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Steve M. Galbraith

Author Topic: When Was JBC Hit?  (Read 160123 times)

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: When Was JBC Hit?
« Reply #413 on: Yesterday at 12:05:27 AM »
I'm not surprised that the concept of drawing conclusions from evidence is foreign to you. You prefer to pull your conclusions out of your ass.

 :D :D
So, please tell the forum how the "wealth of evidence" you have presented demonstrates that the sound of the shots was loud enough to cause a startle reaction at Zapruder's location. Do you even understand the difference between someone reacting to something and a startle reaction? Do you even understand that witnesses in different locations heard things differently?

What I think about this issue is informed by the only witness evidence relevant to this subject - Sitzman's statements. This evidence demonstrates that Jiggle Analysis is a non-starter as far as the Z-film is concerned.
Your sad attempt to counter this evidence is now on the record for all to see.

Do yourself a favour and have a read through "The First Shot" thread.

Online John Corbett

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Re: When Was JBC Hit?
« Reply #414 on: Yesterday at 12:20:29 AM »
:D :D
So, please tell the forum how the "wealth of evidence" you have presented demonstrates that the sound of the shots was loud enough to cause a startle reaction at Zapruder's location. Do you even understand the difference between someone reacting to something and a startle reaction? Do you even understand that witnesses in different locations heard things differently?

What I think about this issue is informed by the only witness evidence relevant to this subject - Sitzman's statements. This evidence demonstrates that Jiggle Analysis is a non-starter as far as the Z-film is concerned.

A silly approach given how unreliable eye and ear witness testimony is. I'm amazed by how many people on this forum think witness accounts are the end all, be all when it comes to evidence. No matter what someone wants to believe about the JFKA, they can probably find and a witness to support it. If we are to believe witnesses, the JFKA happened dozens of different ways.
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Your sad attempt to counter this evidence is now on the record for all to see.

Do yourself a favour and have a read through "The First Shot" thread.

Just what I need. A recommendation from a guy who doesn't think Oswald fired the shots that killed JFK.

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: When Was JBC Hit?
« Reply #415 on: Yesterday at 12:36:24 AM »
A silly approach given how unreliable eye and ear witness testimony is. I'm amazed by how many people on this forum think witness accounts are the end all, be all when it comes to evidence. No matter what someone wants to believe about the JFKA, they can probably find and a witness to support it. If we are to believe witnesses, the JFKA happened dozens of different ways.

Try again - how does the "wealth of evidence" you presented demonstrate that the sound of the shots could have caused a startle reaction at Zapruder's location.
That's the issue at hand.

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Just what I need. A recommendation from a guy who doesn't think Oswald fired the shots that killed JFK.

There is zero evidence that Oswald actually took the shots and lots of evidence suggesting he didn't.
You believe that because Oswald's rifle was found at the scene, that is evidence he actually took the shots. As much as this is going to blow your mind, it is not evidence Oswald actually took the shots.
Because you're not too bright you cannot understand how this can be true.
Like all true Nutters, you don't realise that what you think about this case is actually a THEORY. Your delusion convinces you that it is a FACT Oswald took the shots.
It is not a fact, its just a theory.


Online Dan O'meara

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Re: When Was JBC Hit?
« Reply #416 on: Yesterday at 12:48:23 AM »
Question: Zapruder said he heard only two shots. Not three. Why didn't (or wouldn't) he remember hearing the first shot that caused him to "jiggle" the camera?

Wouldn't he have remembered a shot or sound that startled or shook him enough to jiggle the camera for that third (in your scenario, the first) shot? It's loud enough to cause him to "jiggle" but not loud enough for him to remember?

This is a really good point.
Both Zapruder and Sitzman are unsure as to how many shots there were. They both seem to favour two shots but sometimes mention three.
If, as you say, the shots were loud enough to cause a startle reaction wouldn't it be easily remembered how many there were?

Online John Corbett

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Re: When Was JBC Hit?
« Reply #417 on: Yesterday at 03:04:51 AM »
Try again - how does the "wealth of evidence" you presented demonstrate that the sound of the shots could have caused a startle reaction at Zapruder's location.
That's the issue at hand.

There is zero evidence that Oswald actually took the shots and lots of evidence suggesting he didn't.[/qiuote]

It's mind boggling anyone could make a statement that stupid. You would have us believe Oswald brought the rifle to work just to hand over to somebody else so they could frame him. If you want evidence Oswald took the shots, try the fibers on the butt plate of the rifle that matched the shirt he was wearing that day. When the rifle recoils, it forcefully drives the butt of the rifle into the shooter's shoulders. You would have us believe it is just an unfortunate coincidence for Oswald that fibers matching his shirt were on the rifle.

You believe that because Oswald's rifle was found at the scene, that is evidence he actually took the shots. As much as this is going to blow your mind, it is not evidence Oswald actually took the shots.
Because you're not too bright you cannot understand how this can be true.[/quote]

That's rich coming from somebody as stupid as you. You're not even bright enough to know how stupid you are.
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Like all true Nutters, you don't realise that what you think about this case is actually a THEORY. Your delusion convinces you that it is a FACT Oswald took the shots.
It is not a fact, its just a theory.

Wrong. It is a fact Oswald shot and killed both JFK and JDT. It is impossible to respect anyone who can look at the evidence and come to any other conclusion.

Online Dan O'meara

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Re: When Was JBC Hit?
« Reply #418 on: Today at 12:43:59 PM »
Wrong. It is a fact Oswald shot and killed both JFK and JDT. It is impossible to respect anyone who can look at the evidence and come to any other conclusion.

It is NOT a fact that Oswald killed JFK.
It is a theory.
It is your opinion.
But it is NOT a fact.
You clearly don't know what the word FACT means.
You clearly don't understand what a THEORY is.

It is the benchmark of the trully deluded Nutter to believe his opinion is a fact.

Offline Lance Payette

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Re: When Was JBC Hit?
« Reply #419 on: Today at 01:16:13 PM »
We epistemological types would note that the term "theory" is being tossed around rather loosely by, er, what we might charitably call non-epistemological types.

Since we are dealing with an historical event and a large body of evidence, the scientific definition is not inappropriate:

A theory is "a well-established framework built upon extensive evidence." It is the highest level of scientific understanding short of an observable, scientifically proven fact. The LN narrative is a theory. Certain key aspects of the theory are subject to testing and falsification and have been confirmed.

A hypothesis is "a testable prediction or explanation that is formulated as part of research or experimentation" but has not achieved the status of a theory. The very multiplicity of CT explanations for the JFKA and the extent to which they are debated, as well as the failure of any explanation to convincingly account for Dealey Plaza, shows that none has achieved the status of a theory.

Although Flat Earthers will insist the spherical earth is "just a theory" and thus stands on the same epistemological footing as the flat earth "theory," the fact is that the spherical earth is regarded as an observable, scientifically proven fact while the flat earth is regarded as an absurd myth - not even a hypothesis, let alone a theory.

At this point, to attempt to place any CT explanation on the same footing as the LN narrative, or to use terminology such as "just a theory" in regard to the LN narrative, is completely invalid. Dan has conceded that his LBJ-Byrd-Cason-Shelley scenario is pure speculation and cannot account for Oswald. In epistemological terms, it would be a "wild guess."

Everyone should read Thomas Kuhn's seminal The Structure of Scientific Revolutions and at least some basic works on epistemology. Epistemological ignorance really is at the root of much JFKA debate.