison received a translated-by-Schoenman knock-off copy of it.

In other words, Giant told Phelan his sorely mistaken homosexual thrill-kill theory about Shaw, et al., before he'd been set straight (pardon the pun) by the Kremlin via "Paese Sera" or "L' Humanite" or some-such Commie rag, and even, I've read, before he sent a copy of it to his local New Orleans States-Item newspaper for it to publish.

Factoid for Fancy Pants: Garrison (played by Kevin Cosner) confronts Shaw (played by Tommy Lee Jones -- who ironically plays the role of Pete Bagley in the BBC film, "Yuri Nosenko: KGB") with a put-together-by-Stone Italian-language hybrid fake copy of the anti-CIA / anti-Clay Shaw article in his movie (sic) "JFK."

--- End quote ---

I have no idea what this thread is supposed to be about, why you think it was worth starting, or what on earth you're talking about.

I do, however, put Clay Shaw and Ruth Paine on the Mt. Rushmore of people who have suffered at the hands of CT lunatics.

EDIT: Hmmmm, after posting the above, I, as a Serious and Dedicated Researcher, reviewed over 15 pages of Google results for "homosexual thrill killing." I found zero references to this heinous crime other than in connection with the Garrison investigation. It would appear the FBI is wasting its time with the LGBTQ+ thrill killing training, although I can see why Hoover might've found it titillating.

I also discovered, however, that some fairly serious folks DO question Phelan's account. I must say, the account sounds pretty nutty even for Garrison. Perhaps Phelan was a Solie-planted mole or ferret? What did Nosenko say about all this? Is Newman on the case?

Tom Graves:

--- Quote from: Lance Payette on August 02, 2025, 12:54:20 PM ---No, I simply think Garrison was insane.

--- End quote ---

And overly ambitious, scandal-plagued, and revengeful, to boot. Regarding the latter, I've read that Shaw once publicly embarrassed him in a restaurant by forcing him to stop verbally abusing his wife.

--- Quote ---I have no idea what this thread is supposed to be about [...] or what on earth you're talking about.

--- End quote ---

I doubt that you're that obtuse, FP, but I'll spell it out for you:

If Communist-owned "Paese Sera" hadn't published the bogus anti-CIA / anti-Shaw article so soon after Garrison had arrested the closeted-gay New Orleans businessman, and if Garrison hadn't read a translated version of it (courtesy of Joan Mellen's ex-husband in London) so soon after he'd arrested Shaw, he probably would have "stayed on course" and tried to prove in court (with help from attention-seeking Perry Russo, whom we now know confused photographic images of cleanshaven 5' 9.5" Oswald for Ferrie's bearded 6' 1" gay roommate, James "Lew" / "Leon" Lewallen) that Shaw had masterminded a homosexual thrill-kill assassination of JFK.

But it did.

And Garrison read it within three weeks.

And it convinced him to pursue the "the CIA killed JFK" angle, instead.

Get it?

--- Quote ---I have no idea why you think it was worth starting.

--- End quote ---

This thread was worth starting because we're seeing similar "active measures" today, e.g., the KGB's "losing" to Dutch Intelligence hackers in 2016 some fake "Russian Intel" memos which impugned Hillary, Obama and Biden by incorporating fake emails. At least one of which memos James Comey and Special Counsel John Durham realized was fake, but the former, fearing that it would be leaked by pro-Trump FBI agents before the election and unduly damage the reputation of Clinton or the FBI or AG Lynch or some-such thing, used as an excuse for prematurely (in retrospect) terminating the Bureau's investigation of Hillary's emails, and the latter went ahead and sneakily incorporated some others from the same batch into his nothing-burger Investigation of the Investigators.

And because "useful idiot" (or worse) Tulsi Gabbard, et al., are now trying to spin those fake Russian memos in such a way to make it look as though high-level Deep State Dems sabotaged Trump's campaign, and Tulsi, et al., are hoping that the spun issue of "Russiagate" will distract his MAGAT base from the Epstein/Maxwell/ Trump Case by having it refocus on Russiagate! Russiagate! Russiagate!, and do so while "former" KGB officer Vladimir Putin is jumping for joy -- because "useful idiots" (or worse) "Republicans" are doing his dirty work for him, just as Jim Garrison (and, twenty years later, Comrade Oliver Stone) did the Kremlin's dirty work so well that this "JFKA Forum" exists some sixty-two years after the fact, and you and I are even having this conversation.

That's why.

That, and because it's a "hoot."

--- Quote ---I do, however, put Clay Shaw and Ruth Paine on the Mt. Rushmore of people who have suffered at the hands of CT lunatics.

--- End quote ---

Okay.

--- Quote ---EDIT: Hmmmm. After posting the above, I, as a Serious and Dedicated Researcher, reviewed over 15 pages of Google results for "homosexual thrill killing." I found zero references to this heinous crime other than in connection with the Garrison investigation. It would appear the FBI is wasting its time with the LGBTQ+ thrill killing training, although I can see why Hoover might've found it titillating.

--- End quote ---

"Crazy," overly ambitious, scandal-plagued and revengeful Garrison couldn't possibly have seriously entertained the theory, then, could he, FP?

--- Quote ---I also discovered, however, that some fairly serious folks DO question Phelan's account.

--- End quote ---

Who, pray tell?

Jim "The CIA Did It!" DiEugenio?

Gary "Rudeness" Aguilar?

Jefferson "Yuri Nosenko Was a True Defector!" Morley?

--- Quote ---I must say, the account sounds pretty nutty, even for Garrison.

--- End quote ---

Yes, pretty nutty, indeed, but not too nutty for overly ambitious, scandal-plagued and revengeful Jim Garrison, I'm afraid.

--- Quote ---Perhaps Phelan was a Solie-planted mole or ferret? What did Nosenko say about all this? Is Newman on the case?

--- End quote ---

Funny . . . I was just going to ask you what your favorite humanitarian, Vladimir Putin, told you about it?

Equally funny is the fact that you didn't mention true defector KGB Major Anatoliy Golitsyn. Is it because it was he who tried to warn the CIA and the FBI as early as 1962 that they could expect (after a 35-year hiatus since the GPU's* highly successful "Operation Trust") to be on the receiving end of Sun Tzu-like "active measures" operations by your beloved KGB, and the fact that the aforementioned "Paese Sera" article so nicely fit the bill, albeit some five years later?

Hmmmmm, indeed.

*GPU = Gosudarstvennoye politicheskoye upravleniye

Tom Graves:

--- Quote from: Lance Payette on August 02, 2025, 12:54:20 PM ---I, as a Serious and Dedicated Researcher, reviewed over 15 pages of Google results for "homosexual thrill killing."

--- End quote ---

Dear Fancy Pants,

Did it give you a seriously dedicated thrill?

-- Tom

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