Then went inside with the curtain rods

[Bill Chapman]

Sorry, can't find my gibberish dictionary

Not my bad that your reading comprehension is limited to the point that you have to head for the exit while belching throwaway chickenspombleprofglidnoctobunse cop-outs like 'gibberish'.

[John Iacoletti]

He is definitely going down as an accessory - the man who drove the assassin and his poorly disguised rifle to the scene of the crime.
So he gets together with Linnie to concoct the curtain rod story - Oswald did indeed have a long package but no way was it long enough to be a rifle. It was definitely curtain rod length just like Oswald said.

In this scenario why mention a package at all?

[John Iacoletti]

And there were two curtain rods.
Only two curtain rods.
And they were both still in the Paine garage after the assassination.

If that's the case then how were they submitted into evidence 8 days before they were "found" undisturbed in the Paine garage?

[Dan O'meara]

That's what Frazier said

That is correct

But the only story he told was the curtain rods story, so how does that make any sense if Oswald came up with that story and Frazier actually didn't believe it?

?? Frazier did believe it.
He had absolutely no reason to believe Oswald was lying.
No reason to believe Oswald was bringing a rifle to work.
His trusting nature was taken advantage of.

Btw Frazier left the TSBD before Oswald was arrested and he would have been in Irving by the time news about Oswald's arrest was first on the radio (at 2:40 PM). Frazier's sources of information were very limited from the moment he left the TSBD until he was arrested at the hospital at around 6 PM. So, when and how did he get enough information to connect the dots?

JFK is assassinated by a shot from the TSBD.
Oswald is arrested.
What more information does he need?

It very quickly dawns on Buell that Oswald lied about bringing curtain rods to work.
He'd brought a rifle and Buell quickly put two and two together.
How could he explain away that Oswald had carried a rifle to work that morning and he had done nothing about it.
When Frazier looked back on it, it was obvious it was a rifle.
How could he have accepted it was curtain rods? (because he was a trusting person who had no idea what was happening)

In the report I posted above Frazier is arrested sometime between 5:19 and 5:35.
Using this timeframe, Linnie Mae strolls up to Adamcik to offer the "short-long bag" story sometime between 3:30 and 4:45 (assuming it takes about a half hour for everyone to get back to City Hall).

Frazier had at least one hour to realise what a predicament he was in and to get together with Linnie Mae to come up with the "short-long bag story".

It is actually possible that Frazier was at home when he saw the officers converging on the Paine residence and decided that now was a good time to visit his step-dad.

[Martin Weidmann]

That is correct

?? Frazier did believe it.
He had absolutely no reason to believe Oswald was lying.
No reason to believe Oswald was bringing a rifle to work.
His trusting nature was taken advantage of.

Indeed, so why did you write earlier;

After the event he realised it was a rifle and that no-one would buy his "But I thought it was curtain rods" excuse.

If, as you claim, Frazier thought no-one would buy the curtain rods story, then why would he still tell it and not come up with something else?

JFK is assassinated by a shot from the TSBD.
Oswald is arrested.
What more information does he need?

How does Frazier know so soon that the shots were fired from the TSBD? Btw he testified that he thought they came from the railroad area.

How and when did Frazier find out Oswald was arrested and for what?

It very quickly dawns on Buell that Oswald lied about bringing curtain rods to work.
He'd brought a rifle and Buell quickly put two and two together.
How could he explain away that Oswald had carried a rifle to work that morning and he had done nothing about it.
When Frazier looked back on it, it was obvious it was a rifle.
How could he have accepted it was curtain rods? (because he was a trusting person who had no idea what was happening)

This is all hindsight not supported by the facts or evidence

In the report I posted above Frazier is arrested sometime between 5:19 and 5:35.
Using this timeframe, Linnie Mae strolls up to Adamcik to offer the "short-long bag" story sometime between 3:30 and 4:45 (assuming it takes about a half hour for everyone to get back to City Hall).

In their report, Rose, Stovall and Adamcik gave a later time.

Frazier had at least one hour to realise what a predicament he was in and to get together with Linnie Mae to come up with the "short-long bag story".

Only if he had all the information at that time, which he clearly couldn't have. Oswald was arrested after Frazier left the TSBD. The first broadcast of his arrest was at 2:40 only mentioned that he was arrested in connection with the murder of officer Tippit.

It's highly speculative to assume that Frazier, between his departure from the TSBD and his arrest at the hospital, would somehow have obtained sufficient information to tie Oswald to the Kennedy murder and draw the conclusions you propose. But even if he did, why did he still tell the curtain rods story?

It is actually possible that Frazier was at home when he saw the officers converging on the Paine residence and decided that now was a good time to visit his step-dad.

It's also possible that Frazier wasn't aware of any problem until he was arrested. Speculation isn't getting you far!

[Dan O'meara]

In this scenario why mention a package at all?

Because Oswald was carrying a package.
Frazier would have to assume other people might have seen him carrying the package (Ruth Paine, Marina, neighbours etc.)
How would it look if Frazier denied seeing a package at all that others had seen Oswald carrying to his car?
Why take the chance of the out-and-out lie that there was no package when there was one.

Frazier isn't inventing the package.
He isn't inventing he was told they were curtain rods.

[Martin Weidmann]

Because Oswald was carrying a package.
Frazier would have to assume other people might have seen him carrying the package (Ruth Paine, Marina, neighbours etc.)
How would it look if Frazier denied seeing a package at all that others had seen Oswald carrying to his car?
Why take the chance of the out-and-out lie that there was no package when there was one.

Frazier isn't inventing the package.
He isn't inventing he was told they were curtain rods.

Frazier isn't inventing the package.
He isn't inventing he was told they were curtain rods.

Indeed. He didn't invent a story and simply told the truth.

I still don't understand how you can claim, on the one hand, that Frazier, at some point early on, understood he could be in trouble and needed to concoct a story with his sister, yet on the other hand confirm that Frazier told investigators exactly what really happened.

There is an obvious contradiction there. 

[Dan O'meara]

If that's the case then how were they submitted into evidence 8 days before they were "found" undisturbed in the Paine garage?

I assume you're talking about this extraordinary document posted by Alan:



For me, the importance of this document is that there could hardly be a clearer example of tampering with the processing of evidence.
I find it hard to believe an honest mistake has led to the same document being given different release dates.
It seems to be a doctored document and, as such, can hardly be viewed as being reliable in any way.
The submitted date (3/15/64) can be taken with a pinch of salt.
The question is - what did the person(s) creating this document hope to achieve?