Oswald's shot-1 ricochet was at Z113 or Z105.

[John Mytton]

 

That's so funny, the kid can't fit a square peg into a round hole so just cheats, an excellent analogy of CT thinking.

JohnM

[Andrew Mason]

But nothing wrong with you using a medical illustration of a person not twisted and who's standing upright.

??The point about using the medical illustration is to show the location on the body.  When you compare it the the twisted and leaning torso of JBC you have to allow for changes such as a dropped right shoulder. I have shown how it is certainly not impossible for the bullet exiting the chest at the level of the 5th rib as JBC is positioned in z268 to have struck him in the wrist where it did.

So Dan's response to the abundant evidence that tells us a shot around z271 striking JBC occurred, which was that it is impossible for the bullet exiting the chest to strike the wrist where it did, is not correct. So we are left with all that evidence that tells us the second shot occurred there.

[Andrew Mason]

That's so funny, the kid can't fit a square peg into a round hole so just cheats, an excellent analogy of CT thinking.

JohnM

Yeah. I agree.  But it is also like the SBT cheats about
1. the trajectory through JFK's neck to JBC's right armpit working
2. that the jagged tears on the french cuff, the jagged edges of the chest exit and wrist entrance wounds are consistent with CE399
3. ignoring the fact that the bullet through JBC's back made a round tunneling path
4. Ignoring the problems with a bullet exiting JBC's chest striking the right wrist changing direction and then striking the left thigh on an oblique angle in the direction of the femur at z225.
5. Ignoring Nellie Connally and all the others who said that JFK reacted to the first shot
6. Ignoring the 1... ....2....3 shot pattern
Etc.

[Andrew Mason]

Mason's "Confirmation Bias" Alignment

Non-Bias Alignment (Top of sternum at base of necktie knot)

Are you serious, Jerry? You have the right shoulder 4 inches below the shoulder in the zfilm! Do you really think that the red square is where his right nipple is?

Connally is basically presenting most of his front chest area to Zapruder.

More or less.  But his shoulders are turned almost 90 degrees to the car direction.  His hips are still likely not turned more than 20 degrees. So the torso from hips to shoulders ranges from 20 to 90 degrees to the car direction.

His left torso and left shoulder are closer in space to Zapruder than the right side.

. The difference is miniscule.  It is made even less because of the telephoto zoom lens..

[Andrew Mason]

The sternum is less mobile than the shoulders. And it's the chest and ribs we're most concerned with.

Leaving the sternum match in place, one could tilt the medical illustration a little to raise Connally's left shoulder, but it would not improve the elevation of the right nipple.

Maybe try it in 3D. The medical illustration is 2D and won't match up fully with a life image taken at an oblique angle.

You can't be serious! And you accuse me of confirmation bias!

How can you say you are matching the sternum location when the part where the neck connects to the shoulder is at least 4 inches higher in the zframe?

[Andrew Mason]

Since your medical illustration shows the shoulders at rest, a "shoulder-line" match to the photo should match with how Connally's shoulders are at rest.


The right left shoulder is artificially high and the camera angle is oblique. The best you can do is match the sternum level. The sternum is approximately on the frontal plane of the upper chest, which we can see in the Zapruder film

Come on, Jerry. Anyone can see that you are not even close. As far as the sternum not moving, what are you basing that on? As far as I can tell, the whole rib cage, including the sternum is pretty flexible.  Put your hand on your sternum when you twist.

As far as the left shoulder is concerned, I agree that it is not at the same level as the right, but that is because he has dropped the right.  Besides, the point where the shoulder connects to the neck does not change 

All you are demonstrating is that the alignment of the right nipple and wrist wounds is certainly within the range of positions that are consistent with the zfilm.  I am pretty sure I could convince a panel of independent medical experts.

[Dan O'meara]

But nothing wrong with you using a medical illustration of a person not twisted and who's standing upright.



    "Connally clamps right elbow over torn-open right chest"
          — "Kennedy and Lincoln", Dr. John K. Lattimer (1980)

How long is this going to go on?

"How long is this going to go on?"

The physical and video evidence demonstrate beyond a shadow of doubt that Andrew's theory of a shot passing through JBC around z271 is nonsense. It has been clearly demonstrated but he simply refuses to accept it.
If that is indeed his suggestion for the exit of the bullet labeled in your graphic it simply defies belief. It makes a mockery of common sense. To make matters worse JBC's right shoulder is noticeably lower in the Zfilm than the image of him standing making the bullet hole in the jacket even lower!!

And even if the bullet did exit where Andrew suggests, it exits on a downward trajectory and would never be able to cause the tears in the cuff of JBC's shirt.
The fact of the matter is that the bullet exits JBC's chest a lot lower and is in accord with this quote you posted:

  "Connally clamps right elbow over torn-open right chest"
          — "Kennedy and Lincoln", Dr. John K. Lattimer (1980)

This leaves the problem of the missing bullet as it has clearly been demonstrated there was no shot that hit any of the occupants of the limo around z271