Windshield damage came from outside says ChapGPT & GROK... interesting...

[Tim Nickerson]

I submitted the windshield damage image from Kennedy's limo to ChatGPT, asking if the impact came from the inside or the outside...
Here's my question, and the interesting response in full...

We are looking from the outside... Did this crack come from inside or outside?



ChatGPT said:
Thanks for the image.
Since we're looking from the outside, here are some observations:
Key Features in the Crack Pattern:
The impact point appears raised or textured, suggesting the damage originated on the outside (where we are viewing it from).
The radial cracks (spiderweb lines) spread outward from a central point — typical of an outside-to-inside impact.
There is no visible delamination or raised area around the inner surface, which would be more common if the impact had originated from the inside.
Conclusion:
Based on this image and the perspective (outside looking in), this crack was caused by an object hitting the windshield from the outside. It does not appear to have originated from the inside.
If you’re analyzing for forensic or insurance purposes and need stronger confirmation, examining the feel and texture at the point of impact (outside vs. inside surface) and checking for cratering or glass flaking direction can help further.

Mr. SPECTER - Did you have occasion then to examine the windshield of the Presidential limousine?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes; I did.
Mr. SPECTER - What did that examination disclose?
Mr. FRAZIER - On the inside surface of the windshield there was a deposit of lead. This deposit was located when you look at the inside surface of the windshield, 13 1/2 inches down from the top, 23 inches from the left-hand side or driver's side of the windshield, and was immediately in front of a small pattern of star-shaped cracks which appeared in the outer layer of the laminated windshield.
Mr. DULLES - What do you mean by the "outer layer of the laminated windshield"?
Mr. FRAZIER - The windshield is composed of two layers with a very thin layer of plastic in between which bonds them together in the form of safety glass. The inside layer of the glass was not broken, but the outside layer immediately on the outside of the lead residue had a very small pattern of cracks and there was a very minute particle of glass missing from the outside surface.
Mr. DULLES - And the outside surface was the surface away from where the occupants were sitting?
Mr. FRAZIER - That is correct; yes.
Mr. DULLES - And the inside surface was the surface nearest the occupants?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - What do those characteristics indicate as to which side of the windshield was struck?
Mr. FRAZIER - It indicates that it could only have been struck on the inside surface. It could not have been struck on the outside surface because of the manner in which the glass broke and further because of the lead residue on the inside surface. The cracks appear in the outer layer of the glass because the glass is bent outward at the time of impact which stretches the outer layer of the glass to the point where these small radial or wagon spoke-wagon wheel spoke-type cracks appear on the outer surface.
Mr. DULLES - So the pressure must have come from the inside and not from the outside against the glass?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; that is correct.
Mr. DULLES - As far as the car is concerned from the back to the front?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. DULLES - Not from outside against the glass--from the front against the glass.
Mr. FRAZIER - That is right.

https://www.jfk-assassination.net/russ/testimony/frazr2.htm

[Jake Maxwell]

Mr. SPECTER - Did you have occasion then to examine the windshield of the Presidential limousine?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes; I did.
Mr. SPECTER - What did that examination disclose?
Mr. FRAZIER - On the inside surface of the windshield there was a deposit of lead. This deposit was located when you look at the inside surface of the windshield, 13 1/2 inches down from the top, 23 inches from the left-hand side or driver's side of the windshield, and was immediately in front of a small pattern of star-shaped cracks which appeared in the outer layer of the laminated windshield.
Mr. DULLES - What do you mean by the "outer layer of the laminated windshield"?
Mr. FRAZIER - The windshield is composed of two layers with a very thin layer of plastic in between which bonds them together in the form of safety glass. The inside layer of the glass was not broken, but the outside layer immediately on the outside of the lead residue had a very small pattern of cracks and there was a very minute particle of glass missing from the outside surface.
Mr. DULLES - And the outside surface was the surface away from where the occupants were sitting?
Mr. FRAZIER - That is correct; yes.
Mr. DULLES - And the inside surface was the surface nearest the occupants?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes.
Mr. SPECTER - What do those characteristics indicate as to which side of the windshield was struck?
Mr. FRAZIER - It indicates that it could only have been struck on the inside surface. It could not have been struck on the outside surface because of the manner in which the glass broke and further because of the lead residue on the inside surface. The cracks appear in the outer layer of the glass because the glass is bent outward at the time of impact which stretches the outer layer of the glass to the point where these small radial or wagon spoke-wagon wheel spoke-type cracks appear on the outer surface.
Mr. DULLES - So the pressure must have come from the inside and not from the outside against the glass?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir; that is correct.
Mr. DULLES - As far as the car is concerned from the back to the front?
Mr. FRAZIER - Yes, sir.
Mr. DULLES - Not from outside against the glass--from the front against the glass.
Mr. FRAZIER - That is right.

https://www.jfk-assassination.net/russ/testimony/frazr2.htm

Ahh... yes...

AND ChatGPT would say to Mr. Frazier... "You are lying to the American people?"
AND a good attorney might even ask Mr. Frazier: "Who has paid you, or threatened you?"

So, here's my QUESTION of ChatGPT:

A spider web crack in the windshield from an object hitting from the inside, forms where - on the inside or outside of the windshield?

ChatGPT said:
A spider web crack in a windshield caused by an object hitting it from the inside will generally form primarily on the inside layer of the windshield.
Here's why:
Modern windshields are made of laminated safety glass, which consists of:
Two layers of glass (an outer and inner layer)
A middle layer of polyvinyl butyral (PVB) plastic for bonding and shatter resistance
Impact from the inside:
The inner glass layer bears the brunt of the force.
The spider web pattern will originate and be most visible on the inside surface, although cracks can propagate through the PVB and affect the outer layer as well.
Signs to confirm:
You can often feel the crack with your fingernail on the inner surface.
The outer glass may remain mostly intact unless the force is very high.
Summary:
If an object hits the windshield from inside the vehicle, the spider web crack will form on the inside of the windshield, mainly affecting the inner glass layer.

FOLLOW-UP QUESTION: Even in 1963?

ChatGPT said:

Great question.
Yes, even in 1963, most American cars were equipped with laminated safety glass for the windshield—not tempered glass—so the same general principle applies:
Windshields in 1963:
Laminated glass was standard for front windshields in the U.S. by the 1950s, due to safety regulations and industry practice.
Laminated glass consists of two layers of glass with a plastic interlayer (PVB).
This construction helps prevent shattering and keeps the glass in place during impacts.
So in 1963, if an object struck the windshield from the inside:
The inner layer of glass would be impacted first.
A spider web crack would generally form on the inside surface, as that’s where the force originated.
The outer layer might remain intact, depending on the force and the condition of the glass.

Conclusion:
Yes, even in 1963, a spider web crack from an object hitting the windshield from the inside would generally form on the inside layer of the glass, since laminated glass was standard for windshields.

[Tim Nickerson]

Ahh... yes...

AND ChatGPT would say to Mr. Frazier... "You are lying to the American people?"
AND a good attorney might even ask Mr. Frazier: "Who has paid you, or threatened you?"

So, here's my QUESTION of ChatGPT:

A spider web crack in the windshield from an object hitting from the inside, forms where - on the inside or outside of the windshield?

ChatGPT said:
A spider web crack in a windshield caused by an object hitting it from the inside will generally form primarily on the inside layer of the windshield.
Here's why:
Modern windshields are made of laminated safety glass, which consists of:
Two layers of glass (an outer and inner layer)
A middle layer of polyvinyl butyral (PVB) plastic for bonding and shatter resistance
Impact from the inside:
The inner glass layer bears the brunt of the force.
The spider web pattern will originate and be most visible on the inside surface, although cracks can propagate through the PVB and affect the outer layer as well.
Signs to confirm:
You can often feel the crack with your fingernail on the inner surface.
The outer glass may remain mostly intact unless the force is very high.
Summary:
If an object hits the windshield from inside the vehicle, the spider web crack will form on the inside of the windshield, mainly affecting the inner glass layer.

FOLLOW-UP QUESTION: Even in 1963?

ChatGPT said:

Great question.
Yes, even in 1963, most American cars were equipped with laminated safety glass for the windshield—not tempered glass—so the same general principle applies:
Windshields in 1963:
Laminated glass was standard for front windshields in the U.S. by the 1950s, due to safety regulations and industry practice.
Laminated glass consists of two layers of glass with a plastic interlayer (PVB).
This construction helps prevent shattering and keeps the glass in place during impacts.
So in 1963, if an object struck the windshield from the inside:
The inner layer of glass would be impacted first.
A spider web crack would generally form on the inside surface, as that’s where the force originated.
The outer layer might remain intact, depending on the force and the condition of the glass.

Conclusion:
Yes, even in 1963, a spider web crack from an object hitting the windshield from the inside would generally form on the inside layer of the glass, since laminated glass was standard for windshields.

ChatGPT is wrong.

When a projectile first hits the glass, the glass will be stretched, causing tension on the back side directly behind the projectile. This causes compression around the point of tension. The radial cracks begin on the opposite side of the force at the point where the projectile hits the glass and radiate out from the origin of the impact.


https://ejfs.springeropen.com/articles/10.1186/s41935-017-0019-5

[Jake Maxwell]

ChatGPT is wrong.

When a projectile first hits the glass, the glass will be stretched, causing tension on the back side directly behind the projectile. This causes compression around the point of tension. The radial cracks begin on the opposite side of the force at the point where the projectile hits the glass and radiate out from the origin of the impact.


https://ejfs.springeropen.com/articles/10.1186/s41935-017-0019-5

Look again...
The article you cite is about an air rifle and a window pane... NOT a windshield with laminate...

[Tim Nickerson]

Look again...
The article you cite is about an air rifle and a window pane... NOT a windshield with laminate...

From ChatGPT:

If a windshield is struck by a object on the inside, what side of the windshield will radial cracks appear?

If a windshield is struck by an object from the inside, the radial cracks will appear on the outside surface of the windshield.

Here's why:
When an object hits the windshield, the impact side experiences compressive forces, while the opposite side experiences tensile forces. Glass is much weaker under tension than compression, so it tends to crack on the side opposite the impact.

Radial cracks: These are the straight-line cracks that radiate out from the point of impact.

They form on the side opposite to the impact, where the tensile stress is greatest.

So, if the impact is from inside the vehicle:

Radial cracks will appear on the outside of the windshield.

The inside may show some crushing or localized damage (like a small cone), but the major crack propagation (radial and concentric cracks) will be on the outer surface.

[Jake Maxwell]

From ChatGPT:

If a windshield is struck by a object on the inside, what side of the windshield will radial cracks appear?

If a windshield is struck by an object from the inside, the radial cracks will appear on the outside surface of the windshield.

Here's why:
When an object hits the windshield, the impact side experiences compressive forces, while the opposite side experiences tensile forces. Glass is much weaker under tension than compression, so it tends to crack on the side opposite the impact.

Radial cracks: These are the straight-line cracks that radiate out from the point of impact.

They form on the side opposite to the impact, where the tensile stress is greatest.

So, if the impact is from inside the vehicle:

Radial cracks will appear on the outside of the windshield.

The inside may show some crushing or localized damage (like a small cone), but the major crack propagation (radial and concentric cracks) will be on the outer surface.

When ChatGPT analyzes the actual image of the windshield on JFK's limo, it gives this analysis:

Analyze this windshield crack... Did the impact come from the inside or the outside?
ChatGPT said:
The crack in the windshield appears to have originated from an impact on the outside of the glass. Here are some key observations supporting this:
1. Fracture Pattern
The crack shows a bullseye or star-shaped pattern, which is typical of high-velocity impacts from small hard objects (like stones or bullets).
The long radial cracks (spiderweb pattern) indicate the force radiated outward from a central impact point.
2. Coning Effect
Although this is a 2D image, if the impact site appears to have a small central pit or chip surrounded by a more spidered outward break, that's usually indicative of a foreign object striking from the outside, creating a conical break where the wider part is on the exterior.
3. Glass Behavior
Automotive windshields are made of laminated safety glass: two layers of glass with a plastic interlayer. When struck from outside, the outer layer breaks first, and the inner layer usually remains intact or only cracks secondarily.
The clarity of the cracks visible here—without obvious internal glass shattering—suggests the outside layer took the initial hit.
If you have access to the physical vehicle or image in 3D:
Run your fingers carefully over both sides of the glass. If you feel a pit or roughness, that’s the side of impact.
Summary:
The impact came from the outside of the windshield.

[Tom Graves]

When ChatGPT analyzes the actual image of the windshield on JFK's limo, it gives this analysis:

Analyze this windshield crack... Did the impact come from the inside or the outside?
ChatGPT said:
The crack in the windshield appears to have originated from an impact on the outside of the glass. Here are some key observations supporting this:
1. Fracture Pattern
The crack shows a bullseye or star-shaped pattern, which is typical of high-velocity impacts from small hard objects (like stones or bullets).
The long radial cracks (spiderweb pattern) indicate the force radiated outward from a central impact point.
2. Coning Effect
Although this is a 2D image, if the impact site appears to have a small central pit or chip surrounded by a more spidered outward break, that's usually indicative of a foreign object striking from the outside, creating a conical break where the wider part is on the exterior.
3. Glass Behavior
Automotive windshields are made of laminated safety glass: two layers of glass with a plastic interlayer. When struck from outside, the outer layer breaks first, and the inner layer usually remains intact or only cracks secondarily.
The clarity of the cracks visible here—without obvious internal glass shattering—suggests the outside layer took the initial hit.
If you have access to the physical vehicle or image in 3D:
Run your fingers carefully over both sides of the glass. If you feel a pit or roughness, that’s the side of impact.
Summary:
The impact came from the outside of the windshield.

Dear Jake "Eagle Eye" Maxwell,

Was lead residue found on the inside surface or the outside surface of the windshield?

-- Tom