Geneva Hine

[Richard Smith]

It is typical in an investigation to make a list of the possibilities and then see if any of the possibilities can be eliminated by evidence, circumstances, etc. In the case of Geneva Hine and the question of which lights she was referring to, we have so far listed only two possibilities. The phone lights and the building lights. I haven’t seen any evidence of a Christmas tree set up (in the photos of the offices), and it was still a bit too early in the season for a Christmas tree. So, I don’t think that Christmas tree lights need to be included in the list. Are there any other possibilities that anyone thinks we should list?

Here are some items listed to help in deciding if any possibilities can be eliminated.

Items for phone lights:

• Each button on the multi-line phone lights up when that particular line is in use and goes out when idle. An incoming call is identified by a blinking (or winking) button light.
• Monitoring the phones is the activity that Geneva Hine was performing at the time in question.
• Monitoring the phones requires looking at the buttons to see which ones are lit up or blinking.
• Geneva Hine was discussing what she was doing (monitoring the phones) when she said that the lights all went out.
• The other people who worked in Geneva Hine’s office were outside watching the motorcade. Therefore there was reduced phone activity.
• It was the lunch hour for businesses and schools all over Texas. Therefore there was reduced phone activity.

Items against phone lights:

Items for building lights:

Items against building lights:

• Photographic evidence (several photos) showing that the lights were on in the building at the time of the assassination.
• No witnesses indicated that the building lights went out at the time of the assassination.
• Several witnesses said that the clock on the roof of the TSBD was showing the time of day at the time of the assassination. This is an indication that the power to the TSBD was on.
• Photographic evidence showing the limo just after passing under the overpass shows the clock on the roof of the TSBD displaying 12:30. This is an indication that the power to the TSBD was on.
• Someone was heard by Geneva Hine to be talking on the phone in another locked office on her floor just after the shots were fired. This is an indication that phone service to the TSBD was operating.

Please feel free to suggest any additions to the above list. I will add them as necessary. When the list is complete, each one of you can be the judge as to which lights Geneva Hine was referring to.

That's a great list.  A limited outage within the building means that some person would have to be in the building turning the power and phones off at that moment, back on a few moments later, and then off again and on at some later point if Mooney's elevator issue is a result of another power outage.  That person would have to be in the building for many minutes in the aftermath of the assassination.  No such person was seen by any witness.  Presumably if there was a conspiratorial purpose to this exercise, someone else in the building would need to be in real time communication with that individual telling them when to turn the power/phones off.  The DPD would be searching the TSBD by this point.  No such person is identified by any witness.  And it is difficult to comprehend how these individuals stayed in communication in a time before cell phones to coordinate these activities.

[Charles Collins]

That's a great list.  A limited outage within the building means that some person would have to be in the building turning the power and phones off at that moment, back on a few moments later, and then off again and on at some later point if Mooney's elevator issue is a result of another power outage.  That person would have to be in the building for many minutes in the aftermath of the assassination.  No such person was seen by any witness.  Presumably if there was a conspiratorial purpose to this exercise, someone else in the building would need to be in real time communication with that individual telling them when to turn the power/phones off.  The DPD would be searching the TSBD by this point.  No such person is identified by any witness.  And it is difficult to comprehend how these individuals stayed in communication in a time before cell phones to coordinate these activities.

That’s a good point. I think we should add the fact that no one was seen manipulating any electrical or phone circuits within the TSBD to the list.

[Richard Smith]

You have regressed to 4-3=0.

Irrelevant to this discussion.

You have also introduced a false premise.

Nope.

In addition, Oswald is in flight from the assassination of the president. 

In addition to what?

He has no access to a car or other means of transportation.

You have no way of knowing if he had access to a car or other means of transportation.

What is he going to do?

Tell us.

He gets on the bus.

"the bus" -- LOL

His objective is not advanced

If the bus is the Marsalis bus his objective of going to 1026 N. Beckley is certainly not advanced.

because in the real world events like traffic jams occur that he can't control and intervene in the narrative.

There's no "beacuse" involved, the traffic jams was predictable as he walked east on Elm.

Such random and uncontrollable events are not a function of a contrived narrative.

BS, his choice of bus line is not an "uncontrollable event".

You made the same stupid mistake once again.

Imagine the meeting where the conspirators are planning this event.  They are gathered in a room discussing what should happen after the assassination and someone raises their hand and says "How about Oswald gets on a bus with a load of unknown people that takes him nowhere and it gets stuck in a traffic jam and takes him nowhere before he gets off."   HA HA HA.   

Strawman. Nobody claimed a bus ride was preplanned, massive fail.

No one can possibly believe that was part of a plan.  Well maybe someone who thinks 4-3=0 but no one else.

Well, you just made it up!

You have evidence that Oswald had access to a car after the assassination?  That is more 4-3=0 nonsense.  It is a false premise to suggest that the Marsalis bus doesn't advance Oswald's objectives had it not become stuck in traffic which were:  1) to get out of the area; and 2) get to his boardinghouse.  As I recall, the Marsalis bus gets him to within seven blocks of his boardinghouse.  He got out of the cab five blocks away.  Within easy walking distance.  He certainly doesn't want to get out right in front of the place until he is sure the cops are not there.  You don't believe that Oswald was on this bus (even though he has a transfer issued by the driver of that bus) but you are not suggesting his presence was not part of a plan.  Did magic fairies descended from the heavens to place this in his pocket?  Silly even by your bizarre standards.   

[John Iacoletti]

You know Hine was in the room on her own, yet you still ask for witness testimony that she was talking about the telephone lights.

Forget witness testimony. You have no evidence — period — that she was talking about her telephone lights. It’s pure speculation.

When photographic evidence is posted of the lights still being on, you then insist it was only the lights near Hine that went out and that it could've happened like that because nobody knows how the building was wired.

I didn’t “insist” anything of the kind. And  . Posting a photo with an arrow pointing to a light fixture and just declaring that it is on is hardly conclusive. And besides that, we don’t know where or for how long the lights all went out. So even if the front porch light was on sometime after the assassination, it is completely irrelevant to what Hine said.

You clearly have your own theory about the assassination but won't put it forward.

Really? What makes you think so?

[John Iacoletti]

You have evidence that Oswald had access to a car after the assassination?

Yes. He was seen getting into a car described as a Nash Rambler.

[Richard Smith]

You have evidence that Oswald did not have access to a car after the assassination?

Not compared to the Beckley bus which also left 12:36 from the same checkpoint on Elm.

No, it was totally predictable it would become stuck in traffic.

On a bus that took him back to the crime scene?

For less that one dollar, immediately locating a taxi cab would have taken him out of the area and to the doorstep of the rooming house.

Vs. to the doorstep.

No, not that cab.

That passenger continued south on Beckley.

How does getting out five blocks away achieve that?

No one on the bus remembered him except for Bledsoe, allegedly, who showed up for the interview with prefab answers.

And it would have made him miss Whaley's cab.

And it violates the principle you put forward yourself so why would you believe it?

No, would anyone suggest that?!

Remove those double negations and rephrase whatever point you're trying to make.

You mean including the five live rounds?

You've provided nothing to support the idea that Oswald would have put himself at a disadvantage by jumping on a Marsalis bus that was about to get stuck in traffic.

What do you think happened here?  You don't believe he was on the McWatters bus (even though a witness that knew him confirmed this and he had a bus transfer from that bus in his pocket).  But you entertain the baseless claim that Oswald had access to a car on 11.22 even though we know he never owned a car.  Wouldn't there be an equal risk that a cab or car might get stuck in the same traffic?  Why is the risk only that a bus would get stuck?  He got on the Marsalis bus because it was there at the time.  The first one he comes across.  He doesn't even get on at a bus stop.  It would have taken him to within a few blocks of where he wanted to go.  But of all the evidence and strange behavior Oswald is exhibiting, including fleeing his place of employment midday to get a gun, you are hung up on why he didn't catch another bus?  Maybe he already missed it.  He was fleeing the assassination of the president.  Not a normal commuter who could afford to read the paper waiting for his typical bus.  Unreal.  But lay out what you think happened here to explain all this.

[John Mytton]

Yes. He was seen getting into a car described as a Nash Rambler.

Who saw Oswald get in a Nash Rambler and did they positively identify him in an "unfair line-up"?

JohnM