Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.


Users Currently Browsing This Topic:
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Author Topic: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.  (Read 15220 times)

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 532
  • It was rotten luck, he was just doing his job.
Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« on: March 26, 2021, 01:38:43 AM »
Oswald's shot-1 was at  Z113.
Below is a copy of my posting in my other thread that Oswald's shot-2 happened at Z218 based on Zapruder's startle reaction when he shook his camera at Z224, based on his startle reaction time of 3.7 frames. 

In the same way i can calculate that Oswald's shot-1 happened at Z129.8 based on Zapruder's mini-shake at Z134, based on the shake being due to the shock of the sound of the shot directly shaking the camera, based on the sound taking 4.2 frames to get from Oswald to Zapruder.  Actually, if the distance to JFK is say 88ft horizontally & 60ft vertically then that is 107ft, & if the slug moves at say 2200 fps or 120 ft per frame then the slug takes 0.9 frames.  Hence the slug was in the air at Z129.8 & hit the road at Z130.7.

Or if the mini-shake is due to Zapruder's startle reaction then i need to allow another  3.7 frames, which puts Oswald's shot-1 in the air at Z126.1 & it hits at Z127.0. 

When i say hits i mean it misses JFK & hits the signal arm & then it fragments.
(1) The remnant slug puts a non-round hole in the floor of the limo tween the jump seats (we have a photo) & hits the road.
(2) The copper jacket breaks into 2 pieces as is usual (it is made of 2 pieces joined together), giving us CE567 CE569 found in the car.
(3) Small lead fragments hit JFK in the back of his head (as seen on xrays). 
(4) Other larger lead fragments found in the limo might belong to Oswald's shot-1 or they might belong to Hickey's  AR15.

However i reckon that Oswald's shot-1 happened at Z113, not the above Z127 or Z131. 
This is based on the limo at Z133 being one car length past where it was when Oswald fired.  Before today i reckoned that Oswald's shot-1 was at Z123, based on the limo at Z133 being a half car length past, but today i had a closer look at photos etc & i saw that 1 full limo length past was the true situation.

More exactly, the difference is equal to the length of a painted white line on the roadway.  This is about 17ft.  I saw that the limo takes 19 frames to move the length of the stripe, ie from Z133 to Z152, & then the limo takes another 19 frames to reach the next painted stripe.  But if i assume that the limo was accelerating a little prior to Z133 i can round it off to say 20 frames.  Hence Oswald's shot-1 happened at Z113, meaning that it hit at Z113, but Oswald fired at Z112 (the slug being in the air for 0.9  frames).

The slugs hit at Z113 & then Z218 & then Z313 (an auto burst of 4 or 5 shots).

[PREVIOUSLY I SAID]Ö..Oswald's shot-2 was at  Z218.
Working backwards, Zapruder is startled at Z318 Z319 Z320, which is 5 frames after Hickey's 4 or 5 shots at Z313 Z314 Z315 Z316 Z317.  Zapruder is 84ft from Hickey, & the speed of sound is 343 m/s or 62ft per frame, so that takes 1.3 frames.  Deducting 1.3 from 5 gives a startle reaction time of 3.7 frames. 

Zapruder is startled at frames Z224 to Z229.  Deducting 3.7 from Z224 gives Z220.3.  Zapruder is 264 ft from Oswald, for which the  sound takes 4.2 frames.  Hence Oswald shot at Z216.1.  The slug moved at say 2200 fps which is 120 ft per frame, & Oswald is 197 ft from JFK, hence the slug takes  1.6 frames.  Adding 1.6 to Z216.1 gives Z217.7 as the time that JFK is hit, ie say Z218.

Z218 has always been my estimate based on Connally's testimony re Connally's turning movements.  He said he was turned/looking right, then turned to look over his left shoulder but only got halfway  there when the slug hit him.  That right to left turn can only have happened whilst Connally was hidden by the sign, & Z218 is dead center in that period.
Re Oswald's shot-1, this happened some time before Z133, Z133 being Zapruder's first frame of  that sequence.  We know where shot-1 happened, it happened at the signals, the shot ricocheting off the signal arm. But when is not known.  If it was a half limo length before Z133 then at 1 ft per frame that makes shot-1 at Z123. A full limo makes it Z113.
[END OF QUOTE].

« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 01:58:12 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

JFK Assassination Forum

Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« on: March 26, 2021, 01:38:43 AM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 532
  • It was rotten luck, he was just doing his job.
Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2021, 03:50:02 AM »
The slugs hit at Z113 & then Z218 & then Z313 (an auto burst of 4 or 5 shots).
The slugs are in the air at Z112.1 & then Z216.4 & then Z313.0.
The time intervals are 104.3 frames & 96.6 frames, or 5.70 sec & 5.28 sec & diff 0.42 sec & total 10.98 sec. 
Listeners who are stationary & an equal distance from Oswald & Hickey will hear the above intervals.

Listeners near Hickey hear Hickey's shots 231ft sooner than Oswald's, ie 0.20 sec sooner. 
They will hear intervals of 5.70 sec & 5.08 sec & diff 0.62 sec & total 10.78 sec.

Listeners below Oswald hear Oswald's shots 160ft sooner than Hickey's, ie 0.14 sec sooner. 
They will hear intervals of 5.70 sec & 5.42 sec & diff 0.28 sec & total 11.12 sec.

Listeners on the underpass hear Hickey's shots 220ft sooner than Oswald's, ie 0.19 sec sooner. 
They will hear intervals of 5.70 sec & 5.08 sec &  diff 0.62 sec & total 10.78 sec.

Listeners in the motorcade near JFK hear Oswald's shot-2  91ft later than Oswald's shot-1, ie 0.08 sec later. 
They will hear intervals of 5.78 sec & 5.08 sec & diff 0.70 sec & total 10.86 sec.

These intervals donít accord with witnesses who said that the 2nd  interval was much shorter than the 1st.   But in my above calculations the biggest difference was 5.08/5.78 which is a difference of only 12%.  The smallest difference was 5.42/5.70 which is  5%.   

If we agree with thems that say  that the 2nd shot was at Z224 then that adds 6 frames to the first interval & robs 6 frames from the 2nd interval, ie a difference of 12 frames which is 0.67 sec.  That would make the intervals say 6.11 sec & 4.75 sec, & the difference 22%.   But i much prefer my Z218 to their Z224.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 03:54:30 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 532
  • It was rotten luck, he was just doing his job.
Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2021, 04:35:38 AM »
Here is a small limo at Z113. Actually it is at say Z115 koz jfk is a couple of clicks past the arm.


Secret Service Reconstruction. Here is the small limo at Z133, ie the location of jfk when Zapruder started his sequence.


Here is a well known drawing of the JFK limo at the first shot & supposedly at Z133.
I reckon that the limo is however drawn mistakenly at say Z140 not Z133.


Here are the locations of Z113 & Z218 & Z313. Z113 is mistakenly called Z123 but the shown location is correct anyhow, koz we know that the location is where the signal arm aligns with jfk as viewed/aimed from Oswald's window.

« Last Edit: March 29, 2021, 10:28:20 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2021, 04:35:38 AM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 532
  • It was rotten luck, he was just doing his job.
Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2021, 04:58:54 AM »
Here is Z133 (the first frame in Zapruder's sequence) showing the JFK limo halfway along the white stripe.


Here is Z134 showing a mini-shake possibly due to the sound of shot-1 reaching Zapruder's camera or Zapruder's ears.

« Last Edit: March 29, 2021, 10:30:00 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 532
  • It was rotten luck, he was just doing his job.
Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2021, 11:07:53 PM »
Here is Towner T137 which i reckon is Z112, ie just before Oswald's shot-1.  My reckoning is based on the position of the end of the white stripe painted on the road.  At Z113, Oswald's shot-1, the end of the stripe was level with Nellie Connally, as can be seen in the printscreen from the Secret Service reconstruction footage, based on the position of the signal arm blocking  a shot at JFK from Oswald's sniper's nest (printscreen shown in my posting yesterday).


Here is Towner T139 which i reckon is Z114, ie just after Oswald's shot-1.


Here is T141, which i reckon is Z116.


Here is T142, the last frame of the sequence, which i reckon is Z117.



« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 11:50:44 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 532
  • It was rotten luck, he was just doing his job.
Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2021, 11:51:01 PM »
So, Oswald's shot-1 probly happened at T138 & Z113.  Zapruder's frame rate was they say 18.3 fps. Towner's might have been 16 or 18 or 20 or 22 fps, no-one knows for sure.  These frames are from Robin Unger's Gallery.  I donít know why T138 is missing.  This is i reckon at Z113, Oswald's shot-1.  I doubt that T138 will show anything much, it wont show the slug ricocheting off the signal arm, the remnant slug putting a hole in the floor of the limo & then hitting the drive-shaft & the road, the 2 fragments of copper jacket rattling around in the limo, the shower of small bits of lead hitting JFK in the back of the head.

If Oswald's shot-1 was at T138 then i would expect some reaction by T142, which is 4 frames later, but there is no obvious reaction from JFK & Co, or spectators.  Praps the shot was at T139, & young Tina Towner didnít react & shake the camera until T143, ie after she had already finished filming.  Actually, if Oswald fired at T137 & the bullet ricocheted off the signal arm at T138 then the sound of the shot wouldnít reach Tina until T139, the sound travelling say 120ft at say 62 ft per frame, whilst the slug travelled 107ft at say 120 ft per frame.  Yes we should not expect much reaction from anybody until T143.

Actually in these 4 frames JFK is mostly hidden by the Policeman, & everyone in the limo is blurred. Pity.
T137. We can see JFK's head, looking to his right.  Oswald fires shot-1.
T138. Missing. Slug ricochets off the signal arm. The remnant slug put a hole in the limo. Bits of lead hit the back of JFK'S head.
T139. We can see a little bit of JFK's head. Sound of shot arrives.
T140. Missing.  Does anyone know where we can get a copy of missing frames?
T141. Head is hidden behind Policeman.
T142. Head emerges, JFK is raising his right hand to his head, as described by witnesses re Oswald's shot-1.
T143. Doesnt exist, Tina Towner had stopped filming.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2021, 11:56:05 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2021, 11:51:01 PM »


Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 532
  • It was rotten luck, he was just doing his job.
Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #6 on: March 27, 2021, 03:23:06 AM »
Here is in effect Towner frame T138, which is missing in Robin Unger's gallery. He shows T137 T139 T141 T142.
T138 & T140 are missing. And T143 never happened -- the last frame was T142 (i think).
So, here below is in effect frame T138, a printscreen from i think the Museum's online Tina footage.
Oswald's shot-1 was at Z112, say T137.
Slug hit signal arm (& fragments hit JFK) at Z113, say T138.

We know that Z113 was at T138 koz Nellie Connally is level with the end of the white painted road stripe, in the re-enactment footage, & in Tina's footage.

Sound hit Tina at Z114, say T139.
Tina hears bang at say T141.
Tina possibly had a non-voluntary startle reaction to the bang at say T143 (except that she stopped filming at T142).
Tina possibly had a voluntary fright reaction to the bang at say T145.






Here below are some more printscreens.



















« Last Edit: October 12, 2021, 11:45:51 PM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

Online Marjan Rynkiewicz

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 532
  • It was rotten luck, he was just doing his job.
Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2021, 03:47:38 AM »
Ok the above 10 screenprints are from the 6th Floor Museum on-line video of  the Towner film.
https://emuseum.jfk.org/internal/media/dispatcher/42270/resize%3Aformat%3Dfull

The pix start at T133 (say Z108).
The shot might be at T138 (Z113).
The last is T142 (say Z117).
So here there are no missing frames.

In youtube interviews Tina Towner says that she stopped filming because the JFK limo was too far past.  Tina heard a shot which she thought was a firecracker, at about the time she stopped filming. Tina couldnt remember whether the shot was just before stopping or just after (she said this whilst standing on the corner at a 50th anniversary or something)(but i cant find the footage now)(in other footage she says she stopped filming a couple of seconds before shot-1). Later she heard a 2nd shot.  I dont remember what she said about a 3rd shot.

So, Tina's hearing doesnt contradict an Oswald shot-1 at T138 (Z113). 
It contradicts an Oswald shot-1 at the oft-said Z155.
It contradicts an Oswald shot-1 at the much-said much-loved much-believed (much-lied) Z224.

Tina didnt mention getting a fright by the sound of the shot, or by the sound of Oswald's shot-2 (which i say happened at Z218).
So mightbe Tina didnt shake the camera. Or she did but only after T142.
« Last Edit: May 15, 2021, 12:34:19 AM by Marjan Rynkiewicz »

JFK Assassination Forum

Re: Oswald's shot-1 was at Z113.
« Reply #7 on: March 27, 2021, 03:47:38 AM »


 

Mobile View