Toni Glover

[Sean Kneringer]

Welcome, Toni. Do you still have the blue coat? If so, I'm sure the Sixth Floor Museum would be interested in it.   

[Charles Collins]

FEEL COMFORTABLE? You're speaking as though she were still an 11-year-old.

Good Lord, the woman has appeared at CT conferences, given three interviews at the Sixth Floor Museum, spoken to newspapers, is peddling a book, has a Ph.D. and is a university professor.

FEEL COMFORTABLE???

Has anyone worried about making dear old Lance or anyone else feel comfortable? (Oh, boo-hoo, Lance. Grow up.)

This woman was an 11-year-old kid who saw, more or less, what everyone else in Dealey Plaza saw on that day. You folks write as though some combination of the Virgin Mary and Taylor Swift were blessing us with her exalted presence.

This is what your ridiculous behavior makes you look like to others:






I hope you are better than that. Time will tell…

[Lance Payette]

  Euins gave WC Testimony as to seeing shot(s) fired from the TSBD sniper's nest. That's where his value lies. If Euins is mistaken as to where he was standing inside Dealey Plaza when he saw the shots fired, maybe he is mistaken as to actually seeing WHERE those shots were fired from? There were reports of shots being fired from the 4th and 2nd floor of the TSBD. Maybe Euins actually saw shot(s) being fired from either of those floors? I have never heard/read anything out of Euins with respect to his being on Top of a pedestal around that pool. That Black Kid on the other pedestal was sitting On Top of that pedestal. I believe this rules out Euins being confused as to which pedestal he claims to have crouched behind. On the other hand, there is maybe 2-3 frames early-on in the Darnell film showing what looks like a young kid, maybe Black, sitting down at the bottom of that circular walling that surrounds the water pool. This figure/kid? looks to be sitting below where the man wearing the Hard Hat was sitting on top of that circular wall on the Zapruder Film. Euins could Not have hung around that pedestal/circular wall very long. Officer Harkness found Euins back inside the railroad yard. Harkness made a 12:36 police radio transmission that he had a kid that saw shots being fired from the TSBD. (paraphrasing). This 12:36 Harkness radio transmission gives Euins roughly 6 minutes, (probably less), to travel from that circular wall/pedestal? to the railroad yard where Officer Harkness found him. If that is Euins on the Darnell film sitting at the bottom of the circular wall, he has even less time. That portion of the Darnell Film that shows the kid at the bottom of the circular wall would be roughly 1 minute after the Kill Shot.

Let's say Euins was a bald-faced liar, saw nothing at all, and made up his entire story. Does this change anything? Not that I can see.

I'm having a bit of difficulty following your logic. You want Euins to be someplace other than where he said he was but also to have seen a gunman at a lower floor. The logic seems to be, "If he was mistaken about A, perhaps he was mistaken about B" - right? That's pretty thin, amounting to "There may have been a gunman on one of the lower floors because Euins was mistaken about where he was." We're going to credit him with having seen a gunman, but speculate he was mistaken about the floor because he was mistaken about where he was. I don't see that Euins adds anything at all to the equation, does he? Why not just say there may have been a gunman on one of the lower floors because others thought they heard shots from there? Unless the shots were fired from the SE corner window of those lower floors, Euins would have to be mistaken not only about the floor but the window as well.

I'm also not following the timing thing. I would think a casual stroll from the pedestal area to the railroad yard would take no more than a couple of minutes. What am I missing?

My guess is, Euins was (1) a young Black guy who was overwhelmed by what had just occurred and completely out of his depth when he found himself confronted by the DPD, Sheriff, FBI and WC; (2) telling his story to the best of his recollection but also highly "malleable" (Myers' term) given the intimidating circumstances in which he found himself; (3) initially probably conflating one of the Blacks in the fifth floor SE window with the shots from the sixth; and (4) like many witnesses, increasingly "malleable" as the years passed. To me, no big deal. He is still alive and living in Batch, TX, and appears to have had a few DUI-type issues as recently as 2019. Seriously, he and Toni Glover should have lunch at Denny's, see if they can get their stories straight, and get back to us.

[Lance Payette]

This is what your ridiculous behavior makes you look like to others:






I hope you are better than that. Time will tell…

Oh, COME ON. Are you related to Toni Glover or something?

Actually, I'm NOT better than that, but that should have been apparent long before now. Neither, for that matter, are Iacoletti, Weidmann, Capasse or any of their assorted sock puppets. For that matter, when were THEY or any of the other CTers here handled with the kid gloves with which you think Ms. Glover should be handled? (Yes, I know she's not a CTer, which makes this all even goofier. Should she be off-limits because she's NOT a CTer?)

In legal circles, what your graphic characterizes as "hurting others" is referred to as "cross-examination." It would indeed be a kinder and gentler world if the Dentist Dons could tell their stories without challenge or scrutiny, but the downside is that a lot of people would be believing a lot of crap. Witness the fallout of Dentist Don's latest testimony, where he was not subjected to anything resembling cross-examination. Voila, his crap is headline-worthy bombshell stuff.

I've looked through my posts here and see nothing I would characterize as belittling toward Toni Glover. Belittling, if at all, toward those who would make much of someone who clearly has little or nothing to add to what is already known. If folks here are interested in what a 70-something woman recalls in 2025 about what she saw as an 11-year-old kid in 1963, and believes her memories are not subject to the fallibility that mine seem to be, or to the influence of now nearly 30 years of involvement with the JFKA research community - well, OK, super!

If you want warm, fuzzy and cuddly, don't invite retired litigators to your party.

[Charles Collins]

Oh, COME ON. Are you related to Toni Glover or something?

Actually, I'm NOT better than that, but that should have been apparent long before now. Neither, for that matter, are Iacoletti, Weidmann, Capasse or any of their assorted sock puppets. For that matter, when were THEY or any of the other CTers here handled with the kid gloves with which you think Ms. Glover should be handled? (Yes, I know she's not a CTer, which makes this all even goofier. Should she be off-limits because she's NOT a CTer?)

In legal circles, what your graphic characterizes as "hurting others" is referred to as "cross-examination." It would indeed be a kinder and gentler world if the Dentist Dons could tell their stories without challenge or scrutiny, but the downside is that a lot of people would be believing a lot of crap. Witness the fallout of Dentist Don's latest testimony, where he was not subjected to anything resembling cross-examination. Voila, his crap is headline-worthy bombshell stuff.

I've looked through my posts here and see nothing I would characterize as belittling toward Toni Glover. Belittling, if at all, toward those who would make much of someone who clearly has little or nothing to add to what is already known. If folks here are interested in what a 70-something woman recalls in 2025 about what she saw as an 11-year-old kid in 1963, and believes her memories are not subject to the fallibility that mine seem to be, or to the influence of now nearly 30 years of involvement with the JFKA research community - well, OK, super!

If you want warm, fuzzy and cuddly, don't invite retired litigators to your party.

Lance, I am simply saying that I think you could (if you wanted to) alter your “style” a bit, and thereby help us encourage Toni Glover to share her memories of her experiences. Some of the folks around here deserve, and appear to relish, getting the “Lance Payette treatment”. Please try to tone it down a bit and let those of us who want to interact with Toni Glover have a better chance to do so. Thank you.

[Royell Storing]

Let's say Euins was a bald-faced liar, saw nothing at all, and made up his entire story. Does this change anything? Not that I can see.

I'm having a bit of difficulty following your logic. You want Euins to be someplace other than where he said he was but also to have seen a gunman at a lower floor. The logic seems to be, "If he was mistaken about A, perhaps he was mistaken about B" - right? That's pretty thin, amounting to "There may have been a gunman on one of the lower floors because Euins was mistaken about where he was." We're going to credit him with having seen a gunman, but speculate he was mistaken about the floor because he was mistaken about where he was. I don't see that Euins adds anything at all to the equation, does he? Why not just say there may have been a gunman on one of the lower floors because others thought they heard shots from there? Unless the shots were fired from the SE corner window of those lower floors, Euins would have to be mistaken not only about the floor but the window as well.

I'm also not following the timing thing. I would think a casual stroll from the pedestal area to the railroad yard would take no more than a couple of minutes. What am I missing?

My guess is, Euins was (1) a young Black guy who was overwhelmed by what had just occurred and completely out of his depth when he found himself confronted by the DPD, Sheriff, FBI and WC; (2) telling his story to the best of his recollection but also highly "malleable" (Myers' term) given the intimidating circumstances in which he found himself; (3) initially probably conflating one of the Blacks in the fifth floor SE window with the shots from the sixth; and (4) like many witnesses, increasingly "malleable" as the years passed. To me, no big deal. He is still alive and living in Batch, TX, and appears to have had a few DUI-type issues as recently as 2019. Seriously, he and Toni Glover should have lunch at Denny's, see if they can get their stories straight, and get back to us.

  Regarding the Euins "tick-tock" to the railroad yard, you are Only considering the distance. On the Darnell frames showing the kid sitting at the bottom of the wall, this segment also shows a Press Bus on Houston St. It looks like the Bus has just completed the turn from Main onto Houston. So, there is a lot of the Motorcade that needs to pass Euins before he could get across Elm St and then get back inside the railroad yard where Officer Harkness found him. There's a photo of Euins among the throng of people inside the railroad yard, so there's no question he did get back there. I wonder if maybe he heard "chatter" back there and then repeated what he heard. The 15 yr old's story has changed over time. And now there is a question regarding his actually crouching behind the Perch. Plus, there are No images showing Euins to be in position to see a shooter firing shot(s) from the sniper's nest. The WC trotting a witness out like Euins, reflects on the strength of the case they were trying to sell to the American Publc. 

[Lance Payette]

Lance, I am simply saying that I think you could (if you wanted to) alter your “style” a bit, and thereby help us encourage Toni Glover to share her memories of her experiences. Some of the folks around here deserve, and appear to relish, getting the “Lance Payette treatment”. Please try to tone it down a bit and let those of us who want to interact with Toni Glover have a better chance to do so. Thank you.

Sure, that's fair enough. From now on, my wife, who is at least 40% less snarky than I, will review all future posts before I hit the button. Believe it or not, this is EXACTLY what Mark Twain's wife Livy did for years. Twain was just about the darkest, nastiest, snarliest character who ever lived, and Livy actually did edit out about 10% of all he wrote, books and letters alike. After she died, he ran amuck and pretty much destroyed his funny-guy reputation. But I digress ...

I see that on the "The girl in blue" thread, which I somehow failed to rudely interrupt, Toni acknowledged the fallibility of memory, including hers. So, I will henceforth cut her some slack and encourage her to share her memories, which I will simply point out in advance would have to be shaky at best. She may ask me anything she likes about my 11th year, and I'll see what I can dredge up.

But now back to Euins. This is Pat Speer's take on him: https://www.patspeer.com/chapter-7b-more-pieces-in-the-plaza. His discussion starts well down the page but just do a "find on page" for Euins and you'll be there.

Pat thinks the Bell and Martin films (of which he has GIFs) show Euins sitting on the pedestal to the left of the Glover pedestal, and it certainly looks like him to me. Why is this not a perfectly acceptable solution? Toni is accurate as far as she goes, Euins was simply a bit confused, and all the brouhaha is much ado about nothing except to those who insist on magnifying minor discrepancies into something dark and sinister.

One mystery is the guy who blocked Toni (and her mother?) from leaving the pedestal. In the GIFs, I see no one around. Is the suggestion that this was something sinister, or could he simply have been trying to protect them in the midst of chaos?

(Wow, that Happy Face avatar gets old fast. I'm going to find something a little more dignified. There, that's better.)

[Lance Payette]

  Regarding the Euins "tick-tock" to the railroad yard, you are Only considering the distance. On the Darnell frames showing the kid sitting at the bottom of the wall, this segment also shows a Press Bus on Houston St. It looks like the Bus has just completed the turn from Main onto Houston. So, there is a lot of the Motorcade that needs to pass Euins before he could get across Elm St and then get back inside the railroad yard where Officer Harkness found him. There's a photo of Euins among the throng of people inside the railroad yard, so there's no question he did get back there. I wonder if maybe he heard "chatter" back there and then repeated what he heard. The 15 yr old's story has changed over time. And now there is a question regarding his actually crouching behind the Perch. Plus, there are No images showing Euins to be in position to see a shooter firing shot(s) from the sniper's nest. The WC trotting a witness out like Euins, reflects on the strength of the case they were trying to sell to the American Publc.

If that's him on the pedestal in the Bell and Martin films, he certainly could have seen what he claims to have seen. Do you think it isn't? I wonder if he has ever been shown these? He's only a couple of years older than me, so hopefully he's no more doddering than I am. Anyone here close to Batch, TX? We will reimburse you for mileage and treat you to lunch at Taco Bell!

To cut Euins some slack, at the WC he wasn't even sure of the street names for Houston and Elm. He also seems to have been not very well "coached" since he stubbornly maintained he saw a bald spot, couldn't tell if the shooter was Black or white, and insisted his affidavit was wrong because he had described a white spot and not a white man. I'm willing to chalk him up to a bit confused but basically honest.