The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish

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Online Dan O'meara

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Re: The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish
« Reply #28 on: June 28, 2025, 11:22:01 AM »
While I tend to agree with the main point of the first post, I think that often times we can create conditions where “luck” becomes more likely to happen. The limited time that the assassin apparently had to plan his ambush made things more difficult. Especially for him to “cover his tracks.” However, consider the items he managed to get accomplished in order to be able to get three shots off before anyone could stop him.

1.  He managed to retrieve the rifle and sneak it into the TSBD without any apparent suspicions being voiced before the assassination. This is even though he didn’t drive and had to hitch a ride from BWF.

2.  He planned his ambush to be from behind and above the target. This gave him not only the element of surprise, but also maximized the time he would have to fire multiple shots.

3.  He managed to find and select a position that was visually well shielded from both outside and inside the TSBD. While sitting on the box seat, he was also able to stay out of sight of the SS agents as they approached the TSBD on Houston Street by simply sitting up straight. The boxes in the window would have made it more difficult for any of the SS agents to see him even if they had looked back at that window during the shooting. And keeping his position essentially initially undetected by LEOs he was able to then have a reasonable chance to escape after the assassination.

4.  This position was also well selected for having a “kill zone” where the target was moving almost directly away from him. This substantially increased his chances of hitting the target.

5. His ability to act calm and blend in with other people after the assassination helped his escape efforts (for a while). This was lost after the Tippit murder and all the frantic police activity in the area and subsequently led to his capture.

I think you're missing the point I was making about the very large element of luck involved in the actual shooting.
In a professional hit, luck is not a factor.
The head shot is an easy shot for a professional. The distances involved are small and there is only minimal lateral movement of the target. To miss the limo completely is not an option for a professional. Even the shot that passes through JFK's throat is a 'miss' as the target is the head.
There is then, at the very minimum, a period of 5 seconds between the non-fatal throat shot and the fatal head shot. This is where the large slice of luck comes in because anything could've happened in this interval that could have rendered the head shot impossible to take.
Luckily, for the shooter, JFK stayed upright and no-one came to his assistance.

I'm surprised that the sloppy and amateurish nature of the assassination isn't used more often by those who believe Oswald was the shooter.

Online Royell Storing

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Re: The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish
« Reply #29 on: June 28, 2025, 06:54:34 PM »
Hate to burst your bubble, Royell, but I dealt with the "Huge Gates" years ago and in much more detail than you have.
It's in this thread - https://www.jfkassassinationforum.com/index.php/topic,3078.msg119172.html#msg119172
It starts at Reply#559, read on from there.

All it proves is that the building was not locked down properly. That's all.
It does NOT prove that more than one person was involved in the assassination.
These gates were not closed for at least ten minutes. More importantly, the door to the west of the TSBD building wasn't secured at any point during the day. People could come and go as they pleased through this entrance.

        The link provided above jumps into the middle of the story of the Huge Gates. On top of that, those images show The Gates to be only "ajar". They are not "Wide Open". This is what happens when you jump into the middle of a mystery. You routinely still have a mystery on your hands. The images above were captured After the Kill Shot. What do we know about the status of The Gates before the Kill Shot was fired? Look at the Towner Film as the JFK Limo is turning from Houston St onto Elm St. Where The Gates are supposed to be, we see nothing but a Square Black Hole. Why is that? It is because The Gates and the bright placards on them are Not There. The 2 Huge Gates are "Wide Open" at this point in time prior to the Kill Shot. And for the record, both Gates open INWARD.  If you look at a reverse negative of the Couch Film, those Huge Gates are still "Wide Open" (inward), about 30 seconds after the Kill Shot. We see on the Martin Film showing Euins on the back of Officer Harkness 3 wheel motorcycle, that The Gates are only "ajar" at this point in time. The 2 gates then are roughly 2 feet apart from each other. This would be at about 6 or 7 minutes after the Kill Shot. Officer Harkness gave WC Testimony verifying his making a 12:36 police radio transmission regarding his having a witness, (Euins), with respect to seeing shot(s) fired from the TSBD. (Mandatory to read/know sworn testimony if you seriously want to solve this case). So, how did the Huge Gates go from being "Wide Open" on the Towner Film to simply being "ajar" on the Martin Film at 12:36-12:37?  Officer Luke Mooney gave WC Testimony that he and 2 other officers found those Huge Gates were "Wide Open" as they walked down the Elm St Extension. The 3 officers were inside the train yard when they received orders to secure the TSBD, and they headed down the Elm Ext to do such when they found The Gates "Wide Open". They walked through The Gates and then the 3 of them "Closed" the gates, but they did Not lock them shut. This then puts the Gates in their "ajar" status. (Martin Film). Mooney and the 2 officers then entered the TSBD from the other side of these Huge Gates. Their entry into the TSBD 1st floor found them extremely close to the Stairwell and the Freight Elevators. The 2 officers went up the stairwell while Mooney used the freight elevator. This was the shooter(s) avenue of escape from the TSBD. Straight down the stairwell and then just feet away from walking through the "Wide Open" Huge Gates and mingling into the shocked crowd on the Elm Ext and around the TSBD.                 
« Last Edit: June 28, 2025, 06:59:12 PM by Royell Storing »

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish
« Reply #30 on: June 28, 2025, 09:26:27 PM »
        The link provided above jumps into the middle of the story of the Huge Gates. On top of that, those images show The Gates to be only "ajar". They are not "Wide Open". This is what happens when you jump into the middle of a mystery. You routinely still have a mystery on your hands. The images above were captured After the Kill Shot. What do we know about the status of The Gates before the Kill Shot was fired? Look at the Towner Film as the JFK Limo is turning from Houston St onto Elm St. Where The Gates are supposed to be, we see nothing but a Square Black Hole. Why is that? It is because The Gates and the bright placards on them are Not There. The 2 Huge Gates are "Wide Open" at this point in time prior to the Kill Shot. And for the record, both Gates open INWARD.  If you look at a reverse negative of the Couch Film, those Huge Gates are still "Wide Open" (inward), about 30 seconds after the Kill Shot. We see on the Martin Film showing Euins on the back of Officer Harkness 3 wheel motorcycle, that The Gates are only "ajar" at this point in time. The 2 gates then are roughly 2 feet apart from each other. This would be at about 6 or 7 minutes after the Kill Shot. Officer Harkness gave WC Testimony verifying his making a 12:36 police radio transmission regarding his having a witness, (Euins), with respect to seeing shot(s) fired from the TSBD. (Mandatory to read/know sworn testimony if you seriously want to solve this case). So, how did the Huge Gates go from being "Wide Open" on the Towner Film to simply being "ajar" on the Martin Film at 12:36-12:37?  Officer Luke Mooney gave WC Testimony that he and 2 other officers found those Huge Gates were "Wide Open" as they walked down the Elm St Extension. The 3 officers were inside the train yard when they received orders to secure the TSBD, and they headed down the Elm Ext to do such when they found The Gates "Wide Open". They walked through The Gates and then the 3 of them "Closed" the gates, but they did Not lock them shut. This then puts the Gates in their "ajar" status. (Martin Film). Mooney and the 2 officers then entered the TSBD from the other side of these Huge Gates. Their entry into the TSBD 1st floor found them extremely close to the Stairwell and the Freight Elevators. The 2 officers went up the stairwell while Mooney used the freight elevator. This was the shooter(s) avenue of escape from the TSBD. Straight down the stairwell and then just feet away from walking through the "Wide Open" Huge Gates and mingling into the shocked crowd on the Elm Ext and around the TSBD.               

This has got nothing to do with the topic of this thread so I'd like you to take it somewhere else, Royell.
I posted - "It starts at Reply#559, read on from there." - but you didn't read on, did you Royell?
Start your own thread about your Huge Gates mystery.
If you have anything to contribute to the topic of this thread feel free to do so.

Online Royell Storing

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Re: The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish
« Reply #31 on: June 29, 2025, 03:14:21 AM »
This has got nothing to do with the topic of this thread so I'd like you to take it somewhere else, Royell.
I posted - "It starts at Reply#559, read on from there." - but you didn't read on, did you Royell?
Start your own thread about your Huge Gates mystery.
If you have anything to contribute to the topic of this thread feel free to do so.

    The moral of this story is that Knowing sworn testimony is vitally important to solving the JFK murder. It's easy to just examine the assassination images. This is what most people do.  It is laborious to read through the sworn testimonies and then retain them to memory for future reference when applicable. There are diamonds frequently buried deep within testimony. Diamonds were sprinkled within the Mooney testimony which broke the Huge Gates TSBD Entrance/Exit route wide open. The same was true with the diamonds I discovered in the Officer Haygood/Tague testimonies. Those and the photo of Haygood standing atop the Triple Underpass proved that we are Not seeing Officer Haygood on the Darnell Film. And now I am digging into #3.   ......................STAY TUNED  .......................... 

Online Jarrett Smith

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Re: The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish
« Reply #32 on: June 29, 2025, 06:06:48 AM »
So, you agree the assassination was not professional. That's the point I was making.
It was not carried out by someone hired/contracted for their specific skill as a marksman.
It would appear to be carried out by someone familiar with rifles but not particularly skilled.

Professional enough they had a man in a secret service disguise. Classic Mafia.

Online Tom Graves

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Re: The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish
« Reply #33 on: June 29, 2025, 07:04:05 AM »
Professional enough they had a man in a secret service disguise. Classic Mafia.

Why do you have a psychological need to believe the JFKA was a conspiracy?

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: The Assassination was Sloppy and Amateurish
« Reply #34 on: June 29, 2025, 08:38:37 AM »
Professional enough they had a man in a secret service disguise. Classic Mafia.

So, you start off by saying - "Maybe not professional" - and now it's - "Professional enough"
I assume you believe there was a shot from the GK and you're just going to ignore the points being made about how ludicrous an idea that is in terms of planning the assassination.
The GK could have been swarming with people, there could have been hundreds of people in that area. The planners had no way of knowing what they would be dealing with. There could have been hundreds lining Elm Street. And behind the picket fence was a car park - people parking cars, returning to cars etc.
The car park area was wide open. Look at the pic below, there is no way to control this area:



Try to put yourself in the position of someone planning the assassination.
How sensible does a shot from behind the picket fence look now?

One of the main reasons why people believe there was a shot from behind the picket fence is because so many people run up to that area immediately following the shooting.
Motorcycle cop, Clyde Haygood, heard this transmission on his radio from police Chief Curry:

"Get a man on top of that triple underpass and see what happened up there".

That's exactly what Haygood does. He gets off his bike and races up to the triple underpass - not up behind the picket fence.
A group of people see a cop running up there and decided to follow and this causes a cascade effect of people running up to that general
area just because they've seen other people running up to that area.